Low Level Laser Therapy effectiveness on horse's with sore backs

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Hope786

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Used to use McTimoney therapist come to check my horse's back every 6 months since owning him for 2 years.... Recently my riding instructor noticed my horse had a sore back..... So I called a physio out who was very good, explained where my horse was over compensating and that what I thought was my horse being lazy, was actually my horse being in pain... When I bought him he was very over weight and hadn't been worked in a while, which I've been told contributed to this and has very little muscle on hind....Totally and utterly gutted :'( I am hoping to God that there's not long term damage and it can be rectified....


The physio did Low Level Laser Therapy (LLLT) on my horse's hind quarters and back and gonna have a few more treatments to see whether vet needs to explore further....

Anyone have any experience of LLLT with sore horse's back.... Trying not to panic, but incredibly worried that I will have to retire my horse :(
 
My horse has laser and loves it,so much more supple.
My phyiso said it gets a lot deeper,do you have a massge pad,mitt to use in between times?they help to:-) and pole work and riding long n low :-)
 
Thanks for your response sweet. At this stage physio has said only walk 80% and trot 20% for about 20 min sessions, and long lining....

When I bought him he was very heavy in the hands but now trying to engage his hind quarters has been difficult and now I am understanding why.

No don't have a massage pad or mitt but physio has told me to put hot water bottles on each side of his back, and pilate exercises before riding or long lining..... Just the not knowing is what's really stressing me out....
 
Have a look at infra red poultry lamps on eBay to warm his back before work. They cost about twenty quid. I have four hung in a stable and they are brilliant.

I've used cold laser very effectively on tension injuries. You can buy units on eBay of you want to continue it.

If it's muscular it should come right in time.
 
cptrayes said:
Have a look at infra red poultry lamps on eBay to warm his back before work. They cost about twenty quid. I have four hung in a stable and they are brilliant.

I've used cold laser very effectively on tension injuries. You can buy units on eBay of you want to continue it.

If it's muscular it should come right in time.
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Thanks sweet. Physio thinks it was due to previous owner as he was very over weight and not worked so his hind quarters muscles are hard as rock.... And it's making his back very sore.... Used mctimoney and unfortunately that wasn't enough....

Just wondering how long it will take and whether it will... Making me feel really anxious :'(
 
Whereabouts are you? The treatment used and recommended sounds very much like much like my physio and if it is your horse is in the best possible hands! The laser will help with the soreness and the hot water bottles do help with relaxing the muscles before work! Has your horse got to have follow up treatments?

Good luck :)
 
WellyBaggins said:
Whereabouts are you? The treatment used and recommended sounds very much like much like my physio and if it is your horse is in the best possible hands! The laser will help with the soreness and the hot water bottles do help with relaxing the muscles before work! Has your horse got to have follow up treatments?

Good luck :)
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Thanks sweet...Wales/ Glos. Tim Bradford came who was v.good. Yes my horse needs a couple of follow up treatments, and then gonna re evaluate whether a vet needs to get involved :'( Just trying to quantify (not easy with horses I know!) how long it will take to see improvements or what improvements to look out for....

I'm with a good insurance company but heard a lot of horror stories even from good ones (signs of times I guess) how they make a big fuss about claims....

Bad anxiety kicking in :'(
 
Haven't used for sore back but it greatly speeded up the healing process when one of mine broke his withers and am currently taking one of my dogs 2 x a week for laser for arthritis and he does seem more comfortable after 3 weeks. Agree with person who said put hot water bottles wrapped in towels before riding to warm the muscles (not too hot!) and the long lining will help. Is his weight correct now? It will take the time that it takes to build the correct muscles but don't see why you would have to retire him. Is saddle fitting correctly if he's changed weight?
 
Hope786 said:
Thanks sweet...Wales/ Glos. Tim Bradford came who was v.good. Yes my horse needs a couple of follow up treatments, and then gonna re evaluate whether a vet needs to get involved :'( Just trying to quantify (not easy with horses I know!) how long it will take to see improvements or what improvements to look out for....

I'm with a good insurance company but heard a lot of horror stories even from good ones (signs of times I guess) how they make a big fuss about claims....

Bad anxiety kicking in :'(
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I thought so, Tim bradford is brilliant, he is my physio and has worked miracles with my horses, I trust him explicitly. Give it a couple of treatments, did Tim say when you could hope to see an improvement? I would say after the second treatment things should start to improve, he is normally pretty good at gauging when the vet is necessary! Good luck, stick with it :)

Ps he treats me too and the laser works for me :)
 
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Seems from his website that he's an ACPAT physio - so you might want to remove either his name, or any references to him working without a veterinary referral - for his own sake.
 
Have pm'd you but agree that Tim is very thorough. I've also had laser on me and horse and second the hot water bottles ;) I rigged up an oven glove style thing to pop them into :D
 
He does get a vet referral and the vet is always contacted, it is whether or not the vet needs to see the horse, again or for what he finds. He is one of the good guys!
 
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WellyBaggins said:
He does get a vet referral and the vet is always contacted, it is whether or not the vet needs to see the horse. He is one of the good guys!

(
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I've heard nothing but good things about Tim, and I'm a great ACPAT physio fan. Just thought that the OP's post inferred that he was working without a referral, and thought it should be made clear that he was!
My physio (ACPAT A) doesn't run it past my vet every time she visits - the initial referral was sufficient. She treats him, then reports back to the vet. I'm assuming this is the situ with the OP, but think she needs to clarify this for Tims sake.
 
Good point, I know from personal experience, (I have used them for nearly 10 years) that a referral is always gained from the vet prior to visiting and then reports are sent or vet contacted if anything suspicious is found but I 100% see your point, it does read that way!
 
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Auslander said:
Seems from his website that he's an ACPAT physio - so you might want to remove either his name, or any references to him working without a veterinary referral - for his own sake.
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Sweetie of course he received vet approval beforehand. Nowhere did I say he didn't have vet approval, I have spoken to my vet and he works closely with my vet... Appreciate the concern ;) x
 
Nicnac said:
Haven't used for sore back but it greatly speeded up the healing process when one of mine broke his withers and am currently taking one of my dogs 2 x a week for laser for arthritis and he does seem more comfortable after 3 weeks. Agree with person who said put hot water bottles wrapped in towels before riding to warm the muscles (not too hot!) and the long lining will help. Is his weight correct now? It will take the time that it takes to build the correct muscles but don't see why you would have to retire him. Is saddle fitting correctly if he's changed weight?
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Weight is correct now sweet. Saddle has been checked and adjusted. Fingers crossed, I know it is gonna take time, just want to prepare myself.... Very scared... bless him must have been in a lot pain but endured it and didn't chuck me of.... He is a special angel in my eyes....
 
WellyBaggins said:
I thought so, Tim bradford is brilliant, he is my physio and has worked miracles with my horses, I trust him explicitly. Give it a couple of treatments, did Tim say when you could hope to see an improvement? I would say after the second treatment things should start to improve, he is normally pretty good at gauging when the vet is necessary! Good luck, stick with it :)

Ps he treats me too and the laser works for me :)
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I was pleasantly surprised with the chiro... Tim said see how the next couple of treatments go.... seemed better but initially the laser was uncomfortable for my poor boy but seemed better in himself after Tim had gone, hoping to God that it is maintained afterwards by me and just hope his body is up to repairing itself.... Hoping permanent damage has not been done....
 
WellyBaggins said:
Good point, I know from personal experience, (I have used them for nearly 10 years) that a referral is always gained from the vet prior to visiting and then reports are sent or vet contacted if anything suspicious is found but I 100% see your point, it does read that way!
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Appreciate what you both are saying. When I posted this I was in tears and having a major panic attack :'( So just wrote it as I was thinking x
 
Auslander said:
I've heard nothing but good things about Tim, and I'm a great ACPAT physio fan. Just thought that the OP's post inferred that he was working without a referral, and thought it should be made clear that he was!
My physio (ACPAT A) doesn't run it past my vet every time she visits - the initial referral was sufficient. She treats him, then reports back to the vet. I'm assuming this is the situ with the OP, but think she needs to clarify this for Tims sake.
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As stated before I was very upset and I was not saying anything remotely negative that would affect Tim's reputation. I was having a panic attack and in tears... So looking for people's experience and just generally looking for hopeful comments... x
 
Hope786 said:
Sweetie of course he received vet approval beforehand. Nowhere did I say he didn't have vet approval, I have spoken to my vet and he works closely with my vet... Appreciate the concern ;) x
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Appreciate that you're upset, but there's really no need to the sarcastic tone! I was merely concerned for the physio in question. I read it as physio had been called out, and was going to advise if and when vet needed you be involved, it just suggested that there hadn't been any discussion with the vet. If one person (me) understood it that way, then its possible that someone else might - and that someone else could report it.
 
Hope786 said:
As stated before I was very upset and I was not saying anything remotely negative that would affect Tim's reputation. I was having a panic attack and in tears... So looking for people's experience and just generally looking for hopeful comments... x
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Yes - but you stated that you were upset AFTER after I posted the comment! I also didn't realise HOW upset you were - I know your horse has a sore back, but nothing in your post suggested that it was severe enough to warrant panic attacks and crying - if its back was broken and it had to be PTS, then that's different - but its got a sore back. So chill - not worth getting in a state about, especially when you don't know what the issue is. Could be very easily resolved.

If you want some info/feedback about laser - I can help btw. A diagnosis of the problem is needed though. It works really well for a lot of conditions - but without knowing what's wrong with the horse, it's hard to say if it will help.
 
Auslander said:
Yes - but you stated that you were upset AFTER after I posted the comment! I also didn't realise HOW upset you were - I know your horse has a sore back, but nothing in your post suggested that it was severe enough to warrant panic attacks and crying - if its back was broken and it had to be PTS, then that's different - but its got a sore back. So chill - not worth getting in a state about, especially when you don't know what the issue is. Could be very easily resolved.

If you want some info/feedback about laser - I can help btw. A diagnosis of the problem is needed though. It works really well for a lot of conditions - but without knowing what's wrong with the horse, it's hard to say if it will help.
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I suffer from anxiety hence the crying and panic attacks. So as for "chill" easier said then done! As for anything else, I don't want to argue with you that's NOT why I posted on here!
 
Hope786 said:
I suffer from anxiety hence the crying and panic attacks. So as for "chill" easier said then done! As for anything else, I don't want to argue with you that's NOT why I posted on here!
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I'm not out to start a fight - I just felt like you were getting snotty with me, and it made me a bit grumpy. if you rad my last para, I'm happy to help if I can.
 
I thought we'd suddenly acquired a lot of posters called sweet/sweetie but it appears not... very '90s ab fab :p.

fwiw I was amazed at the improvement in Frank after being treated with laser by a physio recently - I thought we might be looking at requiring a full work up as he was about 3/10 lame on a circle but post treatment we could only make him lame with flexion (and for lots of reasons/with vet discussion/his age we decided not to look deeper at this stage).

Oh I also totally get it with regards to the anxiety btw, but don't think it is fair to accuse other posters of causing upset when they aren't posting unduly.
 
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ester said:
I thought we'd suddenly acquired a lot of posters called sweet/sweetie but it appears not... very '90s ab fab :p.

fwiw I was amazed at the improvement in Frank after being treated with laser by a physio recently - I thought we might be looking at requiring a full work up as he was about 3/10 lame on a circle but post treatment we could only make him lame with flexion (and for lots of reasons/with vet discussion/his age we decided not to look deeper at this stage).

Oh I also totally get it with regards to the anxiety btw, but don't think it is fair to accuse other posters of causing upset when they aren't posting unduly.
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This^^

Laser can be very useful indeed and it does certainly sound like you have someone very good on the job.

It's worth remembering that people on the other end of an internet connection have no idea if you have anxiety/panic attacks etc. so people can't be expected to post in a manner that takes that into account. All Auslander has done is offer you some very good and quality advice and she's offered help...it might be nice to say thank you, not just focus on the negative. She really can give you some good advice, so ask, she's lovely.

Anxiety is a horrible thing, it really is, but the "chill" comment was an comment of encouragement, not criticism...just a way of saying it's not that bad, no need to panic, take a breath etc.

So...take a breath...maybe thank Auslander for offering more advice and everyone can just move on.

As for the laser therapy, it worked instantly for my old mare, but she needed 4 fortnightly sessions before it got to the point that she didn't need it anymore. Not too long really and she was extremely uncomfortable at the beginning. It can work wonders. xx
 
ester said:
I thought we'd suddenly acquired a lot of posters called sweet/sweetie but it appears not... very '90s ab fab :p.

fwiw I was amazed at the improvement in Frank after being treated with laser by a physio recently - I thought we might be looking at requiring a full work up as he was about 3/10 lame on a circle but post treatment we could only make him lame with flexion (and for lots of reasons/with vet discussion/his age we decided not to look deeper at this stage).

Oh I also totally get it with regards to the anxiety btw, but don't think it is fair to accuse other posters of causing upset when they aren't posting unduly.
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Thanks sweet
 
GG I have to say I had sent a video of the lame Frank to the vet and they had all been studying it trying to decide where exact wonkiness might be then was very surprised to present him with a really rather sound one! - physio was keen for me to get him checked over a bit more post treatment in part because he walks v. straight legged too/amount of work he is in.
 
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