Mini-rant: Getting your horse to go "down on the bit"

My pony used to lean on my hands a lot ( to the point I lost feeling in my finger once!). The way my instructor taught me to stop it was lots of half halts and don't give her anything to lean on. So rather than a jab, if my mare leaned on me I'd give a small release so there was nothing to lean on. The release is like a tiny choo-choo train movement originating at the elbow.
So I'd be going round in my head 'half halt, get off my hands' (the get off my hands is the small choo-choo movement)
She soon realised that if there wasn't a 'solid' contact that she could lean on she would have to hold her own head up.
She no longer leans on me.
 
Sooo many riders dont understand just how much forwardness, balance and core strength is needed by a horse in order for it to work correctly through its back. I somewhat despise the know it alls who saw away at the horse or ponies mouth, those that put gags and all sorts in when they are not required, but its the fashion! (ill come on to that in a min!)

I have always started my younsters by allowing them to seek and find thier own balance in walk on ever increesingly small circles, but maintaining their balance throughout, which then by default brings in to play the natural bend required in order to balance. They will do this exercise for a min of 2 weeks in the school every other day before I ever entertain trot... and we are still a long way from obtaining that lovely soft round contact.... I start here... and add to the training in baby steps as I go, until I end up with a soft round horse who enjoys working correctly carrying themselves balanced and forward, who isnt strong in the hand, and who isnt behind the leg.

Gong back to my earlier statement.... I have also got soooo fed up in the past with a know it all teenager who dropped her hands, sawing away at the horses mouth with a dutch gag in... why because she thought thats what the showjumpers do to "get them on the bit"! :eek::confused: No matter what I said she wouldn't stop, So I got out my Abbot Davies Balancing Rein, and put that on the horse, told her to carry her hands, and get her leg close and firm... it didnt take long before she felt her horse carry its self, the horse was far happier, and she STOPPED abusing the poor animals mouth etc :cool:

Only problem is I have come across another of these hard handed teenage wanabe showjumpers in the past few days, and my Abbot Davies is broken :( and I cant get another :(
 
Marydoll said:
If it was up to me all riders would learn first on a lunge with a neckstrap and until they got their balance and feel for what was going on underneath them they wouldnt get near a set of reins, just my opinion
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That's how I'm teaching my niece to ride :)
 
Charem said:
Those who say that their horse goes on the bit without any contact/washing line reins surely your horse isn't 'on the bit' (god i hate that phrase!). You need a contact to have your horse connected and your hands need to be still otherwise the mouth can't be either. I hate all that wiggling fidgeting stuff some instructors seem to teach, the horse can never take a contact if their isn't a consistent one there!
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I prefer the phrase "in self carriage" and if a horse is in self carriage then it should be able to maintain it without any sort of contact, you should be able to throw away the reins and the horse will continue, if it doesn't then it's still relying on your hands.
Like this girl https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=174725109269904&set=o.206353792759492&type=3&theater
 
Cortez said:
The one thing this thread is doing for me is making me ask, again, who on earth is teaching this way? And where did they (the instructors) learn this stuff? It's HORRIFYING!
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The only local riding school in my area :(

They teach sawing to bring horse into "outline" and regularly tell people to "rattle their teeth", yanking the reins downwards when leading if the horse is "playing up", hands first and no leg aides, and what I call "show hands" where the hands are held on the reins palm down and thumbs pointing at each other held somewhere in the vicinity of the horses shoulder :cool: Since leaving I have been told of incidents where one of the RI's punched a horse in the face, the owners are encouraged to underfeed the working livery horses to make them more "docile" and various other things that are pretty horrifying :mad:

I was once told I was a lazy rider because I wasn't pulling my horses head into "outline" the whole lesson :rolleyes: I never agreed with this practice and the most I would do was gentle squeeze feels on the inside rein. I once was told to saw and gently did it and then spent the rest of the day feeling horribly guilty about doing it :(
 
RachelBristol said:
Sooo many riders dont understand just how much forwardness, balance and core strength is needed by a horse in order for it to work correctly through its back. I somewhat despise the know it alls who saw away at the horse or ponies mouth, those that put gags and all sorts in when they are not required, but its the fashion! (ill come on to that in a min!)

I have always started my younsters by allowing them to seek and find thier own balance in walk on ever increesingly small circles, but maintaining their balance throughout, which then by default brings in to play the natural bend required in order to balance. They will do this exercise for a min of 2 weeks in the school every other day before I ever entertain trot... and we are still a long way from obtaining that lovely soft round contact.... I start here... and add to the training in baby steps as I go, until I end up with a soft round horse who enjoys working correctly carrying themselves balanced and forward, who isnt strong in the hand, and who isnt behind the leg.

Gong back to my earlier statement.... I have also got soooo fed up in the past with a know it all teenager who dropped her hands, sawing away at the horses mouth with a dutch gag in... why because she thought thats what the showjumpers do to "get them on the bit"! :eek::confused: No matter what I said she wouldn't stop, So I got out my Abbot Davies Balancing Rein, and put that on the horse, told her to carry her hands, and get her leg close and firm... it didnt take long before she felt her horse carry its self, the horse was far happier, and she STOPPED abusing the poor animals mouth etc :cool:

Only problem is I have come across another of these hard handed teenage wanabe showjumpers in the past few days, and my Abbot Davies is broken :( and I cant get another :(
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Good post!! Oh how I wish so many riders would learn to balance themselves - I do so feel for their horses :eek:

Here Rachel

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BALANCING...t=UK_Horse_Wear_Equipment&hash=item27d2cfa26e
 
Faracat said:
Blimey.

Horses put up with such a lot.

If I rode with a strong contact I wouldn't get anywhere as strong contact + leg = rearing as far as my mare is concerned. I have to ride her with 'baby birds' IE hold the reins as if they are baby birds not reins. Squeeze too tightly and the birds get squished, hold too lightly and the birds fly away.
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I've been told this one too :)

I see quite a few people getting their horses into an "outline" using the method described by the OP :confused: So many people just aren't bothering with decent lessons these days I think :(
 
hnmisty said:
I've been told this one too :)

I see quite a few people getting their horses into an "outline" using the method described by the OP :confused: So many people just aren't bothering with decent lessons these days I think :(
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I fell sorry for novices (and their mounts!) who have no choices when it comes to riding schools or instructors - i.e there is only one in the area within a practicable distance - who are taught these dodgey riding methods. It's all they'll ever know and therefore they won't see anything wrong with it and continue to do these things to their horses :(
 
thanks YasandCrystal, but I bet it will go for £100 or so. I remember paying about £175 for mine brand new, and I would pay it again, but they do wear over the years (17 years to be exact!), so you never know how much life is left in a second hand one :confused: Ill keep an eye on it, and hope it doesnt go for too much though
 
I like yelling "the hand should never be retroactive" while schooling / watching people school (on youtube - the advantage of my field is that I never have to watch anyone sock their horse in the gob in the name of schooling in person!). It's a turn of phrase I nicked from Charles de Kunffy who said it repeatedly at a TTT clinic I happened to watch. It's remarkably pleasing to say outloud... Try it :p

I think it's a nice description too - it can be supportive, there is definitely contact, but it's not backwards, pully or fiddly.

That said, I also say it during fast work while mocking my inability to stop via the (non-existent) authority of my seat ;)
 
My pet hate is the reams of photos many via dealers of 'horses working in an outline' ha ha with their hands down at the wither, blocking the shoulders. Arghhh I hate it!! I would rather see a star gazer with a soft hand than a poor horse hauled in by the bit. The phrase a horse should be 'seeking a contact' sums up how you should be working a horse to me.

Noone is perfect, but we should all carry on striving to be in our riding for the sake of our horses :)
 
I have been taught its from your seat with a light and consistent rein contact maintained at all times. Dizzy thinks pulling on reins is go faster. She stops from me squeezing with my knees or voice. If I want dizzy to stretch further down through her back I push my hands forwards slightly giving with the reins but still maintaining a soft contact. I can have her in walk and trot with her nose practically on the ground. Not sure if its the correct way but my horse always has floppy ears and I get of bit chewing and snorting from it and zero tension :)
 
To add dizzy is 4 and very green so we are working on impulsion, suppleness and balance "collection" is a long way off yet :)
 
JFTD said:
I like yelling "the hand should never be retroactive" while schooling / watching people school (on youtube - the advantage of my field is that I never have to watch anyone sock their horse in the gob in the name of schooling in person!). It's a turn of phrase I nicked from Charles de Kunffy who said it repeatedly at a TTT clinic I happened to watch. It's remarkably pleasing to say outloud... Try it :p

I think it's a nice description too - it can be supportive, there is definitely contact, but it's not backwards, pully or fiddly.

That said, I also say it during fast work while mocking my inability to stop via the (non-existent) authority of my seat ;)
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Whaaaattt???

Surely you should always ask for a forward aid and immediately ask for a backward one...?? That's how you thoroughly confuse a horse into going in an outline.

Duh. I dunno JFTD, sometimes you say the silliest things!

:D
 
diamonddogs said:
That's just cruel.

What you should be doing is barricading them into the corner of the stable with an old door. If they can't move, you won't need baler twine. :D
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I got a bad back so can't lift an old door even if I had one :(
 
digger66 said:
Get your horse trotting on a circle, use an open rein with the inside hand (move it sideways towards the middle of the circle by a few inches) and then use your inside leg behind the girth. Use the outside rein if necessary to prevent going faster, and the outside leg to prevent the horses hindquarters swinging out.

What you are trying to achieve is for the horse to cross it's inside hind leg in front of the other a little, as it reaches under with it's hind leg it will build up muscles in its back so becoming better able to carry out the exercise. You will know when you are doing it correctly because the horses head will drop down where you want it to be.:cool:
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Exactly digger :) and my horse slows down a bit as she collects with that technique, it's hard work for her so I don't push her too much, just keep a nice rhythm and then give a little break or get on to next exercise. She doesn't need inches on the open rein though, just slight finger pressure.

Another thing as well is to always take before you give, the horse learns to yield to pressure instead of fighting it. I let my friend ride my mare once in the arena and poor mare had her chin into her chest as she will yield to pressure but friend didn't know how to give. Her own horse is used to a strong contact and doesn't do that. You can really "make a horse to your hand". I am a bit lazy so tend to use as little hand as I can get away with :).
 
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