Ok, DRESSAGE RIders/horses and Hacking???

[Firewell]

Wasn't it Murphy Himself that could not be hacked. They used to have to lead him off another horse to take him out and they had to box him to the gallops, they couldn't hack him there as he was such a nightmare.
He was an event horse so to me it depends on the horse. I know lots of dressage riders who hack their horses and one or two who don't.
I wouldn't risk my life if the horse was an absolute nutter to hack.
I don't really mind if people do or don't hack their horses. It's not as if these horses are being abused or anything. I think those awful pictures of the Egypt horses and are more worthy recipient of a rant.

 

[ihatework]

I think 'dressage horse & rider' to describe me might be pushing the boundaries but my main discipline now is dressage and hopefully one day to a decent standard. I hack out, always have and always will. I wouldn't buy a horse that wouldn't hack reasonably sanely.
My 5yo is actually better hacking on his own and he goes out 2-3 times a week, he is very forwards out hacking and I take the oppertunity to move him around laterally a fair bit.

I've worked on a pro sj yard and 90% of the horses never hacked and the 10% that did only went out about once a month. They barely went in the field either. Personally I thought it was a horrid way to keep a horse but the horses were brainwashed/instituionalised(sp) and couldn't mentally cope with being taken out of the stable-school-stable routine. Very sad.

 

[Baydale]

Their will always be exceptions to the rule but it is unusual to find a horse confident and happy to hack solo competing as a 'dressage' horse.

And why is that, do you think? I'm not being provocative here, just curious, particularly as I've got some work on at the moment hacking a dressage horse.

 

[PaddyMonty]

And why is that, do you think? I'm not being provocative here, just curious, particularly as I've got some work on at the moment hacking a dressage horse.

I have a theory and it's that DR horses are not exposed to noise etc very much. Yards always seem quiet and god forbid anyone should whisper more than 3 words during a test or dare move more than their little finger. Compared that to the noise and generally chaos at SJ and BE comps and it starts to make sense. Big wide world becomes a scary place when horse is normally wrapped in cotton wool and handled with kid gloves.

 

[Booboos]

Mine hack about twice a week each although they haven't hacked a lot in the last 6 months due to my pregnancy.

R I only hack in company, he will go out alone but he is too much for me and every so often scares the life out of me. He will happily canter in fields but for the last 4 years we have lived in places where there was only roadwork. He hates jumping so we don't do it.

F will hack alone and in company, he is equally nappy either way! He will happily canter in fields but as above. He gets jumped a couple of times a month just a few cross poles for fun, but it's usually my groom who does it as I don't like jumping.

As the years go by I am going more and more off hacking as I am forced to do it on the roads and have had a few too many close calls with insane car drivers. We have a little loop on our land which takes 15 minutes to do and more and more I find myself happy to stay on that.

 

[dressagecrazy]

Mine Hack & have to Hack alone i very rarely have company & tbh they are normally worse in company.
My WB didnt hack when i bought him so it was a bit hairy for a while but i sat tight lol.
My PRE also hadnt hacked he was 3yo when i bought him he's now 4 & hacks alone.

I dont really like hacking but i do it 2x a week, i also use neighbours 100acres for a good blast round as well. I used to event ( many years ago now) so i cant quite get out of the habit not cantering at least around a field lol.
My lot go out on average for 9-10hrs a day & are T/O everyday even in the worst weather.

 

[ThePony]

We 'do' dressage, not to any world beating level mind!!

We only school in the school twice a week. Usually one lunge per week and the rest hacking. From stretchy 1hr hacks to 3 plus hrs fast hacks. Keeps her maj happy, forward thinking and fit. We school on hacks too, not in anything like a comp outline all the time, but def no giraffing or slopping along either. She will hack in company or alone, although alone the hacks are a little more sprightly!

I think it is because she wasn't brought up as a comp/dressage horse and so has had a hacking/seeing the world education straight from the off. So even though we train in a particular disapline, she hasn't been cosetted and treated in a particular way because of this or in order to develop in this area.

I do wonder at the particular treatment some 'comp' horses recieve compared to normals! There are quite a number on our yard who stable elsewhere for part of the year and totally expect that because they are on yards particularly sold as comp yards that they have v little turnout (if any), no adlib fibre and regular spins on the horsewalker in place of turnout. Hacking is v little if any and is only short in duration and expecting a school outline at all times. I find it rather an outdated view tbh. Whatever sport you follow, the needs of a horse are the same! I just think that those brought up with serious sj/dressage in mind often get less of an all round education, and keeping a sane head while hacking is one of the things that suffers as a response to this.

Like others have mentioned, I do think dressage horses can be rather wrapped up, and total silence and stillness can be expected when competing rather than developing the horse's brain to deal with slight interuptions as well as concentration on school work and building the muscles.

Admit that is easy for me to say as my mare has a mindset that makes this easier to deal with - she can be an arse at spooks, but if she was always ready to bubble over I might well change my mind and just want everything to stay silent in order to achieve a nice test and horse/rider staying together for the duration!!

 

[Winklepoker]

I feel I should hack more, but then some days I just wonder why I am bothering He gets upset on his own and I just cant be arsed with it! I want to enjoy my horse and I want him to enjoy our rides, why ruin it with anxious hacking If I decide to take him XC next year we will hack more to build stamina but not until then will I bother too often

 

[Worried1]

And why is that, do you think? I'm not being provocative here, just curious, particularly as I've got some work on at the moment hacking a dressage horse.

I think it's because the trend now is to have horses much sharper and as a result are more reactive than they used to be.

A decade ago warmbloods were often poohpoohed for being a bit thick and lumbersome, you would never have evented one or seen one in the show ring - how times have changed. We have bred more blood and fire and as a result we see horses much hotter.

I would agree that noise also in an influencing factor too. We try not to have a sterile environment and my dad certainly makes his presence felt with his various bits of equipment and machinery!

Having said all this I still believe that hacking in pairs is beneficial for the most. I would NOT in any cirmcumstances hack Arthur. But Baydale if wanna ...

 

[Tempi]

I think it totally depends on the horse, some horses just hate hacking and get more stressed out by it and at the end of the day its not worth risking injury to them or yourself. My old horse was a nightmare to hack, even in company, he didnt mind traffic (was perfect with all traffic) but he just got so stressed out that it would blow his mind. I persevered for ages with him, but neither I nor he really enjoyed it. However if i could get him to the nearest stuble field (always a battle to get there) he did love a good gallop around it. Equally once he had stopped stressing himself out and going backwards/sideways and on two legs around the gallops he was then quite nice to have a lovely canter on.

My mare was competing at medium, won at the Winters and i used to hack her out once or twice a week, shes a saint to hack (apart from the odd buck/squeal). My 3yr old im now breaking in also enjoys hacking and will hack around the gallops on the farm on his own and will go around the lanes with someone else on another horse quite happily and is perfectly behaved in traffic.

I think aswell some of it is due to up bringing, hacking IMO needs to be introduced from a young age - i was leading my now 3yr old out for little walks as a yearling and he got used to traffic in the car park at the yard at that age aswell, and out at shows etc.

 

[not_with_it]

I try to hack out once a week but always in company. Gin is not good hacking alone and I would rather not be a danger to members of the public.
She is naturally a hot spooky horse and is worse when shes fit, which is why I like to go with a friend who has a sensible horse who can box me in if needed.

At the end of the day Gin is still a horse. She lives out 24/7 in summer and goes for a good gallop when we do hack out.

 

[Louise_88]

I find it very interesting aswell. I have a dressage horse who evented to begin with so had to do the hacking, jumping, galloping and the busier competitions and he is fab to hack. he is sharp and not a Dumb blood donkey but hes safe to hack, jumps every week/fortnight, hacks 1-2 times a week and goes for a blow out every now and then when the ground is good. He is schooling at Advanced and competing at Medium. He also goes out in the field for most of the day with another horse and jumps into whatever field he wants (shock horror!!) although i would rather he didn't do that lol.

I have also done abit of eventing and have to say the amount of time a dressage horse has to spend in an arena schooling, compared to an eventer is very different. Eventers can get away with not going quite so well on the flat, you can hide alot in a test and still get a fairly good score but you can't do that in pure dressage (mostly anyway) so have to spend more time IMO in the arena so less time for hacking. This is just my opinion though and I am by no means a pro dressage rider or eventer.

 

[Santa_Claus]

IF I remember rightly Mr Hester hacks (well his grooms do) almost all his horses. I would call them dressage horses I think

Infact as proof his routine says they are hacked twice a week!!

http://www.carlhester.co.uk/Home/DailyRoutine/tabid/63/Default.aspx

 

[Kokopelli]

I know someone with a youngster potential GP dressage horse. He really is amazing.

Anyway she hacks for hours on end going for canters on a loose rein, she always wears a hat to ride, she isn't concerned with all this matchy matchy sparkly stuff and god forbid her horse doesn't even wear boots/ bandages.

She really is a breathe of fresh air though.

 

[xspiralx]

Interesting comment about warmbloods now having more "blood and fire" and therefore not being suitable for hacking - but it doesn't really wash with me.

It would surprise me if most dressage horses had more 'blood and fire' than a fit racehorse or eventer - both of which types generally go out regularly.

Perhaps it is more that these horses simply aren't hacked much as young horses - therefore it never becomes routine, but becomes something scary and stressful.

 

[-Cadence-]

Rossi gets to hack - the other day we were joined by a fox! - once or twice a week. It helps us both chill, and so long as you don't take uneccessary risks with the ground etc it's no more dangerous or risky than schooling

 

[FrodoBeutlin]

The problem is not dressage horses, it's dressage riders. Dressage riders are the epitome of narcissism. Please tell me, what is the point of hacking out if the only person who can see you is the odd farmer driving a tractor?!?

Secondly, dressage riders are completely dependent on mirrors. As far as I know, nobody has yet invented mobile mirrors that you can take along on a hack, allowing you to continuously check your seat and the horse's outline. This clearly makes hacking out unsustainable.

Thirdly, where would we put the Trainer? Most dressage riders are unable to ride without a Trainer, possibly with an accent, sitting on the bench in the corner of the indoor, and a two-way radio system firmly secured on the (patent) boot. To be honest the two-way radio systems cover such a limited distance that they're not really viable on hacks (there clearly is a niche in the market for fake two-way radio systems with pre-recorded messages such as "more flexion", "less angle", "one-two-three, two-two-three, three-two-three" and so forth)

These are just examples, there are plenty more reasons such as the risk of getting mud on your patent Koenigs, the risk of your Swarovski-encrusted gloves/helmet/spurs being struck by lightning in the case of a sudden storm, the risk of your horse's oversized browband being caught in a low branch, etc.etc.etc.

 

[ester]

 

[mtj]

FB you are just not trying hard enough!

I have the Anky amber pad on order - should go very nicely with the hi-viz.

Mirrors - this can be assisted by encouraging your fellow liveries to clean their lorry windows. They are just the right height mounted on a warmblood.

 

[Worried1]

The preparation of eventers and showjumpers is that they are by the nature of their fittening and competition environment exposed to far more, therefore hacking is not suc a big deal. Showjumping shows tend to be bigger so distance from lorry to rings or arenas is greater, they see 'more'. Eventers tend to have to hack from the lorry park to their dressage arena. showjumping ring etc.

At Hickstead this year for the Masters Semi-final there was a lot of muttering because horses had to leave the lorry park head away from the arenas, hack down the road running alongside the A23 and then head into the warm-up from the front.

For Winston this was not an issue as he is regularly hacked in company but some horses were clearly upset by having to 'hack' to the warm-up!

I do still believe that Warmbloods definitely are hotter now than they were a decade ago.

Racehorses are conditioned to 'hacking' right from the word go. I assume if people took the time and trouble to do the same, as we have done, 'dressage' horses would hack with more regularity and less fuss.

There will always be horses who don't hack whether they are an eventer, a show jumper and I'm sure there must be the odd racehorse out there who doesn't fit your typical stereotype.

Blitz has been hacked and ridden around fields from when we first got him at 3. As a result I feel he is much more secure in his outlook and copes exceptionally in any circumstance - however this is a reflection of his training which has included hacking.

 

[MadisonBelle]

FB! Classic :

I have a warmblood, imported from Holland and she wasn't very keen to hack at all! I would go with a friend then the very next day I would hack alone, okay so I had my 2 dogs The next hack would be in company, and then solo etc..... Now she is superb! I much prefer hacking alone as can do what I want when I want. Sometimes I may ask for some lateral work, other times she is having a lovely loose canter on the buckle! I got her at 4 and she is now 5.

I do think hacking is an important part of the overall picture no matter what discipline is being done but of course not all horses are happy which is a shame as it's probably been caused somewhere along the line by human error at a very young, impressionable age either by being pushed too much or by not being shown the world as a true youngster (ie yearling to breaking)...............

 

[kerilli]

I know someone with a youngster potential GP dressage horse. He really is amazing.

Anyway she hacks for hours on end going for canters on a loose rein, she always wears a hat to ride, she isn't concerned with all this matchy matchy sparkly stuff and god forbid her horse doesn't even wear boots/ bandages.

She really is a breathe of fresh air though.

Wow. They'll sack her from the Dressage Queens' Guild though, you should warn her...

fwiw my dressage trainer, who is based in Germany, often says that out hacking is the best place to school horses. he teaches in arenas (obviously!) but does, iirc, most of the work on his own horses out hacking.
i've seen pics and heard stories of top U.K. dr riders using gallops to train their horses - e.g. seeing other horses go past fast encourages the horse to want to go really forwards which can be channelled into, say, passage, or extension... using the horse's natural inclination rather than having to create the energy with the aids.

 

[Puppy]

The problem is not dressage horses, it's dressage riders. Dressage riders are the epitome of narcissism. Please tell me, what is the point of hacking out if the only person who can see you is the odd farmer driving a tractor?!?

Secondly, dressage riders are completely dependent on mirrors. As far as I know, nobody has yet invented mobile mirrors that you can take along on a hack, allowing you to continuously check your seat and the horse's outline. This clearly makes hacking out unsustainable.

Thirdly, where would we put the Trainer? Most dressage riders are unable to ride without a Trainer, possibly with an accent, sitting on the bench in the corner of the indoor, and a two-way radio system firmly secured on the (patent) boot. To be honest the two-way radio systems cover such a limited distance that they're not really viable on hacks (there clearly is a niche in the market for fake two-way radio systems with pre-recorded messages such as "more flexion", "less angle", "one-two-three, two-two-three, three-two-three" and so forth)

These are just examples, there are plenty more reasons such as the risk of getting mud on your patent Koenigs, the risk of your Swarovski-encrusted gloves/helmet/spurs being struck by lightning in the case of a sudden storm, the risk of your horse's oversized browband being caught in a low branch, etc.etc.etc.

Brilliant!

 

[Halfstep]

FB ha ha ha! Genius!

I'm lucky, my dressage horse adores hacking. But when I first had him, he'd never been hacked and teaching him took a bit of time and patience, as he'd panic and spin and rear. I persevered as I felt that it would be good for him to learn, and one day he just seem to twig that hacking was fun as it wasn't *work*. And since then he's been a complete dream to hack out on, even jumps some small xc fences (in a dressage saddle, double bridle, patent, crystals, Konig boots, the lot!) and canters happily in an open field. However, I have never, ever allowed him to gallop under saddle, because I feel that if he learned to really let rip, I'd lose the nice relaxation I have on a hack. It is extremely good for proprioception for horses to be ridden on different surfaces and uneven ground - always being on manicured footing actually is detrimental to tendons and ligaments.

 

[Perfect_Pirouette]

The problem is not dressage horses, it's dressage riders. Dressage riders are the epitome of narcissism. Please tell me, what is the point of hacking out if the only person who can see you is the odd farmer driving a tractor?!?

Secondly, dressage riders are completely dependent on mirrors. As far as I know, nobody has yet invented mobile mirrors that you can take along on a hack, allowing you to continuously check your seat and the horse's outline. This clearly makes hacking out unsustainable.

Thirdly, where would we put the Trainer? Most dressage riders are unable to ride without a Trainer, possibly with an accent, sitting on the bench in the corner of the indoor, and a two-way radio system firmly secured on the (patent) boot. To be honest the two-way radio systems cover such a limited distance that they're not really viable on hacks (there clearly is a niche in the market for fake two-way radio systems with pre-recorded messages such as "more flexion", "less angle", "one-two-three, two-two-three, three-two-three" and so forth)

These are just examples, there are plenty more reasons such as the risk of getting mud on your patent Koenigs, the risk of your Swarovski-encrusted gloves/helmet/spurs being struck by lightning in the case of a sudden storm, the risk of your horse's oversized browband being caught in a low branch, etc.etc.etc.

 

[amandaco2]

mine are out in day in at night or visa versa in hot weather
they do a varity of work including lunging, free schooling, jumping/poles, loose jumps, gallops, hacks...
normally they do a schooling session 2-5x week. rest of week is 'other' work

 

[humblepie]

Not a dressage rider although slight claim in that have lessons from a PSG rider but my decent level show horse gets hacked out as it is hugely educational and fortunately we have plenty of private roads where you can do sideways stuff and school. Whatever we meet out hacking we have probably met worst at a county show, since yet to meet a four in hand western style mail coach or the imps motorcyle display team when out hacking. Fully understand though that some horses do not enjoy hacking and are not safe to do so for whatever reason.

 

[dressage_diva]

i've seen pics and heard stories of top U.K. dr riders using gallops to train their horses - e.g. seeing other horses go past fast encourages the horse to want to go really forwards which can be channelled into, say, passage, or extension... using the horse's natural inclination rather than having to create the energy with the aids.

I'm fairly sure Emilie Faurie has all weather gallops at his yard so I'd imagine he makes use of them with his dressage horses (unless they're just for the liveries). Gareth Hughes also has "canter tracks" at Aspen Grove. Perhaps in the UK more pro dressage riders are coming round to the idea of hacking (like someone else said Carl Hester definitely hacks)?

 

[Worried1]

Emile does have a canter track and often sends Mr Worried round it when we visit!

 

[Lolo]

To be fair, I think horses are a bit like people in that some have things they can't deal with and often these 'bad' traits can be focussed into something very good.

For the average amateur/ just-breaking-through pro who doesn't have 10 horses in training and endless facilities, why spend years teaching your horse to hack when it's having a nice time the way it is. FWIW, unless he's on a 'galloping' hack where Al does fast work with him Reg spends his hacks on the bit, to the same degree he would in a school. What difference is the location of this schooling session making?