Scary Judgement re Buyer Beware

[onemoretime]

I couldn’t agree more, the most important thing about any horse to me is its temperament… it’s such a subjective thing that I don’t know how anyone can buy any animal sight unseen… it’s like getting married off a tinder ad (having never even gone on a date) and expecting it all to be roses… is it possible , yes but likely - no.

OMG just imagine doing that

 

[Upthecreek]

I think holding dealers to the same standard as private buyers and sellers is unrealistic.

My own horses become - even if temporarily - part of the family and I feel a responsibility to carefully place them in the best home for them. I have had 2 horses needing retirement and I found non-PTS but also non sale options for both of them. Both are safe and happy. I could not PTS a healthy, happy but unsound horse. I have spent £££££££ on vet bills for horses such that the vet bills dwarf the original cost or intrinsic value of the horse. I do that because they are my 'family' and I feel I owe them. And they are - to me- a pastime/hobby.

For dealers they are their livelihood. We can find that distasteful - but then we would have to accept the end of horse ownership as a leisure pursuit, as who is going to breed, produce and sell these horses without people making a living from it? It's all very well saying 'well then costs increase and so be it". But ethical breeeders and producers will always be priced out by dodgy ones! So that is simply unrealistic too.

Of course dealers should place horses responsibily (even if unseen), of course they should manage the horses health care needs, of course they should describe the horses accurately. And the friends I know who deal as well as train do all that. Dolly & Lottie both came from fab dealers. But essentially your post seem to say if you don't virw and vet you're a crappy dealer who deserves all they get?

But I see this completely the opposite way round, I see this decision as terrible for horse welfare and for honest dealers. It emboldens the crappy dealers who will feel buyers have no legal comeback, even if they misrepresent the horse. While a dealer who wanted to trade honestly (and did PTS immediately, not try and send back for a refund) was hammered.

This is a victory for cruel and shady practice (misprepresenting then travelling a severely injured horse) and a punishment for behaving in the horses interest (PTS rather than refusing delivery and send back) and generally leaves a horribly sour taste in my mouth.

But the law does not agree with you, hence why it’s a huge risk to rely solely on the description given by the dealer (whether you are a fellow dealer or a private buyer). The Judge has applied the law and decided that the buying dealer failed to carry out due diligence (which is true). Even though it was proven that the injury the horse had was old, the Judge presumably decided it could not be proven that the selling dealer was aware of it?

Do the ethical honest dealers of higher quality horses pass them around unseen and unvetted? Dealers who pass around/swap horses they haven’t been able to sell (possibly because of a physical or behavioural issue), are surely taking a big risk that the horse will have something wrong with it? And if they fail to carry out due diligence, it’s a big gamble and they can’t be that surprised if it doesn’t always pay off. People lie, stretch the truth and exaggerate.

If the knock on effect of this is that it makes people consider more carefully who they are buying horses from and how they are buying them, I consider that to be positive. If it makes people question why a horse is ridiculously cheap and sounds too good to be true and people stop buying from dodgy dealers I’m all for it. There is no market if there is no demand.

I have no problem with ethical honest dealers making a living out of it and they would not be priced out by dodgy dealers if people stopped buying from dodgy dealers! And if that means people have to pay more for quality horses and not everyone that wants a horse can afford to buy one, well that’s life.

 

[onemoretime]

Its not always easy to spot a dodgy dealer though. Some come highly recommended on this forum!

 

[SO1]

It was definitely VERY visible!

So did the dealer buy without even seeing a photo or the horse trotted up in a video just based on a description from the other dealer?

I presume the horse must have been sold to the dealer for a reasonable sum to make it worth their while going to court to get the money back.

If a dealer selling to another dealer mis describes the horse could that not be described as fraud.

I wonder if in this case with trade to trade sales the expectation is that a professional horse dealer would know the risks of buying unseen and would request a photo or recent video trot up even if buying horses from the field.

 

[ycbm]

If a dealer selling to another dealer mis describes the horse could that not be described as fraud.

You would think so, wouldn't you?
.

 

[Keith_Beef]

I suspect that it was thrown out of court because of a lack of written contract and because the case was badly presented.

The buyer should have got a written contract and then would have had the possibility of a civil case for breach of contract when the delivered horse was not as described.

 

[Upthecreek]

Its not always easy to spot a dodgy dealer though. Some come highly recommended on this forum!

True! Which is exactly why buyers need to beware and do their research and due diligence.

 

[honetpot]

f the knock on effect of this is that it makes people consider more carefully who they are buying horses from and how they are buying them

That should have always been true, but people think they buy a horse like a car, and dealers sell horses to the public like they are selling a car or a fitted kitchen, make it look sleek shiney, and its up to the buyer to see through the sales pitch. Most buyers seem to want to believe the sales pitch because they are buying a dream.