Sell? PTS?

Apologies. I am an emotional wreck at the moment who is lost a spiral of guilt and heatbreak.

A friend of mine has just suggested talking to RoR and Heros, both of which I will do as they will be perfectly suited to potentially finding him the right home....I have also begun to looking into retirement livery for him to put him out for 6months + to allow him to just be a horse.

Rest assured I am only going to do what is best for him.
 
I agree with the majority of posts none of which I find judgmental but you are considering pts far to soon.
You are advertising a project horse which he is, but for that you need a project horse price eg £800. Yes you will get lots of unsuitable phone calls, but not all and your get a feeling on the phone who you should let see him and who you should not.

And if you do give up and PtS so soon will you be able to forgive yourself or will that just add to your understandable sorrow with the loss of your lovely horse.

Good luck
 
You need to do what's best for you, BUT, you do need to take SOME responsibility for the horse. If you don't see any hope for you and him (and I do think two months is a very short amount of time) then I think you should re-write the ad placing more emphasis on his good points and less on his bad. You can have a private convo about his exact foibles without all and sundry seeing and being put off instantly.

He doesn't sound dangerous which is a huge plus so already there is a bigger market for him that you might think. I think this is a situation where you need to cut your losses (financially) and just do your best to ensure the home is a good one.
 
FWIW, I do understand how you feel. Trev was on full livery in a v small yard & got obsessed with the lady's mare. Wouldn't let her out of the field, wouldn't be caught himself, being utterly impossible & dangerous. The lady was going ballistic, contacting me over & over again saying that she wanted him off her yard NOW, while I was at work miles away. So I booked Holts, who were lovely, as I thought I simply cannot be doing with him & this totally dreadful behaviour & PTS seemed a fair & reasonable solution. Then like you, when emotions had settled, I calmed down & explored other options, found a ret home & cancelled Holts. Not saying that anything you decide/decide against is right or wrong - just that I understand the rollercoaster.

I understand the grief thing too, having lost Catembi in the most awful way in 2007, and still having got through it rather than over it. ((((hugs))))
 
Of course, you will be a wreck, you lost a horse you loved in a traumatic way, thats totally naturally. And don't feel guilty, you are just sounding out all scenarios, which is totally right to do. Don't add more stress onto yourself over this. This is a scenario that will get sorted with a bit of time.
 
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It’s all been said above, taking the emotion out of the posts - it’s a stressed tb not doing anything particularly dangerous, and seemingly not ok pain.

You clearly are not getting on with him and if it’s upsetting you this much then sell him. £2000 is really expensive for a “project” needing work, especially in Scotland’s where the market is smaller and lots come in from Ireland. £800 would be a decent price if he is a looker.

I have nothing against pts where it is warranted, but there is no reason I can see in the posts as to why he wouldn’t do well for a different rider.

You have every right to be upset and pissed off at the whole situation, and I can understand why it is an emotive subject for you.
 
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Not read all of this but you are anthropomorphising A LOT... I’d advertise him with an honest advert for loan with view to buy... and see if u get any takers...
 
To take the immediate stress off you, put out the most urgent fires : is it that the horse isn't working out as a companion in your field with your other horse?

Do you keep them at home? Is it just the two of them in the field?
 
We got a young very stressy ex racehorse 13 years ago. I would say it took 2 years to see serious change in him. He also madly chomped his bit when ridden. After a lot of repetition in his handling, riding and management he worried a lot less. He did best in a herd situation, but also coped quite well in other situations too. Once he knew his job and what was expected of him he improved greatly. He found his confidence in us in his own time. He is 18 now and so easy to read and a cheerful horse. It took us a while to understand him as he was totally different to any other horse our family had in the past.

If you have recently moved he may be quite unsettled again. As said above tb's can be very sensitive and as such benefit from thoughtful handling. But if you can find the energy to persevere with him and of course rule out pain, you may have a lovely horse after all. I wish you all the very best with him. You sound like you really want to help him. If you can get some input from someone familiar with ex racehorse issues, it could be really helpful.
 
lannerch said:
I agree with the majority of posts none of which I find judgmental but you are considering pts far to soon.
You are advertising a project horse which he is, but for that you need a project horse price eg £800. Yes you will get lots of unsuitable phone calls, but not all and your get a feeling on the phone who you should let see him and who you should not.
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^^ agreed.

I have 2 projects, one was gifted to me and the other I bought at the local bargain basement sales for £900. Only paid that because I liked her breeding.

The welsh took at least 12 months to start to look relaxed. She had been kept on her own for years and was on high alert and very stressy as a result. The WB from the sales has been passed from pillar to post for the last year or so and was a weird mix of exhausted, stressed, needy and difficult to handle but 10 months on is starting to feel like "my horse".

I took these horses on knowing that I could be getting myself into a bit of a muddle so at least I was prepared, whereas it sounds like you were not aware of what you were taking on. That sucks, but it doesn't change anything IMO.

I think you would be able to find him a home if you want to, but you will have to be prepared to sell for peanuts and take the time to find the genuine people. We are out there. I wouldn't pay anywhere near £1k for a horse like you have described, likely to need treatment for ulcers and a lot of time to come right. But I'm a good home for a horse that needs time and understanding, there are plenty of people like me. Shame you moved to a new area because word of mouth is usually the best way to find these homes.

If if comes to it, then I also wouldn't condemn you for PTS, its a guaranteed future and the horse does not suffer. But I also agree that it seems a bit premature given what you've all been through, and I would be "restarting his clock" in terms of how quickly you think he should be progressing, to restart on the date that you moved, because that's another big shock to the system.
 
paddi22 said:
Mt tb used to absolutely melt when i first got him, we had to move yards three times because of moving house, and it was really only when he was out 24/7 in a herd in the third yard that he settled. Two months isn't a lot of time, and they can be sensitive horses. If he was mine i'd stick him out for a few months on grass if budget allowed it, and then look at him down the line. I was totally in the same boa as you before I moved house, and it it was such a relief to just find cheap grass livery and let him off with no pressure on either of us. He came back a diferent horse. Also Would it be worth working an natural horseman style trainer to just give the horse a chance so you can say you tried? I got a rescue exracer loon in for retraining, and two sessions with a good trainer worked wonders, i had a completely different horse.

My thinking would be that while you (completely understably!) not in a good place, you DID take over responsibility for the horse, and saying it 'looks unhappy' isn't a strong enough reason to PTS after two months and a lot of changes. I have a few rescues in who I thought might be lost causes, and it usually IS a case of two steps forward, one step back, like you say.

usually if a horse is a nice character and has no physcial issues, they come right with a bit of time. If he's relatively safe to ride and just a bit unsure then that's not the end of the world. Sometimes they just need to settle with you and learn to trust you. TBs can be very soft souls at times! Are you used to riding tbs?
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This, and I would get him scoped for ulcers.
 
As many others have said above, maybe he needs a couple of months of stability and routine before considering other options. The best thing that ever happened to my highly strung TB was herd turnout and being on part livery. That way he had the same group of mates, he was turned out at the same time every day, brought in at the same time every day and whilst I took away all hard feed and fed a calmer to help him settle and not be so fizzy, after three months he was settled and more rounded. He is now a dope in every aspect. In-fact, I moved yard yesterday and he walked from the box, to the field calmly like he had been there all his life. He has come in this morning for some feed and hay and there is no calling or box walking. These animals can be so highly strung and such stress heads that they sometimes need a little more time and patience than your average horse.

I am not opposed to PTS if it is what is right for the horse, but I feel like he could do with some more time, especially if he was as relieved to see you as you stated he was after the move. Good Luck :)
 
lucy108 said:
Apologies. I am an emotional wreck at the moment who is lost a spiral of guilt and heatbreak.

A friend of mine has just suggested talking to RoR and Heros, both of which I will do as they will be perfectly suited to potentially finding him the right home....I have also begun to looking into retirement livery for him to put him out for 6months + to allow him to just be a horse.

Rest assured I am only going to do what is best for him.
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Hi Lucy, just bumping your reply which seems to have got lost a bit! This sounds like two pretty good avenues to explore (turn away/RoR) and would just add if you do decide to keep him & turn him away then I'd look into treat for ulcers once he is at the yard he will turned away at.


I wish you the best of luck in finding a solution, he is lucky to have an owner who is taking responsibility and not just 'punting' him on yet again without ensuring his next home is suitable.
 
2 months is nothing, its a road that is as long as it takes.

tbs are working horses, they need to work,to have lots to think about, he is most likely bored out of brains from his previous life and needs someone to show him what the world is about and teach him all the interesting things there are to do and take up his brain power, stress in horses can be a sign of utter frustration at having to deal with stupid humans.

i also think a tb can be a full time job so in no way do i underestimate the effort involved.
 
Gosh, if looking sad was enough to be PTS, my mare has been toeing that fine line for three years :D
In all seriousness though, 2 months is no time at all, not even a blink. My mare only started to open up to me a tiny bit in the last year, after coming from a crap background, and can still often be distrustful and a closed book. It's taken a lot of time to find what works for her, and a lot of money too as her ridden behaviour deteriorated but was found to be osteoarthritis that she had been hiding from us for a long time, possibly only started to act up as she finally trusted me enough to feel she could actually tell me something was wrong without worrying about getting a beating for it!

Your options are really to either sell as a project AT a project price (probably the most sensible option), give the horse more time and possibly vet investigations (maybe even turning away somehwere for a while?) and see where you are in 6 months or a year down the line, or have the horse PTS and have that weigh on your conscious (I'm not saying it's necessarily wrong to do so, but from your writing I get the feeling it would weigh on you).
 
Lots of great advice on this thread and I hope you haven't taken too much to heart - we've all got ourselves in a pickle at one point or another.

On the selling side of things I think it's often best to state what type of home might suit the horse rather than listing every behavioural niggle. So from what you've said with this guy, I would say something along the lines of 'horse has a lot of stressy behaviour in yard and field currently and ideally needs a home where he will be turned away for a year to unwind and settle, which I can't give him. He is a lovely stamp of horse, a poppet to ride and is sound and healthy, so should make someone a lovely horse if given time.'

You can give further details over the phone, and I agree with others I'm afraid, £2000 is some way off the mark for a project ex racer.

Good luck with him, whatever you decide.
 
One thing I find helpful when selling difficult horses is to say "Is he were ugly and looked like a mule, would I still advertise him for this price?", and the answer is usually no... price the personality, not the look.
 
I think you are being sensible to think about the future now, however, I think everything is being clouded by grief.

He is not your old horse and never will be, and that sucks.

I wonder if if You had got him 6 months later, with the same issues, whether you would already be sure you needed to get rid or pts this soon? Or whether you would have coped better as you would not feel so raw about your loss and stressed from moving?

I can’t help but feel you may regret it down the line if you rush to a decision.

However: if in a few months there is no improvement and he really isn’t for you, pts May be the safest option. Too many people think a pretty and cheap TB is a good idea and then can’t care for it.

But maybe, just maybe, he is for you and if you open your heart and give him some more love he will come good?

Sorry for your loss
 
paddi22 said:
Also stuff like the teeth grinding or tail switching can be down to bitting/contact issues, or just a nervy habit they get out of when they settle. One of my old tbs had a copper roller bit and he used to play with the centre rolly bit constantly when he was unsure of something, he grew out of the habit and we changed bits and there was no issue anymore.

Also did you get a physio or osteo out? they could be a slight soreness issue anywhere, or saddle fit catching him somewhere.

It does slightly comes across like you are writing a narrative story about a miserable sad horse who doesn't want to live anymore. And I totally understand how you might do this to make it mentally easier for you if you have to PTS (which i totally understand). But if you step back and take the emotion out of it, what you have is a grieving owner who made a snap decision, a horse who has been passed from pillar to post and probably needs rebreaking to understand its new job. And a horse who, naturally, is tense and unsettled because its been moved a few times and has a new owner who it probably senses isn't 100% there for him. You need to stop worrying about whether you bond or have a connection. the reality is you have responsibility for this horse and have to do right by him. Either turn away for a bit or get a pro rider to have a look before you make a decision to PTS. At leats then you can know you tried everything.

He mightn't even be the right horse for you, but he doesn't sound like a lost cause. Coudl you send him to a pro to ride and then resell. I'm wondering if the ad was too negative. We get tbs in and I don't blink at them being stressy or highly strung when they arrive. Im sure theres other tb owners out there who might see the potential.
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What a sensible post!

OP, no wonder the horse is unsettled. He knows that you don't like or want him.
 
Pearlsasinger said:
What a sensible post!

OP, no wonder the horse is unsettled. He knows that you don't like or want him.
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I have just read this whole thread and thought this horse was a non starter from day 1 as the OP was not in a good place mentally after the loss of her horse, so how was the the new horse ever going to make her feel better when he has been moved twice, new owner who is suffering from grief etc..It was a disaster just waiting to happen. I hope everything goes well in the future for both owner and horse given time or the horse is found a forever home.

Big hugs xxx

Shirl
 
If the horse has been in training ,I would contact the trainer . It is amazing what you can learn about an ex racehorse. The trainer has nothing to hide or loose. I would go so far as to say that every trainer I have ever known would want the best for one of his.
 
you bought this horse and need to take responsibility for your decision.

whether he is sold or whatever, and however you feel he is more desperate than you are, your sad loss cannot be undone, but you can go out there tomorrow and groom that horse, start to do some carrot stretches with him, lunge him a bit, put up some cross poles start him jumping for fun, then take him for a walk in hand, pull at a bit of new grass, look at something new, give him some scratches where he likes it most, look into his eyes and talk to him, and put your arms around his neck and hug him.

acknowledge to HIM you understand he is going through confusion, let him sense your vibes that all could be ok.

you need to show him in you he has a safe place, you need to become his leader, instead of half thinking him dead, try and give him confidence that you can make all alright.

if a horse is so sensitive it can pick thoughts from the rider to change pace from thought alone, a horse can soak up good vibes also.
 
I've been mulling over this post since I first read it last night. Like others, I'm so sorry for the loss of your other horse, but agree - your responsibility is to this horse now.

I do think to consider putting him down after two months of ownership, where so much has changed for him is hasty (really hasty).

It's hard to form a connection with an animal that is stressed because of the stress it gives us. That coupled with the fact that you probably (subconsciously) didn't want him anyway will have compounded the situation.

My advice would be to take a deep breath and try and look at the situation with fresh eyes. And give him the opportunity of relaxing and becoming more confident. It may be that you turn him away or you continue with ridden work. Bit to my mind it would probably do him the world of good to be chucked out with others and just finding his feet.
 
amymay said:
I've been mulling over this post since I first read it last night. Like others, I'm so sorry for the loss of your other horse, but agree - your responsibility is to this horse now.

I do think to consider putting him down after two months of ownership, where so much has changed for him is hasty (really hasty).

It's hard to form a connection with an animal that is stressed because of the stress it gives us. That coupled with the fact that you probably (subconsciously) didn't want him anyway will have compounded the situation.

My advice would be to take a deep breath and try and look at the situation with fresh eyes. And give him the opportunity of relaxing and becoming more confident. It may be that you turn him away or you continue with ridden work. Bit to my mind it would probably do him the world of good to be chucked out with others and just finding his feet.
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^^^^^^this. totally agree its the best way forward.
 
Pippity said:
I'm definitely not opposed to PTS for behavioural reasons, but I do feel you might be a bit premature. If you got him in late July, you've had him for around two months, and he's had two yard moves during that time, including a long journey. I've known many horses who would take a lot longer than that to settle.
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Ditto this entirely. Some horses take MUCH longer to settle in a new home, and remembering that in His head he has moved twice since late July. Maybe he's been passed around a lot before too. He misses his old herd, home. Give him longer to settle, and use the time to do some ground work exercises to help a bond establish, as the lack of this will be the other reason he feels so insecure. Good luck Lucy108 .
 
I must stop myself from typing "please dont I will have him !" but on a sensible note, can you not find it in your heart to keep him until you can find someone who a) understands ex racehorses and all of their quirks and b)someone who will treasure every hair on his furry little feet. I also second someone else's thoughs on tracking down his old trainer and even better try and find his stable lad or lass. These little critters are always expected to be either nuts, highly strung or been their and done it all, when all they want to do is please someone and understand what we want of them. My poor little TB has took nearly two years to settle into normal life, but you cannot undo his default setting, he is so longing for a routine, something he can nail his brain to until he begins to realise that this is life, relax, enjoy, he is only upset because he does not know what he needs to do, and that is scary. It is a little bit like going on holiday, the first few days you cannot believe your free of routine, and then by day 5 you have found yourself a routine and by day 10 you just want to go home to get back to your normal routine ! he is at day 10 all the time, but with strange people and horses and in a strange place.

good luck x
 
I can't tell you what to do but I can tell you what I would do (and this is not judging you, I'm just saying how I'd handle it).

I'd cut him some slack. I'd try and see the world through his eyes and understand how utterly bewildering life has been for him. It doesn't sound like he's had any stability in his life and he is probably feeling deeply insecure.

For the sake of the horse I'd turn him away for the winter but with a strict routine of bringing in for a feed and a fuss and a brush every day. I'd let him be a horse and I'd let him experience routine and stability. I'd bring him in mid Winter and start doing a bit of work and I'd give him until mid-Spring and if he still hadn't settled then I'd start looking for a home for him as a project horse.

As much as I feel for you (lets face it...being stuck with a horse you don't get on with is not a happy place to be) I'd be doing what's right for the horse at this point. He sounds like he deserves a chance.

I wouldn't PTS. I feel pretty sad for him to be honest.
 
The more I think about this the sorrier I feel for this horse.
I have kept all my horses until their death, some into old age, some sadly because of illness or accident at any age from 1 month to their 20s. I have missed them all, some I have 'replaced' almost immediately but every time, I have treated the new horse as an individual. That is part of the pleasure of horses, imo, the fact that no two are alike, even when they are of similar breeding. You cannot buy a carbon copy of an old horse, no matter how you try.
OP, you need to put your own sadness about the loss of your old horse aside and start to think about *this* horse, how he feels in his current circumstances, what he needs to begin to feel comfortable and confident in his new home. If you will let him this horse will help you to 'get over' the loss of your other horse, even if, in the fullness of time, you decide to sell him on. He has already begun to demonstrate that he has/wants a relationship with you, he was pleased to see you when he got off the lorry. Try to hang on to that.

And tbh, if you can't do that for him, I suggest that next time you want to replace a horse, you buy a bike.
 
southerncomfort said:
I can't tell you what to do but I can tell you what I would do (and this is not judging you, I'm just saying how I'd handle it).

I'd cut him some slack. I'd try and see the world through his eyes and understand how utterly bewildering life has been for him. It doesn't sound like he's had any stability in his life and he is probably feeling deeply insecure.

For the sake of the horse I'd turn him away for the winter but with a strict routine of bringing in for a feed and a fuss and a brush every day. I'd let him be a horse and I'd let him experience routine and stability. I'd bring him in mid Winter and start doing a bit of work and I'd give him until mid-Spring and if he still hadn't settled then I'd start looking for a home for him as a project horse.

As much as I feel for you (lets face it...being stuck with a horse you don't get on with is not a happy place to be) I'd be doing what's right for the horse at this point. He sounds like he deserves a chance.

I wouldn't PTS. I feel pretty sad for him to be honest.
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this. I've had the horse that I didnt click with and who didnt really settle but I did give him time. when that didnt work I sent him to a pro to give him the best chance-and spent as much as I wanted on diagnostics before cutting my losses and rehoming.
Take the pressure off him and yourself right now but dont let him get too feral. The other possibility is a decent sharer-the sort who's had to give up their own horse for uni or something (obviously depening on location) who wants to be around him. I am not judging you for not wanting to be around him-been there, got the t-shirt-but its not his fault and I think he needs more time and more stability and probably some ulcer treatment.
 
Hi OP
Hopefully you have had done time to read and digest everyone's replies. I don't think anyone thinks you are awful for considering PTS for behaviour. I have considered it for my mare in the past when we have been going through difficult times.
I think the overwhelming view from everyone is that, as hard as you are finding it you need to give it more time.

I bought a new horse at the end of June so have had him 3 months. He has on the whole been great, but I really feel that I barely know him yet and I'm only just starting to learn what makes him tick and scratching the surface of bonding with him.

I'd give yourself a time limit and a plan - some of the other HHOers with TB experience have given you lots of ideas.

Good luck x
 
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