Navicular diagnosis - 7 months in

Identityincrisis

Identityincrisis

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Sorry this is a major woe is me post!

My 7yr old Anglo was diagnosed with Navicular in April this year, it was a massive blow. He has been a very difficult horse with many issues but I had hoped this would be our year! He had been on and off lame for approx 12 months previous to the diagnosis, after a trailer accident.

I have had him 4 1/2 years now and never really been able to consistently get going with him due to my injuries (caused by him!) and his injuries.

He has been barefoot all his life, i'm very pro barefoot, have a highly respected trimmer and do all i'm supposed to do. Following his diagnosis I have religiously walked him in hand morning and night to help improve his feet, and they have improved significantly and he has been sound since diagnosis but today, I'm sure (can't be certain as no one else to trot him while I watch) that he is lame :'( I find it so disheartening. He is fed up, I am fed up of all the in hand walking. He is difficult to lead in hand which means it isn't enjoyable bonding time.

I find myself resenting him, my old boy was retired 3 years before he died, I bought a youngster with high hopes of enjoying riding him but I've barely had a year of riding (that was the backing process) We are in Winter and I just dread it as I would happily give it up today if I could.

I have told myself he has until April (12months post diagnosis) to 'come right' and stand up to work (it scares the life out of me that he won't!)

I have loved this horse, I believe we could be great but this Navicular and uncertainty is killing me

Please be kind, I know I sound hard and uncaring, i'm not, I'm just struggling
 
Identityincrisis said:
We are in Winter and I just dread it as I would happily give it up today if I could.

Please be kind, I know I sound hard and uncaring, i'm not, I'm just struggling
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1: You can.

2: I don't like it when people feel they have to ward off comments with "I know I sound horrible" etc. You don't sound horrible, you sound fed up as we all would be in your position.

Battling an on-going (and degenerative) lameness is absolutely crap and I think him 'coming' right is being very optimistic unfortunately.
 
it is want it is , horses are often hard work with no reward in terms of fun .
Many of us have been in this situation .
I always try to look at problems like this from the outside .
If you think he’s lame get the vet who had been treating him to watch him and check out that something else is not making him unlevel at this time .
Often buying a horse is buying a dream and it’s very very hard when the reality is not the dream .
I think you feel so bad because you are beginning to think the unthinkable but no one should except you to keep an unsound horse for the next twenty years so put a time limit on all this give it your all until then .
Then with advice from your vet and perhaps a trusted sensible friend decide .
I have PTS several very lovely but unsound horses I will freely admit when all the angst and the run up to the event is over I feel relief.
You feel awful because it is awful and this why you must grasp the good times with horses so hard because there’s always crap round the corner
Not much help here and I can’t think of anything to make you feel better because basically it’s not a nice p,ace to be .
 
Thank you both.

I feel bad considering putting him to sleep because he is so young but I know many, many others have been in the same situation.

A woman at the yard who has no desire to ride, has easy to handle horses and keeps them as pets told me just to keep him as a pet, unfortunately I'm not in a position to do that, nor is he particularly easy to handle, I forgave this when I was having fun riding him.

A much more realistic friend told me to PTS at the beginning of the diagnosis but I wanted to give him a chance.

April 2019 it is. I understand the relief, I felt that when the deed was done with my old boy.
 
It can be so crap when this sort of thing happens with horses, I had one that just wouldn't stay sound tried for 2 years so I so know how you feel.

I think if his still not right after the in hand walking rehab, the only other option you have is turn him away for a year as long as his sound enough to be in a field, sometimes it works sometimes it doesnt with him being a young horse it is an option if you feel like you need to give him the chance.

But I really wouldn't blame you if you decided to pts it sounds like you have been through an awful lot, as horrible as it sounds it is often a relief especially if you have had such a stressful time with it.

How bad is the navicular?
 
I just wanted to add one of mine has very slight changes to the navicular bone he also had inflammation in the bursa, his off side fore is worse than the other one they treated both with osphos and steroid and I took his shoes off and he was just having field rest, it took 9 months for him to come sound so quite a long time considering it's not that severe.
 
Pinky boots- my boy is only slight changes too so you have given me a glimmer of hope, thank you 😊

YCBM- i know you have barefoot rehabbed a few, have you successfully rehabbed a navicular horse?
 
Xray and mri. The first vet was very vague and suggested pedal bone odema (? Sp?) I pushed for a diagnosis and a second opinion and was diagnosed with navicular changes. Had the pedal bone injected and he's been sound since, until he hoolied and slipped last week.

I've gone against vet advice which was pads, gel and shoes.
 
ah ok, I just wondered if you had the soft tissue info.

Of course if he hoolied and slipped the lameness could be unrelated. But I do think that putting a time line on things is sensible, especially if they aren't the easiest character. It's hard work not knowing whether it is going to be ok in the end or not.
 
Identityincrisis said:
Sorry this is a major woe is me post!

My 7yr old Anglo was diagnosed with Navicular in April this year, it was a massive blow. He has been a very difficult horse with many issues but I had hoped this would be our year! He had been on and off lame for approx 12 months previous to the diagnosis, after a trailer accident.

I have had him 4 1/2 years now and never really been able to consistently get going with him due to my injuries (caused by him!) and his injuries.

He has been barefoot all his life, i'm very pro barefoot, have a highly respected trimmer and do all i'm supposed to do. Following his diagnosis I have religiously walked him in hand morning and night to help improve his feet, and they have improved significantly and he has been sound since diagnosis but today, I'm sure (can't be certain as no one else to trot him while I watch) that he is lame :'( I find it so disheartening. He is fed up, I am fed up of all the in hand walking. He is difficult to lead in hand which means it isn't enjoyable bonding time.

I find myself resenting him, my old boy was retired 3 years before he died, I bought a youngster with high hopes of enjoying riding him but I've barely had a year of riding (that was the backing process) We are in Winter and I just dread it as I would happily give it up today if I could.

I have told myself he has until April (12months post diagnosis) to 'come right' and stand up to work (it scares the life out of me that he won't!)

I have loved this horse, I believe we could be great but this Navicular and uncertainty is killing me

Please be kind, I know I sound hard and uncaring, i'm not, I'm just struggling
Click to expand...
Have you joined the Navicular facebook page?? https://www.facebook.com/groups/navicular/

We just had a new mare here with Navicular, yet to do xray (cannot go into detail why we cannot get hold of the old ones.) Our farrier said he can get her sound and has done marvels with a gelding who had problem feet. We not sure when she will get shoes on, it is left to farrier as he will need several months to get her feet right. Can say we had a livery here who had Navicular and he survived till 35 years old and it wasn't that which ended his life, he could not get up. Found him down in stable exhausted. :(

Wishing you all the best
 
ester said:
ah ok, I just wondered if you had the soft tissue info.

Of course if he hoolied and slipped the lameness could be unrelated. But I do think that putting a time line on things is sensible, especially if they aren't the easiest character. It's hard work not knowing whether it is going to be ok in the end or not.
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I am hoping it's the slip and unrelated, trimmer is out in Sunday so I'll cry on his shoulder again!

It's the not knowing! When i got him and he was an aggressive, dominant pig, I said if i had a crystal ball and could see him come right in 3 years time i will happily put the work in, he more or less did then went lame..... bloody horses!!

Thank you everyone, you have made me feel like less of a bad person for putting a timeline on it

Further opinions welcome!
 
Identityincrisis said:
Pinky boots- my boy is only slight changes too so you have given me a glimmer of hope, thank you 😊

YCBM- i know you have barefoot rehabbed a few, have you successfully rehabbed a navicular horse?
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I've personally done three and been involved with a few more. One failure, who had a bone spur on the navicular and just kept on going unsound when she reached a reasonable level of work. One who turned out to be sky high Cushings readings, at ten, and has since been PTS. They can't all be saved, sadly. You are very sensible to put a time limit on things.

I am wondering why you weren't riding if your horse was sound? My own rule is flat or heel first landing, sound in walk, I ride.

Also slightly worried what your trimmer is trimming. Would you like to give us some photos to make suggestions about?
 
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I haven't ridden as he's only just come heel first. I have decided to put riding on further hold as i can only ride at weekends (our indoor school has just had the deepest surface known to man dumped in it!) the hacking often gets dangerously slippy, fine for a sensible horse but mine can be a tool if not ridden consistently. And I've abandoned winter riding previously when both mine and his safety became an issue.

Trimmer is very subtle with his trims, he has good links with Rockley so i trust him. I can get some current pics on Sunday?
 
You don't have the best facilities to help you, do you :( ?

Photos side on and front on with the camera on the floor please!
 
No, but it's the best in the surrounding area 😏 They really ruined the school, i even said please don't make it too deep......! Hopefully if it's nit a bad winter I will start riding in February

I have pics from diagnosis day so I'll do comparison pics. Thank you 😊
 
Identityincrisis said:
Thank you both.

I feel bad considering putting him to sleep because he is so young but I know many, many others have been in the same situation.

A woman at the yard who has no desire to ride, has easy to handle horses and keeps them as pets told me just to keep him as a pet, unfortunately I'm not in a position to do that, nor is he particularly easy to handle, I forgave this when I was having fun riding him.

A much more realistic friend told me to PTS at the beginning of the diagnosis but I wanted to give him a chance.

April 2019 it is. I understand the relief, I felt that when the deed was done with my old boy.
Click to expand...

Please don't feel bad considering his quality of life. If he is fed up and miserable, if you are fed up and miserable, keeping him as a "pet" will not help him or you. Its supposed to be fun at the end of the day and you'll find yourself watching his inevitable deterioration over the years.

I had to make the difficult decision for my beloved mare earlier this year, she was just 11. I spent 18 months doing everything to keep her comfortable. She owed me nothing and I owed it to her to make sure she was paddock sound. Inevitably nothing we tried worked long term, and when she horrifically injured a hind leg on the same side as her arthritic front fetlock I called it a day. Thankfully no one questioned my decision, but it was the hardest decision in the world, but as you said there was an element of relief to not have to watch her deteriorate further.

When/if you make that decision, know that you gave him a decent shot at a comfortable life and be kind to yourself.
 
They don't all come sound, as someone else has said. My sister's gelding has navicular and went to Rockley way back in 2012 I think. His feet and soundness improved so much from being there, but we just really struggled to keep him in consistent work when he came back, which is what he needed. First off we struggled to get the balance of grass/ vitamins/ minerals right to keep him comfortable out hacking, once we got that right he went lame behind which interrupted his rehab (turned out to be hock arthritis), then he developed problems with his SI and THEN he needed treatment for ulcers and wasn't ridden for a while as he wasn't trustworthy while he had the ulcers (bolted and jumped a barbed wire fence).

Every time my sister rode him she was paranoid that something wasn't right, until eventually she decided it was easier just to retire him. He now hasn't been ridden in about 3 years and actually looks wonderfully sound when I see him charging around the field, but no-one has got the will to bring him back into work in case he breaks again! He's also quite complicated as he's tricky to catch, so you can't just get him in and get on.

Fortunately for him, my own mare is nearly 26 and also retired and needs a field companion, so he does at least have a job to do. But I completely understand that feeling when they just won't come right, and the stress of knowing what to do.
 
Can you turn him away? Give him the winter off in a huge, hilly field and see what you have come spring? Your not riding, walking him out sounds awful, so give yourself a break.
 
Leo- he needsto be walked to encourage his feet to keep improving. Thank you, it really is but if by April I'm still in this position, at least i can say i gave him 100% of me which will take some of the guilt away.

Hash - this is what i dread!! I'm an active rider, i ride 4-6 times a week but of course life gets in the way. In summer i was walking him in hand for an hour every night, it wasn't sustainable long term!

Thank you all so much
 
But he will walk in a huge hilly field thats why I suggested it :) I know the ideal is walking on tarmac, but sometimes there are workable alternatives. I know my little mares feet have improved quite dramatically going from small paddock turnout into a big field with a small herd.

Just make sure you dont run yourself into the ground over this. Its not worth it.
 
Identityincrisis said:
Leo- he needsto be walked to encourage his feet to keep improving. Thank you, it really is but if by April I'm still in this position, at least i can say i gave him 100% of me which will take some of the guilt away.

Hash - this is what i dread!! I'm an active rider, i ride 4-6 times a week but of course life gets in the way. In summer i was walking him in hand for an hour every night, it wasn't sustainable long term!

Thank you all so much
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It really is hard and I do feel for you so much. I know walking on the road is the ideal, but I do think Legs' feet have improved a lot just being turned out, so don't necessarily feel disheartened if you end up having to do that for part of the winter. That said, I think it has taken longer this way!

It's so hard when you just want a horse to ride! My sister is really very lucky because I need a companion for my mare and as she adores Legs, it works well. And we can kid ourselves that he's doing something useful!
 
I've had two horses diagnosed with navicular - both working in dressage (one advanced medium) so their careers came to an abrupt end. However, both of them eventually came sound with rest - took about a year - so they became happy hackers. Personally, my suspicion is that they are labelled as navicular when in fact they have deep soft tissue damage that just takes a long time to heal. Xrays will show changes to the navicular bone in lame horses but those same Xrays will show changes on sound horses! If I were in your shoes I would consider turning the horse away if possible.
 
I would be a bit concerned that he has only just started landing heel first. I'd wonder if he would be one that would benefit from some judicious booting and padding?
 
ester said:
I would be a bit concerned that he has only just started landing heel first. I'd wonder if he would be one that would benefit from some judicious booting and padding?
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He was boited and padded until a month ago. It's just his feet don't fit the 'norm' so i had to make do and adapt, my trimmer was happy for me hand walking him like this but knows the horse can have a meltdown at the smallest thing so didn't want me riding in these adapted boots.
 
SEL said:
Nothing to add except I also have one who has spring as a timeline due to soundness issues and it's awful. It doesn't help when they self harm in the field!!
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I'm so sorry you're going through this too.

I have to say if he doesn't come right and after my old boy being retired for 3 years prior to him, I'll be taking a break from horses, i never in a million years thought I would but I've just reached the end of the line mentally
 
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