Stage 3 - horse wouldn't move

[ReggieP]

Had a problem today with my daughter's stage 3 exam. The horse provided did not move one inch despite trying all manner of things. Consequently she didn't even get to the jumping or cross country and hence failed the riding section. They then gave the horse to another girl but when it did not move for her (seemed it was probably lame) they replaced the horse so the other girl was able to pass. This seems very unfair and we will be writing to BHS to complain. I just wanted to know if anybody else had come across this during their exams ?

regs
Reg

 

[Elbie]

Sorry can't offer any help but does seem very unfair that they would let the other girl swap.

 

[Fuzzypuff]

That sounds really unfair! Surely when throughout the process the horse didn't want to move an experienced instructor at that yard should have gotten on to check if it was your daughter or the horse that was a problem. Have you complained to the exam centre too?

 

[ReggieP]

That sounds really unfair! Surely when throughout the process the horse didn't want to move an experienced instructor at that yard should have gotten on to check if it was your daughter or the horse that was a problem. Have you complained to the exam centre too?

Just got the "how to complain" documents from BHS. The issue of if the horses / facilities are not up to scratch does not appear to come within their guidance / syllabus. Who I wonder checks prior to an exam that the horses are suitable (and what are these checks) and what is the process for deciding whether a horse should be swapped. It does all seems rather ad-hoc and subjective, with nothing written down. BTW they charge a whopping £75 to lodge a formal complaint

 

[Jenni_]

What an absolute shame. I can totally sympathise- I was also failed on part of a BHS exam for a completely unjust reason and for that reason decided not to ever sit them again. We also complained but it went nowhere unfortunately. I do hope it does for you.

 

[soulfull]

So unfair. This is the reason I never did mine. Heard so many many bad things, and like yours not just sour grapes which is what BHS seem to think
I hope you get a good response

 

[ReggieP]

Have learnt that the regulator for BHS examinations is OFQUAL.

This is clearly an issue relating to "access" and/or "administration" and/or poor professional conduct and so if no joy from BHS will make the complaint directly to OFQUAL. We are not going to question the fail ; clearly it is over so we cant do anything about that, but we will request a re-examination.

Post note, have just heard that subsequent to the horse being swapped for the 2nd candidate, the blacksmith was called and the horse was declared lame ! Who on earth are the assessors that allow this type of thing to happen ?

 

[ArabianBeauty]

They are meant to replace the horse and not to penalize you for one that doesn't move. My friend had a similar horse in stage 2. it stopped at every single jump. They swapped it and she passed.

 

[galaxy]

She should have ridden 2 horses on the flat. How did she do on the other one? Did the examiners tell her exactly why she couldn't progress to jumping? She has to be deemed of an unsafe standard for then to do that.

 

[Kokopelli]

She should have ridden 2 horses on the flat. How did she do on the other one? Did the examiners tell her exactly why she couldn't progress to jumping? She has to be deemed of an unsafe standard for then to do that.

I think now due to insurance purposes if you fail the flat you're not allowed to jump whether you're safe or not.

I really want to do my stage 3 soon but the place I want to do it is closing down so I have no idea where I want to do it now.

 

[Pigeon]

I've heard similar things too. Completely put me off ever doing them.

 

[Kaylum]

You need to phone the training centre and get her money back they basically took the mick. Which centre was it? So others can avoid the place.

 

[Goldenstar]

You hear this sort of thing just too much the BHS needs to get a grip of this pronto.

 

[One More]

Hi,
I know this wasn't at quite the same level, but for my BHS Riding and Road Safety I was given a horse that was clearly lame, (as well as the saddle being extremely badly fitted), to the degree where I asked if I could change horses. I didn't feel comfortable riding a horse that could be in pain. I was told quite clearly that I would be instantly failed, I couldn't change horses, and quite frankly who was I to point out to the BHS examiners that the horse was unsuitable. In the end I backed down and rode the horse. I still feel embarrassed to this day that I was bullied into riding a very genuine horse who was probably in pain. Its put me right off doing anymore of the stages, I wish I knew who to contact as a complaint. Think I am a bit late now though! You aren't alone in being frustrated at their system.

 

[ruth83]

Are you saying that throughout the entirety of the first horse section of the riding exam, your daughter stood in the centre of the school and could not move at all? Or that the horse was not forward going? I ask simply to clarify the situation.

If you speak directly with The BHS they will advise you of the procedure to be followed to persue a complaint. I believe your first port of call (though I am happy to be corrected by BHS Official) would be the Examinations Department, via the main switchboard on 02476840500. As you have already seen (and as is the case with similar practical tests such as the driving test) the outcome of the exam will not be changed but if the complaint is upheld a resit will be offered.

As mentioned above, your daughters ability will have been assessed on the second horse. Unfortunately it is now the case that anyone who is unsuccesful in their flatwork section will not be allowed to jump. This is both for health and safety reasons and to protect the exam horses.

ETA - For those thinking that this happens 'all to regularly', The BHS holds several exams each week. Each exam has between 4 and 18 candidates. Complaints come from a very small percentage of those people. The BHS exams, as the OP has stated, are affiliated to OFQUAL and are regulated in the same way that GCSEs and A levels are.

With regard riding and road safety, the situation here is a little different as the way the test centres are assessed and regulated are currently slightly different because candidates hire horses directly from the centre rather than the centre providing horses for The BHS. I don't wish to comment on a direct situation without having been there but if it was exactly as One More has described, an alternative horse should have been offered and speaking to the examiners would not have resulted in an automatic fail.

 

[ReggieP]

She should have ridden 2 horses on the flat. How did she do on the other one? Did the examiners tell her exactly why she couldn't progress to jumping? She has to be deemed of an unsafe standard for then to do that.

She was only allowed this one on the flat and because she could not get it going, she was not allowed on the jumping and XC. She has been riding daily for 15 years and competing for 12 with success. Her teachers include some of the biggest named in the uk, including fellows of the BHS . She complained to the examiners that there was a problem. They ignored her. The horse in question was subsequently examined with a blacksmith present and deemed to be lame!! The equestrian centre refuses to acknowledge any responsibility and simply passed my message to BHS. If you look on BHS for stage 3 today you can see which centre it was!

I have raised a complaint to the highest level in BHS. In addition because this is not a syllabus testing problem , but more an issue of examination procedure, facilities, etc , it can be raised to OFQUAL as the regulator of BHS exams.

 

[ruth83]

Please do not hold the centre responsible for the complaint, they are correct to refer you to The BHS - the complaint can only be dealt with by The BHS or OFQUAL, not by the centre.

 

[ester]

But aren't the centre responsible for providing suitable, sound horses?

 

[Millie-Rose]

Having been involved in the exams both as a candidate and working for a centre I would complain that she didn't get to ride a second horse . IMO she should have ridden the second horse and as long as she then appeared competent should have gone on to jumping where they would have had plenty of chance to assess her. Even in the sj section you have to warm up on the flat then pop a x pole they could have let her do that then retired her if felt she was unsafe.
In my stage 3 my first horse was a lovely dressage schoolmaster so I floated round feeling smug of course the examiners are not idiots so they swapped me with a girl who was struggling with a green not very forward going cob. This gave us both a chance to show what we could do.
From a centre perspective if we had an issue with a horse (usually being too fresh)y we never had a lame one so can't coment. It was either swapped out or if candidate coping they were allowed to continue but were then given an easy second horse. For example horse unsettled in the wind in a stage 1 candidate couldn't show 2 point as horse strong horse was taken out after her ride and she was given an easy second horse so she could show 2 point and work without stirrups.

 

[ruth83]

But aren't the centre responsible for providing suitable, sound horses?

What I am saying is that the chain of responsibility means that the centre cannot be held responsible for dealing with the complaint directly. The complaint must come via The BHS as the centre were providing a service to The BHS who were, in turn, providing a service to the candidates.

I am also uncertain as to why your daughter did not ride a second horse on the flat but as I was not there I cannot really offer comment. This can only usefully be dealt with by The BHS where there will have been several assessors and the centres manager or chief instructor who will know exactly what the situation was.

 

[galaxy]

Not even being allowed to complete the flat session is highly odd and that is absolutely worth going to the BHS about. Not being put forward to the jumping sections is one thing, but to complete the flat ridden section you are required to ride 2 different horses.

 

[Jade Holleman]

I had this problem when I took my Stage 3 years ago. I got a very unhappy horse for my jumping....couldn't get it to go and it really didn't want to jump. I got half way round the course and the horse just stopped. I said to the examiners that I was not happy with the horse but they said to continue which I did but the horse wasn't havin any of it. Afterwards I found out the horse was really lame and on bute!

 

[teapot]

I think now due to insurance purposes if you fail the flat you're not allowed to jump whether you're safe or not.

I really want to do my stage 3 soon but the place I want to do it is closing down so I have no idea where I want to do it now.

Have only ever heard good things about Huntley and that's reasonably close to you (if your location's correct).

As for OP - I'd try and complain. Hopefully the BHS poster on here will see this thread too.

 

[TableDancer]

Have only ever heard good things about Huntley and that's reasonably close to you (if your location's correct).

As for OP - I'd try and complain. Hopefully the BHS poster on here will see this thread too.

Huntley is the one that's closing down unfortunately.

 

[ruth83]

The BHS are aware of this and I understand have been in touch with the OP.

 

[teapot]

Huntley is the one that's closing down unfortunately.

Really?! That's a real shame.

 

[henryhorn]

In my experience you will be wasting your time.
My daughter got mixed up with another girl when they were told to go out of order.
Despite having a watching BHSI and BHS Int tell them afterwards they were mistaken and posting them a photo they would not change their minds and admit there had been a mistake. The other girl failed her lungeing session whilst my daughter had according to all who were there excelled. She was so angry she never took another exam. She has excelled in her career grooming for the top event riders at 4 * in the UK and Internationally and is now a successful rider herself. You can imagine what she says when her Badminton winning employer was happy for her to ride and lunge his event horses yet the BHS consider her incompetent...

 

[weebarney]

Oh poor horses , what a life

 

[Marydoll]

Id like to say im surprised but im not, meanwhile the BHS will happily continue to take your cash for these expensive exams, find another route and hit them where it hurts .... In the pocket by training elsewhere

 

[Patterdale]

So your daughter couldn't make the horse go, but someone else could?? That would say to me that your daughters ability was in question here. Sorry.
Stage 3 is a long way above Stage 2 and takes months of preparation, even if you are experienced. It's not enough just to ride your own, or just well schooled horses. They don't give you schoolmasters or push button horses.

I get fed up of all this BHS bashing and suspect we are not getting the full story here.

In my stage 3 my xc horse refused almost every jump, violently and totally naughtily. I got it round regardless, and passed.
They don't fail you if you get a problem horse, they fail you if you can't RIDE the problem horse. If I'd not managed that horse, perhaps I'd be on here complaining that they failed me because my xc horse refused every jump, wouldn't I? But I made sure I was properly prepared before putting in for the exam.

A good example is in my stage 2. The girl lunging next to me in the arena sent her horse off with a big whip crack on a small circle. The horse jumped forwards, was pulled on the rope, lost balance and fell over onto its side. The girl was taken out of the exam and was heard complaining loudly that the horse was 'unsuitable' and 'far too unbalanced' to be lunged, and that if they dared fail her over that then she'd be complaining.
I wonder what story her family and friends heard?

Most people tend to complain about the BHS because they've not met the required standard. Remember that BHS examiners are not pen pushers following pointless rules, they are mainly experienced and practical riders who teach and compete at high standards.

OP this is not all aimed at you, but all the BHS bashing really winds me up. If you meet the required standard, you pass. If you don't, you fail.