please watch these vids of my horse being lunged, I don't know what's wrong with him!

[ester]

sorry to here that SB, I'd want to know exactly what they were planning on injecting with (Frank has had steroid + hylauronic acid (joint fluid) injected previously). Only because if he is lame on 3 legs .. you are looking at injecting at least 3 joints (1 per leg) I think you then need to think about the associated lami risk and am not sure whether added cushings increases the risk (if he is positive). I think you need to get some more info first .

 

[Twinkley Lights]

So very sorry hunny that it wasn't better news, as others have said he may still be happy and perky for a few years yet if you get the right combination of treatment.

 

[sophiebailey]

Crikey, what a minefield

 

[JVB]

My old tb had arthritis in both his knees and was quite bad with it, I tried bute but this didn't make much difference so I tried Riaflex HA and devils claw root powder and he was a different horse very quickly, was totally back to normal movement.

 

[HashRouge]

My old lady (19) has had something injected into the joint to stimulate cartilage repair, but I can't remember what it is called! She is fully insured, so we had x-rays and ultrasound scans done to verify what the problem was. We talked about MRI scans, but in the end we decided that we were unlikely to learn anything new (the ultrasound scan showed a ligament injury in the arthritic leg). In the end we decided to try 3 months of paddock rest, with the injection to stimulate cartilage and 4 Cartrophen (sp?) injections. I just wish I could remember what the other injection was called! It's NOT a steroid though - my vet said it's main purpose is to try and encourage cartilage repair and regeneration. You could tell that there was inflammation in the joint as there was always a "hot spot" over the coffin joint of her bad leg, but since the injections and after 8 weeks on paddock rest, it had gone lovely and cool. I don't know how sound she is though, as I haven't see her move faster than a walk for a while. She looks good in walk though, and the vet is coming back in about a week and a half to see how she is. I'm quite hopeful though.

I think the issue is probably clouded by what you can afford. I seem to remember that he's not insured? Ideally, I'd say go for further investigation, because it's quite handy to know exactly what you're looking at. The problem at the moment is that you don't know how severe the arthritis is, or whether the vet is right about it being in all 3 legs, or whether it would be manageable on supplements or whether he would really benefit from injections. But it really depends on your financial situation (sorry, I hate pushing this!), because the investigation can be expensive. But, unless you opt for MRIs, it's not THAT expensive, if that makes sense. My girl's issues showed quite clearly on x-ray. Whatever you decide to do, I really hope things work out for you

 

[Batgirl]

Just to add another opinion into the mix if you go down the bute route I wouldn't bother with the added expense of the supplement as most supplements (particularly joint ones) are preventative and not curative. You cannot re-build cartilage.

Best thing is to keep beloved beastie moving regularly (when sound) and keep comfortable. The supplement will do little unless there have been medical leaps and bounds. AS someone else said injections in 3 legs is a lot of money.

Good luck what ever you choose xx

 

[sophiebailey]

Thank you, Bailey is insured but not for a great deal when it comes to the vets fees section because of his age.

I'm hoping my grandparents will lend me £1,000 so I have the opportunity to take him for the tests

 

[Skipadeedooda]

I know it sounds awful at the moment and and you probably can't see any light at the end of the tunnel but once you start managing this there is no reason he can't hack and go back in to light work. All horses are different and you know yours the best.

I have managed this successfully with my horse for the last 9 years - he's now 20yrs and fitter than many younger horses -he doesn't jump any more but still schools and hacks and enjoys a good canter round fields. He got a course of steriod injections then once in work I managed it with excercise, superflex (excellent stuff) and codliver oil and I have found that magnetic treatments such as wearing a magnetic rug for a few hours in stable or magnetic boots when hacking etc really soothes him. Don't wear magnetic stuff in field as it encourages blood flow so shouldn't be used if horses have open wounds/ in case they have an accident.

I was told to use danillon like a human would use paracetemol, once intial dose to get him feeling better you could just give him one if you think he's having an off day. My friend is in exact situation as you with spavin and ringbone and instead of danillon as it has long term side effects (don't worry one every so oftern will do no harm) her vet gives her Previcox which is predominantly used for dogs and she gives him 1/4 of a tablet per day and he's going great again he is 20yrs and was diagnosed last year.

If vet does x-rays you'll see at what stage the spavin is at e.g initial movements stage when bones start to fuse is usually the worst with pain and inflammation but once bones fuse you are left with the stiffness and achy winter blues. At 20yrs I don't think it would be worth going down this route...your money would be better spent on a good supplement or magnetic stuff to keep him comfortable. At 20 years I think you'd struggle to find a horse that didn't have some form of arthritis.

You know him best and you'll just have to try and few different things and find out what works for him.

I would be confident that once you get this under control you'll have many more years of fun with him.

 

[Skipadeedooda]

sorry forgot to mention Previcox is a fraction of the price of danillon and bute...worth asking vet about it.

 

[BentleyBelly]

So sorry to hear your news. I have a horse that could be yours' brother, so very similar. He even moves the same way without bute. He was diagnosed with arthritis 18 months ago and we had the joint xrayed and then injected with steroid. It lasted 4 weeks and then he was unsound again. I have since tried various supplements and kept him on a bute a day (half a sachet when he is good). I have tried cortaflex, cortaflex HA, flexijoint and most recently Blue Chip Dynamic. The blue chip is by far the best for him and he is looking very good on it at half the recommended dose, he gets a mug a day with a little chaff and a danilon (little bugger stopped eating bute!). Please don't think it is the end...he will have good days and bad days but you will find a routine that suits. Good luck.

 

[Nightmare before Christmas]

I helped do some hock injections into the lower joint today. The horse has had them before and the owner has been a big difference. Hopefully you will find something that works for yours

 

[Goldenstar]

Ask your vet about Tildren , this what we gave our oldie when we got to this stage we got over a year which he really enjoyed having lots of fun I had Danilon to give him if I felt he needed it but I rarely gave it.
I am sorry for you good luck with it all.

 

[FfionWinnie]

Sorry it's not better news. Would you no try the bute first and if no better think about the tests route. Not wanting to sound hard but at 20 you could spend thousands to be told "he's 20" and be no further forward. Good luck with him.

 

[brighteyes]

Just watched the videos and read through all the posts and have reached the same conclusions as most. Old age. I also think he's carrying enough weight and I admit it's a bugbear of mine but it does them no favours.

A professor at Liverpool told me (and a group of students he was teaching) that all horses in their late teens and onwards have 'some degree of pituitary enlargement'. How this affects them varies greatly and laminitis is but one of a huge array of symptoms a Cushingoid horse may (or importantly) may not exhibit. I think laminitis is probably the most catastrophic as most other symptoms are less life-threatening in the long term.

It's not the end of the road yet and I'd prefer to manage a small degree of arthritic stiffness than laminitis any day of the week.

I'd go for minimum cost treatment and be prepared for early retirement. Anything above that will be a lovely bonus.

Watch his weight and don't be too down until your very worst fears are actually realised. They may not be for a good while yet.

Lovely lad he is.

 

[sophiebailey]

Thanks everyone for the kind words and helpful comments

Has anyone got anything they can recommened as an alternative to bute? I'm worried about the long term effects of keeping him on bute

 

[Puddleduck]

You can try devils claw or no bute. I've got a 22 yr old and she was on them for a couple of years as she has a slightly arthritic hock. They worked fine for her and she's in full work however I've just changed to a sachet of danilon every other day as I felt she needed a bit more support

I would get his eyes checked, he's an old man and eyesight can fail as part of the aging process. My girl has 50% vision in one eye due to a cataract, she's adjusted to it now and it doesn't cause an issue when ridden even though it means she can't really see traffic coming from behind when we hack, she stays forward from my leg and pays attention to me.

 

[BentleyBelly]

Thanks everyone for the kind words and helpful comments

Has anyone got anything they can recommened as an alternative to bute? I'm worried about the long term effects of keeping him on bute

I tried Devils Claw and Boswelia, oh and Turmeric but they were rubbish compared to bute. I know the horror stories about ulcers etc with bute but the risks are minimal for the benefit they get. Nothing beats a proper anti-inflammatory and pain killer, please don't waste your money. At 20 he will die of old age before he suffers any ill effect from bute....ask your vet.

 

[Black_Horse_White]

Turmeric is a natural anti-inflammortry, my vet even rates it

 

[sophiebailey]

Thank you. Think I'm going to ring the vet on Monday when I'm thinking a bit clearer and not so upset. I love my horse the world and back and if she tells me he needs the scans + treatment then I'll find the money, but I want to try and be realistic and find the route that's most sustainable and least stressful for him, the route that's going to give him a constant quality of life.

I need to get him comfortable enough that he can go on hacks again because he becomes so miserable when he's left in the field, he needs a small amount of work to keep him happy.

I just want my boy to enjoy his old age and not spend it miserable in a field with stiff legs. Maybe its my inner drama queen talking but I can't see how he'll ever be comfortable again with 3 bad legs

 

[dafthoss]

So sorry to hear this but I'm sure you can find a solution to make him comfortable and you will do the best by him. If he were mine I would bute him this weekend so he is comfortable and then discuss your options with the vet on monday. The weather is doing funny things so that may have set him off which is why he has suddenly become worse if its arthritis related.

 

[popeyesno1fan]

Just going on video, I'd say his problem is in his shoulder, but i dont want to be the vet!!!! To me, it looks like a shoulder problem. hope you get sorted. xxx

 

[Goldenstar]

Thanks everyone for the kind words and helpful comments

Has anyone got anything they can recommened as an alternative to bute? I'm worried about the long term effects of keeping him on bute

Danilon is an alternative to bute better for long term use .
If finance is an issue ask thevet about Tildren which is a very expensive drug but we used it on our oldie without all the expensive diagnosics , which meanlt we spent the money on something to keep him happy and comfortable not spending a fortune investigating all the potential things which could be causing it.
Ask your vet about this approach , it might not be apporiate in your boys case mine was a competion horse so the vet had seen him a lot over the years and we had a good idea what we where dealing with.

 

[Spotsrock]

I have a 32 year old arthritic horse. Kept her comfy on buteless by equine america for years. She's now on half a bute each day which is helping more and keeping her far more comfy than buteless was toward end of me using it. She has liver problems which pre date bute use and it's not aggrevated it.

 

[Sukistokes2]

my horse does that lovely little trip on the front end to, its his sign that he is not using his back end. My boy has arthritis, on his medication he does well. Yes get the Vet, but be prepared that unless they can find something really wrong our may take a lot to find out the cause. It took two years to find out what wrong with Ffin.