pts or not-feeling guilty

OP, hope you are OK, what a lot of opinions in a short time on this thread.

Sometimes I wonder if posters actually read what the post is about before firing off replies!

You took the pony on when it needed to be rescued, it has been badly treated and learnt to he defensive, you have your vets opinion, you are the one who should be praised for not walking away and leaving the pony suffering.

As I said before, your pony your decision, personally I would pts and know it was the right decision for the pony and my family.
 
Sugar_and_Spice said:
Whilst I would agree that the mare doesn't *deserve* to be PTS, I don't think its that simple. Would you reply to an "honest" advert for this pony?

...For sale: shetland mare, rescued (bought) in a poor state, previous broodmare, kicks humans and horses, not suitable for children hence sale for a nominal sum, currently has an infected wound down to the bone which requires further treatment, bad to catch, up to date with farrier and dentist, passported, microchipped and has started course of vaccinations....

Seriously, who is going to want this pony?
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Some unscrupulous so-and-so who is out to make a fast buck and damn the consequences . . . which is why I asked WH, in all honesty and without any hint of aggression/malice/nastiness, if she had space for the mare (as all of hers are with her for life).

So sad :(.

P
 
Sugar_and_Spice said:
Whilst I would agree that the mare doesn't *deserve* to be PTS, I don't think its that simple. Would you reply to an "honest" advert for this pony?

...For sale: shetland mare, rescued (bought) in a poor state, previous broodmare, kicks humans and horses, not suitable for children hence sale for a nominal sum, currently has an infected wound down to the bone which requires further treatment, bad to catch, up to date with farrier and dentist, passported, microchipped and has started course of vaccinations....

Seriously, who is going to want this pony?
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I understand it may not be simple to find a home for her but its got to be worth a try before coming to the decision of pts. Don't get me wrong I am not against putting a dangerous horse to sleep, I would never want to see one passed on and yes there are fates worse than death. Maybe I'm just naive, or maybe I just don't like to think of a pony being pts when it could have the chance to go to a home where people will spend time with it to build trust again.
Personally - No I wouldn't respond to the advert now because I'm not looking to buy; however if someone was looking for a companion then I don't see why not (I'm assuming the wound would not be mentioned as would like to think OP would have that treated prior to moving on.)
If I was looking for a companion, then I possibly would look at it but I am the sort of person that wants to save the world! Also I'm thinking having them at home and only one or two people handling it, not on a livery yard. I would be happy to take a chance on it and spend the time with it, but no I don't have children.
There are plenty of horses out there that are known to kick. Yes it is dangerous around children but lots of people that don't have children keep shetlands as companions. All I am saying is its got to be worth a shot at an honest advert first.
 
To me it's a no brainer ... I may sound harsh but I'd not sell even if I could, I 'd put to sleep. I couldn't live with the consequences if it harmed someone elses children and I certainly wouldn't keep it if it was a risk to my children. I feel sorry for it but at the end of the day, even shetlands can seriously injure people - you've done what you can and it didn't work. call it a day before there is a serious life altering accident.
 
YouOnlyLiveOnce said:
I understand it may not be simple to find a home for her but its got to be worth a try before coming to the decision of pts. Don't get me wrong I am not against putting a dangerous horse to sleep, I would never want to see one passed on and yes there are fates worse than death. Maybe I'm just naive, or maybe I just don't like to think of a pony being pts when it could have the chance to go to a home where people will spend time with it to build trust again.
Personally - No I wouldn't respond to the advert now because I'm not looking to buy; however if someone was looking for a companion then I don't see why not (I'm assuming the wound would not be mentioned as would like to think OP would have that treated prior to moving on.)
If I was looking for a companion, then I possibly would look at it but I am the sort of person that wants to save the world! Also I'm thinking having them at home and only one or two people handling it, not on a livery yard. I would be happy to take a chance on it and spend the time with it, but no I don't have children.
There are plenty of horses out there that are known to kick. Yes it is dangerous around children but lots of people that don't have children keep shetlands as companions. All I am saying is its got to be worth a shot at an honest advert first.
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But it's not great with other horses either so how is it suitable as a companion?

P
 
Thank you everyone for your responses. I have read through them all and digested the information. A couple of people have even messaged me and offered her a home which is amazing. I think I need to go away and think about this carefully now, I feel that taking her life is such an enormous responsibility and yet as someone said, it is not this next home but any after that which concerns me. In all honesty I dont think any of us can say 100 percent that they know for a fact their circumstances would never change and if she ever went anywhere else then it could be a disaster. She is only 12, she has had 5 foals - 2 in the last 2 years so she hasnt exactly had the best life, she has been through the sales twice that I know of, she deserves a break. I have just been back out to her and the first thing she does is turn her bum on me, I am not inexperienced or stupid, (I feel I should explain myself to those that questioned it) my daughter was leading her on one side and me on the other when she knocked her and spun around on her. My littlest one was in the stable with my husband (who is horsey too so not stupid either) who was putting a headcollar on her whilst the baby stood in the opposite corner but grumpy mare that she is buggered off around the stable and gave her a barrel for good measure on the way round. She is a spiteful pony, she wants to hurt people when they dont antagonise her unless you call being within 10 foot of her antagonising! I think a few people have been a little harsh but I did expect it and I havent taken it personally, except one person who was just rude but hey ho, maybe its that time of the month or something ;) All your comments have been useful so thank you and I am sorry for causing a bit of a row xx
 
Sadly with the current state of the market I highly doubt there is this wonderful, experienced, patient home out there for this little mare that many people seem to be suggesting. You've only got to look on the usual horsey facebook pages to see the dozens of horses and ponies offered up as companions for free that do not have medical or serious behavioral issues. Honestly, if you were looking for a companion would you take on a pony that is as difficult as the OP's and requires vet treatment over the others that are straight forward and healthy? I know I wouldn't.

The rescue centers are mostly full and those who do have space are saving it for the horses and ponies that didn't have a responsible caring owner who was brave enough to make the tough decision to pts.
 
YouOnlyLiveOnce said:
I understand it may not be simple to find a home for her but its got to be worth a try before coming to the decision of pts. Don't get me wrong I am not against putting a dangerous horse to sleep, I would never want to see one passed on and yes there are fates worse than death. Maybe I'm just naive, or maybe I just don't like to think of a pony being pts when it could have the chance to go to a home where people will spend time with it to build trust again.
Personally - No I wouldn't respond to the advert now because I'm not looking to buy; however if someone was looking for a companion then I don't see why not (I'm assuming the wound would not be mentioned as would like to think OP would have that treated prior to moving on.)
If I was looking for a companion, then I possibly would look at it but I am the sort of person that wants to save the world! Also I'm thinking having them at home and only one or two people handling it, not on a livery yard. I would be happy to take a chance on it and spend the time with it, but no I don't have children.
There are plenty of horses out there that are known to kick. Yes it is dangerous around children but lots of people that don't have children keep shetlands as companions. All I am saying is its got to be worth a shot at an honest advert first.
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Honestly, I have a pretty black and white approach to this, hence my support for the OP because I have been involved in a hell of a lot of welfare cases over the years and it's surprising what you find out when just minor investigations are undertaken.

The thing is, any private home is not guaranteed. I have one of my dogs because the 7th person to "rescue" her died two years after taking her. He was 52 and perfectly healthy one minute, heart attack the next. The vet had an advert up and we agreed that if she couldn't manage with me and my other dog, that we would have her pts as she could not cope with the cycle. She is now 15 and going great guns, but I absolutely would not have passed her on.

I have worked with a horse that was taken on by a well meaning "forever" home, a lady with land and great facilities, lots of experience, the dream home...but she became ill. She asked her husband to have the horse pts if she died because it had a lot of issues. The husband couldn't bring himself to do it, advertised it as free to a good home and it was collected within the week. By the time we got hold of it, it had to be put to sleep due to having too many medical issues caused by neglect to be saved.

Nobody has a crystal ball and I fully understand and empathise with the desire to save the lives of all animals, but that comforts our human desires...it does not protect the animals and ultimately, regardless of how much it hurts us, we must put their welfare above our personal feelings.
 
nicolenlolly said:
Thank you everyone for your responses. I have read through them all and digested the information. A couple of people have even messaged me and offered her a home which is amazing. I think I need to go away and think about this carefully now, I feel that taking her life is such an enormous responsibility and yet as someone said, it is not this next home but any after that which concerns me. In all honesty I dont think any of us can say 100 percent that they know for a fact their circumstances would never change and if she ever went anywhere else then it could be a disaster. She is only 12, she has had 5 foals - 2 in the last 2 years so she hasnt exactly had the best life, she has been through the sales twice that I know of, she deserves a break. I have just been back out to her and the first thing she does is turn her bum on me, I am not inexperienced or stupid, (I feel I should explain myself to those that questioned it) my daughter was leading her on one side and me on the other when she knocked her and spun around on her. My littlest one was in the stable with my husband (who is horsey too so not stupid either) who was putting a headcollar on her whilst the baby stood in the opposite corner but grumpy mare that she is buggered off around the stable and gave her a barrel for good measure on the way round. She is a spiteful pony, she wants to hurt people when they dont antagonise her unless you call being within 10 foot of her antagonising! I think a few people have been a little harsh but I did expect it and I havent taken it personally, except one person who was just rude but hey ho, maybe its that time of the month or something ;) All your comments have been useful so thank you and I am sorry for causing a bit of a row xx
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OP, do go away and give it some thought, perhaps discuss with your vet again.

If you do decide to gift her, firstly make sure you are completely honest in everything you know of her. I would also put her issues in writing and have any potential new owner acknowledge that she is a difficult horse - if nothing else to slightly limit any potential come back.

I do think you have to be so careful when giving away problem horses - just look at the woman you bought her from, it could be a fate worse than death to be passed around.
 
nicolenlolly said:
Thank you everyone for your responses. I have read through them all and digested the information. A couple of people have even messaged me and offered her a home which is amazing. I think I need to go away and think about this carefully now, I feel that taking her life is such an enormous responsibility and yet as someone said, it is not this next home but any after that which concerns me. In all honesty I dont think any of us can say 100 percent that they know for a fact their circumstances would never change and if she ever went anywhere else then it could be a disaster. She is only 12, she has had 5 foals - 2 in the last 2 years so she hasnt exactly had the best life, she has been through the sales twice that I know of, she deserves a break. I have just been back out to her and the first thing she does is turn her bum on me, I am not inexperienced or stupid, (I feel I should explain myself to those that questioned it) my daughter was leading her on one side and me on the other when she knocked her and spun around on her. My littlest one was in the stable with my husband (who is horsey too so not stupid either) who was putting a headcollar on her whilst the baby stood in the opposite corner but grumpy mare that she is buggered off around the stable and gave her a barrel for good measure on the way round. She is a spiteful pony, she wants to hurt people when they dont antagonise her unless you call being within 10 foot of her antagonising! I think a few people have been a little harsh but I did expect it and I havent taken it personally, except one person who was just rude but hey ho, maybe its that time of the month or something ;) All your comments have been useful so thank you and I am sorry for causing a bit of a row xx
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You honestly sound very sensible. Good luck with whatever you decide :) I'm sorry that you have been put in a position that was never your fault x
 
PolarSkye said:
But it's not great with other horses either so how is it suitable as a companion?

P
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I have to admit to not having read the whole thread so far, just OP's original post. Fair point though. Guess would only be suitable as a companion where horses are on individual turnout. Its a shame as doesn't seem to be the horses fault, sounds like its never been backed so unsurprising its had issues (not OP's fault as she believed it was a riding pony when she bought it). It trusted at one point and didn't have the issue from what the previous owners have said so I think someone to give this pony time to build trust again could work
 
RunToEarth said:
OP, do go away and give it some thought, perhaps discuss with your vet again.

If you do decide to gift her, firstly make sure you are completely honest in everything you know of her. I would also put her issues in writing and have any potential new owner acknowledge that she is a difficult horse - if nothing else to slightly limit any potential come back.

I do think you have to be so careful when giving away problem horses - just look at the woman you bought her from, it could be a fate worse than death to be passed around.
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Very well put RTE. Best of luck OP.

P
 
I haven't read through the whole thread, but OP, it sounds like you have two choices. First choice - you keep the pony but are now fully aware that the kids must NOT go near her, and you try with time and patience to win her round -it may work, If not I think you'll have too go to second choice of PTS.
It would probably be the kindest thing for her if plan A doesn't work (there are plenty of fates worse than death out there for little ponies) and at least you can say you tried.

You sound like a very kind person (I'm a sucker for little ponies too) I wish you luck.
 
PolarSkye said:
Well therein lies the OP's problem . . . from what I gather, the ponies are kept in a field where one daughter rides . . . and two-year-olds will be two-year-olds even with the best supervision.



. . . and I gather the OP has taken the advice on board, considered it, and made her own decision - for her own reasons - which is her right.

P
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cool, and we were asked for our opinions which we gave based on the information given.I wish the op well, have certainly never set out to be rude on here ever.

right, back out to play with new horse :D
 
OP, whatever you decide to do - I hope it goes well.

And to all those who say 'who would want a pony like that' - well I would have been one offering a home, if only my shettie weren't still entire. To have her come to live with him wouldn't be the best idea in the world. I still firmly believe that the little lady should be given a chance to become again the happy pony that by all accounts she once was and if there is anyone out there that can and is able to offer a home and that chance then why not take it?
 
Well she's clearly in the wrong home. It happens. More frequently than one might think, especially in the 'rescue' market.

I think the OP must be the one to decide the fate of this pony but just be aware that a great many horses/ponies do change once their living situations change. I don't know how many distressed horses I've had over the years, some coming here with dreadful reputations, and yes of course I'm careful around them initially, but I've seen huge changes in these horses given enough time, patience and teaching. This pony is probably never going to be a childs pony at this age however there could be another home out there which could work perfectly for her. Rehoming any animal, even good ones, takes time and an innate sense of who will be the right match for the animal is invaluable.

Whatever you do, good luck. I personally wouldn't put a horse/pony down for this reason however I also know there's no way I'd jeopardise my child's safety either, so searching for a suitable home would have been initiated immediately after the child had been kicked (although I'm incredibly cautious about letting little kids be around horses so most likely wouldn't have had child in that situation in the stable - just saying, not being judgemental OP - it's my business to make sure people are safe around horses). I have a lot of equine contacts so I'd be fairly confident that I could find the perfect home for the pony but if you don't have this OP then you must make the best decision you are able to. Best of luck whatever you choose to do.
 
Sounds like a very frightened, unhappy pony that needs a quiet life not a bullet.I appreciate that finding the right home is a minefield but I would be tempted to give it a go before pts.
I am looking after a similar pony right now...been through the ringer and just needs a bit of quiet and some space. She's currently doing a fab job of nurse maiding an oldie Shetland who's losing his sight and some youngsters.
 
If I was being honest, in your situation (as I think I see it) I would pts. Obviously horses can be rehabilitated perfectly over 80% of the time but is it worth the risk? Imo definitely not, not risking small children.
I'm shocked at the amount of people who are crying over the idea of putting a pony down who obviously is not safe around what ultimately is her target market - kids, if it was a dog that had bit your child people would be screaming bullets at it. If it was a bigger horse (16 hands?) people would not be so blasé about saying give it away. Just because its small doesn't mean it cannot hurt and damage people. I know it is not the pony's fault but it is kinder to put her down than pass her on and risk danger to somebody else's child. What could have happened if your child wasn't wearing a helmet? Brain damage, dead, put the poor pony down before something serious happens.
I know there are people who would take this pony from you but a forever home is nit always for forever. And due to the pony's size, chances are she will end up around kids again. This pony, may with proper care become safe around children/inexperience people but that will not happen over night (may never happen) and until then,you and your children are at risk.
 
Those 'having a go' at the OP for her sensible decision if the post said this :

I've got this Shetland pony, I bought it in a terrible condition & was deceived by the sellers. It turns out it's a kicker. It's kicked several people including a child in the head, it doesn't get on with my herd, is a nightmare to handle & now it's got a very severe injury.... Where is the best place to advertise it free to good home?'

Can you honestly say that you would be saying 'well done OP what a great decision, definitely in the best interest of the pony' really? REALLY?
Because by slating her decision to have this pony PTS IMO that is exactly what you are suggesting you would say.

The world is full of lovely, nice horses & ponies that need a home. Whilst it isn't this pony's fault she is dangerous the fact is, she is dangerous!!! More people need to be responsible like the poor OP!
 
glamourpuss said:
Can you honestly say that you would be saying 'well done OP what a great decision, definitely in the best interest of the pony' really? REALLY?
Because by slating her decision to have this pony PTS IMO that is exactly what you are suggesting you would say.

The world is full of lovely, nice horses & ponies that need a home. Whilst it isn't this pony's fault she is dangerous the fact is, she is dangerous!!! More people need to be responsible like the poor OP!
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The pony is dangerous to the people in her situation at present. The pony may not be dangerous in a totally different environment. And no-one has slated the OP from what I've read; everyone has simply given their opinion on how best to resolve the situation. The only people I've read who appear to be slating anyone are those who are vehemently pro-PTS to the people who are offering up other suggestions rather than just having the pony PTS. Either way, it makes not a jot of difference to any of us; it only affects the OP who has to make the decision, and obviously the pony who either lives or dies.
 
I don't see anyone slating the OP...I do see some people getting in a bit of a stew over some of those that wouldn't immediately PTS !
 
Im so sorry you have had to go through such an ordeal OP, glad your children are ok,
As their mum, you have a responsibility to them, to keep them safe, so you have to make that awful decision.

Me? Id PTS, I wouldnt even try a rescue, purely for the fact that she will them become a lifelong responsibility on a charity who is probably already short of funds, she would probably end up locked away or stuck in a field, and who is to say she still would not go on to hurt someone,

Feel for you OP, hope you sort something soon xx
 
Am I the only one here that thinks a pony can be taught not to kick?! And very quickly at that...

That said, OP, I would be 50/50 in your shoes, so whichever way you go, I totally understand.
 
Adopter said:
OP, hope you are OK, what a lot of opinions in a short time on this thread.

Sometimes I wonder if posters actually read what the post is about before firing off replies!

You took the pony on when it needed to be rescued, it has been badly treated and learnt to he defensive, you have your vets opinion, you are the one who should be praised for not walking away and leaving the pony suffering.

As I said before, your pony your decision, personally I would pts and know it was the right decision for the pony and my family.
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There should be a like button here - I totally agree!
 
Agree nearly anything can be turned around, look at the types of horses and pones rescues centers round up, petrified animals who will surely kick out if they had the chance and look how they turn them around.

OP if i could afford another i would take her from you, but i have 4 of my own. I do feel for you, just like i feel for the pony, she deserves a chance, just like all of those lovely ponies going to market deserve a chance, if you can save 1 star fish on a beach, it will make a difference, lifes a bitchhhh, but you need to do what you feel is right.

I am a big one for turning animals around, from parrots, to deer, to horses, to dogs to pigs, to cows, thats just me and i aint gonna change
 
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