Parelli Demo on robert Whittakers stallion Stonleigh Friday 9th...Anybody else bside

I don't agree with tying horse's legs up for this purpose, or for shoeing/trimming etc. When they are sedated for an op it may be necessary.

An awful lot of cruelty and bad practice is being peddled as 'horsemanship'. It doesn't take a genius to work out that this type of practice is abuse.

Some will condone it because the horse is otherwise well treated ie it gets fed and exercised. But you know that is the sort of thing spouse/child beaters say. 'It's ok because I love you and want the best for you.' as they break someones jaw.

And in some cultures this sort of behaviour is acceptable.

I think it is time to move on from accepting bullying/physical abuse. Time to celebrate and appreciate a more intelligent approach.

And as for it being more acceptable to be violent with a stallion? Try telling that to the Spanish Riding School.
 
The thing is, if you were in, say Spain, and you saw a man tying a horse's leg up and laying it down there would be outrage. It would be considered *breaking a horse's spirit* and yes, demeaning it in many people's eyes. A horse is a noble creature, and seeing them trussed up and put to the ground does not sit well with people. Yes, I understand the ethos behind it but that doesn't mean that I have to like it.

Just because it is *Parelli* it suddenly becomes acceptable to use ropes to hoist a horse's body around, and therein lies the problem. Full explanations are not given because *if you want to know, buy the DVD/book/etc* and so the accusations, confusion and hatred continues.
 
sacking out is what Monty Roberts was forced to do as a kid - no wonder he found an alternative method. As for PP, I am just lost for words. sm x
 
I have a bridle shy horse, he isn't dangerous with it, he just has a lot of bad memories and will do what he can to evade it happening again. But with time and patience, teaching him that the bit is a positive thing, he's improving - surely what Pat Parelli jumped into doing is merely reinforcing the horses fear? Certainly would be to my horse!

I actually don't have anything left to say about parelli anymore.......
 
7HL said:
My understanding is he did everything out in front of everyone. Unlike some trainers that might have taken the horse out of view to do what he did
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The fact he didn't and thought it acceptable to do in front of spectators would only make me even more concerned about what does actually go on out of view..
 
Having had a very headshy horse as a result of 2 lots of Liverpool cream (she had sarcoids on her poll) I know how hard it is to regain that trust once it is lost. What surprises me is that Pat and Linda would agree to use a horse with this problem in a demo that is coming from very, very experienced horsemen. If the Whitakers haven't fixed it then you can be sure the problem is a deep rooted one.

That makes me think that either Pat Parelli is stupid and doesn't know how hard it is to desensitize a very headshy horse. Or he's unbelievably arrogant and thinks his methods are so infinitely better than anything the Whitakers can come up with that he would be able to turn the horse around in a few minutes.

That Pat Parelli failed is no surprise to anyone with a brain. If the horse was coming from a timid amateur who had not really tried to address the problem then he might have stood a chance as the problem may not have been too bad, it just hadn't been addressed. But with the horse coming from experienced hands who would have spent time and effort and common sense on working through the issue its a complete no-brainer that the horse was very committed to being headshy and would take a lot of time to persuade him that letting humans touch his head was actually OK.

What is surprising is the decisions Pat Parelli took. Applying a twitch. Tying up one leg. Having the horse get away from him. Going on for 2-3 hours. None of those are good decisions and all of them have made huge dents in his reputation. Why did he do it? Why did he not just assess the horse, try advance and retreat with it, get it to bond with him, explain that the problem was a big one and it could not be fixed in a single session and let the horse leave? He may have been laughed at if he had done that but he deserves to be laughed at for his choice of horse. But if he had done that he would not have lost as much of his reputation as he has with the force he chose to use in front of a live audience. He set himself up to fail which is something he teaches people to avoid with their horses! How ironic he couldn't see that he was doing that to himself.
 
Teddybully said:
The fact he didn't and thought it acceptable to do in front of spectators would only make me even more concerned about what does actually go on out of view..
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Lets just say I am going by the fact I have watched him work with horses in person. Pat is what he is, in public and private. He doesn't do behind doors what he wouldn't do in public.

I did not see the demo. I am only going on that I believe Pat would do. Its not blind faith or idol worship.

So how many of you are actually jumping on board the bashing without even seeing the demonstration?

Pat, Linda the program does need me or others to defend it. It stands on its own. I know it works.
 
7HL said:
I did not see the demo. I am only going on that I believe Pat would do. Its not blind faith or idol worship.
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Well there's a contradiction - if you believe and defend Pat without having seen the demo, then that surely is blind faith?
 
I get the feeling that it's the people who don't have the patience or don't have the knowledge to deal with their horses that turn to 'quick' fixers like Parelli. I didn't see the demo but why wasn't I surprised at the reactions of those that did?!
It's just sad that the followers cannot see they are being totally ripped off by that shadey pair and why on earth have they given them some kind of demi god status? Jeez...
But more importantly it's the horses they deal with that I feel sorry for... those poor animals.
 
Ok, Hi everyone.

I was at the demo in question with my wife who has never been to a demo by Pat Parelli or any of his associates. She has never been to any form of "NH" demo but she has been around horses all of her life.

I started this thread because I knew there would be people out there who were at the demo and i knew that some of the things seen there would cause contoversy.

I love horses. They are my life.

Firstly let me state AGAIN, that I am not a member of "Parelli". I have owned and been around horses for all of my 46 years. I spent four years in the army working with horses and for the past 11 years have made my living with horses (as a qualified Equine Dental Practitioner). I have been in close contact with and worked on THOUSANDS of horses in my time. I have seen people handle horses in several countries worldwide in every concievable form of equestrianism and people who use horses for work purposes. During my time spent gaining my initial dental training I practically lived in the USA for near on two years and travelled extensively over there with several friends. I have worked on cattle ranches and with the Beaureu of Land Management on their wild horse (Mustang) adoption programme and have been involved with rodeo to some degree. It was during my time ata wild horse corral that i first saw anyone using what is now termed "Natural Horsemanship" methodology and techniques. it was a guy called Bryan Nubert. After watching him working on a wild mustang for an hour I turned to my friend (a working cowboy of 35 years and part native american) and said "now that is what I want to be like with horses". His reply was "yep, I told you it would be pretty amazing didnt I". From that moment on I strove to learn about horses as i come into contact with hundreds and hundreds of them every year. I attended clinics by as many different horsemen and horsewomen that I possibly could and I pestered badgerd and begged some of them to take me on as any form of hired help (inbetween attending dentistry school to achieve my instructor / lecturer status). The people I have seen work include (totally expect that tongue in cheek will have have seen or heard of most if not all of them and most of you on here will not) Ray Hunt, Buck Brannaman (travelled with Buck for a while...he is the man behind the inspiration for Nick Evans book "The Horse Whisperer"...i.e, he is the original Tom Booker and the man who explained to me what laying a horse down is all about....which when fully understood makes absolute perfect sense) John & Josh Lyons,Pat Parelli, Kurt Pate, Craig Cammeron, Jeff Spencer (his son Justin and became good freinds as Justin is also an equine dental practitioner), Lesley Desmond, Dr Richard Miller, Dr Deb Bennet, Mark Rashid, Clinton Anderson, Bryan Nubert, Klaus Ferdinand Hempfling, Ken Faulkner ...Monty Roberts (and many of his students including Richard Maxwell and Kelly Marks). So I think I have seen first hand and studied several different methodologies and pretty much understand the psycology involved in their training techniques. I have seen some EXTREME cases handled in good and not so good ways both here in this country and in other countries worldwide.


I can say that, in my experience and opinion, there was no ABUSE to that horse by Pat Parelli or anyone else that evening at Stonleigh. The events which unfolded have beyond any doubt caused many people to change their view based on what was SEEN. It is clear that what many people SAW,they did not understand the rationale of. As is so very very often the case, we look...but we dont see...we listen.. but we dont hear.

I have helped cure many headshy and bridling problems and...Im telling you now...this was EXTREME. I feel that even Pat thought at some stage during that demo that it was going to be easier than he thought. I did from things I saw and different major breakthrough stages I saw being achieved by both horse and handler. I can honestly say that I and my Wife at no sage felt that the horse showed fear or distress other than discomfort. Some of the things seen would come across to some people as "not nice" .Even Robert Whittaker himself said that the way he and his staff used to get the bridle on and off the horse were "not nice". What i am saying is you have to be able to look beyond what you see. Read between the lines and understand the underlying psycology in what is happening.

Pat Parelli is undoubtedly...love him or loathe him...one of this worlds greatest horse lovers. yes....the man loves horse. There have been times, by his own admission, where he has not done the right thing with horses.

Christ, there have been multiple times in mine where I have felt that guilt for what i have done...and anyone reading this who says they have never, unintentionally, caused a horse distress of some form then, in the words of tongue in Cheek,...get up there to God and tell him he's sitting in your seat.

I have seen hobbling used many many times by many of this worlds greatest horsemen and women for different purposes....but....the vast majority of UK horse owners have never seen them used properly or been shown how to introduce them to horses. Pat Parelli Is as EXPERT as anyone in their use..end of..I dont have to explain anymore about that. If you want to understand the "Rationale" behind single leg hobbling look up Dr Richard Miller (the Veterinarian behind the phenomenum of "imprint training".

whenever anything "new" is seen by someone they are quick to slam it down....I was when I first saw hobbling and laying down used in this particular context. Pat did explain why he was going to use this "trick up his sleeve" and at the beginning of his demo he explained that that evenngs demo was going to be different to what many in the audience may have seen from him...He put a particular emphasis on the employment of "techniques" and how different horsemen and horsewomen use varying techniques to achieve the same goal. I feel as well that Pat wished to demonstrate here just how exteme this case was. Yes, you could GET a bridle on this horse...but to get him to accept and overcome his inbuilt fear of having it put on and taken off was something else totally different. He didnt fear the bridle itself (once it was on he accepted it no problem). He had PHOBIA about the bridle going over his ears and the bit going near his teeth. This horse was seven years old & I wouldnt like to hazard a guess when and in who's possesion the problem was CREATED, but a chain reaction has occured in the horses mind and a link in that cahin neede to be broken to "cure" the problem or resolve it for the horses sake. What Pat was trying to achieve was a tiny incident to be able to break the chain and set up a new one. He was looking for a good thing to reward the horse for...for the horse to see thru the red mist in his head and make the all important TRY.

With regard to the use of the "twitch" did anyone see, as I did, the COUNTLESS RELEASES of that "comanchee Calmer". This device was used by comanchee indians who copied it by observing the spanish invaders who brought horses to their country, when breaking their horses and when they went on horse stealing raids into Mexico to steal large herds of horses to sell and trade with other tribes. Each and every TRY that Catwalk gave that evening was rewarded......and evertime he simply said F..* O**. he was made to feel uncomfortable this WASNT a punishment. Ive seen Several of the worlds leading horsemen and horsewomen use it and I understand anatomically and pyscologically WHY it was used. Weve seen links to Monty Roberts using it here in this tread. Its use last night caused no distress or fear to that stallion in that arena that night. My wife said exactly the same

How many of you use a Martingale??? Its a RESTRAINING device....pure and simple....no argument. designed to put pressure on a horses mouth via the bit when the horse puts his head above a certian possition. The device used that night was used in the same context....to show Catwalk that life was far more comfortable for him and that really nice things happened when he lowered his head and that all the things he thought were going to happen...DIDNT happen...but uncomfortable things DID happen with his head in the air...Reverse pyscology...teaching a horse to overcome his opposition reflex.


How many people who were at the demo saw the point at which a major breakthrough was achieved by Catwalk??? Come on....explain that moment on here...I saw it...did you?? Did you see the points at which progression....and regression were made by the partnership in that arena last night. You may have seen several things such as a cowboy putting a rope around a horses leg or throwing a loop over a horses head and then expertly throwing several coils into that rope which went over or close to the horses ears and that same horse shaking off any attempt to to have a bridle put on and resisting certain approaches and advances......but did you UNDERSTAND what was going on and why.

Does anyone reading understand the concept and pyscology used when "Laying a horse down" , as used in the Movie, The Horse Whisperer......the horse in that film was one leg hobbled at one point. If you saw it you wouldnt like it......but if you saw the end result you would be amazed and want to try to understand it. Buck Branaman explained it to me while I was travelling with him because i DIDNT GET IT.....but i do now.

On Saturday I watched Pat Parelli working for several minutes (out of public view) with Catwalk and he and the others didnt see me watching. At no time did he ever ABUSE that horse. He rewarded every single try that horse made. At one point he had a blindfold on the horse....how many of you would have kicked off at that....the stallion was not in distress....even with the blindfold on Pat rewarded EVERY single try that Catwalk made.
 
rushyj said:
I apologise for my tone in the earlier post but really all it is is body language which most of us have mastered years ago.. How many experienced people do you know who can predict which foot a horse will move next it is not a miracle it is body language.......
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a woman after my own heart! I think what the majority of horse owners do is called 'common sense' which arrives after many years of 'experience'. It certainly cant be bought. I like your way of thinking:
 
P.S. The whole demo....and ALL the work that Pat did with catwalk the following day was videoed as i saw the cameras on both ocassions. Who will see it will be anyones guess. But remember ...there were people there and if anything is edited (which I doubt it will be) people will expose the editing and question it.....me for one.
 
Alright, I'm going to switch "sides" for a moment and attempt to play Devil's Advocate.

Let's assume that what you're saying is all accurate and true, ponydentist - that the horse was at no point distressed and that his treatment by Pat Parelli was the kindest way to teach him to overcome his fear and accept a bridle...

The fact that this has kicked off outrage across the horse world, in both camps, suggests that there are many more people who "didn't understand" what they "think" they saw, than who did. Add to this those who supposedly did understand it refusing to say anything other than "I don't need to defend Parelli, it just works, and I cannot possibly take the time to explain to a non-believer what he was trying to achieve" - and you end up with a lot of bad publicity. (I doubt I'm the only one who suspects they have no idea either, but are afraid to say so for fear of being laughed at by fellow Parellists..?)

Another result of this is a whole lot of kids and misguided adults, who have bought into Parelli, now awaiting the moment their horses raises its head when having a bridle put over its ears, so that they may copy what they think they saw on Friday night by twitching and hobbling their horses. Let's assume PP was kind in what he was doing to Catwalk - do we think these people will understand his technique well enough to execute it kindly and safely themselves?

Think Rollkur, for example. Like it or loathe it, fit, highly trained dressage horses with incredible suppleness and flexibility being asked to warm up in hyperflexion is not the same as a wannabe going home and riding their horse horrifically overbent because they think they're the next Anky. That's where the welfare issues really begin.

If Pat Parelli's main concern here was the horse, this work would not have been carried out in front of a crowd of spectators, as quickly as possible. It would have been a private consultation with Robert and his horse, taking the time it takes, as he so regularly likes to preach. His Friday night display would have been an easy-to-reconstruct session with a common problem that is easily and kindly fixed using his methods. I can bet that there is no disclaimer from PP suggesting that nobody tries this at home - rather "buy this DVD and you too will be able to do what I just did!"

That is not a love of horses at this stage I'm afraid, although it may have started out that way. It's now a love of what the Parelli brand can give Pat and Linda financially.
 
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I have information that after working with Catwalk for most of saturday, he will now readily acept a bridle and bit and will let ANYONE put it on and touch his head ears mouth etc.

A talented horse that wont be going to the dogs.

As I said the key to this is UNDERSTANDING.....there are those who "get it"......and those who "dont get it".

All those who who fasten your dog up to your lorry with a lead to restrain it or prevent it from doing something.....or put a muzzle on it coz it bites........look out .....you may be abusing your animals.
 
I did not see what went on and hope video of it all turns up soon so everyone can see it.
I went to one of the two day events at the nec and was not impressed. A lot of happy, clappy people hero worshipping their Gods with lots of country and western music thrown in.

All Pat parrellis talk of preditors etc does not seem to go with tying up legs and gum lines etc.

I feel its a big money making scam that a lot of people have fallen for.

It has a very cultish feel to it and made me feel quite uneasy at the time.
 
ponydentist said:
I have information that after working with Catwalk for most of saturday, he will now readily acept a bridle and bit and will let ANYONE put it on and touch his head ears mouth etc.

A talented horse that wont be going to the dogs.

As I said the key to this is UNDERSTANDING.....there are those who "get it"......and those who "dont get it".

All those who who fasten your dog up to your lorry with a lead to restrain it or prevent it from doing something.....or put a muzzle on it coz it bites........look out .....you may be abusing your animals.
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Gosh, I had some respect for you until I read that tripe.

This horse would not have "gone to the dogs" - it'd have been bridled the way it was being bridled by RW's groom before PP got involved.

It is difficult to "get" something which nobody will explain because they follow Parelli blindly and are brainwashed into believing "not questioning" means that they "get" it, and that they must attack anyone who dares to question it.

Thank you for just confirming that followers of this man really are all as bad as each other, even when it first appeared they had something useful to say.
 
ponydentist said:
I have information that after working with Catwalk for most of saturday, he will now readily acept a bridle and bit and will let ANYONE put it on and touch his head ears mouth etc.

A talented horse that wont be going to the dogs.

As I said the key to this is UNDERSTANDING.....there are those who "get it"......and those who "dont get it".

All those who who fasten your dog up to your lorry with a lead to restrain it or prevent it from doing something.....or put a muzzle on it coz it bites........look out .....you may be abusing your animals.
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OK, cool, please explain to those who ''don't get it'' why this happened. Seriously, if we are ignorant of why, then maybe it would be better to explain why. From what you have said you have a better understanding of what was happening than those of us who weren't there and do not follow Parelli techniques, so would you please explain what the breakthrough was that people who were there should have seen, what the Comanche technique is & why it's used and what the purpose of the hobbling was please? Genuinely, I don't UNDERSTAND so please explain.

With my current UNDERSTANDING, I don't think you can compare tying a dog up to a lorry or muzzling it to what has been described as happening to to Catwalk, so please enlighten me.
 
Very interesting posts Ponydentist, thankyou for taking the time to write them.

If I take what you tell us as true (which I do) there is still a big problem with what Pat did. He showed in public things that the general public were unable to understand and that could be misinterpreted. For someone who is a teacher that is a serious error and the enormity of the mistake is shown by the interest generated by this thread. It still smacks of arrogance. "Because I'm doing it you should trust me and accept it as OK". That isn't the way the world works.

I'm an absolute believer in being relentlessly fair in order to train a horse to become a productive member of society. I think my mind works in a similar way to yours and I have no problem with short term discomfort for long term gain. As long as I understand why. That's where PP made his mistake. Without an explanation from someone the public trust there is only short term discomfort on show. And the backlash from that is not at all surprising.

I do think he made a series of misjudgements in this situation. He may be fed up of having to show the world sugar coated horse handling. He may have a burning wish to show the world the tough stuff and the difficult stuff and show them that it is possible to fix it. But without preparing the public correctly, just as you'd prepare a horse for backing, the result of that lack of public preparation is fear which translates into vilification.

I do actually think PP is a good horseman. He's not the best one out there, the best ones tend to have such a quiet manner about them they'd never be noticed if they stood up in front of a big crowd. PP is a mix of good horseman and outstanding showman. In the past he has shown his flair for marketing and showmanship and his success is testimony to that. But recently he's striking the wrong chord, showing the wrong cases to the wrong audience. Catwalk sounds like a perfect case to show to a group of advanced Parelli people. He was not the right case to show to a cross section of the general public, many of whom are not even horsey. If you make a very public mistake like that you pay a very public price. I think he will have learned a lot from this and will back off on what he shows to the public. Post graduate demonstrations are best reserved for post graduates. I do a lot of teaching, from undergraduates to professors. What I say to each group is completely different and if the skill mix in the people I'm teaching is too wide teaching becomes impossible. In that situation I send some of the trainees away to teach slightly more junior trainees which allows me to talk to the remaining people at the right level for the amount of knowledge they have got. If I did a professor-level talk to undergraduates they would fall asleep because they would not understand one word in 10. This is what PP did assuming Ponydentist is right. He showed very postgraduate training to a mostly uneducated audience. No wonder there has been a problem with interpretation of what was actually done to the horse.
 
So Munchkin....and others.

What crime are we crucifying Pat parelli for here? Horse abuse?? Using certain equipment?? cohercing others into abusing horses?? marketing and running his business in an inapropriate manner?? Running a Cult??? Selling unnecessary items of horse equipment to uneducated or gulliable horse owners (ha ha ha....horse feed companies, equipment manufacturers, tack producers etc etc etc do that every single day of the year......its called mass hypnosis of the equine fraternity).

I dont particularly like the way parelli is marketed. but some would argue his wife is a very asstute business woman.....before she came along he was virtually an unknown ex rodeo cowboy who was giving clinics and advice to horse owners virtually for free.

On that day I saw Edward Gal give a demo too.....another excellent in his field....riding and training dressage horses......how many people will go home and want to do what he was telling them that he does to train horses. People arnt forced to do things.......everyone will realise that what they saw Pat do that night was extremely complicated by many factors and they wouldnt even know where to start.
 
Ponydentist you have really bitten into this thing that if you don't understand what the Parellis are doing you are at fault not them.He was suposed to be TEACHING.If I was suposed to be teaching your child to read and failed to do so and said basically it was your childs fault, would you swallow this codswallop.My experiences ofParelli teaching are this.I a nice kind sweatheart of a cob.My nerves stem from my experiences with another horse not him.I bought him as a confidence giver and he has been marvellous.I decided to go to camp.It was a specialist camp for nervous riders and it said that some of the classes would be NH.I like NH generally.It turned out to be pure Parelli.Now I have seen some demos of Pat on TV which I thought were good BUT I didn't like the deception.None the less I was determined to have a go with an open mind and give it my best shot.The instructor started off by telling us all about how experienced she was and how the last group had got SO much out ofit all.I read the subtext which was If you don't like it its your fault.
We started off teaching the horses to back up swing this rope with a heavy clip at them.He didn't understand.He backs up beautifully of asked in away that he does including down the ramp of my rear unload only trailer.
She came up and started toswing the rope harder. He was trying to work out what she wanted.He thought she wanted him to lunge.He was TRYING to please.She started to yank at his head and had a complete hissy fit.YOU SEE WHAT HE IS DOING.YOU SEE WHAT HE IS DOING.You would have thought he had tried to kill her.
I decided I didn't want to do that anymore.In fact I really didn't want to do very much that she wanted me to do and I had good reasons.She became very assertive at one time.Your horse MUST do this.I shall expect you to do that! Will you indeed.We never went back.
TBH Pat Parelli would come out of this as a much better man if he could accept that he made a mistake.We all do make mistakes. Its human.I don't think Robert has come out of this too well either.
 
I believe that what gets up a lot of people's noses, and mine...is that those who are Parelli followers, have this desire to pass onto everyone else just how 'marvellous' it is, and will blatantly slate you because you aren't doing it yourself, accusing you of being cruel to your horse and telling you you are all wrong.....yes, it's happened to me.

Someone 'tried' to tell me what I was doing wrong (whether I wanted their opinion or not) and they got told two words, of which I would be banned for if I said it here....

People call it a 'cult', and yes, that IS a good name for it, because trying to force your beliefs on someone else teeters on the edge of religion to me!

A religion (there are several) which can accept that other religions exist and work alongside each other, is a good religion. The 'extremists' are the ones who try to force their ideals onto you....

Whichever way you look at it, there will be arguments of this until the cows come home, the Parelli people NEED to try to explain what they do WITHOUT accusing others of cruelty and god knows what else, the worst way to make enemies is to go into attack mode from the word go...

IF those who don't agree with Parelli, and STILL can't get around the idea of it and don't wish to accept it, then that is fine, I don't blame you for getting angry of issues being forced, but there HAVE been positive results obviously....and you just need to assume that those calling you abusive are just blinkered and narrow-minded, and you can happily carry on in life the way you were before!

This is in a Perfect World however, and THAT'S not likely to happen! :D
 
ponydentist said:
So Munchkin....and others.

What crime are we crucifying Pat parelli for here? Horse abuse?? Using certain equipment?? cohercing others into abusing horses?? marketing and running his business in an inapropriate manner?? Running a Cult??? Selling unnecessary items of horse equipment to uneducated or gulliable horse owners (ha ha ha....horse feed companies, equipment manufacturers, tack producers etc etc etc do that every single day of the year......its called mass hypnosis of the equine fraternity).
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All of the above? Like I said, I personally do not believe that what he did to that horse was acceptable, whether the outcome is a good one or not. In the same way he wouldn't agree with me slapping my horse on the a**e to get it into a trailer - but it'd still end up in the trailer.

IF I was playing Devil's Advocate and saying that yes, it all was lovely and kind and the best solution for the horse, I would still have a problem with him misguiding the public who at best, will end up out of pocket, and at worst will be attempting to recreate what they saw using their horses as the subjects.

I dont particularly like the way parelli is marketed. but some would argue his wife is a very asstute business woman.....before she came along he was virtually an unknown ex rodeo cowboy who was giving clinics and advice to horse owners virtually for free.
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Blame Linda then, I personally couldn't care less - they're both as bad as each other and I lost all respect for that woman when I saw a video where the owner (accidentally) smacked a horse in the face with a metal chain to which her reaction was "ooh, good clunk!"

On that day I saw Edward Gal give a demo too.....another excellent in his field....riding and training dressage horses......how many people will go home and want to do what he was telling them that he does to train horses.
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Having seen Edward Gal's demos in the past I know for a fact that he would have been explaining in detail every bit of what he was doing. Not saying "don't ask me what I'm doing, it just works."

People arnt forced to do things.......everyone will realise that what they saw Pat do that night was extremely complicated by many factors and they wouldnt even know where to start.
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It seems you have more faith in the human race than I do.
 
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I've read pretty much all of those threads.

Would someone who follows Parelli or claims to understand the purpose of the exercise with Catwalk just cut to the chase and f***ing stand up and explain to the rest of us what it was?

ponydentist, i believe you said you understood what he was/did & how he acheived - PLEASE EXPLAIN THEN.
 
zefragile said:
Well I think I'll wait to see the video before forming such strong opinions as many on this thread ;)
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I think you'll be waiting a long time then! We might see is a video which showing the horse accepting of a the bridle that misses out most of the techniques used to get there. Or am I just being cynical?
 
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