Stronger bit

[rdavies]

I have constantly been riding my horse in a standard snaffle bit but now he is much fitter, he is getting stronger and stronger to jump and harder to hold.

He absolutely loves to jump to the point of being arrogant about it and deciding when he wants to jump. I've done all sorts with him including lane work, poles, jumping on circles, half halts, coming in in walk and trot and sitting as quietly as possible to get him to listen and stop charging
He is fab dressage wise and I have taken to almost schooling him into fences but he can still speed up super fast in between doubles and bounces

I was just wondering what the next step up from s snaffle would be as it doesn't need to be harsh, just to give me a little bit of control back

 

[Farma]

I ride in a happy mouth snaffle but if i go out in a group or jump/xc i ride in a tom thumb hich works wonders.
Its far worse imo to have to force the snaffle to work than ask a stronger bit to work - its bloomin dodgy to have a horse tanking you into fences aswell.

 

[_Rach_]

I have twizzy in a happy mouth striaght bendy pelham, she loves it, And I can hold her without her sticking her head in the air and running. I also wrap the curb chain in black tape so its not as harsh on her.

 

[KingCharles]

I have always had better reasults with schooling and using my seat, than using a stronger bit. My current horse was jumped in a stronger bit and with his head tied in. I ride him in a french link hanging cheek snaffle. I can do anythign with him and pull him up with no problems. However other riders do struggle to pull him up. Thats becasue they dont use there seat.

One pony i once had, was so strong that before he came to me he had bent the rings on a 3 ring gag! He was dangerous, and given to me because of this.
I took him back to basics, schooled him, and put him in a french link snaffle. I never had a problem , and even took him cross country and hacking out with groups in that bit, and always had breaks. Again i use my seat and less rein. Many times i find that its a case of the horse running away from the contact and the stronger the bit, the more they run. I have to admit that when i started to jump my current horse he was strong in his bit, but i schooled him more and now i find i have control with jumping and i still have the same bit.

i did try him in a stronger bit and he was overbent and stronger.

I see it all the time at the local showjumping, horses going round like camels, riders with very strong bits. The horse backing off the bit so much, it just looks wrong.

 

[Gezzy2910]

What about a hanging cheeck snaffle as it applies a bit of poll pressure which most horses respond to without being harsh as it is still a snaffle. Neue Shule do a lovely one.

You've opened up a big can of worms here about bits!!!

 

[sally87]

have you tried poles before & after the fence? when i had a similar problem i used a placing pole 3 human strides before the fence & a pole 3 human strides after the fence. no need to jump high when doing this kind of exercise but it helped me get more control & respect going into the jump. bit wise how about trying a snaffle with cheeks? just a bit more leverage

 

[sally87]

What about a hanging cheeck snaffle

didnt see this post before mine. also forgot to mention mine was a fairly short striding pony so 3 human strides may not be correct

 

[MontyandZoom]

Zoom has a super soft mouth and is riddne in a neue schule starter bit 90% of the time. However, she also has a tendency to get super excited jumping (and you can tell from the name that she is super fizzy anyway!).

I ride her in a hanging cheek french link snaffle for jumping with a grakle noseband and I found it has given me the extra control needed.

KingCharles, I get your point about schooling, and I HATE seeing green horses that rush due to lack of schooling put in 4 ring gags and martingales. However, it seems that OP has been doing alot of schooling. Perhaps a slightly stronger bit is needed to gain back a bit of respect?

 

[BigRed]

Neue Schule sell a snaffle called a Tranz Losenge. It is dressage legal. It is a loose ringed snaffle with a losenge, the losenge is nice and round, but it is on a very slight angle to make your pony thing about things a little more.

 

[rdavies]

Thanks very much for all the replies. Much appreciated

The Tom Thumb and the Hanging cheek French Link snaffle looks good.

My next question is how do you size a bit for your horse? I've never done it as he came with the bit he uses now 3 years ago

Thanks

 

[ncarter]

I use a dutch gag with a french link - I put it on the snaffle ring for flat work / hacking, and then drop a ring for jumping as it gives me a bit more control - he is a Welsh D and sees a jump and thinks 'I know what I'm doing' and will tank himself into the bottom of it if allowed. I jumped him 1m 10 yesterday in this (my highest ever - he is only a short legged 14.1!)

Forgot to add - this also means you do not have to keep changing the bit if you DO need a different bit for jumping and you only have 1 bridle

 

[ThePony]

hi op,
would second the ns tranz, is a fab comfy bit which is shaped really nicely to the mouth - more comfort for the horse often seems to result in more sensitivity to aids from the bit. Less is often more! Re the rushing into jumps, my oh horse has a tendency to do this as she reckons she totally knows it all and doesn't need any rider offering advice from her back! She is really powerful so she can mess up on the approach and still pop them! The only thing that works for her is grids, she has to stand off them and work properly over them which helps stop her charging forwards and hurdling them! Obv goes without saying that the horse needs to be balanced in the first place, but it sounds like you have done a load of flatwork so hopefully you have that sorted. Keeping your leg on coming into a jump can help too as it brings the horse between your leg and hand more and you can then control your speed a bit more while still keeping the impulsion in your canter.
Re measuring the bit, if the bit you are currently using fits well then just measure the mouth piece of that. This website describes it really well http://www.ehow.com/how_2169314_fit-horses-bit.html
Before ordering a bit I would call a few bit banks and get their opinions, an expensive game otherwise trying a load of bits! Goes without saying, but do consider your horses mouth confirmation when picking a new bit. As he has got fitter, and I assume has muscled up more, might be worth a saddle check just to make sure all is well.

 

[rdavies]

All great advice thanks very much.

Time to do some measuring, buying and testing!!!

 

[Kat]

Hi OP, before you change anything I'd have an instructor look at you jumping your horse just to be sure that it is a bitting issue.

It could be that you need to ride more from your seat, leg and body. Many horses do not respond well to you taking a pull while jumping, but respond better to weight aids. A couple I ride if you take a pull will stick their head up, hollow and run through the hand, but if you leave the contact alone, sit up, put your weight into your heel and bring your shoulders back they steady up nicely.

It could also be that your horse is a quick jumper and isn't rushing at all but has a naturally quick way of going and steadying him up is not doing him any favours.

If you are sure that you need more breaks then I would start with something just a little bit stronger and see how you get on. A horse I ride goes significantly better just because you switch her loose ring french link for one with a thinner mouthpiece, it gives a little more pressure and she listens to it better.

It is difficult to advise without knowing what your horse does when he tanks off. If he sticks his head in the air I'd avoid dutch gags or hanging cheeks and go for maybe a pelham or a kimblewick. If he's opening his mouth to avoid the contact then I'd try a drop noseband or a grackle and leave the bit as it is.

But to be honest my first port of call would be a different snaffle, but the precise one would depend a bit on your horses mouth conformation and his preferences. One that might be worth a try that is under used is a twisted snaffle. They look awful in text book pictures, but my instructor suggested one for a rushy horse and it has worked wonders, the one she had was not sharp or anything, it was just a slight spiral shape to the mouthpiece that prevented the horse leaning on it. I've since used it on quite a few other horses that need just a bit more than a normal snaffle but nothing too harsh and it has been accepted happily by all of them. Including one who has objected to a myler comfort snaffle, a hanging cheek, a dutch gag, and a wilke. Certainly worth trying before you go for something like a waterford.

 

[rdavies]

Agreed, the quieter I do sit the more he calms down but sometimes in between fences and with grid work he sets his neck like concrete and just wants to whizz off. He doesn't bolt or stick his head in the air, its like a power canter at the speed he wants to go, he's just fast and he does slow down just not when I want him to slow down. I don't want to ruin his enthusiam as he does love to jump, just get some respect back and listening.

The thing is he is very soft and supple dressage wise but when he wants his own way jumping he can set the neck very quickly and he's got very strong physically through dressage and jumping in the last 2 years. I prefer him like this as he used to be so lazy it was unreal. Its as if all the training has paid off but now we have too much forward going and I need him to be safer.

While he's zooming off and I'm trying to steer him to the next fence, its proving to be a battle of wills to stop the concrete neck and turn sensibly and safely towards the next jump

 

[Kat]

In that case I'd be inclined to carry on with the schooling.

Lots of bending and flexing and doing circles and shapes between the fence so that he can't set his neck and only jump when he is soft. He needs to learn that setting his neck does not get him to the fence faster, but actually means he has to do a shedload of extra work.

I'd work on lateral work too, nothing to stop you jumping a fence, and doing leg yeild or shoulder in to get the suppleness and bend back and then jumping another. Just watch a Tim Stockdale demo - he does a bit of going sideways!

I'd avoid grids for now unless you are going to really challenge him to keep agile and under himself. Grids (especially if the distances are a bit long) can exacerbate this sort of thing whereas a few fences set around the school so you can jump them on a figure of eight, a circle or whatever would probably be better. Concentrate on using your weight to slow him and also your voice. Try to make sure that he is always listening, and doesn't know where he is going next and is ready to bend or flex whenever you ask in whatever pace you ask.

 

[wench]

http://www.4dobbin.com/product-Triple-Barrel-Myler.html

I use one of these on my horse, although it has the full cheeks with hooks. Really helps with the steering and brakes, would recommend if you can get hold of one to try.

My other horse cant stand it, however he is a bit funny with his bits. He loves NS trans universal, but yet hates the snaffle version!