My horse is 'seriously underweight'

OFG said:
At the end of the day the woman who has been caught giving hay / hayledge to this horse is out of order and has no rights to be doing that. :mad:
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This is an interesting post, in many ways - because I'm always banging on about duty of care on livery yards, by the YO, and by fellow liveries.

So if the lady giving the extra hay was genuinely concerned about your horse then whilst her actions may have upset you, she hasn't really done anything wrong - other than top up a hay ration that has been used up.

We had a very good system some years ago, whereby four of us had a system of last person to leave put the hay in. This meant that those on smaller rations because of diets didn't stand for too long overnight when their ration was eaten.
 
FWIW (and sorry if this has been mentioned already), I think people can only give their opinions on his weight once the extra rations have been cut out and we see pics of him as he was before the other livery started feeding him :)
 
OFG said:
I wouldn't do this either. At the end of the day the woman who has been caught giving hay / hayledge to this horse is out of order and has no rights to be doing that. :mad:

No way would I be leaving a haynet out for this woman to be able to continue to give extra forage.

Most horses will continue to eat what is given to them so just because his haynet is empty doesn't mean it should be given more. If I used that philosphy my lot would be hippos :rolleyes:
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Exactly the same with mine, he doesnt know when to stop if he was to constanly have hay on offer he would be seriously obese! This is why he is limited we did try ad lib hay at one point but he just got so fat it was unbelievable
 
amymay said:
So if the lady giving the extra hay was genuinely concerned about your horse then whilst her actions may have upset you, she hasn't really done anything wrong - other than top up a hay ration that has been used up.
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I wouldnt mind this if he was actually underweight but i really dont want him carrying any extra weight as he is seeming prefect condition wise right now
 
OFG and OP - maybe try double netting your hay if yours are good doers, as standing a horse with no forage can cause stomach ulcers. Yes horses need to sleep etc, but on average they spend 16-18 hours grazing. Ad lib/Trickle feeding reduces the chance of your horses getting ulcers. Ulcers are fairly expensive to treat so best avoided!

I have a horse on a strict diet here atm, and I make sure he always has something in his stomach by using a routine like this:
8am bring in from mud patch and give chaff with bute and give handful of hay in double net
at 12 - another handful into net
4pm another handful into net
8pm turn out in mud patch with shelter (there is grass coming through but very little, and he eats it as it comes.

Believe it or not, he still isn't losing that much weight, so I am going to have to look into soaking hay etc.

OP your horse is in tip top condition, lovely seeing him like that. I am suffering the consequences now of my boy having carried too much weight as a youngster before we got him. He now has severe arthritis in coffin joints, hocks and stifles.

I would however cut down feed and up hay.
 
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Inthesticks said:
IMO - I would want a little more weight on him yes, and agree that one haynet a night is not nearly enough for him, not excusing the lady's actions as I would not want her doing it either, but sometimes we feel sorry for horses that are not getting enough,( in her opinion), hay or haylage so people may think they re doing the right thing feeding them a little more.
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Sorry - how many haynets a night should he be getting?! Mine is out grazing all day and then has about 3 squares of hay at night. She's perfectly covered (older horse so not as much demand on her system as this boy). If he's hoovering all his hay up in a nanosecond, maybe get a net with smaller holes, or use a net in a net, so slow him up a bit.

I'd have gone COMPLETELY mental at this woman and demanded that the YO sort it out. How DARE she feed someone else's horse? Disgraceful behaviour.

I think he's just fine (actually he's a bit of a smasher!). He's just how I'd want mine coming into the summer. Too much weight while he's still developing physically could do far more harm than good.
 
tbh if he was mine I would want to see a bit more weight on him so his ribs were covered, but he definately doesn't look massively under weight.
 
I m another who thinks he s underweight. Dont like to see any rib showing. However, if he s in full work [ eg training 2-3 hrs daily at all paces] then I d say he was in 'hard' condition and ok. But to me he s unfurnished- and I d be feeding him haylage behind your back!
 
For those of you saying you want to see more weight on him....Why? Im no expert but from what i know and have been told by vets ect. an ideal weight is when you can just see the ribs and no more:rolleyes:
 
My biggest concern would be that if someone else is feeding him (which is completely out of order without permission) there is little you can do to monitor his intake.

We have one of ours at about this weight and are trying to get a little(!) more on him atm. Had someone come over the other day and have a moan about how he looked very ill and skin and bones... luckily OH is far more diplomatic than me and explained the situation and that he's at a near perfect rate as I just turned the tractor revs up and drowned them out :o

I hate people messing with feed without having discussed it as it makes it very hard to monitor a horses intake properly

Pan
 
Okay people,

So, as above, how much hay SHOULD you give a stabled horse at night? I have a fatty (although to be fair not MASSIVELY fat, but still needs to lose some) he is out Mon-Thurs from 6.30am-6pm where upon he gets brought in, groomed, ridden etc etc. By time this is all done it's about 7.30-8 and I put him to bed. With ONE BIG haynet. His hay is soaked for about 16 hours a day as he has a nasty cough otherwise. He also gets a small feed in the evening.

Is this enough for him considering his field hasn't got loads of grass but I need him to lose a bit of weight? I have gone down before and checked on him late at night and apart from a little bit left in the bottom, he is out of hay. (This was at 10pm)

Fri, Sat and Sun he goes out 24/7 but I still give him the haynet, but a smaller one and his feed.

He has lost weight since I've had him and is gradually fittening up. He needs to lose a bit more and then he'll be at his ideal weight I'd imagine.

So how much hay should I give him at night? Is the one big hayney enough? At the end of the day he's a greedy bugger and if I left 5 nets in overnight, he'd eat 5 nets and would balloon as he is a good doer.

OP- your boy looks fine, he's gorgeous! I wouldn't want him much lighter though.
 
Wagtail said:
I really wouldn't want any less weight on him. If he were mine I would up his hay myself. No excuse, I know for the woman who has been feeding him, but it sounds as though he is pretty hungry, and leaving a horse without forage can lead to troubles and expense along the line that you really do not want to get into! Perhaps you could leave an extra net out for this woman to give him?
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I agree with the above. Not sure what sort of yards some of you are on, but on ours we all keep a look out for each others horses. If one is kicking the door as it has been brought in from the field by someone else (ie last horse not to be left on it's own so has been brought in) and has no hay, then someone will chuck some over. I brought in a friends' horse from the field the other day but as she wasn't expecting it to be brought in (another last horse in the field thing) she hadn't left it with any hay. So I chucked a section over the door. The owner was grateful , not "apoplectic with rage" as some of you seem to be. TBH I would rather someone chucked some over my horses door as at least I know that someone is looking out for my horses. Our yard is in no way perfect, but on reading some of your comments I really wouldn't want to share a yard with some of you!!
OP, on the question of your horse - he isn't seriously underweight - in fact he's a cracker - really lovely horse! But if that is how he is when someone has been feeding him extra and you don't want him feeding by anyone else, then i would double net your hay, or give a small extra net. Good luck with him, he's lovely :)
 
You Wont Forget Me said:
For those of you saying you want to see more weight on him....Why? Im no expert but from what i know and have been told by vets ect. an ideal weight is when you can just see the ribs and no more:rolleyes:
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Theres more to it than ribs. Your horse lacks top line. His neck is too thin he lacks muscle on his quarters and his back most definitely needs more covering on it especially around the saddle area.
I echo the comments above, if he looks like this after being given additional food by someone else then he would have been very skinny if he only had access to what you are prepared to feed him.
He needs more hay , preferably as lib .
 
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amymay said:
Although it's interesting that you're getting mixed opinions on his weight on this thread - much like at your yard:)
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As amymay says mixed opinions,
Probally because at wieght he is it's going to cause no issues but could he be carrying a little more and still be perfectly ok yes so it's a bit down to personal taste,personally I would much rather a horse was on the lean side because it's better for their joints but find it hard to keep mine like that most of the time.
If I would say anything about horse is that it's carrying much less muscle than say my six year old ( I hope I am right remembering its six) but that can be for many reasons one of which could be he's beens using muscle as an energy source but you canot judge that unless you know the horse and what it's been up to.
But hes definatly not seriously underweight on the other hand would a bit of hay harm no of course not but obviously you should not feed someone's horse if you know they have an issue with it.
 
I think he is fine, but would need a little extra, and i mean little, going into winter....i like to see a bit of rib when standing, not all the indentations but a shadow. Mine, including the 16.2 exracer, all have one net a night (different weights to their different sizes) and then a small net with breakfast when the first person up the yard feeds.
 
I think he looks fine for his age and the time of year. People seem to love a "show condition" horse... Anything else is skin and bone.

And as for 1 haynet being too little and causing ulcers, Over feeding a horse can do just as much damage.

I have a fatty, she has recently been diagnosed with ringbone so the vet advised a VERY strict diet so there isn't too much pressure on her joints. She gets 6kg of hay at night in a doubled up small holed net, for those who don't know, 6kg is roughly 1 everage sized haynt. This is also soaked for 12 hours. (she is 16.3hh well built TB)
When she is in over night (winter only) she is out for 12 hours and in for 12 hours. Summer she is on restricted 24/7 turnout. You can just see her ribs, But she is perfect weight and have I nothing but compliments on how much better she is looking now she is no longer fat and dopey.

I have had grief from people about what I feed my horse, a fellow livery once felt the need to "check" my horse when she was in for the day to de-bloat off of the grass last summer and then tell me I was starving her. I did not keep my opinion on that to myself, put it that way!

I choose for my horse to be on a strict diet, but at least she isn't left in agony from her joints (probably something which a previous owner over feeding her has contributed to) if I put a bale of hay in her stable she would eat it so for me, putting 3 nets in for a night would mean my horse would end up fat and crippled, and she would still eat and eat and eat!!!

It is your horse, NO ONE has the right to feed your horse without your permission and I for one would be absolutely fuming!!!! :mad:
 
People seem to love a "show condition" horse
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I don't think anyone here has mentioned that he should have significantly more weight on, or that he should be in 'show' condition.
 
amymay said:
I don't think anyone here has mentioned that he should have significantly more weight on, or that he should be in 'show' condition.
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with regards to this, I am referring to the fellow livery feeling the need to feed the horse in question without permission from the owner.
 
At the risk of getting shot down by the Fat Police, I'd like to see a touch more on him if he were mine. That doesn't mean I think he is 'severely under weight' by any stretch of the imagination, but I don't think he's 'perfect' either.
As others have said, the lack of muscle doesn't help the over all imagine either.
I'd be livid if a livery at my yard were feeding extra rations to my horse behind my back, though. If the lady in question had concerns over your horses weight, she ought to have addressed the issues to you personally before taking such drastic action.
 
Holly Hocks said:
I brought in a friends' horse from the field the other day but as she wasn't expecting it to be brought in (another last horse in the field thing) she hadn't left it with any hay. So I chucked a section over the door. The owner was grateful , not "apoplectic with rage" as some of you seem to be. TBH I would rather someone chucked some over my horses door as at least I know that someone is looking out for my horses. Our yard is in no way perfect, but on reading some of your comments I really wouldn't want to share a yard with some of you!!
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I have done this in the past on my old yard but only with horses it has been agreed that we are happy bringing in etc, otherwise the owner would get a call. I wouldn't want my horse fed without me asking (some treat it and I don't mind, but not hay/haylage/hard feed) as it's very useful to know if your horse is clearing up (rather than old/left overs having been taken out) or leaving some (rather than extra being put down). Same as water etc, with bucket water if I filled anyones up I'd let them know so they didn't worry their horse wasn't drinking.

If someone was going to feed it I'd far rather they feed hay than haylage too.

If I was concerned about a horses weight I'd sit down and talk to the owner, not go behind their backs.

Agree with a lot of the posters re smaller holes or double nets as horses shouldn't be left for long periods without something going through their system.

Pan
 
baker190 said:
with regards to this, I am referring to the fellow livery feeling the need to feed the horse in question without permission from the owner.
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Did the fellow livery say she expected to see the horse in show condition, or that she was just concerned about the general lack of hay.......?
 
He looks better on the last two to me - I like to be able to feel the ribs but not see them :)

if he's wolfing down his hay can't you double up your hay net? Or invest in one of those tricklenets? Have a chat with the woman feeding him too - I too would be livid about it but I'd speak to her and tell her to talk to you if she had any concerns about him in future.
 
You Wont Forget Me said:
For those of you saying you want to see more weight on him....Why? Im no expert but from what i know and have been told by vets ect. an ideal weight is when you can just see the ribs and no more:rolleyes:
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You think he is an ideal weight now? Why then are you going to reduce his feed (which effectively you will be doing by removing what this woman has been feeding him). He will lose weight. Why doesn't logic tell you this? Why do you want to see? He is ONLY JUST the right weight and could not stand to lose more. Also,by leaving him without forage for hours you risk gastric ulcers.
 
Photographs always seem to make horses look a little better covered than they are in reality - therefore I would say that this horse is a little on the lean side.
 
Personally Id want a little more weight on him hes a little too lean for me BUT I wouldnt want him looking in 'show condition' IE big tummy hanging down and apple bum. He could do with a little more covering all over as his neck looks thin compared to the rest of him and I prefer to feel ribs rather than see them :)

He is stunning though and looks to be happy but have to agree with previous who say more than one haynet unless its a massive haynet.

My wee mare (14.1hh) gets one haynet but its two leafs soaked and triple netted so as it lasts her most of the night as shes a good doer :) Anymore and she will get too chunky ;)
 
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