Racehorse bloodlines! WWYD?

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Fimbacob

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I have the opportunity to purchase a fantastically bred horse at an absolute steal, but bearing in mind it might be awful to handle as unbroken age 6. I get the impression the horse is next to abandoned and would really benefit from some tlc. I have loads of exp. bringing on youngsters and have another I have brought on to ride already, so theres no rush, but what do I do with her? She will never be a happy hack and im not a competitive rider, maybe id try a bit of BE80/90. Would someone else compete her for me? Does she need to compete at all? Any experience/advice welcome! X
 
Yeah... If she was bred to race with decent bloodlines, she must be pretty diabolical to get to 6 without being broken or handled properly!

But if you think she won't be a happy hack simply because of her bloodlines, take the blinkers off ;)
 
My horse has race horse blood lines on both sides of her family tree and is related to Mr Prospector... It doesn't stop us hacking! :)
 
If you have the skill to take on an unbacked horse, do it. It sounds like she could do with a home. She might be the safest, bombproof hack ever, a super competition prospect or a twit - at the moment she is an unknown quantity. View her and see what she's like, as giving her an education will give her a far brighter future. :)
 
My Thoroughbred Bo, is by Desert Sun who sired a New Zealand mare by the name of Sunline (Bo is her 3/4 brother). She had career winnings of $11,351,607AUD. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8yZpnk1nXtk

Through Danzig he is related to Danehill.

He has Northern Dancer on both his sire and dam lines. Through Danzig he is distantly related to a horse called Makybe Diva.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AVOspyelgRw

Also a horse called Northerly who had a big rivalry with Sunline back in the day.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_YLsmKjVlNw

He is also related to Black Caviar through Desert Sun and Nijinski. Black Caviar won at Royal Ascot in 2012.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjSOqlEs6qo

Now that I have rattled off all these racing heavyweights... Bo would be quite content being a happy hack. He doesn't really mind what he does as long as he gets fed and loved, his feet trimmed, has fresh water and looked after correctly. Just because a horse has racehorse bloodlines does not mean they have to compete. :)

I agree with Lolo, a well bred race horse isn't generally left unhandled. They at the very least have basic groundwork taught. I say take her on, she could end up being the best horse you have ever known, she could be a little madam. You never know unless you give her a chance.
 
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Spanner in the works coming..........my view, and hopefully very wrong, is the mare was broken at yearling/2 year old as she is flat bred and then one of two things happened.

She could have had major temperament issues or major physical issues that prevented her furthering her racing career. Bloodstock breeders spend huge amounts of money on stud fees and the keeping of broodmares. I think around 60% of race bred horses are failures for whatever reason. My advice, for what it is worth, would be to trace your potential purchase back to the breeder, look at the pedigree and make a lot more enquiries before landing yourself with a possibly mad as a hatter, unsound nightmare.

Remember some TB lines are known to be difficult, Montjue for instance - brilliant stallion but throws quirky but mega talented stock.
 
My experience of TBs if if they are going to be quirky to ride they are already quirky on the ground. What's she like to handle? As AA suggested trace her back to her breeder. Is she flat bred or hunt bred? Fortunately horses can't read so she doesn't know what her breeding is nor her potential. Lots of tbs make excellent hacks.
 
I work on a racing yard and just recently we had two 6 year old in to break. The owner/breeder just had them sat in a field and had overlooked them or was a bit short on money- we are not sure.
Both a little more tricky and stuck in their ways than a younger horse but doing really well and hoping to run one of them soon.
Both will make really lovely riding horses if no good at racing.
Never say never!
 
I had a lovely TB in - grandsire had won the Derby :)
THE most stunning well put together chap & lovely natured to handle on the floor & in the yard, with no stable/field vices.

However, he couldn't race (was a complete arse if behind any other horse at any time, so was told by trainer)

Tried to retrain as polo-pony - complete arse (as told to me by YM)

Retrained him myself (got him as reject from polo yard at 4 in autumn) to be happy hack & dressage monster as cost me £200.....
Took to all fine - untill another horse was in front..... then very dangerous horse!
Managed to get him to compete in winter dressage by obtaining early times etc but could not progress from there as could not work in with others.
Sold him to a lady after 8 months & careful vetting of prospective purchasers - who hacked on own & kept him at home with small pony - 18yrs later, still one happy horse & happy owner (horse of lifetime for her)

Be careful.... breeding is NOT everything.....
 
I have three ex racers - all different bloodlines, all completely gorgeous and all happy hackers after successful careers on the track. The only problem I've had with any of them is that one hated going out on his own and became quite silly. Oddly, he's the softest soul on the ground. One TB is so different from another; it's a shame they get tarred with the 'typical TB' brush. They are super horses and, having seen so much so young (two of mine are better travelled than me!), they aren't phased by much.
Most TBs have Mill Reef/ Northern Dancer/Danzig/Rainbow Quest etc in their bloodlines which means not a lot nowadays.
I wouldn't let the age put you off too much. It's no bad thing to have a couple of years off after being started so young. Good luck.
 
char3479 said:
I have three ex racers - all different bloodlines, all completely gorgeous and all happy hackers after successful careers on the track. The only problem I've had with any of them is that one hated going out on his own and became quite silly. Oddly, he's the softest soul on the ground. One TB is so different from another; it's a shame they get tarred with the 'typical TB' brush. They are super horses and, having seen so much so young (two of mine are better travelled than me!), they aren't phased by much.
Most TBs have Mill Reef/ Northern Dancer/Danzig/Rainbow Quest etc in their bloodlines which means not a lot nowadays.
I wouldn't let the age put you off too much. It's no bad thing to have a couple of years off after being started so young. Good luck.
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Just wondered - did she ever race - when you say unbroken, do you mean as a racehorse?
 
Bloodlines only create a price tag in racing. You could have the best bred horse in the world and it could be utterly useless!

Take Voodoo Prince for example - by the massively talented Kingmambo out of none other than the supermare herself Ouija Board. Didn't race until it was an older 3yo gelding and has managed to win a donkey derby or two on the all weather - a far cry from the Triple Crown horse he was supposed to be.

Forget thebloodlines as they generally mean nothing if the attitude/ability isnt there.

Plus at 6yo it is also possible that she was destined for jumping and was left longer to mature.
 
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Bloodlines mean nothing unless you're trying to breed something to sell back into racing. TB is limited gene pool, so most horses related to something famous. Do not assume there is a problem because it hasn't been started yet. I know of a couple of tb's been bought unbacked from the field, had passed through several hands of people with aspirations but little interest. One had even been won in a poker game.

Take the horse at face value. May make superb riding horse. Have you considered doing endurance? May be a sport you enjoy (& you don't ever have to go up to the big distances if you don't want to, you could spend your career doing pleasure rides). You will find a lot of horses which have been written off from other sports find their way there. They enjoy working with someone, & being allowed to move along with minimal fuss. I would suggest though you train them to settle behind as well as infront, a horse pulling or misbehaving for miles is not fun.
 
Lolo said:
Yeah... If she was bred to race with decent bloodlines, she must be pretty diabolical to get to 6 without being broken or handled properly!

But if you think she won't be a happy hack simply because of her bloodlines, take the blinkers off ;)
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Absolutely agree with this! If it has got to 6 and not been broken I would think that is either a lie or it is as Lolo said "diabolical"- i.e. unrideable
 
ThoroughbredStar said:
Absolutely agree with this! If it has got to 6 and not been broken I would think that is either a lie or it is as Lolo said "diabolical"- i.e. unrideable
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How on earth can you possibly know that without meeting the particular horse in question?

Plenty of horses of different breeds and values are backed at an older age with no problems at all.
 
Faracat said:
How on earth can you possibly know that without meeting the particular horse in question?

Plenty of horses of different breeds and values are backed at an older age with no problems at all.
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As you can see in my post I said "think" not "I know"

This op has stated the horse has racehorse breeding, so I am presuming it was bred to race (unless I have misunderstood OP?!) Races horses are broken as yearlings (usually). If it was bred for racing it is highly unlikely it hasn't been broken/tried in training- ppl don't bred racehorses for them to do nothing- they are bred to do a job, race or breed- failing that they get sold onto do something else. So unless like SF says, it has been a broodmare, I find it hard to believe it hasn't been tried.

OP- have a look to see if the horse has ever been put through a sales ring, i.e. ascot or tattersalls etc. You can see if it has sold, who to, what they intended to do with etc etc. You can find out a lot on a horse bred for racing- do your home work and you could avoid getting something you really don't need/get someone elses problem.
 
Lots of mares, especially Irish mares are kept for breeding and never race. All everybody is doing/can do is guess without knowing a bit more about the one in question......
 
bonny said:
Lots of mares, especially Irish mares are kept for breeding and never race. All everybody is doing/can do is guess without knowing a bit more about the one in question......
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Out of curiosity- why do you say especially the irish mares?

Yes, all we can do is guess but you can certainly dig the information up :)
 
Define fantastic bloodlines. I have found that they are unlikely to remain unbroken that long if they are truly well bred for flat racing, although it is not entirely unusual with NH horses, especially as given that age, there are likely to be a few that didn't sell at the sales and the owners ran out of money due to the recession.
I find a lot of tb's are quite happy to just potter around, they don't know if they are competing or not!
I would look at tracing the breeder, and maybe trying to find out why it was unbroken, or look in the bloodstock section of the racing post, do a sales search and find out if it was ever entered at the sales.
 
It's not as rare as you might think for TB's to not make it to training, especially recently with the financial situation. Training fees are steep. I could have bought a cheap 'slipped through the net' one like that recently but I'm not in a position to do so sadly.

But anyhoo - the situation is the same, the OP needs to view the horse and find out more about it. Hopefully it will all work out and the horse will have a nice home and be a happy ridden horse in the future. :)
 
No, a lot of tb's with moderate bloodlines are not going into training any more, but she did say 'fantastic bloodlines' which makes quite a difference!
 
Thanks for all the replies. Some very interesting points that I hadnt thought of. She has been used as a broodmare but I dont know if she has ever raced. Im going to do some detective work and trace back to the breeder. Although I was supposed to be saving up for a horsebox!! Doh!
 
My Tb mare has many well known racehorses in her pedigree. I've never ridden her but seen her throw massive tantrums at competitions to the point my daughter wouldn't take her anymore, but, out hacking she was apparently pretty good, bold, fearless, no jogging and dancing, providing she was ridden consistently, if you left her for a week or more then you'd have o get the nappiness out of her system. It's a shame about the competitions because she has a cracking jump and quite nice paces for a TB but she likes being a happy hacker and in fact now is mostly a companion, she does not seem at all discontent with this.
 
If she's been a broodmare then why do you say she's unhandled ? Have you actually met the horse ? Firstly you say she's unhandled and now she might have raced ! Confusing .....
 
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