Nappy broncing pony

[bz88]

Hi all. I’m a bit at loss and came here for support and advice. Our pony who we bought just over a year ago always has been very good. In about October last year he started broncing and only does it once in a fortnight especially when ridden in company sand school. You pull him up, kick him forward and he’s good as gold. Instructor labelled as napping or disrespect towards rider saying he trying on. The other day my daughter rode him with her friends and he was really out of character. He was super speedy(he is forward but can be corrected) He bronced three times and ended up bolting which ended in fourth bronc and my daughter fell off. He had teeth done last Wednesday and saddler is coming today. I’m also in process of booking physio or chiro for him or both if needed. When he started broncing I had him checked around November by chiropractor, saddler and vet. Chiropractor found tightness and bit of pain, that was sorted. Saddle fitted. Vet didn’t found anything and labelled as testing boundaries.

Normally he’s good as gold and broncing occurs literally once every fortnight.

After he’s been checked again today and next week I’m considering sending him away to schooling livery or have someone coming to school him at our yard as if is disrespect towards my daughter who might you is a good little jockey(she’s 10 now and riding since she was 4) he totally respects her and myself on the ground. I don’t understand why he’s broncing when ridden in company and he’s absolute star on his own, yes he might still bronc on his own but my daughter drives him forward and that’s it he’s not trying again. It’s only happens in sand school he’s absolutely fine hacking. It’s getting bit embarrassing especially in front of other parents as he’s been labelled as naughty/nasty. I thought he’s school sour so we taking him hacking or local arena hire as much as we can and he’s fine doing that in fact good as gold. It’s getting to the point where I don’t want my daughter riding with her friends. We livery at the yard where riding school is therefore we have instructor on site but she only offers group lessons which my daughter hates as she knows he might bronc. I asked instructor to give my daughter lessons after school but she said she can’t offer that because she got her own thing to do after 4 o’clock so I’m looking for someone to teach her that can come to our yard which I might get looks and whispers but I asked instructor there and she can’t help. She can give my daughter lessons only in school half terms and holidays which is what we do at the moment but I don’t feel is enough. I’m not sure why pony behave like that ridden in group, he’s rushy, his trot gets faster then he falls into canter and when you try to correct him he broncs. He also huffs and puffs and seems stressed( only in group) he’s coming from showing background so he’s surely use to being ridden in groups. Well done if you got to the end.

Any suggestions?

Many thanks

 

[SEL]

Bucking on a soft surface would point me to investigating suspensory ligaments. What investigations did the vet do?

Everything you describe points towards discomfort.

 

[bz88]

Bucking on a soft surface would point me to investigating suspensory ligaments. What investigations did the vet do?

Everything you describe points towards discomfort.

He didn’t do scans but checked him for lameness, back pain, lunged him on hard and soft ect. Just like when vetting. What puzzles me is the fact it’s happening every other week and most of the time when there’s other horses in the arena.

 

[mariew]

I'm guessing it wasn't a true bolt as I'd never get back on one that bolted without an explanation.

Does anything happen next to the arena every 2 weeks for him to react? Is it the same day he does it? I'd go down pain route too before assuming he does it willingly. My old one was a broncher but in hindsight it was probably always a combination of high jinxes/ too much energy and possibly KS or similar.

 

[Red-1]

I would book him in for a full performance work-up.

I took one of mine, who trotted up sound, for one. He managed to show a little less confidence after flexion tests and then lungeing on the hard, in one front leg. It was tiny.

After we started to numb the leg from the foot up, when we got to the suspensory just below the knee, it was obvious. He became animated tossed his mane and did a totally different trot. I believe it had been niggling him all along. Once the niggle was gone, he was elated.

I had a ride, his dressage was tremendous. Although he was sound before, this was a different quality of movement.

I believe, with niggles, sometimes the business can put them over what is already a raised threshold.

Bucking can be dangerous, I would get him booked in, before any physio intervention, but perhaps after the saddle is checked if that hasn't been done recently.

 

[Poppy+MrDarcy]

I posted a thread about excited bucking, and if this is your first spring with him, that could be it. My one does that , and I'm sure most horses go a bit fresh going into spring. But as you suggested I would get a chiropractor out and phisio possibly.

 

[ycbm]

He didn’t do scans but checked him for lameness, back pain, lunged him on hard and soft ect. Just like when vetting. What puzzles me is the fact it’s happening every other week and most of the time when there’s other horses in the arena.

It's called sensory overload and trigger stacking. They have a niggle they can cope with for so long, and then one day you add one bit more stress of some kind and they react.
.

 

[bz88]

I'm guessing it wasn't a true bolt as I'd never get back on one that bolted without an explanation.

Does anything happen next to the arena every 2 weeks for him to react? Is it the same day he does it? I'd go down pain route too before assuming he does it willingly. My old one was a broncher but in hindsight it was probably always a combination of high jinxes/ too much energy and possibly KS or similar.

Literally nothing. Same as everyday that’s why is so confusing. I will book full work up check with vet later today after saddler been.

 

[bz88]

I posted a thread about excited bucking, and if this is your first spring with him, that could be it. My one does that , and I'm sure most horses go a bit fresh going into spring. But as you suggested I would get a chiropractor out and phisio possibly.

That’s my plan. Saddler is coming today. Then physio and I will speak to vet about full work up check.

 

[millikins]

Agree with other posters to check again for source of pain but if nothing found I wonder if he is just school sour? We're at the end of winter, as your daughter's only 10 I expect she's been very limited in what she can do for months, if he's fine hacking he could perhaps just be rather bored?

 

[bz88]

I posted a thread about excited bucking, and if this is your first spring with him, that could be it. My one does that , and I'm sure most horses go a bit fresh going into spring. But as you suggested I would get a chiropractor out and phisio possibly.

Also broncing started in October. He can go month without then he does it every two weeks, it’s like literally with calendar in your hand. He is child pony ridden 4-5 times per week combined with sand school, hacking and arena hire. He is fine hacking or arena hire only does it in our sand school at the yard.

 

[sbloom]

Naughtiness barely exists in horses, I know that sounds bald, bit it's almost always pain or confusion. Yes that time interval makes it confusing but he doesn't know what a fortnight is, so it doesn't make it any more likely to mean he's being naughty. I know you've not really accused him of that but I just want to stress it as some professionals will still dismiss this kind of behaviour.

Keep looking, good luck.

(Oh and it's saddle fitter, you won't be the first or the last but fitters get mildly irritated and saddlers accuse us of pretending to be them, far from it!)

 

[Widgeon]

he was really out of character.

This is the thing that would make me agree with the others about pain. Exploding like that is so out of character for a nice child's pony that I'd be worried. Also this - "he’s rushy, his trot gets faster then he falls into canter and when you try to correct him he broncs. He also huffs and puffs and seems stressed"

I am no expert and can only speak from experience, but my total sweetie of a horse started doing this (the frantic bucking, plus rushing in trot and collapsing into canter in the school) and it was hock arthritis hurting him.

He is fine hacking or arena hire only does it in our sand school at the yard.

How deep does your school ride? If it gets deep patches I would be suspicious of that exacerbating a physical issue.

 

[musk]

I really like the video Sue Dyson did on 24 behaviours that indicate pain/lameness in the ridden horse.
Horses can look sound without a rider but can be unsound with a rider- she recommends always riding at full work ups.
This behaviour indicates pain to me

 

[ycbm]

arena hire only does it in our sand school at the yard.

How do the surfaces differ? Is one deeper/harder than the other?

 

[Poppy+MrDarcy]

Also broncing started in October. He can go month without then he does it every two weeks, it’s like literally with calendar in your hand. He is child pony ridden 4-5 times per week combined with sand school, hacking and arena hire. He is fine hacking or arena hire only does it in our sand school at the yard.

That's a bit odd? But yes go along with the things your going to do, aka physio and the saddler

 

[McGrools]

Just to add i taught at a riding school for years and most of the ponies go up a gear in a group lesson as opposed to on their own. There were a few spicy ones that couldnt go in group lessons because they would always misbehave.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

Also broncing started in October. He can go month without then he does it every two weeks, it’s like literally with calendar in your hand. He is child pony ridden 4-5 times per week combined with sand school, hacking and arena hire. He is fine hacking or arena hire only does it in our sand school at the yard.

Then it seems obvious that there is something about the sand school that bothers him. If not something that happens near/in the school or a particular companion that really only leaves a reaction to the surface. If he is finding the surface troublesome you need a vet before a physio.

 

[bz88]

This is the thing that would make me agree with the others about pain. Exploding like that is so out of character for a nice child's pony that I'd be worried. Also this - "he’s rushy, his trot gets faster then he falls into canter and when you try to correct him he broncs. He also huffs and puffs and seems stressed"

I am no expert and can only speak from experience, but my total sweetie of a horse started doing this (the frantic bucking, plus rushing in trot and collapsing into canter in the school) and it was hock arthritis hurting him.



How deep does your school ride? If it gets deep patches I would be suspicious of that exacerbating a physical issue.

School isn’t deep. We have three schools and one of them is very deep and unusable so no one using it. The one that everyone is using is fine. Another one is being topped up as we speak. I will definitely get vet to check that.

 

[bz88]

Shame I can’t add videos so you all can see. Thank you everyone who took time to read and replied. I will definitely take all suggestions aboard.

 

[Goldenstar]

You really do need to invest in a work up from a vet that specialises in that type of work .
I have had competition horses who where always a handful it was who they where but when a horse starts with this type of behaviour it’s likely going be a soundness issue I would suspect from description hind limb but thats a big guess .

 

[bz88]

I just booked osteopath as physio and chiropractor got waiting list so they might come out in 2-3 weeks.

 

[sbloom]

Shame I can’t add videos so you all can see. Thank you everyone who took time to read and replied. I will definitely take all suggestions aboard.

Can you put up on YouTube or another hosting site and link to them?

 

[bz88]

Great idea

 

[bz88]

Can you put up on YouTube or another hosting site and link to them?

Great idea

 

[bz88]

Sophie Christy-Cook on Instagram

41 likes, 1 comments - sophie_and_wilson on March 9, 2023

www.instagram.com

here is video from instagram

 

[bz88]

Here’s another https://www.instagram.com/reel/Cn9eYGwId5-/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y=

 

[bz88]

Here is from Sunday. Not sure if you be able to view this one as it’s on TikTok with private profile

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMYu2Y3qP/

 

[southerncomfort]

Apologies if you already mentioned this in you first post, but how much turnout is the pony getting?

If the bucking started in October did it coincide with turnout becoming limited? Was their a change in feed? Did the workload drop down?

Also, small ponies have very busy brains and need to be kept active and thinking. More hacking will help, but also think about what daughter and pony are doing while they're in the school.

Is she giving him things to think about from the get go or do they spend a lot of time mooching about?

If none of the above resonates then honestly, I'd cancel the osteo/chiro/physio and book a proper vet work up.

ETA I don't have Instagram or Tik Tok so can't comment on whether pony is sound or not.

 

[bz88]

Apologies if you already mentioned this in you first post, but how much turnout is the pony getting?

If the bucking started in October did it coincide with turnout becoming limited? Was their a change in feed? Did the workload drop down?

Also, small ponies have very busy brains and need to be kept active and thinking. More hacking will help, but also think about what daughter and pony are doing while they're in the school.

Is she giving him things to think about from the get go or do they spend a lot of time mooching about?

If none of the above resonates then honestly, I'd cancel the osteo/chiro/physio and book a proper vet work up.

He’s in at night and out in the day from 7-4 o’clock. He’s actually happy to come in and waiting by the gate from about 2 o’clock every day. They do various things, jumping, flat work, pole work, lateral movement ect. Different things every time not the constant one all the time. He gets jumping once a week.