<rant alert> why do people over bit horses!?

feisty_filly

feisty_filly

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it makes me so mad! a girl that i know rides her 4 year old in a grakle nose band, a single jointed pelam with roundings and a running martingale. poor thing, shes hardly light in the hand either!
i know, i know its her horse she can do what she wants with it but i just think if you have to put tack like that on a 4 year old thats not good.
she broke the horse herself last year and has had gadgets (always lunges in a passoa(sp?)) on and off it ever since.
correct me if im wrong but id much rather teach my horse to be ridden lightly in a softer bit than strap it up.

rant over. thanks for listening :)
 
just to add im in no way against putting a stronger bit in if the horse genuinly needs it, i just have an issue in horses being put in gadgets as people seem to like the way they look.
 
Not ideal but I would actually much rather see someone riding in a stronger bit and using their hands lightly than people that claim their horse is snaffle mouthed and end up pulling the poor things teeth out.
 
wellsat said:
Not ideal but I would actually much rather see someone riding in a stronger bit and using their hands lightly than people that claim their horse is snaffle mouthed and end up pulling the poor things teeth out.
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i very much would agree - if she had light hands
 
Totally agree, but most people use them because they look cool on there horse or they make people think 'that horse must be very difficult to ride and she must be a very good rider' kinda thing. OR they are just totally ignorant and dont know how to to train there horse.

P.S. Totally didnt recognise Darroch in your photo! :D How is the little man doing?
 
:D darrochs great thanks, had his first night out last night after the gelding! being such a big boy (but im pritty sure he will expect a huge feed when he come in this afternoon ;) lol) how are your guys?
 
My boy is in a flash and I would love to take it off but he needs it on! He looks prettier without it!!

I agree with what your saying my horse is in a gag with just the one ring above and below the snaffle ring and I can have a nice light contact
 
What's wrong with her lunging in a pessoa? They're brilliant for getting the horse moving correctly and building muscles...

But I agree it's a shame when young horses have to be bitted up so much, however some are just like that and need the extra tack
 
wellsat said:
Not ideal but I would actually much rather see someone riding in a stronger bit and using their hands lightly than people that claim their horse is snaffle mouthed and end up pulling the poor things teeth out.
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^^^^^This^^^^^^

My mare is in a port-mouth pelham and flash.

Teeth all fine (recently had major work to remove a busted one and spent alot of money to make sure all was well in there) and yes...so is back (recently checked) and saddle.

This is the only bit she respects, I have tried EVERYTHING else INCLUDING a bitless (might as well have hopped on with nowt, as we galloped off down the field...) and this is the only bit she does not fight me on.

I have had MANY people question me on this, and I offer people the chance to ride out, in a snaffle....and when they hit Scotland, they might decide I was correct after all.

My mare is 16 years old, and almost 4 years of working hard to school her in a snaffle has fallen by the wayside. To fight against it IMO, is much worse...than being able to be light on the mouth on a bit she respects.

Horses are like humans, we are all individuals, and I am afraid.....that like us, they do not follow 'what is morally right and correct' in the book.
 
That seems a bit OTT for a young horse. I do hope it's teeth are ok though, my rising 4yold has got a wolf tooth that is due to be taken out. There's still alot going on in their mouths at there age which could contribute to bitting problems and adverse behaviour.
 
I think a lot of people over bit a horse, either because they are scared of them, or just dont know how to train correctly. People seem to believe that the bit is what stops the horse, so its like if one bit doesnt work, instead of teaching the horse HOW to stop, they use a bigger bit. Until people realise that the bit is not actually the brakes, people are gonna use stronger bits when training would be more ideal.
 
Quote..<rant alert> why do people over bit horses!?

Because unfortunately some people are more concerned with 'fashion' that what is actually appropriate for their horse.

I notice on my yard that if one person gets (for example) a crank noseband for their horse...within a week there's an outbreak of crank nosebands, someone gets a Dually halter...suddenly they've all got their ponies wearing them and the yard is full of 'horse whisperers'
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I must admit that when I was a child / young teenager, I thought big bits were fashionable. It was a common thing amongst my horsey friends that we'd pretend to have big warmblood stallions who needed every gadget under the sun to control them, and then we could prove what good imaginary riders we were. Luckily for the equine population in general, I didn't have a pony when I was little. Bt the time I did, I also found myself a lovely, very practical, down-to-earth horsewoman who took me under her wing and guided and trained me. She questioned every ounce of tack on my pony, and if I didn't have a good enough reason for it to be there, it got taken away.

The end result is that I'm not one of the "strap it down" brigade, and I like to think I have common sense when it comes to horses.

So IMO, what these people are lacking is PROPER education.

And no, I don't have any objection to big bits when used properly. I had the task of re-educating a bolshy young cob once, and she loved the Myler short-shank triple barrel. I looked over-bitted, but felt very proud the day I took her to the field her owner regularly got dumped in and walked her round on the snaffle rein with the curb only there for emergencies. Correct use, not over-use!
 
I get fed up seeing ponies at shows, especially little kids lead rein and first ridden ponies being ridden in hanging cheek or wilkie snaffles - they are pretty much gags and a true childs pony should never need such a bit in it's mouth.

All of mine are broken in full cheek french link bits and caveson nosebands and they will be shown in these as novices. My lead reins go in small french link eggbut snaffles. My open ponies get schooled to portmouth pelhams so that they have the correct double set of reins in the ring. Each and every one of these ponies can be ridden by pretty much anyone in a snaffle. They are light in the hand and work up from behind properly, their only flaw is that most of them need a strong leg to keep them goings forwards working rather than just bumbling along with a passenger on board.
 
I agree with OP. Hate seeing people with stupidly strong bits when the horse clearly doesnt need it. You should start with the most basic, simple bit then go up from there only when necessary. Too many people jump up to crazy strong bits missing all the ones in between (or simply trying one with a different action). And why do so many people keep a horse in whatever they buy it in?! First thing I do is put it in a snaffle and take it from there!
 
MagicMelon said:
And why do so many people keep a horse in whatever they buy it in?! First thing I do is put it in a snaffle and take it from there!
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Because it makes sense sometimes, if a horse seems to be going well in a certain bit, for a new rider to use that bit, whilst they are getting to know each other. Doesn't mean they are incompetent or anything else.

MANY people are nervous when buying a new horse, and if they feel safe, the horse doing alright, why would they want to change something? Sure, have a play when they are feeling more secure, but for a sure beginnng, then it is perfectly reasonable for a rider to keep a horse in a bit it is used to.
 
MagicMelon said:
I agree with OP. And why do so many people keep a horse in whatever they buy it in?! First thing I do is put it in a snaffle and take it from there!
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Not totally fair. The people I sold my (11 year old) horse to have kept the same bits in that I recommended. Having owned him for nearly 6 years I had arrived at a combination that worked for him. Loose ring snaffle for flatwork and a fulmer NS gag for jumping. No need to reinvent the wheel as he went well in those bits.

And there are 2 sides to the bitting argument. A pelham for a 4 year old sounds extreme. All the babies on our yard, whilst in a variety of bits have all got very soft mouths, but there are older horses who need stronger bits then a snaffle.
 
I hate seeing young horses in big bits.
I backed monty (6 next month) myself and until earlier this year had only been in snaffle and martingale (martingale purely as he is a head shaker and even with nose net some days his ears end up up my nose without it other wise he wouldnt wear one.) Recently put him in neue schule jointed pelham with roundings afetr the little sod took off with me 5 times on the trot (in different places so not a habit thing). He only wears it when hacking in company and jumping as it gives me just a tad more control of his gangly legs. Hacks alone and schools in said snaffle. Will pint out i have very light hands and thought this was better option than yanking his mouth about in sanffle in the futile attempt to stop him. He's only tested the pelham once whilst xc and after small half halt not tried again. He's happy in these so wont be changing them again.
 
A girl a once knew backed her 3yr old in a 3 ring gag!!! :eek: :eek:

When I asked her (nicely) why, she said if it started to buck with her she could give it a jab so it learns it's lesson first time around.

Said horse did buck, a lot, it did like to bronc. The girl came off a good few times to many. Sold the horse to driving home and never rode again.

Thank god.
 
Mucky Shavings said:
A girl a once knew backed her 3yr old in a 3 ring gag!!! :eek: :eek:

When I asked her (nicely) why, she said if it started to buck with her she could give it a jab so it learns it's lesson first time around.

Said horse did buck, a lot, it did like to bronc. The girl came off a good few times to many. Sold the horse to driving home and never rode again.

Thank god.
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Thats horrific!!! not to be mean but she deserved to come off.. if i was said horse i'd have her off then trample all over her!!
 
OP I am totally with you. No need for it whatsoever on a young horse, horses are only taught to pull by bad riders.

And roundings should be burnt.
 
DragonSlayer said:
My mare is in a port-mouth pelham and flash.

Teeth all fine (recently had major work to remove a busted one and spent alot of money to make sure all was well in there) and yes...so is back (recently checked) and saddle.
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What about your riding?
 
Its not nice to see a horse dragged around in anything let alone a strong bit, so I get where the OP is coming from. I also know that sometimes a horse requires a stronger bit.

I myself use a loose ring jointed snaffle for flatwork & hacking, but a Cheltenham gag for jumping for my mare. I use the Cheltenham because she works a lot on the forehand & without it I would be almost pulling her back teeth out trying to get her to collect towards a jump. Put the Cheltenham in she becomes easier on the arms/shoulders, comes nicely into fences & doesn't try to dislocate my shoulders by tipping her nose after a fence. In return my hands remain light & only half-halts on needed for pace readjustment. Hopefully I will eventually SJ in her snaffle but its going to take a lot of training.
 
I really dislike it when people feel the need to have their horse in a pelham just so they can get an outline - they should at least try in a less severe bit first and do a bit of work to get an outline rather than just locking their hands on and forcing the poor thing's head in.

I used to have a Connie that used to be my mums since he was 6 and when she got pregnant I took over him as I had grown out of my section B. He was always a bolshy horse, and he was a lot of hard work to slow down let alone get into an outline, but me and my mum could both do it with a single-jointed eggbutt snaffle - we just never locked on, and just used a lot of half halts and gave the rains to him when he was good. We did used to put him in a pelham for shows, because he got too strong for us to stop! I think that putting a 4 year old in a pelham or a gag or any form of strong bit is unacceptable - they should only be used when they genuinely are needed!
 
DragonSlayer said:
Probably as bad as your attitude, my dear.
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Why does questioning whether you've had your riding checked, make my attitude bad? It was a genuine and valid question, I felt! I just can't comprehend any feasible reason for putting a horse in a pelham with roundings and a flash?! What a combination, sorry that it blows my mind.
 
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