No, you do not 'love' your horse if...

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Mollylittle said:
Agreed. I have a 35 year old gal here with me who served her whole life faithfully at a riding school, only to be discarded at age 33. She was due to go to the meat-man. I offered her a retirement home and she's still here,happy out, munching away on the filed with my 6 others. I LOVE horses. I don't care if they earn their keep or not.They deserve a retirement just like human beings.And would you know it...it is as if she knows.The most loving old gal ever.:-)
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I find that some animals just know when they have landed on their feet. We have owned many dogs, but one current one (we are her fourth home) has now been with us 8 years and you can really tell just how 'grateful' she is. When we got her she was very withdrawn, but now she is just so faithful and loving. Your old girl sounds lovely and very lucky to have you.
 
Wagtail said:
No one is condemning anyone for putting a horse to sleep when it can no longer work. I just get irritated when the same people say they love the horse. They do not. That is not to say that they cannot love a horse. They just obviously haven't owned it yet.
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You are talking complete rubbish .
Your experiance must be narrower than I thought .
There are many many reasons to pts horses who are no longer working .
Frankly I have no time for people who think that those who don't take their view on this issue don't love and care for their horses .
I don't accuse those who retire horses of thinking more about their own feeling than their horses when they keep old lame horses going limping round the fields and I don't say what I think about sending pampered horses used to being treated as individuals to places like the blood bank because I know there's a range of views about this sort of thing .
 
Who on earth has the right to judge someone else's definition or degree of love? How arrogant!

When my horse can no longer be ridden, he will be euthanised. It will be in his best interest.

When I can no longer enjoy life, I would like to be euthanised. Sadly, it is a privilege denied to me.
 
Akkalia1 said:
I didn't think this was about horses being kept going too long or being medicated just to stay field sound? Those are separate issues and ones I wouldn't do either. It broke my heart when I had to make the decision for my mare. But I know she was a happy healthy (unmedicated) horse up until that point who'd enjoyed her retirement - at the detriment to my bank balance on many an occasion!
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You are right. This thread is not about owners' preferences of when a horse should be put to sleep. That is their own opinion and some people refuse to medicate (and I understand why - I am torn on that issue myself). The thread is also not saying people who put unrideable but otherwise healthy horses are bad owners, or are wrong to do what they choose to do. It is totally their decision and they should do whatever they are most comfortable with. All I am saying is that they have not experienced loving their horse for itself and therefore should not say 'I intend to put my horse to sleep as soon as he can no longer be ridden.' And then go on to say 'I love my horse.' Because you could not possibly do that if you love your horse as a horse and not just an animal to be ridden.
 
Luci07 said:
This opens a can of worms. Horse folk are the absolute worse for being fixed in their opinions and often take very poorly to different views.

I kept, out of choice, my retired mare of a small yard on sort of part livery because she hated living out. She had her own stable which she could choose to use (and did) and a small herd of close friends (2 others). I really struggled to keep her like this but said mare was sound, happy and loving life. She was PTS about 4 months ago as was starting to show signs of confusion and at 30, I wasn't going to start trying to work her up to get to the source. However, I owed this mare big time and loved her dearly. I have had horses that I would not have carried for so long in retirement, so yes, I do understand what Wagtail is saying,
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Thank you. I admit that I did not love every horse I have owned. I have been fond of them all, but truly loved only one. I am on my way to truly loving my current mare, I love her more each day. It's something which grows, I think.

Nothing wrong with choosing to put a horse to sleep so long as it is done properly, and there are loads of reasons, financial, ethical and humane for doing so. But to put a horse to sleep just because it can no longer carry you is not love. But it is also not wrong. Just don't say you love the horse.
 
Wagtail said:
You are right. This thread is not about owners' preferences of when a horse should be put to sleep. That is their own opinion and some people refuse to medicate (and I understand why - I am torn on that issue myself). The thread is also not saying people who put unrideable but otherwise healthy horses are bad owners, or are wrong to do what they choose to do. It is totally their decision and they should do whatever they are most comfortable with. All I am saying is that they have not experienced loving their horse for itself and therefore should not say 'I intend to put my horse to sleep as soon as he can no longer be ridden.' And then go on to say 'I love my horse.' Because you could not possibly do that if you love your horse as a horse and not just an animal to be ridden.
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And I am saying you are talking nonsense .
What gives you the right to judge how much people love their horses .
I would never ever allow one of my horses pass from my care when it was no longer sound I find the idea of doing so repellant on every level .
But I would never say that gives me the right to say those who do that don't love their horses .
 
Wagtail said:
You are right. This thread is not about owners' preferences of when a horse should be put to sleep. That is their own opinion and some people refuse to medicate (and I understand why - I am torn on that issue myself). The thread is also not saying people who put unrideable but otherwise healthy horses are bad owners, or are wrong to do what they choose to do. It is totally their decision and they should do whatever they are most comfortable with. All I am saying is that they have not experienced loving their horse for itself and therefore should not say 'I intend to put my horse to sleep as soon as he can no longer be ridden.' And then go on to say 'I love my horse.' Because you could not possibly do that if you love your horse as a horse and not just an animal to be ridden.
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Who on earth are you to decide what love means?
 
How are you able to say that someone who makes a different choice to the one you would make does not love their horse? They can stand in front of you and say 'yes I do' and what makes you right and them wrong? Your version of life and love with a horse is the one where an owner looks after the horse until it's old age and their version is simply different. Is it cruelty to put an animal down after providing for it during a long ridden career and then not wishing to anymore? Is it cruelty? If it isn't then who is anyone to say they didn't love the horse?
 
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Wagtail said:
Thank you. I admit that I did not love every horse I have owned. I have been fond of them all, but truly loved only one. I am on my way to truly loving my current mare, I love her more each day. It's something which grows, I think.

Nothing wrong with choosing to put a horse to sleep so long as it is done properly, and there are loads of reasons, financial, ethical and humane for doing so. But to put a horse to sleep just because it can no longer carry you is not love. But it is also not wrong. Just don't say you love the horse.
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I can say whatever I like.
 
But unreasonable to suggest to really.

Supposing the current horse is unrideable and they can't afford to keep it until it's dying day and buy another one or can't afford vet fees (since insurance usually exempts things after having to pay out) for any reason for the next ten years until it dies of its own accord?
 
My mother in law kept her dog in a state for twelve months despite my advice and that of the vets and this was all in the name of love. There are owners here who have done the same with their horses after having retired them for 10 years or more. How does that sit with your version of love?
 
Wagtail said:
[sings - cover your ears] What is love...anyway? Does anybody love anybody anyway? :D
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If you didn't have so many posts to your name, I would honestly assume you were a troll. That or a 12yo with nothing better to do in the holidays than stir up a forum with hurtful blanket judgements of those who have made the hardest of decisions. I would hope that reading back over this, you might be ashamed of your pronouncements. I won't be surprised if we differ in our opinion of shame, like we do that of love.
 
Cortez said:
I wish people would love their horses less and take care of them more. IME it is the animal lovers who tend to keep their horses (and other animals) going far, far longer than is kind or reasonable, because they "love them too much to kill them".
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Spot on. Of course it is that bit harder when it is your own animal, but there are far too many left to suffer because the owner can't bear to let them go...
 
I have a horse that is field sound but only 9. I am afraid that he will be being put down before the winter. He has had 15,000 spent on vets fees, but he is still not up to ridden work and there are certainly some psychological issues. He has had a couple of years being a horse in a field with friends and lots of love BUT this could go on for 20 years as he is so young. I find it insulting you would say I do not LOVE him! I have given him more than many would but in can not go on forever. I do not think this is harsh or unloving but actually KIND!
 
piglet2001 said:
I have a horse that is field sound but only 9. I am afraid that he will be being put down before the winter. He has had 15,000 spent on vets fees, but he is still not up to ridden work and there are certainly some psychological issues. He has had a couple of years being a horse in a field with friends and lots of love BUT this could go on for 20 years as he is so young. I find it insulting you would say I do not LOVE him! I have given him more than many would but in can not go on forever. I do not think this is harsh or unloving but actually KIND!
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Well I can believe you love your horse .
 
Whoopit said:
But unreasonable to suggest to really.

Supposing the current horse is unrideable and they can't afford to keep it until it's dying day and buy another one or can't afford vet fees (since insurance usually exempts things after having to pay out) for any reason for the next ten years until it dies of its own accord?
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As I said, nothing wrong in that. If you have to PTS for financial reason, then it would be a very painful decision to make if you love the horse, even if you're just fond of it.

I just think 'love' is a very strong word which people use too lightly. It devalues the word.
 
Wagtail said:
You say you will PTS as soon as it can no longer be ridden.

We all have different views, and it is true that the horse doesn't know it is going to be PTS because when it's dead, it's dead and so long as it is done well, then it is none the wiser. It does not suffer. If the owner has also taken care of it well throughout ownership, then they are a good owner from the horse's point of view. But please, people who state that they will PTS as soon as the horse cannot do its job, even if it is very happy and comfortable not being ridden, you do not love the horse. You love riding the horse and competing the horse and hunting the horse, or hacking, whatever, and you are probably a kind responsible owner, but you do not love your horse. If you really love your horse for itself, as a living, breathing being, then you would keep the horse in retirement, end of.

Now, I am not for one second condemning people who do this. Not one bit. I am just saying that they do not love their horse and they shouldn't state that they do. They care for it and treat it well but they do not know what it is like to love a horse if that is what they think it is.

Also, not all horses are equal. Some get to you more than others. One day they may meet a horse that they really do love, and then to PTS so they can get a new one would be the last thing they would want to do.

Then they will know what it is like to love a horse.
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After spending the afternoon at the vets with my youngster, who I bred myself, out of my wonderful ole girl, I can assure you I love this horse with all my heart. Since the day she was born we have had an amazing bond.

She hasn't been herself, and while waiting with her at the vets it looked like she had navicular and suspensory damage. showing 3/10 lame. I was in no doubt, that if the xrays confirmed that, I would PTS.

To me this would have saved her from living in pain for the next 20 odd years, would it have saved me from pain, no I would have been distraught. But comfortable in the knowledge that I did the right thing by her.

Your post is in bad taste.
 
What a complete & utter load of noncense wagtail...
Loving your horse is about doing the right thing by him or her. Putting to sleep (& being brave enough to make that decision) when necessary.
Some horses aren't able to cope with a non ridden retirement - I know mine wouldn't have done - so I did the honourable thing and put him to sleep. You know nothing about the situation & I'm not about to discuss it on here, but you should keep your sweeping generalisations to yourself!
Loving a horse is about giving it the best possible home for 14 years of his life, with no expense spared. Also an appropriate and dignified end to his life when the time very sadly came.
 
piglet2001 said:
I have a horse that is field sound but only 9. I am afraid that he will be being put down before the winter. He has had 15,000 spent on vets fees, but he is still not up to ridden work and there are certainly some psychological issues. He has had a couple of years being a horse in a field with friends and lots of love BUT this could go on for 20 years as he is so young. I find it insulting you would say I do not LOVE him! I have given him more than many would but in can not go on forever. I do not think this is harsh or unloving but actually KIND!
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So it is a financial decision. Why would I think that is unkind or unloving? If you cannot afford to keep him for 20 years I don't think that is unloving.
 
For me it's about quality of life. Having had 2 horses retire to grass it was a pleasure watching them hoon around, roll about and graze. They certainly didn't seem too bothered about not having a purpose! I got fed up of the comments about having field ornaments, my horse, my money I'll do what I please. The first sign they were not happy with the way things were I had them pts.

What I didn't agree with was a woman I knew who spoke in the most savage of manner about her hunters. "This one is no use anymore, arrange to have it shot tomorrow". Disgusting. It sadly became a running joke with me and my boyfriend at the time, my car broke down one day, he just looked at me and said "shoot it".
 
Wagtail said:
As I said, nothing wrong in that. If you have to PTS for financial reason, then it would be a very painful decision to make if you love the horse, even if you're just fond of it.

I just think 'love' is a very strong word which people use too lightly. It devalues the word.
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you can think things all you like ,you can be curious about why people do and say things but you can't make the judgement that others don't love just because they take a certain course of action with a horse you don't know an owner knows a horse best .
I think retirement is a difficult thing particularly when livery with decent large fields avialable all year round is so difficult to find .
Personally I would not want to keep a old unridden horse in a small paddock alone as is the best many liverys can offer in winter and I would not keep one on hard standings it's is IMO not a stimulating enough situation or offering enough movement for an unworked horse .
I totally understand why many who love deeply pts their horses st the end of their working lives .
 
nicky_jakey said:
What a complete & utter load of noncense wagtail...
Loving your horse is about doing the right thing by him or her. Putting to sleep (& being brave enough to make that decision) when necessary.
Some horses aren't able to cope with a non ridden retirement - I know mine wouldn't have done - so I did the honourable thing and put him to sleep. You know nothing about the situation & I'm not about to discuss it on here, but you should keep your sweeping generalisations to yourself!
Loving a horse is about giving it the best possible home for 14 years of his life, with no expense spared. Also an appropriate and dignified end to his life when the time very sadly came.
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If you read my and other posts I am talking about people putting to sleep JUST because the horse cannot be ridden anymore. Notice I said horses that could happily and comfortably retire. You made the decision based on the knowledge of your horse; that he would not be able to happily retire. That is not the same at all.
 
Asha said:
After spending the afternoon at the vets with my youngster, who I bred myself, out of my wonderful ole girl, I can assure you I love this horse with all my heart. Since the day she was born we have had an amazing bond.

She hasn't been herself, and while waiting with her at the vets it looked like she had navicular and suspensory damage. showing 3/10 lame. I was in no doubt, that if the xrays confirmed that, I would PTS.

To me this would have saved her from living in pain for the next 20 odd years, would it have saved me from pain, no I would have been distraught. But comfortable in the knowledge that I did the right thing by her.

Your post is in bad taste.
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Did you read my OP? Completely different to your situation.
 
Wagtail said:
No one is condemning anyone for putting a horse to sleep when it can no longer work. I just get irritated when the same people say they love the horse. They do not. That is not to say that they cannot love a horse. They just obviously haven't owned it yet.
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who are you to judge others and what they feel ?
 
I think what wagtail is trying to say is you cannot love your horse if you can happily say "this one is broken shoot it so I can have a new one" not those that have horses that are not fit to retire or people who cannot afford to keep them in retirement.
We have become a disposable society where things have no futher use to us are just discarded. I actually agree with her I too have met people who will say they love an animal but will discard it when it is old or needs more than they aer willing to give. Classic as an elderly german shepherd thrown from a moving car. I am sure that family loved him while he was a young and vibrant animal
 
windand rain said:
I think what wagtail is trying to say is you cannot love your horse if you can happily say "this one is broken shoot it so I can have a new one" not those that have horses that are not fit to retire or people who cannot afford to keep them in retirement.
We have become a disposable society where things have no futher use to us are just discarded. I actually agree with her I too have met people who will say they love an animal but will discard it when it is old or needs more than they aer willing to give. Classic as an elderly german shepherd thrown from a moving car. I am sure that family loved him while he was a young and vibrant animal
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no, Wagtail just likes the attention :)
 
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