Opinions on changing working pupil positions??

SilverLy

Active Member
Joined
10 July 2019
Messages
32
Visit site
Hiya,
Be prepared for a ramble!
I was wanting an opinion on a slight dilemma that I’m currently facing. In September I started working as a working pupil at an absolutely fantastic dressage yard (one of the best GP yards). I have learnt so much about riding in the past 5 months and I’m incredibly grateful to them for helping me through all the very sticky phases with my youngster.

However dressage isn’t what I want to be doing in the future as I want to event my young horse. I’m trying to start taking her to jumping lessons at a really good event yard 45min away but as I currently cannot drive a trailer and horse transport is OBSCENELY expensive there is a limit to how often I can take her (which is a problem if I want to take her eventing this season). I have now noticed this event yard is looking for a working pupil to take on. They offer frequent lessons, XC schooling, taking you to 5* events, etc. PLUS a wage which I do not currently receive. To me this seems an incredible opportunity.

My question is: what should I do? I take my dressage very seriously and I would also feel guilty about leaving the gp yard so soon as they struggle at this time of year. I suppose another option is to go to the event yard for the season (I believe that’s what they advertise) and then go back to the dressage yard for the winter which I’m sure they’d love as that’s when they need people. I’m not too sure about the logistics of that tho.

I’m so sorry for the long post and I don’t blame any of you if you skipped it!
Thanks xx

TLDR : should I change from dressage yard (with no pay) after five months to event yard job opening (with pay) as eventing is what I want to do?
 

Leandy

Well-Known Member
Joined
4 October 2018
Messages
1,540
Visit site
Yes if eventing is your long term goal, absolutely. You have however identified one potential flaw here which is the possible seasonality of the eventing position. Will they want you to stay next winter, if all goes well, or do they routinely take on extra staff for the season only? If so, you need to think about how that will work. I don't think the dressage yard will have any issue with you so long as you give proper notice and aim to leave on good terms. It happens all the time.
 

gallopingby

Well-Known Member
Joined
17 January 2009
Messages
1,628
Visit site
Interesting close read. You say trying to go for jumping lessons so how many have you been for and would you definitely be offered the job? Six months is a reasonable time to stay in a training position although a year would be better. You def need to leave the door open to return is need be, the world is very small but also it’s good not to have all your eggs in one basket.
 

SilverLy

Active Member
Joined
10 July 2019
Messages
32
Visit site
Yes!
You don’t owe them anything, so don’t let guilt keep you there. They’ve had months of free labour off you!

You absolutely should have been paid. This is ringing all kinds of alarm bells.

I did get free accommodation, food, lessons every day and livery so I guess that makes up for it. They are an excellent yard so I don’t mind too much in that sense.
 

SilverLy

Active Member
Joined
10 July 2019
Messages
32
Visit site
Yes if eventing is your long term goal, absolutely. You have however identified one potential flaw here which is the possible seasonality of the eventing position. Will they want you to stay next winter, if all goes well, or do they routinely take on extra staff for the season only? If so, you need to think about how that will work. I don't think the dressage yard will have any issue with you so long as you give proper notice and aim to leave on good terms. It happens all the time.
To be honest I haven’t thought it through completely yet as it’s just an idea - I don’t want to be impulsive! :) I don’t think I’d come back for the whole winter - maybe get a couple of weeks off for the training at the dressage yard. I appreciate all the thoughts on the potential problems!
 

SilverLy

Active Member
Joined
10 July 2019
Messages
32
Visit site
Interesting close read. You say trying to go for jumping lessons so how many have you been for and would you definitely be offered the job? Six months is a reasonable time to stay in a training position although a year would be better. You def need to leave the door open to return is need be, the world is very small but also it’s good not to have all your eggs in one basket.

I’ve been going to clinics and lessons for the past few weeks and have been figuring out that doing this for much longer will be too expensive - especially on no pay. I’m going again to talk to the other yard this week hopefully - but I believe there’s a good chance of getting it. However as I’ve said in another reply I’m not making any rash decisions - as you said, I really don’t want to burn any bridges!
 

Goldenstar

Well-Known Member
Joined
28 March 2011
Messages
46,020
Visit site
Go for it , it’s a no brainer .
i would love to know how they legally have you working for no wage on your current yard .
if eventing is your love go now you can come back to dressage later
 

SilverLy

Active Member
Joined
10 July 2019
Messages
32
Visit site
Go for it , it’s a no brainer .
i would love to know how they legally have you working for no wage on your current yard .
if eventing is your love go now you can come back to dressage later
I do get free livery, two lessons a day and accommodation but it does make it a bit hard with no extra cash. But I really do like it here and they’re good people:)
 

Goldenstar

Well-Known Member
Joined
28 March 2011
Messages
46,020
Visit site
They cant withhold more than a certain amount for your housing I think it’s just under £60 a week .
how many hours do you work ?
the training is a considerable perk I am most sure how off setting that now a days .
Over forty years ago I was a working pupil I got free room in a cottage wood and coal provided a hot meal every lunch time and it was a proper meal .
i got training daily and my father paid for my horse things have not changed that much I loved it .
 

Nicnac

Well-Known Member
Joined
9 May 2007
Messages
8,037
Visit site
I also say move, however it is the start of the eventing season so make sure you will get the help and lessons you hope for over the next few months as you may find they/you aren't actually at the yard as much as you want to be until it's time to return to the dressage yard (where you should be paid at least something despite the benefits in kind)
 

SilverLy

Active Member
Joined
10 July 2019
Messages
32
Visit site
They cant withhold more than a certain amount for your housing I think it’s just under £60 a week .
how many hours do you work ?
the training is a considerable perk I am most sure how off setting that now a days .
Over forty years ago I was a working pupil I got free room in a cottage wood and coal provided a hot meal every lunch time and it was a proper meal .
i got training daily and my father paid for my horse things have not changed that much I loved it .

We work 60hrs a weeks - looong week. Your working pupil position sounds wonderful! I’m quite jealous of the hot meal as well!
 

alexomahony

Well-Known Member
Joined
12 January 2015
Messages
760
Visit site
I did get free accommodation, food, lessons every day and livery so I guess that makes up for it. They are an excellent yard so I don’t mind too much in that sense.


No it doesn't make up for it... these should be benefits, not in replacement of wage. How did you ever buy anything? Savings? It's no wonder why they struggle to 'hire' people if they don't offer any wage!
 

SilverLy

Active Member
Joined
10 July 2019
Messages
32
Visit site
No it doesn't make up for it... these should be benefits, not in replacement of wage. How did you ever buy anything? Savings? It's no wonder why they struggle to 'hire' people if they don't offer any wage!

My parents have helped me a bit - but there’s only so much they can give. I know a previous girl used to work at a hotel after we finished but I think it really tired her out.
 

Leo Walker

Well-Known Member
Joined
19 July 2013
Messages
12,384
Location
Northampton
Visit site
They are breaking the law. End of. 60 hours at minimum wage is £402.61 a week. Minus accommodation costs which can be maximum of £52.85, you should be coming out with £349.76. Even with livery and training, you are not getting that much in benefits.

Do you get payslips? If not I would assume they are not paying your national insurance contribution, which affects all sorts of things from statutory sick pay to pensions.

This is illegal and you are being exploited. I am so very sorry that this is still happening in this day and age. Please leave and report them as you do.
 

gallopingby

Well-Known Member
Joined
17 January 2009
Messages
1,628
Visit site
So complicated these days and everyone wants something more!

How about looking at this another way, as a training position Which is what a working pupil is. Ok if fully experienced with x years training a realistic wage should be paid and expected but this doesn’t appear to be the case.

As a student at college you’d be paying course fees, plus accommodation costs and have to pay for your horses livery. So how would these be funded?

So two lessons a day from a top instructor could easily be £50 for 45 mins each so that £500 a week if we consider a 5 day week. Livery including food and bedding? even on DIY is likely to be at least £90 or considerably more depending on the area and with indoor and outdoor schools free to use. Accommodation charges are set, including hot water and heat?

l haven’t any idea where this place is but assuming the lessons are of good standard and as frequent as stated then maybe there’s more to this than just a working position. Modern apprenticeships don’t pay minimum wage they pay a ‘training’ amount.
Sadly as WP jobs decrease in number due to current expectations the number of people with appropriate knowledge/experience gained in a hands on way decreases and we‘ll continue in the downward spiral of horses being disposable as no one has sufficient knowledge to either train correctly or overcome any problems which will inevitably arise when unskilled workers are the only source of labour.
 
Top