Remove shoes for introductions?

[TreeDog]

A new horse recently arrived at the yard, and he's supposed to be joining the same field as mine. They're currently in fields next to each other to get used to each other over a fence before going in together. The new one has been quite threatening to mine over the fence, he's a big horse and shod all round so I'm a bit worried about them going in together. Mine doesn't have shoes and I don't really know anything about having a shod horse, so want to ask on here if it's normal/reasonable or really annoying to ask the owner of the new one if his back shoes are being/can be removed for when they're put in togther for the first time?

Or does it not really make a difference, a kick can be can be pretty damaging anyway shoe or no shoe?

 

[be positive]

An experienced YO should be able to determine if the threatening behaviour is is a genuine threat and likely to become more serious or if it is posturing and if put in together they should quickly become friends, it can be tricky to make that judgement and as a YO I would take the hind shoes off if I felt the horse was a real threat but equally if I felt it was likely to be really nasty I would not put two liveries in together as the risk of injury is not worth the risk.
I would either try a different pairing, sometimes they take a dislike to one and not another, or leave them in their own space for longer, ensure they have been worked and turn out at the same time, not put one in to another horses field which they can be territorial about, introductions sometimes need careful thought, other times it is obvious they will get on well and you can just pop them in together with no issue at all.

 

[Bob notacob]

I watched an amazing intro yesterday .Middle ranking horse and newcommer were going back to back . Herd leader wanders over . Has serious word with mid ranking horse and tells him to button it. Goes over to newcomer and by sheer presence tells him to clear off. Newcomer slinks off into next field ,one very sad bunny .

 

[Clodagh]

I always take hinds off for an intro. It is a PITA but having lost a horse to a bad intro it is well worth it.

 

[Red-1]

I would remove hinds too, but then they would both be mine, so not a pain to me at all.

 

[milliepops]

even with the shoes off, if they are going to have a proper set-to then you can't assume they won't hurt each other. One of mine was paired with another horse and they were shoved in together without me knowing... that evening I arrived to cuts and knocks all over her hind legs, sad lame horse and cellulitis setting in. not happy!
If they can't be friendly over a fence then it's not worth putting them together IMO.

And on the other hand, if they are friendly neighbours and not showing any signs of lifting a leg I'd put 2 horses together with their shoes on without worrying too much. Like BP mentioned the key is to really observe their behaviour.

 

[paddi22]

I can totally see the logic but if I was the other owner I'd refuse as my horse is currently going through remedial shoeing every five weeks under vets orders and it would be an absolute pain, a hassle trying to get my farrier in the first place and costly for me to get him to come just remove the backs for a day. Just something to think about, it's not always that easy to just remove the backs. Even with the others, if any were due to go to an event or anything I wouldn't want the back shoes taken off because the chances are they might be tender, or it would be sod's law they would stand on a stone and get a stone bruise hooning around.

 

[TreeDog]

Thanks all. I don't think I'll ask if shoes can be removed, but I'll chat to the owner of the new one about what his typical behaviour is like with new horses, I guess she would know whether it's just attitude for show or whether he might actually be aggressive (and hopefully she'll be honest!) YO also wants to put them in together just before I'm going to be away on a work trip and also wants them in the field that's been resting for a month which now we've had rain the grass is looking very very lush, so I'm not sure how happy I am about that :/

 

[Auslander]

I'd be putting my foot down re the new one being introduced yet.
I've got a horse here who arrived 3 months ago. Normally, I keep them in solitary for a few weeks for quarantine purposes, then turn them out next to the herd they're going into - then I watch them, and watch them, and watch them. Nothing gets turned out together til they are all getting along over the fence. Usually, it takes 1-2 weeks- but this guy didn't have a good word to say about Alf for 10 weeks. I tried them together about 6 weeks in, but the new boy kept charging Alf, who's a bit too creaky to be running for his life! Newbie was sent straight back to solitary, and didn't go out with the boys til last week, when I could see a difference in his attitude. I watched them like a hawk for the first day, and they ignored each other, so I carried on turning him out with the boys. 4 days later, I turned him out, and they promptly started grooming each other!
It takes as long as it takes - not worth rushing it.

 

[milliepops]

It takes as long as it takes - not worth rushing it.

^^ wise words there Aus
Sadly not all YOs are as patient as you. I've been on several yards where they all give lip service to "it takes as long as it takes" yet you turn your back for a second and find that they got ants in their pants and shoved the newbie in, and everyone has had a ding dong.

That said - OP I would also raise my concern about the new horse being introduced (a) so early and (b) when you're away - you'll be fretting about it otherwise when you can't be there to supervise.