Tennesee Walking Horses OMG The Cruelty!!!!

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Did you watch the second video - the CNN report? If you did and you still think there is little or no cruely in this, then I don't know what to say
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stella,
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I NEVER said I did not think what happened in vid two was cruel. I made it clear that I was unable to watch it and said I am aware bad things happen but that it is not widespread. I also was quite clear I am against any form of cruelty

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Back to dressage - We don't choose to harness and train the fear reactions though
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What is your point here?

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I am not sure I understand what you are asking me here? What did I say about that topic? I cannot remember if I did and do not know how I am supposed to respond to this

[/ QUOTE ] Jade - You said "Yes, I've seen horses flip over backwards when frightened too"! in reply to me saying that dressage movements are executed naturally in the field.

When you said that you couldn't access the second video, I posted some intructions above (just what worked for me) on getting into it - its not straightforward, but I found a knack! I'd genuinely love to hear your opinion on it.
 
Oh! The "flip over backwards comment" lol I meant that in response to you saying I should introduce a stallion ( etc. ) and see just what moves my horses could make. That was a fairly pointless example I made and had no real purpose to the thread other than that my horses would most likley flip over if cornered by a raging stallion than start performing dressage.lol

I will try and see the vid in a moment but I am sure if it is cruel I will agree with you
 
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Arabs aren't gaited horses as far as I know...
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=ploSG67K6d8&feature=related

I used to ride a grey arab stallion myself (complete schoolmaster) who certainly didn't move like that. He'd extend beautifully but not in the unatural, half lame stilted manner caused by however they're training/riding this horse.

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And the tw#t on it cant ride at all, he looks like he has never ridden before. Poor horse! The TWH video is appalling. It sickens me to think that our beautiful equine friends are treated so badly. I also agree that a lot of horses around the world in many different disciplines and walks of life are treated badly. Usually because the human wants to show off!
 
In defense of the breed ( not the deeds of the big lick lot) we have friends in the states who won't hear a bad word said about walkers for general riding, and I guess like many 'average' riders treat them just like any other horse. On a slightly different note, our friends swear there is nothing better for ageing joints than a fox trotter, wish there were more here!
 
stop getting your back up, I'm not attacking you. I know I lumped your quotes together, I couldn't be bothered to annalyse(sp?) them all in minute detail, do enough of that at school. I understand you disagree with these practices as the rest of us, but the way you take umbrigde at comments and make comparisons to the sports all of us here enjoy (that do far less damage to our horses than is being done to the ones in the videos) gives us the wrong impression, whatever you may have intended to get across.
 
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stop getting your back up, I'm not attacking you. I know I lumped your quotes together, I couldn't be bothered to annalyse(sp?) them all in minute detail, do enough of that at school. I understand you disagree with these practices as the rest of us, but the way you take umbrigde at comments and make comparisons to the sports all of us here enjoy (that do far less damage to our horses than is being done to the ones in the videos) gives us the wrong impression, whatever you may have intended to get across.

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huh?
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Once again I think you took my posting in the wrong context

Why would I not make compariosns to the sports you know and enjoy? Would that not be how to make an example to the TWH that you could empathise with and understand
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Say...we do jump and do dressage here too you know
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FAR more in fact than we show TWH's if you wanted to break it down to percentages.

I also would have to see statistics of horses caused injury, stress, lameness (etc) to truly belive that it happens more in the TWH than jumping, eventing and dressage. I would have to say it could be possible more negative things could happen to eventers? Not positive though but would like to see some concrete proof of this.

I never had my back up in that last post I made to you
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When you summed it up I just wanted you to understand just how I meant each of those comments as your posts left me unclear that you did.
Not sure how you read what I write but I think perhaps I should put more smilies and winks?
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btw I love the horse in your sig
 
Very well explained thank you "Smoochy"
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I personally think it is disgusting. It is INCOMPARABLE to dressage, as others have said they do it in the field, and in the wild, they also jump in the wild. The riders sit on the weakest part of the back, so surely it is likely they have kidney problems (the horses) from having weight too far back? The bits they ride in are awful and being broken in as yearlings is just cruel. I'm sure you all saw the video posted a few weeks ago about that racking horse with a massive rider on and it was only 2, people thought it was too young etc etc, well imagine a year younger! I am disgusted tbh.
 
I'm sorry, I didn't mean to sound like I'm having a go... maybe I need to put more smilies in there too lol. I think I have been reading your posts wrong... I'm an english lit student and I tend to overanalyse things, it's kind of ingrained. you're probably correct about eventers suffering more injuries, I know a fair number who have been ruined by their careers and a far larger number of hunters who end up in cans because of horrible injuries to their legs caused by the selfishness and ignorance of their owners. thank you, your horses look like angels in your sig, I'm guessing from previous posts that they're aqhas?
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Of course these horses have a way of going that is virtually unknown in this country. There is a small saddlebred society and the occasional Morgans will if trained and if it occurs naturally.

The double bridles should only be handled with finesse - these are not necessarily "cruel bits" it is how they are used, after all. These show horses do not necessarily go "on a contact" like a dressage horse, they are supposed to respond to the lightest of touch on the mouth.

What I take issue with is the riding of 2 year olds in the ring, with adult male riders - and not lightweight ones either - and the awful extensions on the hooves. If they lift up their legs and flick their toes, fine, but why do they need these heavy artificial aids to do that?

These horses are the descendants of the European amblers that were taken to the New World. This way of going died out in Europe apart from the Icelandic ponies that tolt. Of course, there have been different traits bred in as well.

I was told by an American rider/trainer that actually the term "gaited" used to mean "fully trained" which included doing the Spanish Trot, which looks like "the rack." Think about it.
It takes a long time to train a horse to do the Spanish Trot - years of high school training.
So much quicker to use artificial aids AND then you can get your 2 and 3 year olds to do it.
 
I was the forum member who posted that vid and I did agree it was horrible upon first seeing it and do not think he should have been plowing down the roads on her like that when she was not even two. The horses owner found us ( somehow!
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) and actully explained in the thread how little the filly was worked and having no facts to dispute her I had to take her word for it. She said the filly was ridden about once a week at 15 mins a pop ( I think) She claimed this mare was a natural and that is why she was going so well so young. Looking at her I would have thought she had HOURS of long training to get that way. The man was huge for a young horse but he did have a good seat . Not like the man shown with the arab! lol

Starting as a yearling though!???
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That would be bad for any form of riding.
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My condern is about the adding of four inches to the leg with the stacked shoes, the strains that must put on the joints is very worrying. IMO that is abusive on it's own, whether or not they use blisters etc. Also the mutilation of the tail, so unnecessary surely.
 
Having ridden an Appy who paced quite naturally and also when in a strop about not being allowed to get her mouth down to rub on her leg, would bring the leg up to rub her mouth, I would say that the movements ARE natural for these horses and what a shame that they have to spoil what they have created.
 
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dear God! I just got the video to work!

I stopped it soon after I realised that I was about ten years old when it was made
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Find me a recent undercover vid (whick I am sure is out there
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) and I will have a better comment.

Again, I am against cruelty to horses but I cannot understand how anyone could put up such an old vid and then discuss what is happening with animal welfare in the US today?

It would be like me playing an old Western movie where John Waynes horse flew off a cliff to it's death ( which was prob not special effects back then
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and many horses were killed in these westerns ) and then saying the movie industry today should take better care of horses as it is appaling and disgusting ???

Again, I am not saying this never happens anymore to TWH and that it is right if it does, I am just saying that the ancient vid makes a poor argument to help the cause.
 
Well I assume so if there are vids of the shows of them in motion out now wearing them. I have never been to a show where they ride like this though and have only ever watched them being ridden in a more natural way with all hooves on the ground. When they are left more natural looking they can be very beautiful. Not my thing though
 
I wasn't aware that it was an old video. I hadn't noticed that. It was posted on the thread on the other forum I mentioned in the original post. I do hope things have changed since then - perhaps even as a result of the CNN report?
 
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