Poor foot balance/navicular - help needed!

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rebs

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My horse is back at the vet hospital today. They've just re-Xrayed him and the news isn't great. He's got long toes and very collapsed heels - bad thoroughbred feet. I've been taking him for remedial farriery for the last 2.5 years with little/no improvement in his feet. He's currently in wedge heels with rubber filling which has kept him sound for last 3 months or so, but means he can't go out at all and I'm going up to the yard at least twice a day to muck out and walk him out to keep him sane. If I'm working long days (which happens 2-3 times a week) then the yard will muck out for me but virtually never walk him out, which isn't nice for him. The xrays today show that there is degeneration in the coffin joint so he can't go back to normal shoes, but the current shoes are costing me over £200 every 5 weeks, plus 3 hours travelling to get there and back. Plus supplements for his hooves and joints. I've been told today that the only options are to keep him in these shoes (and none of the local farriers want to do this so I'm stuck with going to the vet's every time) or at a push to take all shoes off and turn him away for several months to see if his hooves can develop some strength (last time I tried this several years ago he came down with laminitis). Either that or have him pts as there's no guarantee he will ever be able to be ridden much and I can't retire him and turn him away with the wedge shoes on as they won't stay on in the mud. Does anyone else have a similar experience? Any suggestions for what on earth I can do??
 
I think your only option is to take his shoes of and to try the barefoot route through Equine Podiatry. Sounds like that being barefoot is the only way in which he is going to grow any heel...
Have you got any pics of his feet? What foot supplement are you using?
 
Hi rebs...
Am in a similar situation to you as my mare has similar conformation to yours, though thankfully we're not at the point of navicular etc yet.
I have a post in the stable yard section which is titled "*without starting a debate* Can I have some advice please?" which may help you
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The only other thing to add is that IME wedges/raised heels etc can actually exacerbate the problem with collapsing heels as they provide the support short term, but at the same time are putting further pressure on the heels and crimping the heel tubules rather than letting them grow downwards.
If you can't go barefooted then perhaps talk to a farrier about eggbar shoes? They support the heels and fetlock without putting extra pressure on them... though this won't solve your turn out problem I don't think
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On the other hand- have to tell you my story! Having been through similar experiences, I found that the heel wedges and natural balance shoes seem to completley crush the horses heels. And they made the feet contracted and thus the whole thing became worse. Heel wedges are only supposed to be worn for a few months anyway- never forever. I assume that your boy is shod with Natural Balance?

I completely went against the advice of the vet and vet hospital and took the natural balance shoes and heel wedges off, and changed farrier to a guy that was very carefull and concientious - he put big round shoes on with just a toe clip at the front, and the heels were well supported. He said that my horse had lovely big round feet and that the feet should never have been forced into the small square shape that is made with NB shoeing. The horse then showed a SIGNIFICANT improvement in movement, immediately. There was so much more depth and surface area to the feet- they are more concave instead of flat little square things. This farrier is very against Natural Balance shoes as he thinks that they stop the horse wanting to pick its feet up properly and therefore stop proper propulsion from behind. Thus the whole musculature becomes incorrect- the horse suffers from aches and pains- and more problems are caused- it is a vicious cirlce.
However have had other horses in NB shoes and theyv'e been fine. It obv didnt work for that particular horse.
It is horses for courses. But IMO heel wedges are crippling for every horse that Ive seen, and make things far worse. Unfortunately the vets dont seem to agree and it is difficult to know when to draw the line between following your own instincts and following the advice of your vet.
 
Thanks for the link to Karen Beaumont. Do you know anything about her reputation? Does your DAEP know of her? I'm a bit worried about taking his shoes off given what happened last time but am beginning to think that it may be the best way forward as shoes aren't working. We were in eggbars prior to this and they didn't work unfortunately. Just got off the phone from the vet and they have suggested that the best way forward is to take shoes off and turn him away for 3-4 months to see how his feet go and reassess in the Spring. He's currently on Synequin (Glucosamine and Chondroitin) and Kerabol (biotin and zinc).
I can post some photos of his feet but not sure how to load them up on this site - anyone know how?
So shoes are coming off this afternoon. Need to get some boots to protect his feet in the field to start with - anyone got experience of which ones are best?
Fingers crossed!
 
Yes, I was worried about the heel wedges too. All the research I've seen suggests that they crush the heels further so will never recover. Asked the farrier about this this morning and he said the silicone filler in the shoe should prevent this, but then the vet has contradicted this by saying that the shoes and wedges can prevent the hoof from growing well. So shoes off and no riding it is. I just hope I've made the right decision and he's not going to be in agony...
 
From what I understand-He will prob be in agony in the first few weeks and this is normal- he just has to get through it...boots will help though ( do not know anything about them!)

As for the feet- would try farriers formula rather than the Kerabol. FF is much more balanced & People rave about FF- and if you look on their website- they've got all the scienctific evidence to back it up on how it works. If you look at the scans of the feet after 6 months on FF- the difference is amazing.
 
Have to second the concerns re wedges and NB shoes. My young horse had foot balance probs this summer, my farrier put NB shoes on - no real difference and her feet looked horrible. Took her to a remedial farrier expecting some fancy shoes but he just shortened the toes, balanced the feet then shod with normal shoes but with side clips, and set a little under the foot. My own farrier has now taken over but I am having her x rayed every 2 shoeings - its incredible just how much toe has to come off. Barefoot may help some horses but not all - mine needed shoes as she has slightly sloping pasterns and setting the shoe back can help support the whole suspensory apparatus. What part of the country are you? The remedial farrier I used is amazing , doesnt seem to do anything radical but does seem to get horses sound.
 
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Thanks for the link to Karen Beaumont. Do you know anything about her reputation? Does your DAEP know of her?

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I am going to contact my EP and I will get back to you. I am confident in recommending her because she is a qualified DAEP using the KC LaPierre trim, and it is a very tightly regulated set up.

I'm concerned that by just taking the shoes off without a proper trim, or an assessment of whether white line disease treatment is needed, your horse's hoof walls will crumble and chip and you will lose heart and give up. If you have the support of a DAEP they will be able to reassure you about the way things are going and tackle any problems that you may encounter. At the same time the trim and conditioning will gradually correct the hoof structure.

I wouldn't recommend boots for turnout unless the ground is frozen.

Bear with me and I will get you a second opinion on Karen Beaumont (have you looked at her website?)
 
Gosh, what a nightmare, really feel for you! What does your farrier say? - do you trust him? I'd be a bit disheartened if 2 years of remedial shoeing hasn't helped the shape of his feet at all.

My mare has coffin joint probs and is in aluminium egg bars, but I know you said you've tried egg bars. It's just wedges sound horrible.

If you do decide to turn him out, can you maybe grit your teeth and wait till early spring when hopefully ground is a little warmer and softer?? good luck.
 
Wedges are horrible. NB is good if none properly as they basically work on shortening the toe and pulling back the break over point, BUT any farrier should be conscious of the toe/breakover anyway without having to resort to NB. A prevoiously said, pulling the shoe further back to support the heels should be done on EVERY horse, but unfortuately it doesnt happen and thats why we get these sort of problems. As previously said, throw him out, get him on a good hoof supplement (Alfa is also high in calcium and protein so good for feet and horn growth) and keep fingers crossed...
 

I would try taking the shoes off, my old mare had terrible feet, in a totally different way to your horse!

Her feet had practically crumbled away & she had a huge crack that ran from her coronet band all the way down with a huge gap at the bottom ( a large triangle shaped gap) that had to be filled with hoof putty, She had had egg bars on for around 4 years, when I started to do less with her my back smith suggested we take them off, I really did laugh out loud! but it was the best thing I have ever doen, She now has lovely feet & they are now bigger than they used to be, I think its just the shape! They key was it was winter when they came off, so the ground was moist with a good cut, by the time the next spring came all the nail holes from the she's had practically grown out, I did wonder as the ground got harder if they would need to go back on but that was 9 years ago! She's 32 now.

I'm considering the same for my 13 year old he was diagnosed with arthritis of the Coffin joint back in May, He's had NB shoes every 5 weeks since then, He's feet are not to bad a shape actually, Its just what's going on in side when you see the x rays! But as I said my old mare seems to have a better shaped foot now, so it might be worth a go?
 
Urgghh to wedges and egg bars!!! A horse cannot possibly grow a decent heel with them on.

By far the best thing for underrun heels is a horse walking correctly, heel first on the road. Obviously it takes a while to get there and to the point where you can do that - but having two years of wedges in a massive no no in my book.

Vets continue to infuriate me more and more as the majority seem to have such antiquated views regarding the treatment of feet problems with absolutely no regard as to modern research.
 
Thanks to everyone for your advice and support. After discussing with the vet we both agreed that the best way forward looks like removing the shoes and allow the hooves to grow. So, I've bitten the bullet and had the shoes removed. The farrier has trimmed them and rolled the toe slightly in front to reduce the risk of the long toe putting excess pressure on the foot. He's on Danilon for the next couple of weeks to try and keep him comfortable just in case and will then see how it goes.
I've been told to get him boots for walking to the field and back as the yard has stony lanes and don't want to get too bruised.
I just hope I've done the right thing. I'll let you know how we get on...
 
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