Pugs?

Lévrier;12744588 said:
You are beating your head against a brick wall I fear Colouredwelsh, there are an awful lot of people who have decided that breeders are clearly the work of the devil and cannot do any good.....

I get similar comments every time I mention CKCS on here, despite knowing the breed an awful lot better than a lot of people passing comment
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Not really, I am genuinely querying as a scientist if the traits desired by the breed standard are directly linked to some of the associated health problems how will good breeders resolve the issues?
 
My mum has 6 of the blighters.... she absolutely adores them and they her. They are major lap dogs, sit on her Feet when she's standing do something, have an involuntary licking you problem but also incredibly overweight. One had a serious rare illness and cost them £6,000 which they are still repaying

But Great Little dogs if you want a lap companion as they just love constant human contact :)
 
ester said:
Not really, I am genuinely querying as a scientist if the traits desired by the breed standard are directly linked to some of the associated health problems how will good breeders resolve the issues?
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That is a perfectly reasonable question Ester - you weren't one of the ones I was meaning :) In answer to your question, I think good breeders will be the ones who influence the breed clubs (and therefore the Kennel Club) to change the breed standard for a better quality of health (bad grammar but you know what I mean?) :)
 
yup that makes sense :).

I do think if someone were to say the breed standard should say short muzzle, flat face not preferable and place less emphasis on screw tail being preferred too.

Compared to say CKCS that has a huge range of tests available for breeders to use to help them breed healthier dogs the situation doesn't seem to be quite the same for pugs other than x-raying for hemivertebrae (though parents can still be carriers)- I don't know if you have to have these anyway to get the tail?/hip displaysia

ie.

http://www.dogbreedhealth.com/cavalier-king-charles-spaniel/

compared with

http://www.dogbreedhealth.com/pug/

Although from those it might just be because CKCS have managed a longer list of issues, with the conformational ones included as well. But, CKCS breeders can show they are being responsible, with testing, more than the pug breeders can - unless they are obviously breeding conformationally different dogs.
 
Perhaps a more unusual suggestion but how about a papillon (I type this with my own pap smugly sleeping in my lap). Small, active, generally pretty healthy bar the usual small dog problems (can be prone to slipping patella, teeth problems and mine is incredibly picky with food) and they are just such happy little creatures. I've got a grumpy, elderly, ill cat and my dog has always been very good with him- she goes to the yard (on a lead as she is so small and fearless around the horses) and she is very trainable. They are not everyone's cup of tea but if you want a small, fluffy lapdog that can also do all kinds of tricks and training and is outgoing and active then they are a good choice IMO.
 
We also breed Boston Terriers and miniature pinschers!!!! Both have health issues but again we've never had jeuvenile cataracts in our Boston lines or slipping patella in our min pin lines.

Our min pin foundation bitch is now 12. Our Boston foundation bitch would have been 12 but we lost her this year.

12 years of breeding from these lines and no health issues in our puppies.

Hmmmm me thinks we do something right!!!! Not back street breeders, just breed when we want a puppy for the ring and only ever to try improve the breed standard!!!!!
 
Lovely dogs and we have two that lived quite happily with the (now deceased) cat. In fact, both dogs used to move apart so that the cat could sit between them. We also used to have ducks, with a regular posse of ducklings in our courtyard where the dogs sit out in the summer. They never touched the ducks (wanted to) because they had been told not to go near them.
cinnamontoast said:
TFC: border terrier, you know you want to!
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I have one and they are wonderful dogs! Their reputation for having health problems is largely due to back yard breeders, but you get this with any breed. The breathing is not an issue with all pugs and collapsed trachea, which is what some pugs can get, is something other breeds of dogs can get as well. Hips dysplasia is prevalent in many large breeds but a good breeder will hip score their dogs and should not breed from those with bad hips.

Pugs are not lazy dogs, mine can happily keep up with my friend's staffie and outruns my neighbour's patterdale. He is incredibly affectionate and full of character. Many of my dog friends who have never really met a pug are surprised at how much character he has! I'm part of a group of pug lovers on facebook and there are pugs on there that are 16 years old! If I was to get another pug, I would look for a reputable breeder that has had both parents tested for PDE and HV and one that is kennel club registered, as the KC will not allow you to interbreed siblings, which I think is part of the problem with backyard breeders who get any local stud in.

Feel free to PM if you wish to know more :)
 
Echo24 said:
I have one and they are wonderful dogs! Their reputation for having health problems is largely due to back yard breeders, but you get this with any breed. The breathing is not an issue with all pugs and collapsed trachea, which is what some pugs can get, is something other breeds of dogs can get as well.
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Other breeds of flat-faced/brachycephalic dogs - ie completely related to the current breed standard and just because it is only some dogs that is ok? - and it is not just collapsed trachea that causes issues- that is often the last stage, see here
http://www.vcahospitals.com/main/pe...h/brachycephalic-airway-syndrome-in-dogs/2143

and as mentioned earlier,

Brachycephalic ocular syndrome
hemivertebrae (HV testing is incomplete as a dog can still be a carrier and x-ray clear)
skin fold issues

It isn't just tracheas and hips and eyes that are a problem, many of which are intrinsically linked the the current breed standard, and if good breeders are breeding to this standard it isn't just back yard breeding which is an issue.

I just cannot see how it would not lead to a much healthier dog if we allowed them to have short muzzles rather than the ski/slope flat type nose they currently have.
 
One of my rehomed pugs has a collapsed trachea and the other is too fat. My past pugs luckily had no health problems until old age. Such a shame the breed standards are so extreme and there are many unscrupulous breeders. Pugs have great character, like other dogs and love being with you as much as possible, which I am sure would not suit everybody.
 
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