Physical "limitation" vs the end of the road.

Allover said:
I suppose that could all come down to what one considers to be a good pro. If it is a trainer that is happy to take time to train the horse and manage the horse in accordance with its needs then no, you wont find the ones that push their horses till they crack. Others may see a good pro as one that has Olympic medals regardless of how they get there, behind these trainers/riders are a succession of ruined horses that were never really given the opportunity to be the best they could be. In these cases the biggest limitations the horse ever encountered were those presented by the trainer/rider/owner.
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Ah, I agree completely with your last point, although I don't agree it's only something that happens on professional yards. However, I don't think it's a conversation most people feel comfortable having outside of that narrow parameter.
 
Nope, unfortunately you are right although I think us mere mortal riders are nowhere near as brave when it comes to getting into a set to with a horse and it sets a lot of the pros apart. Again it comes down to the individual and how far they are prepared deny right from wrong in achieving their individual goals.

Its a shame people feel uncomfortable to talk about what goes on in these yards after all who are the ones in the wrong and more importantly who are the ones that are suffering?
 
Allover said:
Nope, unfortunately you are right although I think us mere mortal riders are nowhere near as brave when it comes to getting into a set to with a horse and it sets a lot of the pros apart. Again it comes down to the individual and how far they are prepared deny right from wrong in achieving their individual goals.

Its a shame people feel uncomfortable to talk about what goes on in these yards after all who are the ones in the wrong and more importantly who are the ones that are suffering?
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That isn't really what I meant. I think many people are more than happy to think all pro yards are horse abusing factories that start them too young and work them too hard and always sacrifice the horses' best interests to ego. In fact, my personal experience is that it is not the sole province of any particular group. In fact just today I watched a group of people who I'm sure would tell you they love their horses treat one in a way I would never conscience and flat out ignore the horse's obvious distress simply because they wanted to do what they wanted to do.

What I think people are maybe not that keen to discuss is what else might limit a horse's potential/confidence/skill, other than possibly pushing it too hard. Not in a judgemental "this way is wrong" way, but in a "let's avoid this pitfall or recognise this sign of trouble" way. I would say at least some "damage" (in itself a loaded term) is done by ignorance, which is, luckily, easily fixable. If you move a horse up and it goes wrong it might not be possible to completely repair that situation but it might be possible to learn for the next one. Similarly, if a horse moves up easily you can store away the "signs" you recognise in retrospect and look for them again when you have a similar decision to make. Rosettes - even clear rounds - are not necessarily a sign that it's all good and the horse is fine to step up.
 
The sad thing about being in this horse world ,is that we all make mistakes . I look back and think if only I had done x,y or z with a particular horse. We have to face the fact that we will often get it wrong.Good horses try to kid us that it is all still ok . We so often want to believe them. Its a hard road , the only thing anyone can do is be true to themselves.
 
Mike007 said:
The sad thing about being in this horse world ,is that we all make mistakes . I look back and think if only I had done x,y or z with a particular horse. We have to face the fact that we will often get it wrong.Good horses try to kid us that it is all still ok . We so often want to believe them. Its a hard road , the only thing anyone can do is be true to themselves.
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So so true. I had a good endurance horse - a Standardbred. This horse had the biggest work ethic of any animal I have ever owned. I really think he would have dropped before he would tell you he was tired and needed to stop. I rode him in 2 50 mile rides then retired him - everyone thought I was mad but it was just too stressful riding a horse who did not know how to tell you when enough was enough! Only the subtlest signs would emerge to tell you he was pushing his limitations.
I'd far rather ride the lazy sod I have now who CAN do it but is also very clear in telling me "I need a rest now".
 
My late mare started refusing showjumping. I had taught her to jump and she had always been really brave and careful and really straightforward round a course getting placed in all her baby classes. We built up as you do but as we started doing 1m affiliated courses things started to unwravel. She had a huge natural jump but for some reason she started to refuse the oxers and spreads. Never the uprights no matter how spooky.
I thought it was me, I had lessons and we went back to 2ft3. I thought we had it cracked but then it happened again at a BS show, she would back off an oxer, try to jump from no stride and land in the middle before refusing the next time.
I only did one show and thought that's itno jumping except tiny jumps at home. Others may have pushed on but I didn't want to go out and not do well, I didn't want us both to be upset. So we did dressage which she did really well at and we had fun out hacking. I'm so glad I listened to her, we had so much fun that year even though no jumping. That November she died. She had terrible oldworm damage from before I got her as a youngster that aged her digestive system early. Vet ttold me it was a miracle she lasted so long and that she would never had seen old age.
I now think it was tummy pain that made it hard for her to stretch over oxers. I'm so glad I didn't push her or myself.
Current boy I compete well within his ability and he makes me laugh with his love for the job he does for me. I try hard to be a good enough rider for him. If we end up having problems I will look to myself first and if that doesn't work then I will know that he isn't comfortable. I will find what he is comfortable doing and do that or nothing if that's the case. I see people all the time who continue trying and trying and I think 'why?', it's not meant to be hard and its meant to be enjoyable. I think it's the mark of a good horseman to know when to push on and when to call it a day, I also think many horses have a very useful and happy life even though they may not be 100% sound through good management and why not :). If they aren't in pain and they are enjoying their work thenI don't see the problem.
 
TarrSteps said:
That isn't really what I meant. I think many people are more than happy to think all pro yards are horse abusing factories that start them too young and work them too hard and always sacrifice the horses' best interests to ego. In fact, my personal experience is that it is not the sole province of any particular group. In fact just today I watched a group of people who I'm sure would tell you they love their horses treat one in a way I would never conscience and flat out ignore the horse's obvious distress simply because they wanted to do what they wanted to do.

What I think people are maybe not that keen to discuss is what else might limit a horse's potential/confidence/skill, other than possibly pushing it too hard. Not in a judgemental "this way is wrong" way, but in a "let's avoid this pitfall or recognise this sign of trouble" way. I would say at least some "damage" (in itself a loaded term) is done by ignorance, which is, luckily, easily fixable. If you move a horse up and it goes wrong it might not be possible to completely repair that situation but it might be possible to learn for the next one. Similarly, if a horse moves up easily you can store away the "signs" you recognise in retrospect and look for them again when you have a similar decision to make. Rosettes - even clear rounds - are not necessarily a sign that it's all good and the horse is fine to step up.
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Ah OK sorry for misunderstanding. I can only go by the Pro yards I have worked on and been involved with and I would not let any one of them on a horse of mine when things are going wrong. Another difference between pros and amateurs is that the amateurs don't really claim to be anything that they are not where as the Pros do. By hook or by crook they get the job done. I find this much harder to swallow from a Pro as people look up to them and children idolise them and think if it is acceptable behaviour for x then it must be OK for me.

As Mike007 quite rightly said we all make mistakes, whether through ignorance or stupidity, my only issue with making mistakes is not learning from them.

I often do not think it is just ego, its a business and people are trying to earn as much as possible and we know how morals and ethics can go out of the window for a "fast buck" in any industry.

I suppose there are so many factors that will limit the horses ability to reach his full potential that it will never be as simple as XYZ.

With regards to your last point. Nick Skelton and Arko moved up very easily through the ranks to become Olympic contenders. He gained plenty of rosettes on his journey but openly admitted afterwards that the horse should not have gone as he was not ready and was never the same again. Hey ho though he brings in good stud fees. Have the same mistakes been made with Big Star?
 
We've gone off topic again, though :)

I'm sorry your experience of professionals has been so negative - it's really not been mine that all pros push horses until they break and all amateurs always make the best decisions for their horses, or that only one group will learn from mistakes.

It does go a bit to my original musing though. We will all make mistakes and we should all learn from them. (Including accepting that the people who advise us aren't perfect either!) I guess it does go to the idea that everyone is often making decisions for their horses based on convenience, opportunity or other non-horsey factors - they jump in such and such a competition because it's closer, even if the horse needs another 2 weeks to be solid, or they train with that person because their friend goes there and provides transport. We can only ever do our best within the circumstances available to us. But I think recognising that and acknowledging it might require modifications is part of the game.
 
I would also say, a propos of a conversation about this thread, it's important to think of this stuff in your planning and training, and then let it all go once you're in the tack and listen to what the horse is telling you on the day - good and bad! All sorts of horses rise to the occasion and others that 'should' don't on the day. That's life. All you can do once the buzzer rings is kick on and see what happens.:)
 
Have we gone off topic or just discussed the fact there are so many mitigating circumstances that there will never be a clear cut answer to the original question you asked?

There is no need for you to be sorry for my experiences of Pros, again I guess it comes down to what sits comfortably with the individual. At no point have I said that it is Pros that do the bad stuff and amateurs do not. If you look at my previous post again I state that I have a bigger problem with Pros as people look up to them and think that if it is acceptable for them to do it is OK for the amateurs too. I picked on Arko/Big Star as to me it is a classic example of horses being pushed past what they are mentally capable of because they have the physical ability to do so. These horses are not on their own. The limitations of their competition career are from how they are managed and not from the physical abilities they have.
 
Nothing in horses - life - is ever clear cut. :D

I guess my original question was to see what people thought on the issue - I would never expect a single, universal answer. It was more to the idea that is a 'limitation' something that always needs to be overcome/fixed or can it just be something that's accepted in a horse, even if it means the horse can't do what the owner wants. Is it okay to trust that the horse might know its own limits or is it always a sign that we need to 'do' something? And, if we know a horse is limited, is that really a reason it shouldn't be asked to do any job, even if it says yes?

Clearly, opinions are mixed. :)

I think firewell's answer actually summed it up the best.
 
Allover said:
Have we gone off topic or just discussed the fact there are so many mitigating circumstances that there will never be a clear cut answer to the original question you asked?

There is no need for you to be sorry for my experiences of Pros, again I guess it comes down to what sits comfortably with the individual. At no point have I said that it is Pros that do the bad stuff and amateurs do not. If you look at my previous post again I state that I have a bigger problem with Pros as people look up to them and think that if it is acceptable for them to do it is OK for the amateurs too. I picked on Arko/Big Star as to me it is a classic example of horses being pushed past what they are mentally capable of because they have the physical ability to do so. These horses are not on their own. The limitations of their competition career are from how they are managed and not from the physical abilities they have.
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Ok, so it didn't work out for Arko but it did for Ready Teddy, Minors Frolic, Escada and many others. Horses don't see if they can go out of their comfort zone unless they try. It is recognising if they just need time to work it out or actually shouldn't be there. This is where it can be easy to misjudge a pros motives - mistakes the first time or so doesn't mean failure and with a rider who is consistent in the way they ride to a fence (not all pros!) the horse can learn an improve. It is assessing this that is not always easy and often comes down to trial and error and gut feeling. This is where the experience and horsemanship of good pros is an advantage over amateurs.
Off topic but connected - is it wrong to give a young naive horse his moment of glory even if he never reaches those heights again? Some horses will go there at that stage of there career but won't later on when in theory they are ready. They can enjoy life as a schoolmaster at a lower level as long as this is accepted.
 
TarrSteps said:
That would be a 'how' question for me. If an established horse was consistently giving fences 50cm I would be concerned. There have been a few horses that jumped up to a very high level like this but they are notably unusual and rarely last. If it happened intermittently I'd want to know when and why. It might be something, it might be nothing. It would also fall into the category of 'one fence does not a course make'. Every horse can jump a few bigger fences once and awhile, it doesn't mean they can make a career of it.
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I know this is a bit off topic, but I wanted to ask you about this.

I sometimes ride a pony who overjumps showjump style fences the first time he is asked to jump them, but not on the subsequent attempts. If I take him around a (very) small course twice, the first time, he will overjump everything but the second/third time, he will jump it at a more normal height. The height of the fence doesn't seem to affect this, unless it is so low he can trot over it. He does it with everyone who rides him. He is a gypsy cob type, so not very suited to jumping anyway.

I have put this down to inexperience on his part, as he is not that established over jumps. He used to be a driving pony, and he is not that balanced in the school (although he is getting a lot better). Your post has worried me a little that there could be some other factors involved.
 
oldvic said:
Ok, so it didn't work out for Arko but it did for Ready Teddy, Minors Frolic, Escada and many others. Horses don't see if they can go out of their comfort zone unless they try. It is recognising if they just need time to work it out or actually shouldn't be there. This is where it can be easy to misjudge a pros motives - mistakes the first time or so doesn't mean failure and with a rider who is consistent in the way they ride to a fence (not all pros!) the horse can learn an improve. It is assessing this that is not always easy and often comes down to trial and error and gut feeling. This is where the experience and horsemanship of good pros is an advantage over amateurs.
Off topic but connected - is it wrong to give a young naive horse his moment of glory even if he never reaches those heights again? Some horses will go there at that stage of there career but won't later on when in theory they are ready. They can enjoy life as a schoolmaster at a lower level as long as this is accepted.
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Older horses out competing are more of a rarity and seen as "freaks" to keep going as long as they do. As I have said before the majority of competition horses are finished either physically or mentally well before their time and are often handed down to "amateurs" who spend the time/patience and money needed to get these horses back to somewhere near their former selves.

Yes I believe it is wrong to give a young naïve horse its "moment of glory" if it is detrimental to his physical and mental wellbeing. Maybe if it wasn't having its "moment of glory" at such a young age he would still be having a productive competitive career later on in his life.
 
Allover said:
Older horses out competing are more of a rarity and seen as "freaks" to keep going as long as they do. As I have said before the majority of competition horses are finished either physically or mentally well before their time and are often handed down to "amateurs" who spend the time/patience and money needed to get these horses back to somewhere near their former selves.
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Isn't that a bit like saying all human competitors should be able to compete at the same level until they die of old age and that turning to coaching or similar is an admission of failure?

Interestingly, most of the people I know who compete schoolmaster types have regular coaching and/or are based with a professional and basically on a professional program. I have not heard of too many 4* or GP horses disappearing and then going up the grades again from someone's back yard.

Edited to add I just had a look at the eventing rankings and most of the horses in the top flight are between 11 and 17, so hardly all spring chickens. I suspect the YR lists would skew even older.
 
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oldvic said:
This is where it can be easy to misjudge a pros motives - mistakes the first time or so doesn't mean failure and with a rider who is consistent in the way they ride to a fence (not all pros!) the horse can learn an improve. It is assessing this that is not always easy and often comes down to trial and error and gut feeling.
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I think consistency is a topic not often discussed! The ability to allow the horse to make a mistake and then come back the next time, on the same track, with the same pace and the same ride in training, so the horse can learn to fix the mistake is a special skill all its own. (This is a separate skill from being able to anticipate and adjust quickly in competition or in situations where the risks are too high to leave it to the horse.) It has to do with faith. If you change your ride every time something doesn't go perfectly it's very hard for the horse to adjust. This is why sometimes riders who are not perhaps technically the best but are very sure of themselves can do very well - they do the same thing, with conviction, every time, and the horse learns to adapt. Significant lack of skill will get found out, of course, but the ability to be consistent - especially in the face of trouble - is highly underrated!
 
Penumbra said:
I know this is a bit off topic, but I wanted to ask you about this.

I sometimes ride a pony who overjumps showjump style fences the first time he is asked to jump them, but not on the subsequent attempts. If I take him around a (very) small course twice, the first time, he will overjump everything but the second/third time, he will jump it at a more normal height. The height of the fence doesn't seem to affect this, unless it is so low he can trot over it. He does it with everyone who rides him. He is a gypsy cob type, so not very suited to jumping anyway.

I have put this down to inexperience on his part, as he is not that established over jumps. He used to be a driving pony, and he is not that balanced in the school (although he is getting a lot better). Your post has worried me a little that there could be some other factors involved.
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He just sounds green which, given your greater knowledge of the horse, goes to your gut feeling. :) The circumstances in which he over jumps are consistent and understandable and he improves so it sounds like the sort of thing that just takes time and practice. Does he get out jumping quite often?

Just as a note, if something is "of note" that doesn't necessarily mean it's anything to "worry" about. I'd say most trainers spend about 99% of the time taking note of a horse's reactions without actually doing anything specifically different in that moment. If you go "hmmm" too many times or in too many situations then, yes, perhaps it's time to ask advice or change the program but it's not a case of either ignore or worry. Most of the time a blip is just a blip and it will work itself out with time and patience if you just keep on keeping on. :)


As a note to the original post, it was about a horse that over jumped all the time, even after it had quite a few miles on the clock, and then stopped when the fences went up. So not quite the same. :)
 
TarrSteps said:
He just sounds green which, given your greater knowledge of the horse, goes to your gut feeling. :) The circumstances in which he over jumps are consistent and understandable and he improves so it sounds like the sort of thing that just takes time and practice. Does he get out jumping quite often?

Just as a note, if something is "of note" that doesn't necessarily mean it's anything to "worry" about. I'd say most trainers spend about 99% of the time taking note of a horse's reactions without actually doing anything specifically different in that moment. If you go "hmmm" too many times or in too many situations then, yes, perhaps it's time to ask advice or change the program but it's not a case of either ignore or worry. Most of the time a blip is just a blip and it will work itself out with time and patience if you just keep on keeping on. :)


As a note to the original post, it was about a horse that over jumped all the time, even after it had quite a few miles on the clock, and then stopped when the fences went up. So not quite the same. :)
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Thank you for the reply and sorry for taking the thread off topic :). I realise it is different to the situation described in the other post, but it just made me think of this horse.

He doesn't get to jump that often, as his main rider (who is a young teenager) got a real confidence knock when he tripped over some poles. She is not that keen on jumping anyway, and he was bought for her to mainly hack, which he is very well suited for. Her older sister occasionally jumps him, but she is very busy at the moment, so doesn't have the time- hence me being asked to ride him a bit. Hopefully, if the winter is not too wet, I can give him a bit more regular practice over some small jumps, which I am sure will help, as it is probably just inexperience. :)

He has been broken to ride for several years, but before he came to this home, I don't think he had really done much in the school at all, or at least not for a long time!
 
TarrSteps said:
Isn't that a bit like saying all human competitors should be able to compete at the same level until they die of old age and that turning to coaching or similar is an admission of failure?

Interestingly, most of the people I know who compete schoolmaster types have regular coaching and/or are based with a professional and basically on a professional program. I have not heard of too many 4* or GP horses disappearing and then going up the grades again from someone's back yard.

Edited to add I just had a look at the eventing rankings and most of the horses in the top flight are between 11 and 17, so hardly all spring chickens. I suspect the YR lists would skew even older.
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No it isn't. Human athletes are responsible for themselves. Horses are completely reliant on their humans. I am talking about people placing horses under too much pressure from too young and managing them so badly that they break them, not that they should not be doing it at all.

TBH I know very little about eventing and have never been involved to any level. Do you think that the difference in management could have a lot to do with why they go on longer? I have ridden some young SJ horses and the horses that were produced by a hunting guy who took them up and down the Dorset hills every day were significantly better balanced and well behaved than those produced purely in the school by the rider. They were physically and mentally sounder IYKWIM! Eventers need a huge amount of fitness and body awareness and to achieve this they need to be going over all terrains at all speeds and a horse that is confident and well in his body is more confident in his job? I would imagine there is also a difference in how young eventers and young SJ/Dr warmbloods are raised. I know in Belgium and Holland turn out is not a given so are these studs placing "limitations" on the horse from the moment they are born?
 
Allover said:
Older horses out competing are more of a rarity and seen as "freaks" to keep going as long as they do. As I have said before the majority of competition horses are finished either physically or mentally well before their time and are often handed down to "amateurs" who spend the time/patience and money needed to get these horses back to somewhere near their former selves.

Yes I believe it is wrong to give a young naïve horse its "moment of glory" if it is detrimental to his physical and mental wellbeing. Maybe if it wasn't having its "moment of glory" at such a young age he would still be having a productive competitive career later on in his life.
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How do we know they are finished before they're time? Their time could actually be when they are young, naive and precocious like a child prodigy. It may well be that waiting until you feel they are trained may be too late. When they are naive and perhaps a bit cocky they can be more careful or maybe a bit braver which makes them less aware of their limitations. For me it is not wrong to use this if you are aware that there may be a time when you need to back down and let the horse have an easier life. Horses, like humans, have differing career lengths. Some lose interest or their body/mind has enough whereas other enjoy the challenge and go on improving with age. The former are not necessarily abused just as the latter aren't freaks.

Horses aren't totally reliant on their humans. They have plenty of ways they can say they won't/can't / don't want to play any more.
 
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I think one of the underlying aspects of the whole conversation is the individuality of horses and the fact that we have to be careful with ideas like "should" "could have" "will" I know the people who have the horse is my original example think he "should" jump 1m but the fact is, on that day at least, he wasn't doing it easily. He isn't very old, he's been passed sound by the vet, they haven't pushed him at all, the rider has jumped at that level. . .and yet he struggled. If it was as simple as saying wait until the horses is x age or x level, no one would ever get it wrong.

The same goes the other way, too. Sometimes horses are ahead of the curve. Usually ones with optimised management, schooling and riding, but there is still an unpredictable element to it. I genuinely think - from education observation and experience - that there are "windows" for teaching skills, developing attributes etc and missing them can also mean a horse struggles, mentally and/or physically, more than it might otherwise. It's probably not a big deal in most cases, but just while we're having the discussion . . .

The fact is, as we all keep saying, there is no way to be prefect and that's okay. But I do think it comes down in the end to keeping an open mind and assessing what is ACTUALLY happening not what we think should or should not be happening.
 
I havn't read the thread but my plans for my gelding seem relevant.

I was competing him at 1.10/1.15m BS and Novice BE last summer. I posted on here several times when he started stopping. It turned out he'd damaged his collateral ligament so he's halfway through 4 months off now.


I've thought long and hard about my plans for him when he comes back into work. He has arthritic hocks which have been treated twice now with steroids and once with tildren, and he'll be 16 when he's back in work.

The vets have said the injury should not limit him physically, although obviously there is a higher risk of reinjury.

I've decided he won't be competing at 1.10m anymore. That's the point where it stops being easy for him, and he's done enough. This means I probably won't be competing him affiliated anymore as he is out of discovery and has BE points, so we're just going to play and have fun at lower levels. Do some SJ champs, maybe the Milton Keynes 3 day event, some derby classes. Maybe take up hunting (he loves it but fizzes him up so I didn't dare take him often when I wanted a dressage brain!)

He loves going out - I've never seen a horse light up like him when he sees the box - and I enjoy competing so I want to carry on competing. However, the hocks won't get any better and...well he's done enough to be pushed now. I mean don't get me wrong, I don't think he found novice/1.15m SJ very difficult but it was definitely the point where it always started to show our weaknesses whereas he can pop round a 1m with his eyes shut even if I was riding like crap so I think he deserves to just go out and have some fun at that level now.
 
What an interesting thread! It's a subject close to my heart, as my horse is one who, despite not being physically talented, is an out and out saint, who tries his heart out, and managed to go far further than anyone would have predicted, purely because he never says No, or stops trying. He has however, paid the price for his saintliness, as the demands of the higher level stuff led to pretty major physical problems with hind legs that simply weren't designed to do what he did with them. He then compounded his problems by continuing to try his little heart out and carried on competing for a while, but gradually got more and more unsound, and ended up virtually unrideable when he finally chucked the towel in and said "Enough is enough". Had he been less generous, he probably wouldn't have reached the level that he did, and he probably wouldn't be so fragile now.
I thinks it's important not only to listen very carefully to what your horse is telling you, but also to make some tough decisions about how far you can push a horse, because sometimes - they just carry on trying for you until they break themselves.
 
This sums it up for me as to why it is so important to look after them. Their generosity of spirit. We chose to have them in our lives we owe it to them to treat them right.
 
From a personal perspective I have a lovely SF mare who is currently loaned out as a broodmare. I got her at 20 months and she promptly injured her coronet. She is a beautiful, well bred, talented, intelligent, feisty, gobby, bolshy hormonal mare and I love her. Anyway she *should* have been my horse of a lifetime and instead it was a continual battle to keep her sound and happy. She had a lovely foal at 6 (now jumping 1m50 classes in USA!) and came back into work. We found a dressage trainer and she was going great guns (no competing as we were in the depths of France) then she went lame again. She had "changes" in her foot so there was talk of injecting and the like. I decided given her history and considering how well she popped out the first one that she could have babies instead. She is now in a lovely home with a lovely family and has had 3 more lovely babies with another one on the way next year. She is a fantastic mum and loves her babies :) Throughout our time together it was a battle to convince people there was anything wrong with her, she loved to be in work (she is a bitch when she is not in work/in foal!) so when she played up I knew she was hurting and not just "being a mare" or being nasty. I can only imagine the battles she could have gotten into in the wrong hands! Anyway her physical limitation was not the end of the road for her :)
 
Allover said:
This sums it up for me as to why it is so important to look after them. Their generosity of spirit. We chose to have them in our lives we owe it to them to treat them right.
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Too right. Alf has never been badly treated, but he's had a hard life. He loves his job - and still offers up his party tricks given half a chance - so if he still wants to play, I'll happily accept his offer - but I feel that my job is to make sure he is being rewarded for being a star all his life, so if I have the slightest inkling that light work is hurting him, he'll never work again.
 
I thought of this thread when I read a post on Facebook about the sad death of a pony at the equestrian centre where my nephew rides.

This pony was retired from a career as a showjumping pony to a riding school. He spent 11years teaching children to ride at every level from their first ever lesson to jumping a course. He may not have been seriously competitive anymore but he had plenty of life left and so much to give. He had enough left for lots of children to get their first taste of competition at the RC shows.

The heartfelt messages about him left on FB would be enough to convince anyone that a life at a lower level can be rewarding and happy for a horse. That pony would not have been popular with both staff and clients if he had been unhappy or uncomfortable. He clearly loved his job and did it well despite him being retired from serious competition.
 
And just think of the RDA ponies and all they give :) These horses are "worth" just as much as your next Valegro.

In one of my first jobs I worked with a RS pony who jumped in his younger years. You could put a complete novice on him but as long as you showed him a pony jump the course before him he would get them round safe. I swear he used to try and catch them when they were falling :) R.I.P Dusky.
 
Those lively kind, generous ponies and horses are worth 10x of any competition pony/horse. And often the horses/ponies that take to it best aren't the ones you expect it to be.......
 
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