Parelli = Horse-Man-Sh*T

That was awful and very uncomfortable to watch. Poor horse being wacked around like that. She was deliberately trying to hit him in the face with the rope twirling it around like that. He had no idea what he was supposed to do :-(
In a way I'm pleased it's been caught on camera that should stubb out all the stupid parelli-ites for good!
 
And what exactly did that stupid bitch acheive???????? The horse was clearly stressed and upset. I will NEVER alllow anyone to use a parelli line on my horse nor one of the headcollars - but then I have trained my lot to quietly respond to a normal headcollar......Parelli is an extremley agressive training method IMHO and is a dangerous form of abuse in the wrong hands = I am not against all NH methods, before I get lynched by the bunny huiggers - I have watched Richard Maxwell and Kelly Marks and found them to be very sensible and calm and full of common sense - something the Parelli method quite clearly lacks - That video was disgusting, tantamount to abuse in my book.
 
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I'm not a Parelli follower but this horse was showing a lack of manners/respect and to be fair she did take the pressure off when the horse responded appropriately.

I was at a Carl Hester demo some years ago and he made the comment that for 23 hours a day the horse can basically do what it wants but for the one hour he is ridden he should listen to the rider.

A fair number of spooky horses don't listen to the rider which causes more of a problem.

Having said that I am sure the Parelli's won't be thrilled at this video being posted.

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I dont think the horse was showing lack of respect, it blatanly just didnt have a clue what Linda was asking it to do! I think id run around in circles if someone was launching a leadrope at me and i had little other means of escape!
Had she done this to my youngster, she would've got his two back hooves planted in her forehead.
Stupid woman
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" this horse was showing a lack of manners/respect "

I didn't think so. I thought he was completely confused about what the hell the mad woman on the end of the rope wanted.

I'd buy the horse any day, lovely gentle accepting fellow. I'd lock up the trainer if I could!

But what owner stands by and lets someone do that to their horse? Assuming the person standing by was the owner. It just shows how these big name trainers brainwash people.
 
The scary thing is that they have "office space" with the BHS in Stonleigh and are actively supported by them. I believe that their methods are also incorporated into the BHS syllabus. What do you do if you are studying for your exams and you have to learn methods that you blatently do not agree with and face failing if you do not tow the party line! What a nightmare situation to be in.
 
Exactly! and yes it was looking around a bit, but by the looks of there were lots of other horses out probably being whacked around the head...so lots of things for it to look at! but he was certainly not showing her a lack of respect....I think she needs a good whack round the head tbh
 
crazyfriesian - ooops sorry, didnt mean 2 make it sound like i was having a pop at you!! just a general rant about the methods of naturalhorsemanship and how they groom horses for it.
 
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I believe that their methods are also incorporated into the BHS syllabus. What do you do if you are studying for your exams and you have to learn methods that you blatently do not agree with and face failing if you do not tow the party line! What a nightmare situation to be in.

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This is why i don't believe in the BHS and haven't taken any of there exams. I don't like how they do things and it's there way or the high way.
 
S' ok. I have those rants too.
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Me thinks they groom the people too.

This is just storing up trouble for later and sooner or later in an unforseen situation that horse will react to that situation that he has been put into. It will be involuntary but it will be a throw back. They are the dangerous reactions and difficult to retrain because the stimulus can be so random and the reaction almost irrational.

Poor little horse - couldn't bring myself to watch it, but can definately imagine as have seen their "genius" at work...

BTW one very respected trainer immediately took the "parelli" halter off when presented with a horse at one of his demo days. In his opinion the only use those halters have is to cause pain and suffering. He trains with only a loose rope round the horses neck. He is a pure joy to watch...
 
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I believe that their methods are also incorporated into the BHS syllabus. What do you do if you are studying for your exams and you have to learn methods that you blatently do not agree with and face failing if you do not tow the party line! What a nightmare situation to be in.

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This is why i don't believe in the BHS and haven't taken any of there exams. I don't like how they do things and it's there way or the high way.

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Yep, I did my exams loooong before all of this "natural horsemanship", then I discovered a better way, by chance, and started following the true gentle masters of the horse...

Why o why cant people use common sense and evaluate the info in front of them and work out if it is ethologically sound. Is it "natural" for the horse. (granted that most of what we ask is not "natural") Do they understand or is it totally alien to them. Are we asking them to do "back flips" when they are quite literally not capable of it?!!!! - You get the drift.
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"this horse was showing a lack of manners/respect"

can anybody tell me how so please? yes the horse was looking around a bit, not unusual for a living , breathing animal. If she wants his attention she should be asking for it! if i want my horse to pay attention to me a gentle squeeze on the rein is enough, perhaps some flexion or backing up and moving him in different dirrections, you have to work for it and earn it!! hence i have a horse who when i am stood behind him in the stable i can say "come back" + he will do so. I havent ever had to beat him round the face with a leadrope, metal clip, whip or anthing else for that matter. You earn a horses respect, you dont beat it out of him!!
 
well thats just shocking
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horse didnt understand what was going on, had a pooh as it was frightened and surely what that lady was doing is abuse.

i cant believe that the owner was watching and didnt stop what was going on! noone would ever get away with treating my pony like that regardless of who they are.
 
Watching that made me angry, try that on mine and she'd bolt, can't believe the patience that horse had with her
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Hideous.
I had actually considered having a play around with the Parelli 'games'. Was told it was about letting the horse 'think for itself'. Glad to have seen this - removes any doubt from my mind about Parelli. Is there anyone here who can explain why they think this is a kind and effective method of training and that I have missed the point/misinterpreted what is happening?
 
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I'm not a Parelli follower but this horse was showing a lack of manners/respect and to be fair she did take the pressure off when the horse responded appropriately.

I was at a Carl Hester demo some years ago and he made the comment that for 23 hours a day the horse can basically do what it wants but for the one hour he is ridden he should listen to the rider.

A fair number of spooky horses don't listen to the rider which causes more of a problem.

Having said that I am sure the Parelli's won't be thrilled at this video being posted.

[/ QUOTE ]I am inclined to agree. I think it looked worse than it actually was. Horses with no respect regularly put people in hospital.
 
Don't think the Parelli's will be happy with this video posting might stop the gravy train of money rolling in for a bit - cos lets face it that's mainly what they're about!
 
THAT folks, is why natural horsemanship has such a terrible name: certain individuals like this have tarred everyone else with the same brush.
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It was horrible to watch. Those metal clips bleddy well HURT when swung in your face. They are designed to be a weight to make the signals clearer, NOT to wallop your horse in the face with.

This is where parelli really falls apart for me. That's nothing but agressive horsemanship. Natural horsemanship used to be, well, still is for others, a way of showing the horse you can be a leader, without resorting to aggression, and to work with them using a language more similar to theirs than traditional methods. A way to develop trust and respect on the ground before you get on the horse using different tools, which would combine with what we already know. Not instead of, but WITH our existing tools. Taking the horse's nature more into account. Taking behaviour into account. Making allowances.

That is just some spin doctor showing everybody how NOT to do it.

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I'm not a Parelli follower but this horse was showing a lack of manners/respect and to be fair she did take the pressure off when the horse responded appropriately.

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A fair number of spooky horses don't listen to the rider which causes more of a problem.



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She didn't give the horse the chance to understand her half the time, let alone respond appropriately.
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I do agree a horse who doesn't listen is a problem... but I think dealing with it like this isn't going to solve the problem, just confuse the horse and make him not want to be anywhere near the craazy confusing lady.
 
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I'm not a Parelli follower but this horse was showing a lack of manners/respect and to be fair she did take the pressure off when the horse responded appropriately.

I was at a Carl Hester demo some years ago and he made the comment that for 23 hours a day the horse can basically do what it wants but for the one hour he is ridden he should listen to the rider.

A fair number of spooky horses don't listen to the rider which causes more of a problem.

Having said that I am sure the Parelli's won't be thrilled at this video being posted.

I am inclined to agree. I think it looked worse than it actually was. Horses with no respect regularly put people in hospital.

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How worse could you get hitting a horse over the head. That horse had respect. God you should meet Herbie my new pony if you want to meet a horse with no respect he will walk straight through you and jump up and down on top of you to ensure he has done a proper job.
Oh and guess what his old owner used to do with him.
B***dy PARELLI. AHHHHHHHHHH now i have a pony with so many issues i have to sort it out. And the owner asked me if i would continu parelli with him.
NO I'M FLIPPING NOT. (ofcourse i said yes to her but i had to get him out of there one way or another)
 
You think they won't like this being shown in public? I recognise the clip, it is off a DVD that is part of the Level 1 learning materials. Maybe not the latest version, I lose track, but from the set of DVD's that replaced the video version, the ones that had a lot of talk about learning theory as well. So it is well and truly in the public domain, it's not some undercover filming work.
For those who say their horse would kill her. They wouldn't. Linda Parelli has worked with 100's of horses, they all submit to this. She's teaching the horse to back up in the Yo Yo "Game" by the way. When she smacks the horse on the face to make it turn away at the end, that would be the Driving Game.
So, for people who say that in Parelli the horses back up from soft wiggles of the rope, now you know why. They learn to reconise that a soft wiggle of the rope is followed by this stuff if they don't back up.
Having said that, I'm not sure I think it's any better or worse than some of the work I've seen with a Dually, or with a horse running scared around a round pen with long lines flapping around it's hind legs... that's another discussion.
This is why I am so passionate when I try to get people to look wider before they condemn all "NH" type stuff because of Parelli, and even Monty. They aren't all like this.
 
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THAT folks, is why natural horsemanship has such a terrible name: certain individuals like this have tarred everyone else with the same brush.
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It was horrible to watch. Those metal clips bleddy well HURT when swung in your face. They are designed to be a weight to make the signals clearer, NOT to wallop your horse in the face with.

This is where parelli really falls apart for me. That's nothing but agressive horsemanship. Natural horsemanship used to be, well, still is for others, a way of showing the horse you can be a leader, without resorting to aggression, and to work with them using a language more similar to theirs than traditional methods. A way to develop trust and respect on the ground before you get on the horse using different tools, which would combine with what we already know. Not instead of, but WITH our existing tools. Taking the horse's nature more into account. Taking behaviour into account. Making allowances.

That is just some spin doctor showing everybody how NOT to do it.

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Thats how it was explained to me years ago by an II who had a keen intrest in NH methods(all of them
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Anything that makes you think about what and why you do things the way you do is good,and you will normaly find something you can take away and put to good use.

Extreme weirdos who insist their way is the ONLY way always make me uncomftable,whatever you are up to.
This clip is disgusting -I have no idea what she is trying to do so the poor horse has no chance!
 


[/ QUOTE ]I am inclined to agree. I think it looked worse than it actually was. Horses with no respect regularly put people in hospital.

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Im sorry, at what point did this horse look so badly behaved it was going to put some one in hospital? Was it when she smacked him round the face + he backed off? or when she lashed him on the back end + he tried to run away? I agree that there are horses out there that require more advanced training because they are more difficult to handle, meaning they need more experienced handlers, not someone waggling a learope in their face and antagonising them.
 
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You think they won't like this being shown in public? I recognise the clip, it is off a DVD that is part of the Level 1 learning materials. Maybe not the latest version, I lose track, but from the set of DVD's that replaced the video version, the ones that had a lot of talk about learning theory as well. So it is well and truly in the public domain, it's not some undercover filming work.
She's teaching the horse to back up in the Yo Yo "Game" by the way. When she smacks the horse on the face to make it turn away at the end, that would be the Driving Game.


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If this stuff is all on her DVD then why on earth do so many people follow it and pay them all this money to keep doing it? I get that not all NH stuff is like this but why do so many people follow this particular c**p then?
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I understand some parts of parelli, and that technique is completely unacceptable but it should NEVER EVER be used in that way. She would yank down on the rope so it jumped forwards and then wack it in the face - that poor horse is going to end up completely wrecked
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Edited as I looked at the video again and decided I was wrong about the technique being used on ANY HORSE - its an outrage!
 
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This is why I am so passionate when I try to get people to look wider before the condemn all "NH" type stuff because of Parelli, and even Monty. They aren't all like this.

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There is a massive misconception that if it is "natural" it is good. It is a word that is bandied around far too often. I have gotten to the point of cringing if I hear the term.

There are some WONDERFUL practitioners out there. But at the end of the day they are there to remind us of what we have either forgotten (deep down gut feelings) and to remind us to STOP and LISTEN to what our horses are telling us. They are there as the ambassador for the horse.

Personally when working with horses I try to remember the first rule of doctors "first cause no harm". If what you are asking doesn't fall into that catagory then there is somehting wrong with what you are asking.

Also remember that as with a child if at first they dont understand then ask again. If they still dont understand it may be worth modifying the question to a way in which they do understand. You may have to ask / explain yourself several different ways - but NEVER resort to violence!
 
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If this stuff is all on her DVD then why on earth do so many people follow it and pay them all this money to keep doing it? I get that not all NH stuff is like this but why do so many people follow this particular c**p then?

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Because it's the latest fad and people are told it's a kinder way to treat a horse and they believe it
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I do my own form of NH. I have had the best teachers in the world Lucy and now Herbie and anyother horse that has entered my life. I do my own version of join up. Not in a small pen where the horse has no choice but in a big field and i use body language and not lunge lines. I certanly don't beat any horse over the head.
 
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