Spurs or no spurs?

Having just dipped back into this post, I thought I has better reply to Koen as it would be rude not to!!! I assume your comments are a wind up? If I fed my horse straight oats or race horse mix as he/she suggested, I would either be bucked off or still been bolted with and en route to the Northern most part of Scotland!!! What a daft and ignorant comment to make, as I feed my horse feed that is suitable to the amount of work I do, he is not a competition horse and as such doesn't need such high energy giving food. I cannot give him anything with cereals or sugar in as that would be cruel to him as his temperament cannot take that sort if food, I have finally managed to get him a diet which gives him controlled energy but keeps him sensible.
 
i do not wish to upset or wind up anyone.

i feed all mine on straight oats and sugar beet, as far as i can see its a fallacy about oats winding up horses, they contain good fibre and other substances which are good for horses mentally, and they release energy slowly so horses are not subjected to blood sugar spikes and dips (complex carbohydrates) spelling!! especially if hay is fed at regular times as well.

i seen enough almost exploding dressage horses to form the conclusion that its not what i want to see, much prefer horses who look soft muscled, on the aids in such a way that they can show almost relaxation and can maintain a consistant metranome like rhythm, from which comes real collection, tension being the enemy, the horse with tension cannot put itself at the riders disposal , which is what true collection is, energy released not forced.
 
tristar said:
i do not wish to upset or wind up anyone.

i feed all mine on straight oats and sugar beet, as far as i can see its a fallacy about oats winding up horses, .......

........
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Correct. As a grain feed, oats were designed for horses and sheep, in my view, and neither have ever been harmed by such a diet!

Alec.
 
tristar said:
i do not wish to upset or wind up anyone.

........ the horse with tension cannot put itself at the riders disposal , which is what true collection is, energy released not forced.
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You don't have a choice, at least not if you think spurs should be binned.

I 100% agree about tension there are enough horses at Grand Prix level displaying forced tension. A good example, and strangely enough highly acclaimed (score wise and in the general publics minds) was this lovely mare (see video). Tail swishing with each and every jab of the spur. A horrible sight IMO. A "horse with great expression" but at what cost.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYhYwyJYNFI

It has to be said the exception is that a horse in Piaffe certainly needs a certain amount of asked for controlled tension certainly at the level required to come into any kind of contention at todays levels. The horse cannot achieve this without high levels of energy unless there is abuse of spurs.
 
Koen said:
You don't have a choice, at least not if you think spurs should be binned.

I 100% agree about tension there are enough horses at Grand Prix level displaying forced tension. A good example, and strangely enough highly acclaimed (score wise and in the general publics minds) was this lovely mare (see video). Tail swishing with each and every jab of the spur. A horrible sight IMO. A "horse with great expression" but at what cost.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYhYwyJYNFI

It has to be said the exception is that a horse in Piaffe certainly needs a certain amount of asked for controlled tension certainly at the level required to come into any kind of contention at todays levels. The horse cannot achieve this without high levels of energy unless there is abuse of spurs.
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I had a funny feeling it was going to be Blue Hors Matine in this vid before i even opened it!

Im not going to bother typing what i think of you. This horse and rider are one of the greats!! Some horses tail swish anyway, spur or no spur. Must be easy sitting slagging off all the best horses and riders out there.

Does Blue Hors Matine look abused to you?? Really??
 
tristar said:
there's better places than ireland to gain experience, in my australian osteopath's opinion 'its like the dark ages' and joking apart it is infested with ragwort, sadly
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And actually Tristar, If you're referring to the same Australian Osteopath that I know, I don't think she would be too impressed to have you put such negative words in her mouth on a public forum. I think I might direct her to this thread..

Koen, I would be fascinated to see some videos of you riding if you would care to share? Usually people like yourself, who I call the closed mind and open mouth brigade tend to be all talk with nothing to back it up.
So... would you care to share?
 
mmmmm i have a feeling that if koen had seen me riding my mare she would have had me hanged for Rollkur, has Baby always went behind vertical somewhat, with out thinking why she did as a few people did with nasty comments included. once people understood she was actually blind in bottom of both eyes so brought her nose further to chest to see and i had to ride with a steady but gentle contact to give her confidenc (but couldnt fuss lenghtening/shortening reins as she panicked )so had to move my hands back and forth to keep contact they were gobsmacked. A little understanding goes along way :)
 
AdorableAlice said:
I can't wait any longer, English please.
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Well you can't translate slang in another language that accurately, and duifje can be used to be a little rude and derogatory especially in certain parts of NL. So lets just say we could apply it here to describe someone who sits at home watching other people do things successfully and criticising them. Whereas the schatje would be out there, actually doing it, and being admired.

I'm surprised that "Koen", als een binnenlander, didn't comment on it, since most of his arguments seem to be based on buitenlanders being ignorant.

In the Netherlands, one of the main problems, as in Germany, is lack of turnout and indeed even where there is turnout, its difficult to get the large varied pastures incorporating natural features to develop bone strength and health in the young horse. Such as hillsides. That is one of the few advantages that the UK has over The Netherlands. Another is the great tradition of hunting, as opposed to riding in a manege all the time. That's why "English" grooms are sought out all over Europe - they tend to have a wider and more practically based experience. I found it ironic that "Koen" assumed everyone on here was an amateur rider, when he has no competition record himself, even at amateur level.
 
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I see spurs as an aid used to sharpen up a horse who needs on the odd occassion it I don't think they should be used everyday / every comp. Ive used them once in the last 5 years. And they were the blunt / rounded ones.

I haven't ridden with a whip in years after having a horse who's trust had been lost via a previous rider - he taught me I don't need one.

I don't ride to high level - more mid range. I get my kicks out of bringing on young horses (unbroken / off the track).

I also feed oats and alfalfa :)
 
Koen said:
Now compare that video of Matine to this one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbwIXEEo9-A

Getting the point? Waiting aids?
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I love this as an example when Edward Gal trains his horses in urm... Not
the most harmonious way shall we say. Which is probably worse than using spurs! Even though everyone seems to think he is a genius even though other users of the system get slated!
 
shortstuff99 said:
I love this as an example when Edward Gal trains his horses in urm... Not
the most harmonious way shall we say. Which is probably worse than using spurs! Even though everyone seems to think he is a genius even though other users of the system get slated!
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And you know this for a fact do you?!
 
My apologies for the outburst. Seems poney club is out.

Was rather shocked at the advert on H&H, "broken your hunter" try this one.

The rather shallow cry of "bunny hugger" comes to mind.
 
Cortez said:
I realise that English may not be your first language, but what on earth are you trying to say???
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I've got a feeling that Koen correlates the somewhat tasteless advert title with the fact the horse is jumping a wire fence. Which of course it isn't.

Endless hours of amusement...beats uitzending gemist.

Meneer Gal is of course the epitomy of everything that Koen doth preach.
 
Elsiecat said:
Erm it's quite clearly tongue in cheek.. Basically saying "if theres a reason your hunter can't be hunted - BUY THIS ONE"
And I'm guessing they've used that strapline due to the time of year.
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Spot on. The lady selling that horse has forgotten more than Koen is likely to know having produced horses that jump at international level. There are plenty of broken hunters given the bottomless going this winter is providing.
 
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