Stabling during the winter thoughts?

[Tiddlypom]

Here we go again.....Keeping horses stabled is perfectly OK if, and only if, you exercise and work them sufficiently. If you are not able to do that then you really should not have the horse. Most horses do not get enough work, and also get fed too much which is a dreadful combination, but if properly cared for they will do fine stabled. As examples: the Household Cavalry, police horses, most horses in Spain, Germany, lots of other countries, etc.

Well said. The usual knee jerk reactions to any suggestion of no turn out in winter. It can be done, as long as it is done properly and the horse can be in full work. It would not suit creaky horses or youngsters.

(Mine can live out all year here, so not an issue with mine).

 

[paddi22]

Here we go again.....Keeping horses stabled is perfectly OK if, and only if, you exercise and work them sufficiently.

I would put forward the argument that psychologically it in never ok to keep an animal in a very confined box for over three quarters of its day every day. I wonder if it's nearly worse if you were, say, hacking an animal for 5 hours a day, getting it super fit and then totally restricting it's movement for the rest of the day. but I have no knowledge of the practice in these places, so maybe the horses are taken out during the day for hand grazing etc.

saying that I grew up in a hunting yard with a horse would was stabled all year apart from summer. he was fine and lived to a good old age, but its not something I would do now.

also psychologically I think it's unfair to not allow an animal free movement on some level to play and groom other horses.

nowadays there is no excuse for yards not to make some kind of freestanding all weather turnout.

 

[paddi22]

Well said. The usual knee jerk reactions to any suggestion of no turn out in winter. It can be done, as long as it is done properly and the horse can be in full work.

what classes as full work for most people though realistically? most people are rushing to and from yard between work and kids.

the level of time needed to exercise a horse for 4 to 5 hours a day is massive. I do 4 to 5 hour hacks at time in walk each week normally for my eventers to keep them fit but your day is gone! and in winter it's really tough. we are lucky to have mountain trails here and quiet roads, but the majority of yards don't have access to that and there's no way I'd do 5 hours a day hacking on a busy road.

add bad weather or extreme heat on top of that and I would argue there is no way for an amateur owner to do 4/5 hours of work a day on a horse even 6 days a week.

just out of curiosity what would people think is the minimum work needed for a horse that's kept in 24/7 in winter.

 

[Cortez]

Minimum exercise would be 2 hours slow work, proper work (fast or intensive) is generally about 45mins. I would want a horse out of it's box for at least 3 hours a day if kept stabled full time. When in work mine go out at least twice a day, if out performing their regular schedule is three shows daily, a total of 2 1/2 hours under saddle, and they will be tired at the end of it. I do have an all-weather turnout, and my horses get out in the fields almost every day in winter, but it's not always practical, and if the weather is very bad they will object to being out. I have also had horses that didn't want to be out for more than an hour or so; not every horse wants to be out and some are very happy being stabled. I've never had a horse that was unhappy in, but we have a slightly different life than most leisure horses.

 

[paddi22]

yeah Cortex, I'd imagine you are in a very small percentage of people on here that would have horses in proper intensive work. your set up of bringing them in and out of work three times a day (and the associated grooming, tacking up, washing down etc) would be way more mentally stimulating to them than a livery horse just standing in a box and getting out two hours a day even.

I agree some horses like being in. I've a set up where they can walk in and out to a small paddock during bad weather, and even though one spends most of her time in, she loves her stable, , she still comes out, has the odd mooch around, has a trot around and a buck if something is exciting, or has a groom and goes back in. mentally that's a lot more freedom than just keeping her in full-time.

 

[indie1282]

Minimum exercise would be 2 hours slow work, proper work (fast or intensive) is generally about 45mins. I would want a horse out of it's box for at least 3 hours a day if kept stabled full time. When in work mine go out at least twice a day, if out performing their regular schedule is three shows daily, a total of 2 1/2 hours under saddle, and they will be tired at the end of it. I do have an all-weather turnout, and my horses get out in the fields almost every day in winter, but it's not always practical, and if the weather is very bad they will object to being out. I have also had horses that didn't want to be out for more than an hour or so; not every horse wants to be out and some are very happy being stabled. I've never had a horse that was unhappy in, but we have a slightly different life than most leisure horses.

I would say that most owners would not exercise their horses this much.

I also read the OPs post as this new yard does not have fields, so would be stabled 24/7 all year round which I'm afraid is no life for any horse really..

 

[Lex2009]

Nope I would not keep a horse in 24 hours a day . It very bad for the joints and it actually been proven by loads of studies. There is study that says a horse should not be stabbed at all they should be out in the field 24/7 Unless it’s for health reason. No amount of exercises the horse is doing would not be the same as a horse going out to field. Here is a video about it

 

[sharni]

cruel cruel cruel a horse should not be stabled for that long.

 

[[131452]]

It is easy to say "I wouldn't do it" but what if you don't have a choice?
Where I am it seems to be getting wetter every year and fewer and fewer yards allow winter turn out. And even then it's a couple of hours in mud.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

It is easy to say "I wouldn't do it" but what if you don't have a choice?
Where I am it seems to be getting wetter every year and fewer and fewer yards allow winter turn out. And even then it's a couple of hours in mud.

Everybody has a choice, you don't actually have to own a horse!

 

[Tiddlypom]

Everybody has a choice, you don't actually have to own a horse!

And that is going to become increasingly common. The number of livery yards that can offer acceptable year round facilities for horses, at a price that is affordable, is already decreasing.

It’s not ideal to stable a horse all winter, but as stated above, it can be done, but almost certainly not by the average livery with a full time job and kids.

Before we moved here, I had mine on a lovely yard where the turnout was restricted to 1 hour a day in winter, 1.5 hours in summer. That was the Wirral for you, many yards didn’t turn out in winter at all. But my horse thrived, he was in medium work with regular schooling, lessons, competing and lots of lovely hacking, plus plenty to look at on the yard. He was very settled there.

 

[Cortez]

Everybody has a choice, you don't actually have to own a horse!

Completely. And you also don't have to stable it 24/7 either - you take it out and exercise it. That is your responsibility if you are going to have a horse. I take it that people are substituting work with turn out? Being in a field is not as beneficial as correct exercise.

 

[chocolategirl]

Completely. And you also don't have to stable it 24/7 either - you take it out and exercise it. That is your responsibility if you are going to have a horse. I take it that people are substituting work with turn out? Being in a field is not as beneficial as correct exercise.

But being in a field is preferable to being stuck in prison though don’t you think? I was always told horses weren’t designed to be ridden either, so you say that being in a field isn’t as beneficial as correct exercise contradicts that??

 

[Tiddlypom]

All turnout is not equal, either. Small, crappy, shelterless, all electric fenced bottomless bogs are not good for horses, but are so commonly seen.

Been to two fancy livery yards, once for holiday livery, once for schooling, where ‘year round turnout‘ was trumpeted, and this was all there was. The going was so bad, it was dangerous. I removed the horse early from the latter despite having paid up in advance, and brought her home.

 

[paddi22]

It is easy to say "I wouldn't do it" but what if you don't have a choice?


in that case I think I'd admit that currently I wasn't in a suitable position to keep a horse. there's plenty of people who would love to have dogs, but know because of small apartments or their working hours etc they can't offer a dog the conditions it needs. I'm confused why this doesn't apply to the horse world sometimes.

 

[WandaMare]

But being in a field is preferable to being stuck in prison though don’t you think? I was always told horses weren’t designed to be ridden either, so you say that being in a field isn’t as beneficial as correct exercise contradicts that??

I don't think my horses think of their stables as prisons, in fact if they had the choice of 24/7 in a stable through winter or 24/7 in a field, they would probably choose the stable option, lazing around and beckoning me to bring hay all day. Not all horses mind being in, but saying that I wouldn't move to a yard with no turnout, even just through the dark depths of winter. Its not good for the horses or the owners, feeling obliged to ride when the weather is awful or you're too busy, is not fun.

I would look out for some more options OP, are there any other yards you could move to?

 

[Cortez]

But being in a field is preferable to being stuck in prison though don’t you think? I was always told horses weren’t designed to be ridden either, so you say that being in a field isn’t as beneficial as correct exercise contradicts that??

Look at a competition horse that is in peak physical condition, well muscled, glossy coat, bright and interested in the world around it. Now go and look at any number of horses out in fields, take your pick from the grossly obese, undermuscled all the way to skinny, rainscalded, or downright neglected, and everything in between. Yes of course there are gradations of every kind in that mix, but I know which horse I would consider to be in good condition. No, horses were not meant to be ridden, but humans were not meant to be gymnasts or ballet dancers either, and they also need to be properly trained to do that.

 

[indie1282]

Completely. And you also don't have to stable it 24/7 either - you take it out and exercise it. That is your responsibility if you are going to have a horse. I take it that people are substituting work with turn out? Being in a field is not as beneficial as correct exercise.

You are right, being in a field is probably not as beneficial as being correctly exercised physically. But being turned out in a field is much better for the horses mental wellbeing.

I've been on sh*tty livery yards where all you got was half an acre on mud/grass with no shelter and my choice then was to stable overnight. I always tried to turn out by day unless it was heavy wind and rain but if they stayed in they always did some work at either end of the day. Plenty of the others only got taken out of the stable so their owners could muck out.

Sadly some people don't seem to even think about properly exercising their horses when they are left in for days or even weeks on end.

We have a laminatic pony on our yard and the owners way of dealing with it is to shut him in his box 24/7. He only stands outside twice a day to be mucked out and maybe walked down the drive once or twice a week if he's lucky. He's quiet in the stable so they think he is happy but you can see in his eye that he is stressed and completely shut down.

 

[Chappie]

Hi, this is going to be quite long!
At the moment I have my pony in a rental yard with a girl I know so it’s just the two of us and we do everything ourselves. There is a field so we put our horses out to it, the one problem with this yard is the arena, it’s absolutely horrible and unridable especially if it’s been raining. The membrane of the arena has started to come up and it’s all over the arena and on the main track as well and it’s causes our horses to trip which is dangerous as they’re getting their hooves caught in it, there is also flooding in various areas of the arena and big potholes everywhere. This is all in summer and winter as well. The biggest problem I have is that there is no lighting in the arena so in winter I can’t ride at all. An option we have is to move to a livery yard from the end of September to end of February. The livery yard has 2 good arenas 1 indoor and 1 outdoor with lights, my only problem with this yard is that the horses are stabled 24/7 as there is no field. I had my previous horse at this yard and she became depressed and used to throw me all the time but I think that was my fault as I didn’t ride her much because I was so nervous and scared of her. Before we bought her as well she was used to being out in the field 24/7. I’m just scared that if I move my pony to this livery yard he’ll become like my old horse although I’m more confident on this pony and ride him far more and harder than my other horse but I’m just wondering what anyone thinks I should do? Should I stay at my currant yard or move just for the winter? And what does everyone else do for stabling one the winter? If you made it this far thank you for reading ?

OP what is your hacking like at your current place? If its good, could you go out longer hacks on your days off work, and use some annual leave days to get your horse exercised during daylight in winter? Do the horses hack alone or need company, can your friend do the same?

That way you might not miss the arena so much? I'd approach the owner to see if it could be improved too. Doesn't seem right you're paying for a facility you can't use.

Also what is your field like, does it drain well and have good shelter eg. trees/bushes/hedges and an actual field shelter? Can you section it off so some is "saved" and other bits "trashed"? Could a bit be sectioned off to ride in?

Could you put them in the arena to wander about, roll, groom each other and eat hay, therefore saving the field a few hours a day?

Do you have actual stables at your current place? Does the weather get really bad in your area? Would you be best having a stable for shelter some days?

All these queries would influence me as to what I would do.

I'd not leave where you are if you have decent hacking, a sheltered draining field and the option to use a stable. Depnds where you are, but sometimes the weather is too bad in winter to even ride in an arena of an evening. But at least the horses would have the field to exercise themselves to an extent.

Could you have access to transport and arena hire occasionally?

My loan is stabled a lot (I can't change this) and its a super-demanding schedule trying to give him as best a life I can. I'd LOVE daily dry turnout, but I'd also want a stable as the weather where I am can be so harsh.

 

[Winters100]

Here we go again.....Keeping horses stabled is perfectly OK if, and only if, you exercise and work them sufficiently. If you are not able to do that then you really should not have the horse. Most horses do not get enough work, and also get fed too much which is a dreadful combination, but if properly cared for they will do fine stabled. As examples: the Household Cavalry, police horses, most horses in Spain, Germany, lots of other countries, etc.

Leaving horses out in sodden mud pits all winter is not exactly kind either, and whilst most people do look after their horses well, many do not and there are advantages and disadvantages to both methods, with a combination of the two (turnout and stabling) over winter being my preferred option.

I also like a combination of the 2. Mine go out to a field with a shelter dawn to dusk in winter (in the middle of winter this is about 7am until 3pm), then they are stabled overnight. But I have to be honest and say that for a good part of Winter half of the field is a mud pit and they have to go to the higher part to be in the dry - so i would not like them in this all the time. Mine are ridden 9 out of every 10 days, fairly hard work, not just slow trot and canter. I know that people do say that horses can be fine stabled 24/7 with enough work, but I really would not like to do that. IMO they need the freedom of the paddock to feel good in themselves. I would also question how many people really have time to give adequate exercise in this case. Last winter one of mine had 2 weeks when the vet asked me not to let her go in mud, hence no paddock. It almost gave me a nervous breakdown being there enough to keep her happy without putting her out, and I was lucky that YO let me 'turn out' with her friend in the indoor school for 2 hours between 5am and 7am. Going 4 times a day to walk her was a disaster for me, and I really could not keep that up all winter.

 

[PoniesRock]

Here we go again.....Keeping horses stabled is perfectly OK if, and only if, you exercise and work them sufficiently. If you are not able to do that then you really should not have the horse. Most horses do not get enough work, and also get fed too much which is a dreadful combination, but if properly cared for they will do fine stabled. As examples: the Household Cavalry, police horses, most horses in Spain, Germany, lots of other countries, etc.

Leaving horses out in sodden mud pits all winter is not exactly kind either, and whilst most people do look after their horses well, many do not and there are advantages and disadvantages to both methods, with a combination of the two (turnout and stabling) over winter being my preferred option.

Well said. Couldn’t agree more. My horses spend a large amount of time stabled in the winter. They are exercised - properly worked everyday. It also massively reduces the mud fever and cellulitis issues that one of mine suffer from. Both of them are more than happy in their stables. But they are in a very well ventilated converted cattle barn. I do try and turn them out in the field early (I start work between 6-7:30am depending where I’m working) then by lunchtime they have more than had enough and are happy to come in and be worked. But In all honestly when it’s pouring, windy and generally horrid they will both chose a haynet in the stable over turnout. My hunter always gets turned out the day after hunting. So I wouldn’t want to go somewhere with no turnout but they are happy, healthy and well looked after even when their turnout is limited.

 

[[131452]]

Therefore most people in my county shouldn't have horses?
Seems a bit harsh.
What about those who have had horses for decades and lost land to various things like flooding ? Should they just shoot their horses?
I agree it is far from ideal but considering that every winter is wetter than the last, we can only do our best. My last pretty much refused to go out in the winter , what do you do with a horse that you have to drag down the track and will only just stand at the gate and shout until you get him in?

 

[TheMule]

If you can’t use the grazing then the yard should have all weather pens. It is not acceptable to keep a horse in a small box for 22 hours a day.

 

[[131452]]

Who in here has year round turn out on grass? And I mean grass, not mud.
And where in the country are you?
There are NO yards anywhere around here that can offer any form of winter turn out that isn't mud or a surfaced pen.
And you're lucky to even have access to those.
Most yards lie and say they have all year turn out that is weather dependent, knowing very well that come November there will be no turn out. Or it is an hour standing in mud. Only the hunt yard is honest about it and say no turn out after October, but then their horses are worked very hard. Unfortunately their liveries' horses often aren't though.

 

[[131452]]

If you can’t use the grazing then the yard should have all weather pens. It is not acceptable to keep a horse in a small box for 22 hours a day.

My horse wouldn't stay in a surfaced pen either. He just wanted to be in.

 

[MagicMelon]

I would rather not have horses than keep them stabled 24/7 all winter. The only way I think this can possibly work (obviously apart from box rest when necessary) is if the horse is worked hard twice a day, and hand walked multiple times a day which isn’t practical for most owners.

Same here, but I dont think its even the lack of exercise thats the worst thing - I think its the lack of natural grazing and socialising etc. I cant believe so many yards actually offer full time stabling at any time. I wouldnt keep horses if it was my only option.

 

[MagicMelon]

Who in here has year round turn out on grass? And I mean grass, not mud.
And where in the country are you?
There are NO yards anywhere around here that can offer any form of winter turn out that isn't mud or a surfaced pen.

I keep my horses at home privately, I have 2 horses on only 1 acre of ground yet they live out 24/7 brilliantly (no mud fever etc.). I have a hardcored area outside my stable block where the hay sits and so they can stand on it to get out of the mud. This saves a lot of the field. Works great.

 

[TheMule]

Who in here has year round turn out on grass? And I mean grass, not mud.
And where in the country are you?
There are NO yards anywhere around here that can offer any form of winter turn out that isn't mud or a surfaced pen.
And you're lucky to even have access to those.
Most yards lie and say they have all year turn out that is weather dependent, knowing very well that come November there will be no turn out. Or it is an hour standing in mud. Only the hunt yard is honest about it and say no turn out after October, but then their horses are worked very hard. Unfortunately their liveries' horses often aren't though.

South West, 24/7 365 day turn out with a field shelter and a pen of hard standing with a feeder if things get really bad (maybe 2 or 3 nights per winter) These are my fields at the end of winter having been grazed by 4 horses- there is mud between the hay and the water trough in their main winter field, but I can walk through it in short boots no problem.
Good land management and not over-stocking the land are the key, this is not lovely free draining sandy soil.

 

[[131452]]

I keep my horses at home privately, I have 2 horses on only 1 acre of ground yet they live out 24/7 brilliantly (no mud fever etc.). I have a hardcored area outside my stable block where the hay sits and so they can stand on it to get out of the mud. This saves a lot of the field. Works great.

That one acre would last about 2 weeks in winter here .

 

[[131452]]

South West, 24/7 365 day turn out with a field shelter and a pen of hard standing with a feeder if things get really bad (maybe 2 or 3 nights per winter) These are my fields at the end of winter having been grazed by 4 horses- there is mud between the hay and the water trough in their main winter field, but I can walk through it in short boots no problem.
Good land management and not over-stocking the land are the key, this is not lovely free draining sandy soil.

View attachment 52214

No yard here has that much turn out. You're very lucky if you've been able to buy or rent that.