Obese horses in showing

only_me

only_me

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there is a particular horse in HH today that caught my eye, a beautiful dun highland but seems to be carrying excess weight.

Is obesity in horses in showing declining or increasing? All i seem to see is overweight horses winning classes. Are there any classes in
particular that are more likely to have overweight horses?

Obese horses winning showing classes really annoys me; I find that my horse is always looking very light in showing classes because the others are overweight, whilst he is lean and fit
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There are a few others in HH that are fantastically turned out but again appear to be overweight.


Have to say though, FMM's horse looked stunning
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I think things are improving, but there are still far too many fat horses in the showring. You get articles where producers protest that thir horses aren't fat but that everyone else's are, whilst pictured sitting on an obese horse - I think they need educating sometimes about what constitutes obese and what is acceptable.
 
I must admit i was shocked at one of the horses in the showing section today - it was very obese - i think it was probably the same one as you saw! But then glancing over the rest of the pages in the showing section there were several that caught my eye as being larger (to put it politely) than i would like!
 
This is one of my pet hates and IMO there are far too many obese horses in the show ring. The judges are as bad as the producers IMHO. If you look back at pictures of winning show hunters from the 1950's what was then classed as a heavyweight would look more like one of today's lightweights.
 
exactly, i saw a pic of a heavyweight hunter a few weeks ago in HH and I was shocked! I have never seen a horse that large before
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and surprise surprise, it won its class!!
 
Mrs T you are absolutely right
I just got hold of a copy of Pamela Macgregor-Morriss' book, Champion Horses and Ponies, published in 1955.
All of the hunters, hacks and cobs look fit to run for their lives.
However this was when corn was still rationed, there were few actual 'pleasure' horses, no DIY yards, plenty of old fashioned grooms and NO COMPOUND FEEDS!
 
There was a county/HOYS show horse at a local show I was at recently. Apart from it's obvious quality the thing which really marked it out from the 'normal' horses was it's condition.

It had masses of topline, which had clearly been carefully cultivated but which made it wallow as it moved and it's gut was so huge the riders legs were put in a strange position. So many of these horses in their silly little saldles have riders in a ridiculour armchair seat, with big spurs to enable the horse to feel the rider under all it's fat.

It just looks ridiculous really...
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i think its as much of a issue than ever !!! i took a 3 year old showing at the beginning of this year who imo was up 2 weight but certainly not fat as he is a growing horse, i was place in the middle of the line up and when i asked the judge why? i was told he needed to put on weight!!!! this made me very angry the same horse has now won championships but i would not want to comprimse the health of my horse just for a rosette!!!
 
I had several issues of the Horseman's Year book, all of the winning show horses in there looked fit to go and do their job. There is a huge difference between a well muscled fit horse and a fat one. I know which one I would rather ride
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I struggle to maintain my horse's weight - as a Welsh Cob she only has to look at grass and the pounds will pile on, and I go to great lengths to cultivate a safe bare paddock in spring and summer and to exercise her intensively during this period to keep her weight down.

I took her to a show last summer, and I'd been worrying in the weeks leading up to the show that she was still carrying too much weight - I'd been ill for a couple of weeks and her exercise regime had suffered because of it. We went to the show anyway...

...she was by far the lightest, fittest horse in the M&M class.
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She looked positively svelte and muscular in comparison. None of the other horses had any visible muscle, they were just a series of swells and ripples. Very bizarre.

I noted that a lot of them moved very ponderously and didn't gallop on well at all. We won that class because the judge liked our gallop so much - we were the only ones to freely gallop on and move foward, the other horses hollowed and were reluctant to move on properly.

Off to get H&H now to have a look.
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I think it is very much still an issue. I went to a local show on Sunday and noticed a "well proportioned" horse. It had a very big bum, wobbly crest, my daughter pointed it out (shes only 10 but said "that horse is fat") and sure enough it won it's class!

The problem is, when I was talking to one of the other people in the class, the judge told her her horse would have won if it had more condition!! She did say she wan't going to fatten her horse like a pig just to win.

I know judging is always subjective but fat scoring is less so i.e. you can or can't feel ribs, judges must know if a horse is obese? Maybe now is the time for some more concrete guidlines?
 
well i shot her a filthy look and under no circumstances would i show under her again!!! its something that really gets my goat and its the judge that are fuelling it by placeing the competitors with the fat horse, maybe they need to start placing the less correct horses over the obese ones only then will the messge get across
 
I too think this is really bad and the fact that they keep winning isn't encouraging change is it?! I heard a few years ago that they had brought new guidlines in and judges were being told to inform competitors that their animal is over weight and ask them to leave the ring.... Now, I can't reemember who I heard it off or where I read it but I do remember thinking what a releif.
I too like my youngtsers on the more lean side and build their condition up at their natural pace.
We sold a 3 year old RID to ireland a few years ago and went to watch her compete at one of her first shows in hand. she was a well built mare but again, we had kept her on the more lean side. Well, she looked like a new born next to the other youngsters.. it was disgusting and she didn't get a look in as she wasn't 'conditioned' enough. What chance do these aniimals stand as they progress in life with that sort of condition as a starting block!
 
ooo this is a real pet hate of mine!! My vet recommends young horses are kept on the leaner side due to impact on joints ect, its a no brainer surely FAT HORSE = impaction on legs greater LEAN horse = less impaction on legs!! Why are they so monsterous and can you imagine what they feed these horses as its unlikely to be all muscle. I was with a friend at an inhand sports horse class a few weeks ago and her chap was rising two the judges comment was 'needs feeding as weak topline!!!!!!
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errrm 2 years old unless you feed it like a fattened pig, topline should be muscle built up over a period of time with work/correct protien,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, NOT WITH STARCH AND SUGAR, !!!!

until the judges change their attitude the horses will stay the same if not get bigger!!!!! how scary!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
that's one thing I hate as well, a horse under ages of 3 should NOT have a topline
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that only comes from correct work imo
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I think the horses in this weeks showing reports in HH are a disgrace to the horse world. If you entered an underweight horse that was verging on a welfare case you wouldnt win so why should those that are excessively obese win! I refuse to show my own horse as I want to keep it at a healthy weight and I know that it wouldnt get anywhere in a hunter class unless it was overweight.
 
Mrs T you seem to have my entire equestrian library. I find that the old books are sometimes more illuminating than the new ones.
 
Yes I do so agree!
We are taking our homebred 2 year old to the county show to do the Hunter Breeding class. He is very well proportioned and moves well but has a very natural life - out 24/7 with Hi Fi nuts and a supplement only. He will, I know, look nothing against the big topped 'show' horses but we dont care. He is eventing bred and hopefully he will grow slowly and have many years of active working life after his showing 'career'.

I still think judges should be brave enough to put the 'gross' horses (particularly the young ones) down the line whatever their quality. There is a serious welfare issue here.
 
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that's one thing I hate as well, a horse under ages of 3 should NOT have a topline
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that only comes from correct work imo
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I agree 100%. I too have been on the receiving end of the 'needs to carry more condition' type remarks but only at County level from panel judges!!
I've read letters / comments in HHO from judges claiming that they don't put overweight horses up the line.......but they do, & until the judges start changing their ways then the top producers won't, because they want to win.....never mind the horses long term health / soundness.
I did see about four years ago a county judge who's 2yr hunter winner / reserve champion had no topine & you could see the shadow of its ribcage under it's shining coat. It had the most magnificent frame, moved beautifully, & was of true hunter type. You should have heard the mutters about 'the thin horse' from the ' in the collecting ring !!
 
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Yes I do so agree!
We are taking our homebred 2 year old to the county show to do the Hunter Breeding class. He is very well proportioned and moves well but has a very natural life - out 24/7 with Hi Fi nuts and a supplement only. He will, I know, look nothing against the big topped 'show' horses but we dont care. He is eventing bred and hopefully he will grow slowly and have many years of active working life after his showing 'career'.

I still think judges should be brave enough to put the 'gross' horses (particularly the young ones) down the line whatever their quality. There is a serious welfare issue here.

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Beautifully put, & my youngsters are the same. Heathily covered but not fat, & will hopefully go on to lead actives lives, & forfill their potential.
 
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Yes I do so agree!
We are taking our homebred 2 year old to the county show to do the Hunter Breeding class. He is very well proportioned and moves well but has a very natural life - out 24/7 with Hi Fi nuts and a supplement only. He will, I know, look nothing against the big topped 'show' horses but we dont care. He is eventing bred and hopefully he will grow slowly and have many years of active working life after his showing 'career'.

I still think judges should be brave enough to put the 'gross' horses (particularly the young ones) down the line whatever their quality. There is a serious welfare issue here.

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This is the same as my two year old (except he has minimal amount of hard feed because the grazing is so good). Last year at the same county show he got a special rossette for the best small hunter yearling but was bottom of the line in the comp horse class because he wasn't as 'mature' as the others. WTF? hes a yearling! its disheartening to be beaten by something with cow hocks just because the judge can see ribs!
 
ps has anyone got a pic of the highland? (am too poor to buy my own copy!)

this is my friend two year old colt;
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as you can see he is on minimal grazing yet he is still rotound so it is very difficult to keep the weight off of them!
 
It really saddens me to watch some of these show classes especially the hunters! I will be showing my horse in the hunter classes this year and was told by someone who DOES show that "oh you wont get placed as you can see his hip" WTF i'm sorry but my horse is fit (although admittedly carrying to much podge) and I'll be damned if I fatten him up to the point of gross obesety just to get a rossette!

I am going to the suffolk show this year and will be making a point of commending anyone in the show classes whose horse is in GOOD condition.

It is a sad sad state of affairs if you ask me and SOMETHING needs to be done for the welfare of these horses
 
Recently I've been shocked at the number of clearly obese horses doing well at shows. A Welsh stallion with rippling fat was placed top of a very large breed class at a show I was at at the weekend.
I feel my horse is overweight and am trying to get him to shed the excess pounds even though my vet says his weight is fine.
Obese horses doing well in the show ring leads the everyday rider and owner to believe that 'fat' is ok, when having a fat or obese horse can lead to health problems etc...
 
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Please, just remember that if you are wanting to event your horse, then he needs to be a completely different shape to a show horse - it is obvious that a show horse does not have the requirement to be as fit as an eventer (just think of the amount of working in some of the sharper types would need!). And it is not in the best interest of a show professional to overtop their horse as it does (as you have rightly said) have repercussions on their limbs.

Many of our old showing horses are still going strong well into their teens competitively, and when older, have been passed on loan to racing trainers (for example) as their hacks. This can't be the case if they have been overfed and have poor or damaged limbs. Equally, a show horse should have clean legs, so overweight horses getting splints is again pretty pointless for a showing professional.

Some horses LOOK fat but if you are experienced you can see whether they are grossly overweight or simply a bigger type of horse (such as a cob or a HW hunter) that needs to carry more weight to fill the frame.

A horse that is overloaded at the shoulder will NOT be able to move well, and therefore not win classes.

It is often the amateur owner who thinks they can cover up conformational defects with excess weight that is the culprit.

It bothers me that some people who think their horses look perfect actually have them quite underweight and poor, and what these people think is muscle and fitness is simply all that is left of the horse as there is no weight being carried.

Interesting, at Badminton this year, I noticed that many of the horses were carrying more weight than usual - don't quite understand why - perhaps there are not so many TB types taking part and therefore these horses are naturally better doers and better covered than the standard TB - any ideas?

Taking our yard into account, our pro rider comes from a background of breaking racehorses (( believe she was the first person to sit on Dancing Brave), the family has evented to a very high level and she is now one of the country's top show riders and producers. Yes, we sometimes get it wrong and get a horse fatter than it should be - just one night in the field can blow one up to elephant proportions. Each horses' diet is strictly monitored, but a sudden growth in grass is harder to predict. Bear in mind also, that some horses look great in the flesh and in pictures look thinner or fatter - just as people don't always look the same in a picture as they do in real life. Our horses are assessed DAILY - that is every single horse on a yard of 30 or so - and they are not only assessed, but discussed and feeding changed as required. How many people do that on a daily basis with their own horses?

Look at people and assess your horse in a similar way. Wobbling is not good, but it will not kill you. Obesity is bad for humans and horses. People are built on different frames and carry their weight differently. Small boned people don't carry weight as well as large boned people - equally a large framed person looks ridiculous if they are so slim that their bones are showing.

I am rambling on a bit here - but I do (as you all know) get really frustrated at a few horses being singled out as overweight and people saying their horses are marvellous but not placed because they are too thin. Sorry, but I don't think life is as simple as that.

And if you don't want to come down the line with your "perfect" horse, and you KNOW you won't get placed with your perfect horse because you don't want him overtopped, then don't enter a showing class. There is just no point. Wait until your horse is older and then make the decision whether to show or not. Showing is not compulsory - and if you don't think you want to go down that route, then choose another equestrian discipline in which to take part.

Note : I am NOT referring to anyone else on this thread with the above comments - just generally listening to people at shows and on other forums.
 
lol fmm! I agree with you completely, and I understand that different types of horses carry different amounts of weight - but there is a point when there is too much weight being carried. Fwiw, I thought that the highland was really the only one I thought was grossly overweight
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And fmm, I thought your horse looked amazing!

What I had posted about was really if obese horses were were still wining clases, and are mm types more likely to be fat because they r good doers
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Wow FMM how long did it take you to write that?! But you've made some interesting points.

I disagree that a horse fit enough to event will be a completely different shape to a show horse and therefore not do well, what about working hunters, they majority are fitter than a low level eventer, and rightly so.

Also its the inconsistancies from one judge to another that get to me, but then showing is at the end of the day all about one persons opinion and I think alot of people resent that.

I also agree that horses can look completely different in magazine photos than they do in the flesh just change the angle slightly and you can make a horse look huge!
 
With regard to the original comment which referred to a native I think there is a particular problem with weight and natives perhaps moreso than any other showing class.

I have a native who has come out this season at county level and was well covered though by no means fat - she had nice topline but needed to fill out behind the saddle. I knew she needed more condition on her to be classed as 'in show condition'. After one show a few weeks ago (she won) a friend of a friend who is a well respected and experienced judge of native classes said my pony needed 'a boatload' of weight on and that she shouldn't be shown until she 'piled on an awful lot of beef'! In essence he was saying the pony needed to be obese!

I repeated these comments to a friend who breeds natives and she said - I know it's wrong but if you want to win it's what you've got to do.

I am aware that native ponies tend to be naturally 'well covered' and that it can be hard to keep the weight off them but I think that obese native ponies in the ring should not be encouraged. I watched one class recently where a Welsh Cob (that has been VERY succesful at top level) was making noise in canter -so fat it was thick in its wind - and heard the owner comment - 'oh all welsh cobs make that noise' !

Sadly Ican't see anything changing in the near future
 
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