Martingales....worthy of a debate?

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MizElz

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What are your views on martingales? If you disagree with the use of bungees/draw reins/harbridges/market harboroughs etc, do you also feel that martingales come into this category? Are they too restrictive on the horse's action? Are they necessary for some disciplines, and not others; likewise, are they essential for some horses, but not so for others? Seeing as most horses, when a martingale is removed, will stretch their head and necks up into a more naturally high carriage, could martingales be considered cruel? Is a certain type of martingale 'better' than another? If you compete in a discipline where martingales are not legal, do you still use them at home, for hacking or schooling?

Discuss!
 
Fitted correctly, have no problem. but pet HATE is when they are too tight!!
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personally dont use one
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Standing martingales generally shouldn't be used for jumping.

Much prefer running martingales to standing myself, I ride my girl in a running martingale but she still pokes her nose out and neck up when jumping so it's not over-tight
 
The thing is that ever equipment on the market is design to help with any problem that your horse may occur (after having checks)
If this was surpose to resrictive the horses movement etc
I think they would of gave up these ideas long ago as long as they are propley used in a correct and sensible mannor then i c no problems with these types of equipment.
If we all debate this equipments what about the use of crops (whips)
 
I dont have any issues with running martingales if fitted correctly and for a good reason. I would use one for jumping just for a little extra control if needed.I would rather my horse was in a running martingale and snaffle for jumping than bitted up to the eyeballs. I personally dont like standing martingales or draw reins as they seem to be too restrictive.

As for the other training aids, I dont tend to use them. The only time i would consider it is if I had a horse that was dangerous without but would only be using them temporarily until the level of schooling had improved.I wouldnt use them to force a horse into an outline. Thats what your legs and seat are for!!
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i don't like them, and i very very rarely use them. if a horse has a real problem with throwing its head up, i want to know the cause and try to solve it, not prevent it from expressing itself. i would rather use a standing than a running, because it has no impact on the mouth, and it more honest to the horse, i think. i've put a longish standing martingale on a horse a few times and then never needed to use a martingale on it again, it can break the habit completely.
a loose running martingale on a horse that flips its head right up to evade the bit action can be very useful though... for instance, although i hate them, i use one on my new mare for jumping because she sometimes flips her head right up when excited, then swings her bum violently to the side, and leaps sideways off the leg... (nice!) so being able to keep a contact in front means i can keep her straight and sensible, and i don't want to go to a fence sideways and out of control!
i don't think of them as being a "gadget" as such because they are not to make the horse go in an outline, they simply stop it from evading the bit (and breaking the rider's nose, perhaps...)
totally agree with KatB, when they are too tight (pulling the reins downwards when you take up a contact) then they pull on the horse's mouth as it stretches its neck forwards in a bascule, which is effectively punishing it for using itself.
i've had 1 pony and 1 horse who came to me having always been jumped in a martingale... the pony never wore one again and absolutely didn't need one, and with the horse, i dispensed with it after a few months... she liked to carry her head high to a fence, but as it didn't stop her from being a phenomenal jumper, i just let her use herself how she wanted, and used a big fluffy noseband instead... which she was much happier in.
for speed in jump-offs, a running can definitely help, i think... (not that i've done one for years!), hard to explain, but i think you can sort-of swing the horse more tightly round your inside leg using the inside hand as a slight brace, while keeping the shoulders upright. i'm not explaining this very well, but the fact that it makes the connection from hand to bit slightly indirect (if fitted perfectly and not too tight, not too loose) keeps the neck and shoulder more up, stops the horse from leaning in round the corner.
cookies if you can make sense of that, i know how it feels but i really can't explain it without it sounding terrible!
fwiw, my German trainer's opinion of martingales is that he allows them only for riders of over 90 years old, for security. i honestly don't think he's joking...
 
It's interesting you prefer the standing martingale! I think I'm a bit like you. Id use it if I felt it would help with a serious issue but other than that i wouldnt. Plus if you use a martingale when you dont need it it is just more tack to clean!!
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I only use a running martingale nowadays when jumping or on a cross country ride!!!
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Standing martingales generally shouldn't be used for jumping.

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I disagree. A correctly fitted standing martingale doesn't interfere with a horse's jump. In fact, I think standing martingales are kinder than running martingales as they don't act on the mouth.
 
more tack to clean, and makes tacking up harder, because i like to put the saddle on first, and always forget if i'm going to use a martingale and do the girth up!
so, i don't use them because i'm actually bone idle....
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more tack to clean, and makes tacking up harder, because i like to put the saddle on first, and always forget if i'm going to use a martingale and do the girth up!
so, i don't use them because i'm actually bone idle....

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LOL!
Im the same!!!
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If you dont need it in the first place...it is just extra to clean and put on.
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Easier not to have one at all!!
 
I used a standing martingale for a few weeks on my ex race horse cos she was being a bit thick about what I wanted
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went to go like a giraffe, standing martingale came into action head came down in surprise head never went that high again, she suddenly twigged what I was asking, after a few weeks I took it off never used it again, most people fit running martingales either two short or too long so they have no effect, I tend not to use them cos the horse's I ride do not require them, but if neccessary I will use them, make a good neckstrap as well
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I use a running martingale and wouldn't be without it whilst out hacking. It is fitted correctly, been checked by my instructor and as ZigZag says also makes a handy neck strap.

If my boy is soft and working correctly it doesn't even come into play...

I have had a bloody nose from a tantrum out hacking without one as he can throw his head about. Quite frankly I have no problem with using one.
 
I use a Standing Martingale on Solo- its quite loose, and I use it because he shakes his head about when he's excited.
I use the Standing Martingale rather than the Running Martingale because Sol is sensitive enough in his mouth, without needing a Martingale tugging on him.
Also, I would ride Sol in a Hackamore, if I had any brakes, as he responds better to pressure on his nose than his mouth, and the Standing Martingale applies preaaure to his nose, as and when it is needed. I use it in conjunction with a wide Hunter Cavesson noseband (which is fitted quite loosely), to try and disperse the pressure over a greater area.

As Kerilli says, it is more tack to clean too, and I like to see an uncluttered horse- not one that is so restricted it HAS to do what it is being asked.

It annoys me when people just use them for the sake of it- alot of people at my yard do-
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if people want a neckstrap, they could always use an old stirrup leather.

I use a bungee for lungeing/long reining, its as loose at it will go and is there to gently remind them to work themselves.
I would never use one to ride in, I don't see the reasoning behind that.
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I never hack or school in them, but for fast work I have one because coloured has a tendancy to bring his head disturbingly high.
I used to hunt my pony in a standing martingale, I was largely hated for it but it was justified and have no problems with doing it on a future horse is needs be. I think until you have really experienced a horse who needs a martingale they do seem pointless. A woman I used to ride for always put one on the horse, who clearly didnt need it and we got into endless arguments about it, I'm not one for tarting horses up with faff.
 
Only time I use a martingale on my lot is on Hattie when I ride and lead. I ride her and she can generally be very rude to the lead horse and head bobs, she only head bobs when riding and leading. When trotting and trying to signal while riding and leading a head bobbing horse can be very annoying so I put a running martingale on as a standing, because I don't have a standing martingale and I don't use it enough to justify buying one. It is not on tight and she knows as soon as I put it on she can't throw her head up high so doesn't but she knows when I don't put it on.

At work everything is jumped in a running one, which is very annoying as hardly anyone need it and therefore they don't come into use so it just makes more tack for me to clean.
 
I prefer not to use them at all, full stop.
However if I was to use one it would be a standing with an elastic insert as first port of call. I can't abide the feeling of a running martingale and the false connection you get with the horses mouth, that said I have used in the past and no doubt will use in the future.
 
I don't use one now, but had a running martingale on my lovely horsey when i got him as he tended to throw his head up - mistake!! - well for him anyway! Found that as he lifted up his head the (correctly fitted!!) martingale jagged on his happymouth snaffle causing him to get more worried and attempt to put his head up more.

Wore a very long standing martingale on him for a while to stop him going to the extremes, and now don't wear anything. He gets a swift kick now if he tries it to make him go forward and down instead. (but not too much of a problem now that he treats hacks as a running hedge buffet - naughty pony!).

He goes fine in his straight happy mouth snaffle for everything, and I have to say I enjoy being one of the few that doesn't wear a martingale for BSJA or BE. (Or one of those stupid baggy breastplates/girths that must be totally useless its so baggy that seem to be fashionable - now whats that all about - how about a separate thread for that?!)

But then, horses for courses
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if you need one and it works then fair enough - but i'm with everyone on the tack cleaning - a muddy girth is enough!
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It's good to read the comments on this post. I posted a while ago about using a standing martingale on my lad, who tends to raise his head when excited/worried/evading.

Personally, I would rather not use one, but in the circumstances with my boy I'm going to give it a go. I've never used one on my other horse, but I've had her since she was 3 and know how she's been educated. My lad's not had much schooling and just doesn't seem to get it.

I will give it a try, but hopefully W will get the message soon and I can ditch it. I hate any excess tack, cos it's just another thing for me to get tangled up in when I put it on him!!
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(Or one of those stupid baggy breastplates/girths that must be totally useless its so baggy that seem to be fashionable - now whats that all about - how about a separate thread for that?!)


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Couldnt agree more, seems to be the fashion to have a 5 point breastplate (nothing wrong with that!
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) so loose it actually does f all, and the point is.....?!!
 
As long as martingales are correctly fitted, I have no problem with them at all. I think it was Jennie Loriston-Clarke (though I could be wrong) who said that she prefers young horses to be ridden in a running martingale if the rider's hands aren't perfect.

I ride in a running martingale, loosely fitted. The neck strap is invaluable for his wobby moments, although I don't think he actually needs the martingale at all otherwise - maybe on the odd hack when he gets frightened... I frequently school without it.
 
Daisy wears one for hacking on roads because it keeps her safer. She is basically a very good horse but every now and then she will spook at something silly and when she does that she will stick her head up so high that her reins are up around her ears. On a road I need to be able to deal with any spook quickly and effectively and I can't do that with reins by ears
 
I don't like them at all - and the only time I would use a running martingale is (bizarrely) if I suspected that horsey and I were likely to part company - as it does stop the reins tangling about the legs to an extent. But if I say it must be over 16 years since I last had one on a horse that would indicate how rarely this situation might arise
 
As a rule, I normally ride my boy in snaffle and no martingale e.t.c.

If I lunge I lunge with a bungee.

However, as my boy can be very strong out hacking in company on sponsored rides or jumping I ride in either the gag on 2nd loop or my fulmer for more steering, grackle and martingale.

Dressage and showing, no martingale, standard cavasson and snaffle.

I know what my boy needs for different situations. I never over do it. I do everything by what he needs at the time, this includes, feeding, shoeing and general care as well.
 
I always use a running martingale on my TBx - it stops her from chucking her head around and the strap is very handy for her take off moments
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I'm not sure abt standing martingales tho - I've seen so many horses ridden in them that have ended up with huge muscles under the neck and back problems where they haven't been able to flex properly... Probably because they haven't been fitted properly.
 
A standing martingale attaches to the breastplate in the same place that a running does, but is just one strap, rather than two. This strap runs up between the reins and attaches onto the back of the cavesson noseband!
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I have never used one so have no pics, but I'm sure someone on here will have one....
 
Coffee Bean - Standing martingales (or at least standing attachments on hunting breasplates!)....
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I have to say I HATE any form of running martingale with a passion
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. I use standing martingales for polocrosse as they help avoid losing teeth in the stops/turns, and will use a standing on ex-racers if need be when they are first being rebacked. I use mine loser than the majority and rarely will they come into effect until the head is within inches of my face, as I don't believe in restricting the horse unless it is being dangerous.

In answer to the original question I dislike most other restrictive gadgets, but I will use a market harborough occassionally on a really head flinging, teeth knocking kind of a horse, but not if it has a tendency to go up.
 
I use one on Lacey at all times except at dressage & showing shows. She's v. opinionated and will quite happily stick her ears up my nose if she feels like it. Also she can rear and buck and bronk, whatever takes her fancy, so I like the neck strap.

I only use a martingale on Willow when jumping after she went on her knees when she stopped once, instructor looked at the video and said it was because her head was too high.

These are running martingales btw.
 
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