Policy on livery yard for in-foal pony - I'm not happy

[lachlanandmarcus]

If I was putting my mare in foal, I would want to make sure that the YO had both the facilities and knowledge to support me and the mare.
I would be wanting a larger box for foaling, straw to bed on (we are usually on sawdust) and the YO's permission to carry out the late night checks for however long was necessary.

If I was you, I too would be mad at this woman's complete disregard for you. Our yard is all locked up at night, assuming yours is, it is going to be quite intrusive for you if you live on site and have her coming and going at all times.

As it happens, the yard I am on now could accommodate a mare and foal, others I have been on couldn't possibly have done so and I would have moved somewhere more suitable prior to getting the mare in foal.

If it really is a massive inconvenience to you, maybe you could suggest she sends the mare back to stud to foal down

This, I would be asking her to leave TBH (Im not a YO so it wouldn't arise) but to me not telling your YO you are putting your mare in foal/have put them in foal is extremely rude and an equivalent level of rudeness would not be tolerated in any other context, so why should it here when there are studs available who could board the mare till foaling?

Just because there might be a field which with a lot of work COULD accommodate a foal doesn't mean you are obliged to do so. The client is paying livery for ONE horse in the existing grounds and anything else is entirely at the YO discretion. In addition it isn't just about the field, its the toings and froings at all hours, upsetting the other settled clients and the plain deception.

I suspect that you are normally a cheery nice YO and it isn't really fair of people on here to judge you as a YO based on a scenario where you have been shafted by one of your clients and backed into a corner. Im sure you would be more sympathetic if someone bought a horse in good faith and it turned out to be a BoGOf, but that's a totally different situation.

 

[Strawbz]

The owner sounds totally irresponsible and has shown total disregard for the well being of her mare, unborn foal, and you! This mare is in the final stages of pregnancy and you didn't even know! I know you said it is a DIY yard but they still should have informed you.

The advice given is great and personally I would give her a months notice to leave.

Be wary when you check on your insurance too. 'Hi NFU, it turns out a mare on my yard is in foal, am I covered?' 'I'm sorry Mr/Mrs ChasingMyTail, you are not covered and your current policy is now invalid. Your new policy to cover the mare will be an extra £1500 to be paid in the next 24 hours.'

 

[Elsiecat]

This may have already been said BUT -
I reckon the owner has only told you now as she thinks its too late to be told to have her foal elsewhere.
Perhaps you could speak to someone who really knows about breeding and see if she can still be moved at this stage?

Could you not tell her to sort her own field out and that she has to sign a disclaimer that any injury to foal or mare in that field is accountable by her and her only?

 

[micramadam]

I'm not a yard owner, I'm a livery and I have to agree with HBM1. I think it's very dishonest of the livery to spring this on the YO. It should have been discussed beforehand.
I bred a foal whilst on livery and this was discussed with the YO who also decided to put 1 of her mares in foal at the same time so the mares and foals could run together and would be company for each other at weaning time. Sadly this didn't work out as her mare took longer to get in foal than mine and foaled 2 months later than mine. My foal was also a huge colt and hers a small filly. However as this has been discussed we still managed to find solutions to the problems and all on the yard were happy. I was happy to absorb any extra costs, after all, they were of my making not the YO's.
Is this the mare owner's 1st foal? If so then she has obviously not thought it all through properly and is going to need a lot of support from the YO. As far as I can see, the YO is within her rights to charge for the extra costs and work incurred as there was no prior agreement. If the mare owner doesn't like it, then she'd be better moving to a yard where the set up can cater for a mare and foal.

 

[Equilibrium Ireland]

I can't see YO's point of view. And also many of us give out about one thing or another.

Here's the thing, this will be difficult. And I agree once people get something extra they sometimes feel entitled. Thing is mare and foal need more than a small space. Electric fencing can be a nightmare with foals. Then you've got weaning. As soon as weaned it's now 2 charges. Then you have to have appropriate company as well. So this really isn't a little inconvienence.

While you have a right to be feeling like you do, this probably isn't right for you or owner. You are already annoyed which is understandable, but the relationship is probably only going to deteriorate further. It just doesn't seem like a place for the needs of mare and baby.

I also propose an in foal exam take place before anyone by a mare. Is it me or does it seem like surprise foalings are becoming common place? If I was owner I'd be trying to find somewhere more appropriate. May not be my fault but nor is it anyone elses responsibilty to get things sorted for me.

Terri

 

[HBM1]

It is best to move with four or more weeks to go, as then the mare can build up the antibodies in her new place. I know some who move 2 weeks before, but I wouldn't risk it due to stress, mares getting used to new surroundings etc. If she is due to foal imminently, it may be best to let the mare foal down there (after all this situation isn't her fault), and then ask the mare owner to move on within a certain period of time post birth.

 

[Equilibrium Ireland]

That should be CAN see YO's point of view.

Terri

 

[Equilibrium Ireland]

In the TB world people move mare's days and a week from foaling. They foal normal. Not the way I'd do it but it does happen. It's basically just a cost saver. Nightwatch is expensive. A mare will build immunities to her environment 3 weeks out and if foaling out for others I like them a little early but it really is a money thing with most.

Terri

 

[Cinnamontoast]

If it's not too late, I'd get her off the yard. It sounds like a nightmare.

 

[ozpoz]

I'd also be upset as a YO. Livery yards tend not to be set up for breeding and that's why your insurance needs checking.
I'm afraid I'd be asking her to look for somewhere more suitable, and if the birth is imminent then I'd ask her to make plans for moving once the foal was old enough to travel.
Both mares and foals should have the right company - a livery yard, with all the coming and going that entails will be stressful for them, and the other owners.

Incredibly irresponsible of the owner, imo.

 

[Tnavas]

New contract - No foals - that's what is in mine! I have council grazing and our contract is really quite strict.

Is there any particular reason the paddock is not in use and needing clearing? Once cleared will it be safe for the foal, if not then you need to tell her that she will have to find alternative grazing as you are not set up for a foal. While mine have never been a problem there are some that just have to get into every bit of mischief possible.

It is advisable to have the mare moved at least 4 weeks prior to foaling so that they build up immunity to their surroundings - helps to protect the foal.

 

[JenJ]

Well presumably if she's doubling her number of horses you can double the money she pays you?

 

[quirky]

I assume the mare owner hasn't been having the vet out for checks/ vaccinations. so sad and irresponsible.

Eh !
How have you managed to reach that conclusion?

 

[Tnavas]

Well presumably if she's doubling her number of horses you can double the money she pays you?

You cannot charge grazing for a foal until it's 6 months old - there's a law somewhere but no idea where I'd find it now.

 

[FreddiesGal]

Eh !
How have you managed to reach that conclusion?

I thought the exact same thing. God Almighty, some people on here really do like to jump ahead of the story.

OP, if you're that annoyed ask her to leave. I'm sorry but you don't sound very 'friendly' to me, or professional for that matter.

 

[WelshD]

I think it's an ok assumption to make even if not true

The owner planned the pregnancy and has managed to keep it secret throughout

Regular vets check ups etc would have surely started alarm bells ringing or tongues wagging

 

[quirky]

I think it's an ok assumption to make even if not true

The owner planned the pregnancy and has managed to keep it secret throughout

Regular vets check ups etc would have surely started alarm bells ringing or tongues wagging

Assuming the mare was scanned in foal at the stud, are there any other regular checks needed?

I was on a DIY yard which was a stable block and land behind a man's house. He had absolutely nothing to do with the yard and wouldn't have known who was who coming and going.
Seeing as the yard here is purely DIY, maybe it is a similar scenario.

 

[MerrySherryRider]

The owner of the pony sounds like an irresponsible nightmare. If the yard is not suitable for foals, then why does she expect you to provide suitable facilties without discussing it . Breathtakingly rude.
Get rid.

 

[Spring Feather]

If you don't want to clear the land and fence as another paddock then tell the owner that what you see is what you get! If you don't want foals on your yard then amend your terms and conditions and give the owner notice to move on. It doesn't sound like you are set up to cater to foals, nor do you sound like you want them, so forget about writing notes and all that, just go and speak to the lady and tell her how it is.

 

[Hippona]

Just a pondering.....where did YO think the mare had gone off to, when she went away to stud? Did the livery lie about it?

 

[megwan1]

If you've got a spare field that isn't currently in usable condition (so I assume its just stood there used for nothing) I don't see the problem with her using it, especially if she's paying extra!
Sure, she should have told you earlier. But perhaps she didn't know herself?
You come across as a YO that I'd run a mile from

just because the field isnt being used for liveries doesnt mean it doesnt have a purpose or a use, hay field perhaps? or machinery parking?

 

[pippixox]

im quite shocked someone would sneak a mare off to a stud and back without mentioning it! especially when at a small diy livery where everyone is normally going to be chatting about comings and goings!
ive never heard the first 6 months no charge rule?
personally, regardless of the fact it is a foal, when it arrives it is just like another horse and she needs to pay whatever you would charge for that extra field, and like others have said the cost of getting it safe and useable.
if she needs extra help you have to charge, as it is a business afterall. if she had be open before she even took the mare to stud she would of had you in a much better mood and even willing to help, but not having been so decietful to you.
i would be tempted to ask her to leave as she clearly has no respect

 

[HBM1]

Just a pondering.....where did YO think the mare had gone off to, when she went away to stud? Did the livery lie about it?

It is not uncommon for mares to be driven to stud, inseminated, and driven home again. If the pony was regularly out and about it would not raise suspicion, or maybe this sneaky pony owner even did it when she knew no one would be around.

 

[Hippona]

Oh, ok......I somehow thought they were gone for days/ weeks
All very underhanded, anyhow...

 

[Gingerwitch]

Just give her her notice -end of.

 

[Clava]

It is a bit cheeky. By personally I think your attitude stinks coming on here moaning about a business client. I hope she finds a better yard.

Livery yards are a business not a right, change her more which is acceptable as obviously there will be more tailored needs or let her find somewhere else but tbh a heavily pregnant mare should be kept calm.

I have to agree, one of my brother's liveries has found out her mare is a bogof and we are trying to provide a safe area for her to foal. If there are costs then charge them, but don't moan about it.

 

[night_mare]

I assume you charge for each livery per horse, therefore as soon as the foal arrives it is an additional horse that you'd be charging livery for so you'd be getting some additional income.

If you intended to clear the other field and utilise it at some point in the future then clearing it now is not really an extra expense or extra work, but more a queston of the timing being brough forward - so it would seem unfair to charge them for something you were going to do at some point anyway at your own expense.

If you never intended to clear the field originally but having cleared it for this livery you then used it for others in the future (eg after this livery client has left) then again it would seem unfair to charge them for the cost of clearing it as once done you would receive a beneift and income from the cleared field after they had gone from future liveries (who didn't pay towards the expense of clearing the field).

If however you never intended to clear it, and if you cleared it for them to use, would never use it again for other liveries in the future after this particular client left - that's when it would be a one-off expense just for this client - after which you would not utilise or receive any benefit of the cleared field. This is the one scenario that I would say it would not be unreasonable to have them pay for clearing it. It may even be better just to rent the field to them (as it is) and leave them to do what they want with it in terms of clearing it, etc at their own expense.

 

[Tnavas]

I assume you charge for each livery per horse, therefore as soon as the foal arrives it is an additional horse that you'd be charging livery for so you'd be getting some additional income.
do what they want with it in terms of clearing it, etc at their own expense.

You cannot charge livery for a foal until it is 6months of age

 

[katastrophykat]

I didn't pay livery on mine until he was weaned... Neither did the one that foaled down the year before me. I have no idea about any laws, I just know I didn't pay

 

[Elsiecat]

You cannot charge livery for a foal until it is 6months of age

Who says?
I can't imagine their being an actual law on this?