loaned horse sold within days - dispute on ownership

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janeyhewitt

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Our horse was loaned without a loan contract. Within days the horse was sold as a much younger age than she actually is. Also rugs were sold too.
Passport was retained by us. No paperwork exchanged. When I was refused access to visit I spent a day touring Lancashire until luckily we found her new home, but the latest buyer won't part with her until the money has been reimbursed. Reported all this to police. Procedure is civil action and so slow. RSPCA visited horse and said welfare okay.

We are so worried about this aged horse.

Any similar experiences please?
 
god thats disgusting. I hope you get horsey back!
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I dont where you stand with this, have you spoken to a solicitor? Can you not go down the route of they stole the horse and sold it on with the police?

TBH i also know where the horses new owner is coming from, i wouldnt give it back until i got my money.

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Surely it can't just be a civil matter? The horse has been stolen by the people who loaned it from you. I think you really need to report it as stolen in order to get the Police help that you obviously require!
 
What did you say to the police? What did the police say to you?

If I were you I would call the police and report your horse stolen....you can then go and 'find' him, pick him up and if necessary press charges against the 'loaner', the new 'buyer' will have to take it up with the person they gave money to, that's got nothing to do with you!

For me the moral of the story is never loan your pony....my pony was stolen by the loaner before passports came in to force and now I've lost her forever
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I think we all have bitten our tongues quite well
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but I don't think it's very constructive to tell the OP what they should have done or not done, it's to late
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Now they need a solution not preventative method...
 
If it was me, I'd go down late at night and simply load her and be on your way.

Might not be legal, but at the end of the day, she is stolen property, and legally she belongs to you anyway.

As they say, posession is 9/10th's of the law.

Let the buyer take it up with the person they bought it from.
 
Sorry but 2 wrongs do not make a right - thats makes you just about as bad as the people that sold her on.

The people who bought her did nothing wrong - so why do that 2 them? You have her passport yes, well why havent you enforced this with the police, they should be doing something about this.

In my opinion is doesnt sound like you have done much - sometimes the police need a push in the correct direction. Them not being able to do something is a lot of sh!t.

I dont know where you stand with this, but why havent you gone to see a lawyer? This isnt something that will sort itself out.
 
Not civil action....THEFT.


The horse belongs to you and I assume you can prove this. Unfortunately the buyer is not in a position to demand money, they have bought stolen goods which should be returned to you as the rightful owner.

Involve the Police and your solicitor as soon as possible.
 
believe it or not, having a horses passport doesnt PROVE ownership......

its just an identification document.....
 
Jesus, this is awful. Yes, a contract should have been drawn up but it wasn't, you're not the first and I doubt you'll be the last to make this mistake. You really do need to take legal advice on this situation and unfortunately being the holder of the passport doesn't legally make you the owner in the eyes of the law. I truly hope you get this sorted out, you must be devastated....good luck
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Sadly, you are not the only one that this has happened to. As the horse was sold on without a passport, then Trading Standards should be involved. The horse was stolen from you, so the Police must do something about it. In past cases when the horse has been traced, the horse has been returned to the original owner (you) and the person who bought the horse has had to try and recover their money from the person that stole the horse. If you are a member of the BHS, they have a good legal helpline (have a look at their website), otherwise have a chat with a specialist equine solicitor.
I am sure you know you should have had a contract (it is easy to be wise after the event), but horses have been stolen whilst on loan even with supposedly watertight contracts.
I hope you get your horse back soon.
 
The loanee has sold a horse they had no title to, AND minus a passport. I would be talking to Trading Standards for starters as this person has probably done this before.

IF you tried to remove it from its new home, you would be 'stealing' it in the eyes of the police. Presumably they have SOME proof that they paid for the horse - a receipt, cheque cleared, whatever. The rights and wrongs will be a court matter (probably Small Claims) and I would start action (against the person you loaned her to) immediately.

I would also make friends with the new owner. Keep them informed of what is going on between you and the loaner. Obviously if the Court holds that it is your horse, they will lose it as the court will order it returned to you. They will then have to seek re-imbursement from the loaner. In fact it MIGHT be possible for you and the new 'owner' to bring a joint case against the person you loaned to.

BUT, these cases are not particularly 'easy' because judges often don't understand the concept of 'loaning' a horse - or giving it away for that matter! (I know - I've recently won a case which involved a mare in-foal who was given to me by the owner who didn't want her - and who changed her mind months later once a nice healthy foal was on the ground and wanted her back!) During the negotiations she attempted to steal the mare and foal back - and the police escorted her OFF my property and told her to stay off!

I had evidence that the mare was given to me, that I had kept her at my expense for many months before the woman tried to get her back, etc. etc. and it was that evidence (mainly e-mails) that swung the case in my favour.

The lack of a loan agreement is obviously not in your favour, the fact you still have the passport is NOT of itself proof of ownership. You will need SOME evidence the horse remained yours and was just on loan - or witnesses to any discussions. They - of course - cannot prove they paid YOU for the horse.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Sorry but 2 wrongs do not make a right - thats makes you just about as bad as the people that sold her on.

The people who bought her did nothing wrong - so why do that 2 them? You have her passport yes, well why havent you enforced this with the police, they should be doing something about this.

In my opinion is doesnt sound like you have done much - sometimes the police need a push in the correct direction. Them not being able to do something is a lot of sh!t.

I dont know where you stand with this, but why havent you gone to see a lawyer? This isnt something that will sort itself out.

[/ QUOTE ]

How on earth does it make you as bad as the person who sold her on?

Not much sympathy for the buyer either if they bought her without a passport.

The OP wouldnt be guilty of theft -simply recovering your rightful posessions does not make you a thief.
 
My friend bought a car once, years ago admittedly, paid in cash then found out it was stolen and had to give it back to the rightful owner at a complete loss to him. Surely if this is the law for a car it has to be the same for a stolen horse. There is a law against theft in this country, you are the rightful owner, she was sold without your consent..go get her back and let the authorities help.
 
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