clipertyplop
Well-Known Member
did anybody see the bit of news, where somone had a landrover full of tack IE: saddles bridles rugs ect for more information pm only please
Shipwreked tanker
- Thread starter dieseldog
- Start date
WishfulThinker
Well-Known Member
I think that its fair for them to take the goods! Cos then they can if they dont want it sell it on and it will benefit the economy and hopefully make some moeny to replace the millions that stupid tanker is going to use up having the mess cleaned up!
Sorry, just a bit peeved about it all!!
This WAS avoidable I believe! Especially as they knew the ship wasnt 100%, and they sailed into waters with storm warnings!
But yes, they ARE stealing but from the person the goods are FOR, not from:
Section 237, Merchant Shipping Act 1995 C.21
237.(1) Where a vessel is wrecked, stranded, or in distress at any place on or near the coasts of the United Kingdom or any tidal water within United Kingdom waters, any cargo or other articles belonging to or separated from the vessel which are washed on shore or otherwise lost or taken from the vessel shall be delivered to the receiver.
(2) If any person (whether the owner or not)
(a) conceals or keeps possession of any such cargo or article, or
(b) refuses to deliver any such cargo or article to the receiver or to any person authorised by the receiver to require delivery,
he shall be liable, on summary conviction, to a fine not exceeding level 4 on the standard scale.
(3) The receiver or any person authorised by him may take any such cargo or article (if necessary by force) from any person who refuses to deliver it.
Section 245.(1) A person commits an offence if he takes into any foreign port and sells
(a) any vessel stranded, derelict or otherwise in distress found on or near the coasts of the United Kingdom or any tidal water within United Kingdom waters;
(b) any part of the cargo or equipment of, or anything belonging to, such a vessel; or
(c) any wreck found within those waters.
(2) A person who is guilty of an offence under this section shall be liable, on conviction on indictment, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding five years.
So they could class eBay as a foreign port as its on the world wide web?
Sorry, just a bit peeved about it all!!
This WAS avoidable I believe! Especially as they knew the ship wasnt 100%, and they sailed into waters with storm warnings!
But yes, they ARE stealing but from the person the goods are FOR, not from:
Section 237, Merchant Shipping Act 1995 C.21
237.(1) Where a vessel is wrecked, stranded, or in distress at any place on or near the coasts of the United Kingdom or any tidal water within United Kingdom waters, any cargo or other articles belonging to or separated from the vessel which are washed on shore or otherwise lost or taken from the vessel shall be delivered to the receiver.
(2) If any person (whether the owner or not)
(a) conceals or keeps possession of any such cargo or article, or
(b) refuses to deliver any such cargo or article to the receiver or to any person authorised by the receiver to require delivery,
he shall be liable, on summary conviction, to a fine not exceeding level 4 on the standard scale.
(3) The receiver or any person authorised by him may take any such cargo or article (if necessary by force) from any person who refuses to deliver it.
Section 245.(1) A person commits an offence if he takes into any foreign port and sells
(a) any vessel stranded, derelict or otherwise in distress found on or near the coasts of the United Kingdom or any tidal water within United Kingdom waters;
(b) any part of the cargo or equipment of, or anything belonging to, such a vessel; or
(c) any wreck found within those waters.
(2) A person who is guilty of an offence under this section shall be liable, on conviction on indictment, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding five years.
So they could class eBay as a foreign port as its on the world wide web?
HBII
Well-Known Member
IMO the police should have closed the beach on grounds of Health and Safety! What a bunch of scavangers, all I keep thinking about is another reinforcement how some people are just after a freebie - bet they wouldnt be so god damn keen to go and dig up and bag oil slicked sand.
What a bunch of freeloaders.
Hb
What a bunch of freeloaders.
Hb
suestowford
Well-Known Member
They are closing the beach today apparently.
I would go and help clear it up, I thought it looked horrible on the news last night, what a mess on such a beautiful beach. And all those greedy people - it reminded me of the stories from times past about the wreckers!
I would go and help clear it up, I thought it looked horrible on the news last night, what a mess on such a beautiful beach. And all those greedy people - it reminded me of the stories from times past about the wreckers!
weevil
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Secondly it is not illegal to sell the items on Ebay as long as they have filled in the form and waited the proper amount of time.
[/ QUOTE ]
OK, but apparently these items are already appearing on ebay - do you accept that that is illegal?
Secondly it is not illegal to sell the items on Ebay as long as they have filled in the form and waited the proper amount of time.
[/ QUOTE ]
OK, but apparently these items are already appearing on ebay - do you accept that that is illegal?
Sooty
Well-Known Member
Whether or not it is illegal, if I lived near enough I'd be down there like a shot seeing what I could find.
Ferdinase514
Well-Known Member
Did anyone else hear the South African lady on the radio today?
She was shipping her belongings over in a container and saw people looting her stuff from the beach
I found it amusing that the news were saying that some of the cargo was toxic - sounds like a rouse to keep looters away.
They'll never recover the stuff that's been taken.
Crowd behaviour at its worst though
She was shipping her belongings over in a container and saw people looting her stuff from the beach
I found it amusing that the news were saying that some of the cargo was toxic - sounds like a rouse to keep looters away.
They'll never recover the stuff that's been taken.
Crowd behaviour at its worst though
siennamum
Well-Known Member
You and me both.
I would expect the goods are already on their way to being declared as lost at sea or suchlike and the insurance claim is being processed as we speak.
Savlaging goods like that is pretty traditional isn't it. Can't see what the fuss is all about, looks like loads of fun.
I would expect the goods are already on their way to being declared as lost at sea or suchlike and the insurance claim is being processed as we speak.
Savlaging goods like that is pretty traditional isn't it. Can't see what the fuss is all about, looks like loads of fun.
emma69
Well-Known Member
Hopefully she is insured above and beyond what the contents is worth - I know a few people who wouldn't have minded their containers getting washed overboard (apparently it is pretty common for containers to get washed overboard, as they are not secured to the ship in any way) and a nice cheque appearing instead! Hopefully there was nothing irreplacable (photos etc)
Ferdinase514
Well-Known Member
My Daddy insures containers
Will call him later and get some gossip
Will call him later and get some gossip
evsj
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Hopefully she is insured above and beyond what the contents is worth - I know a few people who wouldn't have minded their containers getting washed overboard (apparently it is pretty common for containers to get washed overboard, as they are not secured to the ship in any way) and a nice cheque appearing instead! Hopefully there was nothing irreplacable (photos etc)
[/ QUOTE ]
Insurance cannot replace tems that you have been collecting for years and years - personal effects are PERSONAL. I would feel sick if this happened to me. Maybe she was one of those people who DIDN'T want her stuff washed over-board and rummaged through by theives?
Fair enough, scooping up packs of nappies which are never going to have any resale value but taking stuff which belongs to someone in this way is grossly offensive.
Hopefully she is insured above and beyond what the contents is worth - I know a few people who wouldn't have minded their containers getting washed overboard (apparently it is pretty common for containers to get washed overboard, as they are not secured to the ship in any way) and a nice cheque appearing instead! Hopefully there was nothing irreplacable (photos etc)
[/ QUOTE ]
Insurance cannot replace tems that you have been collecting for years and years - personal effects are PERSONAL. I would feel sick if this happened to me. Maybe she was one of those people who DIDN'T want her stuff washed over-board and rummaged through by theives?
Fair enough, scooping up packs of nappies which are never going to have any resale value but taking stuff which belongs to someone in this way is grossly offensive.
dieseldog
Well-Known Member
So me, Siennamum and Sooty are the only people who would be down there on the beach.... I thought it would be brilliant fun, although I know I would come home with loads of stuff I would never use like babies nappies.
Thunder
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Can't see what the fuss is all about, looks like loads of fun.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah, losing your personal possessions, only to see any hope of seeing them again disappear as theives gleefully sift though items you once held dear - nothing to fuss over that, no... Oh what fun there is to be had.
Can't see what the fuss is all about, looks like loads of fun.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah, losing your personal possessions, only to see any hope of seeing them again disappear as theives gleefully sift though items you once held dear - nothing to fuss over that, no... Oh what fun there is to be had.
dieseldog
Well-Known Member
Thunder - not being pedantic - but
Would you really want your stuff if it had been ruined by being lost at sea for a bit. I know I would want new stuff rather than water damaged items - and before you say photos etc - they are going to be ruined.
Would you really want your stuff if it had been ruined by being lost at sea for a bit. I know I would want new stuff rather than water damaged items - and before you say photos etc - they are going to be ruined.
severnmiles
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Whether or not it is illegal, if I lived near enough I'd be down there like a shot seeing what I could find.
[/ QUOTE ]
Me too! Apparently half of it is already on Ebay! And it is perfectly legal to salvage shipwrecks.
I do really feel sorry for the Swedish family though...I wouldn't have touched that container...very unfair!
Whether or not it is illegal, if I lived near enough I'd be down there like a shot seeing what I could find.
[/ QUOTE ]
Me too! Apparently half of it is already on Ebay! And it is perfectly legal to salvage shipwrecks.
I do really feel sorry for the Swedish family though...I wouldn't have touched that container...very unfair!
Thunder
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Thunder - not being pedantic - but
Would you really want your stuff if it had been ruined by being lost at sea for a bit. I know I would want new stuff rather than water damaged items - and before you say photos etc - they are going to be ruined.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes, I would - as for it being ruined - do you really think people would be carrying it all off if it was ruined? There are a lot of sentimental items other than photos...
Thunder - not being pedantic - but
Would you really want your stuff if it had been ruined by being lost at sea for a bit. I know I would want new stuff rather than water damaged items - and before you say photos etc - they are going to be ruined.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes, I would - as for it being ruined - do you really think people would be carrying it all off if it was ruined? There are a lot of sentimental items other than photos...
Thunder
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Me too! Apparently half of it is already on Ebay!
[/ QUOTE ] And has been removed after being reported as stolen property
[ QUOTE ]
And it is perfectly legal to salvage shipwrecks.
[/ QUOTE ]
Er, not quite, common misconception though - see above for the relevent legislation...
Me too! Apparently half of it is already on Ebay!
[/ QUOTE ] And has been removed after being reported as stolen property
[ QUOTE ]
And it is perfectly legal to salvage shipwrecks.
[/ QUOTE ]
Er, not quite, common misconception though - see above for the relevent legislation...
dieseldog
Well-Known Member
Look some of the scavengers are human...
But a coastguard official later confirmed that a member of the public had reported the container.
"The person that recovered them has delivered them so we can reunite her with her things," said a spokesman for the Maritime and Coastguard Agency.
But a coastguard official later confirmed that a member of the public had reported the container.
"The person that recovered them has delivered them so we can reunite her with her things," said a spokesman for the Maritime and Coastguard Agency.
Thunder
Well-Known Member
Aw, you know, that makes me all warm and fuzzy...
Just waiting now for all the other fine upstanding citizens to do the same...
Dream on.
Just waiting now for all the other fine upstanding citizens to do the same...
Dream on.
Ferdinase514
Well-Known Member
Ooooh don;t think there were photos and personal things like that...more carpets and furniture
severnmiles
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Aw, you know, that makes me all warm and fuzzy...
Just waiting now for all the other fine upstanding citizens to do the same...
Dream on.
[/ QUOTE ]
You're taking the moral highground with us....I do hope you're perfect in everyway!
Aw, you know, that makes me all warm and fuzzy...
Just waiting now for all the other fine upstanding citizens to do the same...
Dream on.
[/ QUOTE ]
You're taking the moral highground with us....I do hope you're perfect in everyway!
dieseldog
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Aw, you know, that makes me all warm and fuzzy...
Just waiting now for all the other fine upstanding citizens to do the same...
Dream on.
[/ QUOTE ]
There is no pleasing you is there?
What about those naughty policemen that killed the dog?
Aw, you know, that makes me all warm and fuzzy...
Just waiting now for all the other fine upstanding citizens to do the same...
Dream on.
[/ QUOTE ]
There is no pleasing you is there?
What about those naughty policemen that killed the dog?
severnmiles
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Aw, you know, that makes me all warm and fuzzy...
Just waiting now for all the other fine upstanding citizens to do the same...
Dream on.
[/ QUOTE ]
There is no pleasing you is there?
What about those naughty policemen that killed the dog?
[/ QUOTE ]
DD....don't get him/her started on that aswell!!!
[ QUOTE ]
Aw, you know, that makes me all warm and fuzzy...
Just waiting now for all the other fine upstanding citizens to do the same...
Dream on.
[/ QUOTE ]
There is no pleasing you is there?
What about those naughty policemen that killed the dog?
[/ QUOTE ]
DD....don't get him/her started on that aswell!!!
Thunder
Well-Known Member
severnmiles,
I'm not taking the moral highground at all.
I would hope that every member of this site, and indeed society would consider that theft, which is what we have here, is wrong.
Hell, Children over the age of 14 are expected to know in law the difference between right and wrong, nevermind adults...
As for me being 'perfect', it's not a question of that at all, but I can honestly say that I wouldn't partake in anything illegal and have a thorough understanding of what's acceptable behaviour and what isn't...
It's quite sad that some people are openly condoning theft, and I wonder how they'd feel if they were the loser.
Re the dog - very tragic and as had been said, disciplinary action may be being taken, rightly so.
I'm not taking the moral highground at all.
I would hope that every member of this site, and indeed society would consider that theft, which is what we have here, is wrong.
Hell, Children over the age of 14 are expected to know in law the difference between right and wrong, nevermind adults...
As for me being 'perfect', it's not a question of that at all, but I can honestly say that I wouldn't partake in anything illegal and have a thorough understanding of what's acceptable behaviour and what isn't...
It's quite sad that some people are openly condoning theft, and I wonder how they'd feel if they were the loser.
Re the dog - very tragic and as had been said, disciplinary action may be being taken, rightly so.
severnmiles
Well-Known Member
For me I would have gone down there if it was nearer. When I was confronted with a container that was clearly full of personal items I wouldn't have touched it. If I had come across 500 bottles of shampoo/make up, 200 packs of nappies then yes I'd have taken them. Theft or not.
The companies that they belong to won't want them, they will claim on the insurance and the items from the containers will be auctioned off for a pittance by salvage companies.
Therefore technically, when washed up on the beach it belongs to nobody. If you pick an apple from a wild tree its not stealing!
Just my way of viewing things anyway.
The companies that they belong to won't want them, they will claim on the insurance and the items from the containers will be auctioned off for a pittance by salvage companies.
Therefore technically, when washed up on the beach it belongs to nobody. If you pick an apple from a wild tree its not stealing!
Just my way of viewing things anyway.
Thunder
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
The companies that they belong to won't want them, they will claim on the insurance and the items from the containers will be auctioned off for a pittance by salvage companies.
[/ QUOTE ]
Would be advisable to wait and be told that they didn't want them before assuming ownership
[ QUOTE ]
Therefore technically, when washed up on the beach it belongs to nobody.
[/ QUOTE ]
Er no, it belongs to it's rightful owner until they decide otherwise
[ QUOTE ]
If you pick an apple from a wild tree its not stealing!
[/ QUOTE ]
Well now - another aspect of law - if the apple tree is not a farmed one, ie growing 'wild' then it's not an offence to take an apple providing you're not intending, at the time you take it, to sell it, be that in it's original form or an altered one.
If you were to take one thinking it'll make a nice pie for the next WI stall, then it's theft.
If you were to dig up the whole tree then that too would be theft, whether you wanted to keep it for yourself or not.
Hmm, I'll be getting a reputation for being a right pedantic get!
dieseldog
Well-Known Member
I think its wind up Thunder day.....
so, I walk past a cash machine with money sticking out and no one is near it, the bank is closed, do I take the money or leave it there?
so, I walk past a cash machine with money sticking out and no one is near it, the bank is closed, do I take the money or leave it there?
severnmiles
Well-Known Member
This reminds me of a fella who wasn't 'all there' in Aberwystwyth a few months ago, he threw £5,000 to passers by, is that theft to pick up a few £20's?
severnmiles
Well-Known Member
"Er no, it belongs to it's rightful owner until they decide otherwise"
Can you explain the legalities of this please...
Can you explain the legalities of this please...
emma69
Well-Known Member
That's why I said I hoped that there was nothing irreplacable. From what I understand containers going overboard happen more frequently than people think - something like 10,000 containers are lost a year overboard. The vast majority of them (statistically) will be commercial goods, and they generally only make the headlines when something happens to affect consumers - e.g. a number of cars were lost when a ship sank last year, causing shortages in north america. However, for that very reason, I wouldn't ship things that couldn't be replaced (photos, heirlooms etc) only furniture, clothes etc, which, whilst you may be attached to them, can be replaced. I didn't say i condone people taking the items, it must be obvious that this was a personal container, not commercial