The Brooke animal hospital causes suffering to animals

stormalong said:
If the only way many of you will believe me is to see photographic evidence, I can ask my daughter to post it online for you to view. Don't doubt me, it does exist.
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Please do - it would be very helpful.


amymay - I would imagine she has not, but then it is very unlikely that the Chief Exec would be the best person to try and contact regarding this anyway. Any mail to the CE would probably go straight to the supporter services team, who would then refer it on to the most appropriate department. Hopefully the OP has at least sent the photographs of the horse and the cars to add credence to her claims.
 
Just because I don't reply to your post straight away does not mean the answer is a NO!!
I do have a life, and can't sit at the computer all day, I have horses of my own to see too, work and family commitments.

I don't have a photograph of the vehicles, I do of the horse concerned. If you prefer to disbelieve me than fair enough. After all from the comfort of your own home, you can bury your head in the sand and believe it doesn't exist.

I mean I can get my daughter to cut and paste or whatever you do to load a photograph, but if you disbelieve me in the first place, how are you to know the photograph I have of the horse, is the one I am posting about. It could be from anywhere.

Its not just me that experienced this dreadful scene, my husband was there too. The vehicles are a little irrelevant to the story. My aim is to stop unnecessary suffering to the animals treated there.
 
stormalong said:
I have not contacted The Brooke. However they deny they have any vehicles out in Luxor. As I have seen them with my own eyes, I have no trust in them whatsoever.
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But surely, if you have genuine concerns, that would be THE first thing to do :confused:

canteron said:
I just hope this thread doesn't get pulled before we find out the truth.
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I'm surprised it's still standing...

stormalong said:
Providing evidence of bad management at The Brooke? I am not commenting on heresay, I actually saw the horse shortly after it had been hit, and then returned later. The vet? was very surprised to see me later on in the day. I suppose most tourists who do visit, don't return later on in the same day as I did to check up on an animal.
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But everything you have said is anecdotal and uncorroborated in the true sense... That's the point... You need to start the formal wheels moving to acknowledge the evidence you have and your experiences... I am not for one minute suggesting that you have pulled this out of your hat but I could say the same on a public forum when in reality I've never been to Egypt... Scepticism is healthy until something a bit more tangible is available... I hope you get a prompt reply from the charity and they look at your complaint properly...

:)
 
I do hope that this is either overstated or untrue (although I cannot believe someone would spend their time posting defamatory remarks) as I have fundraised for Brooke at times. Now concentrate on local animal rescue, and try and close my eyes to other advertisements, cannot afford all.
 
muddymate said:
"just ask any of the caleche drivers"
What shall we call YOUR charity? FOECD (Friend Of Egyptian Caleche Drivers)? Why are you swanning around in a caleche in all that heat and obvious danger to horses (that are hit by vehicles etc.)?
I really CANNOT imagine that you would be allowed near the animals in the extreme state that you describe, as a jolly tourist, especially if the organisations in question HAVE SOMETHING TO HIDE...
I will forward a link to this thread to Brooke, even though I am sure that they have much better things to do than deal with than your bad grammar.
Enjoy the rest of your holiday; I understand that half starved horses working in the environs of the pyramids are desperate for more work.
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I understand people being sceptical but this response is pretty sarcastic and unpleasant.

I didn't think the OP's grammar was particularly bad (certainly no worse than muddymate's), but so what if it was? What would that have to do with the case?

It's fair enough that people should question the OP and request more evidence, but surely it can be done with a little less rudeness.
 
There is no reason to disbelieve the OP - but the place to take this up is the Brooke, who should investigate. I can imagine that it is hard to keep tabs on every member of staff and every clinic, but hopefully they will find out what is happening and if the standard of care is less than it should be.
 
FionaM12 said:
I understand people being sceptical but this response is pretty sarcastic and unpleasant.

I didn't think the OP's grammar was particularly bad (certainly no worse than muddymate's), but so what if it was? What would that have to do with the case?

It's fair enough that people should question the OP and request more evidence, but surely it can be done with a little less rudeness.
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^^^ What she said.

The likes of AmyMay, I feel have gone about it the right way, in a nicer manner. I would also like to see the evidence, or at least be comforted that this has been taken up with Brooke, but there is NO need to be as rude as you have been, muddymare.
 
I sat and worried over this post, and have just decided to send email to Brooke re post, asking them to read and answer. Hope to hear from them soon. I know that this does not mean that OP was telling untruths, but am so worried.
 
stormalong said:
Just because I don't reply to your post straight away does not mean the answer is a NO!!
I do have a life, and can't sit at the computer all day, I have horses of my own to see too, work and family commitments.
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Apologies - you were however on line and reading the post for quite some time after I asked my question (which is still yet to be answered.....)


I also don't disbelieve you. However I would like confirmation of whom you have officially complained to.
 
Freddie19 said:
I sat and worried over this post, and have just decided to send email to Brooke re post, asking them to read and answer. Hope to hear from them soon. I know that this does not mean that OP was telling untruths, but am so worried.
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The Brooke have answered posts on here in the past - so this should be interesting.
 
I am going to Luxor next week. Two of my sisters live there. One of whom has adopted cats from ACE and received nothing but good advice. I am taking adhesive bandages and fly fringes with me this time.

I don't think that bashing one charity from another ultimetly from another helps anyone. Obviously if one has real concerns then they should be aired.
 
Sorry amymay if I did not answer all of your question.

I have written via email to The Brooke. I have searched for a direct contact email for their CE but can't find it. However, I have emailed the society directly.

Re the photograph, no I haven't sent it, due to my computer skills not being up to it. However like I say, it is on our digital camera, and it can be posted.

Someone yesterday also sent a link to The Brooke's Facebook page for me, they replied that they would investigate for me.

I appreciate many people don't believe my claims. To prove I was there - I also made a donation of 100LE whilst there, and I have a written receipt, signed with the date.

I also made sure I wrote in the visitor book mentioning the stricken horse, hoping it made a full recovery. (This was the first time I visited in the morning). In the afternoon the visitor book was not available!
 
Janah - if you are going out next week is there any chance you can take photographs of The Brooke and its facilities. The vehicles were all parked inside the compound.
However in all honesty its the ability of the vet there that I question, and why I am posting my concerns.
 
I think it's quite likely everything OP has said is accurate. Sadly all large charities of any kind contain a certain amount of lazy uncaring people who's only thought is to themselves and their pockets. That is the problem when they get so big, not every one is there for the right reasons. Unfortunately the smaller and more dedicated charities do not carry the same clout world wide. It's a rock and a hard place situation as to where to donate your hard earned contribution.
 
SusannaF said:
I find it odd that instead of reporting your concerns to the Brooke, you wrote a long post on a public forum on which you've made few posts and in which you repeatedly sing the praises of another charity which could be said to be competing for the same funds.
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I'm sure they are doing the best they can and they are better than nothing? I no longer donate to them (as only want my donation going to the animals and not to people) but have changed to SPANA
 
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I am not going to comment on your claims, but do want to know WHY you were using one of these horse drawn vehicles, adding to their overwork and stress needlessly.
 
moana said:
I am not going to comment on your claims, but do want to know WHY you were using one of these horse drawn vehicles, adding to their overwork and stress needlessly.
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Thats a catch 22 though isn't it? If they can't earn money through tourists they'll just either a) not be able to feed their horses or b) make them do some much harder labour either in the fields or the brick kilns. Rewarding good ownership with patronage is a good thing to do. Me and the OH rode horses to the pyramids when we went, yes they weren't UK 'show condition' but they were not emaciated, and were well looked after. (although in my naivety I didn't see under the saddles - this was 8 years ago).

Many of the people don't want to be cruel to their animals, but in a country where there is no free healthcare of anything else for people, how can you expect their horses to be cared for as well as ours if they don't have money? :)
 
Stencilface said:
Thats a catch 22 though isn't it? If they can't earn money through tourists they'll just either a) not be able to feed their horses or b) make them do some much harder labour either in the fields or the brick kilns. Rewarding good ownership with patronage is a good thing to do. Me and the OH rode horses to the pyramids when we went, yes they weren't UK 'show condition' but they were not emaciated, and were well looked after. (although in my naivety I didn't see under the saddles - this was 8 years ago).

Many of the people don't want to be cruel to their animals, but in a country where there is no free healthcare of anything else for people, how can you expect their horses to be cared for as well as ours if they don't have money? :)
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It is catch 22 I have lived in a developing country and its a dilemma you had to deal with all the time I still don't know what's the right thing to do.
 
I think that the correct and right course of action in this case would be to contact the Brooke directly (which you say you have) and the Charities Commission if you have a complaint to make.

You should be (or may be already) aware that by posting this on a public forum, it could be viewed as defamatory and could also jeopordise any future investigation.

I am deeply saddened by what you say (particularly as I support the Brooke) but I also work for a large NGO and some of the allegations that have been levelled at us beggar belief!! I don't necessarily disbelieve you but if you want to prevent the situation that you witnessed re-ocurring then complaining to the Brooke and the Charities Commission is the way forward - not posting comments on a public forum that could potentially land you in hot water.
 
Taffyhorse said:
I think that the correct and right course of action in this case would be to contact the Brooke directly (which you say you have) and the Charities Commission if you have a complaint to make.
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Thats a good point. Charities registered in this country get an awful lot by way of tax breaks. They are subject therefore to stringent conditions governing their modus operandi. I do not think therefore that it is unreasonable to question the activites of a charity. Sometimes things find their way out anecdotally first. Charities are in the public eye and can reasonably expect public criticism when they are seen not to function, if indeed that is the case.

OP - I should think writing to the Charities Commissioner, with some of your evidence, would be worthwhile.

Taffyhorse said:
You should be (or may be already) aware that by posting this on a public forum, it could be viewed as defamatory and could also jeopordise any future investigation.
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Veracity is always a defence to defamation, and the OP states that she has evidence. I doubt that we are talking about a criminal investigation here, so I find it unlikely that any investigation by the appropriate body (the Charities Commission) will be jeapardised.
 
Moana - in reply to your question on why we use the caleches at all - we only ever use the good ones. Its like all things in life - they are not all bad. The horse we use, we have known for 6 years now. Every year we return to Luxor he looks well, even in the revolution when there was no work at all. I went out last November to visit, and to see how the horses were. Yes some of them were very thin, but Rambo - he looked the same as usual.
His owner knows having a nice horse brings him in far more revenue. He is not the only good horse out in Luxor, there are many more. However, go in the backstreets and you will see many horses not so fortunate.

To everyone who has viewed my post, and replied to it, thank you for your constructive comments. I had not thought about contacting the Charities Commission, but will do so.

The Brooke have replied to me and asked for a description of the vet in question. My daughter has also helped me to upload some photographs taken on the day, including one of the horse that died.
 
When I went to Egypt, we were encouraged to use the Caleches which had the well cared for horses because this encourages the owners of the poorer horses to improve their care. Some of the owners were incredibly proud of thei animals and carriages. I hope the Brooke situation is investigated as I saw them doing great work (although it was a long time ago I was there!)
 
To the OP, I posted this morning, asking what you were doing about this allegation and this evening you have answered my question. You have contacted the Brooke and sent the photographs. Hopefully they will investigate this matter asap. Well done and thanks
xxx
 
This is obviously a very distressing situation, I hope you get a satisfactory response from The Brooke.

Can you keep us posted...not everyone on here wishes to give you a hard time...I understand that people are skeptical but I agree with others on here that some of the replies on this thread have been extremely rude.

Your post has given me a lot to think about, I also agree with seeking out the working horses that are well cared for and in good condition...I did the same in Italy.
 
I think the OP has been completely credible from start to finish! I can't believe people would doubt her. But then again, those people have probably never been to a third world country and seen suffering - it really could make you so angry that you would come on here and fire off a thread... It sticks in your mind.. If nothing else, among the accusations there were some useful suggestions on where to go next with the complaint..

OP good luck, and keep us posted.x
 
Is it at all possible that it is a fake charity masquerading as The Brooke? It coul dbe done.............given that someone has opened a fake Primark in Dubai, then why not a fake charity to rake in cash?
They may well have the vehicles, but not have been authorised to have them.
 
Ok, I for one need to hear from The Brooke now.

Like many others I have a standing order for their works and have raised funds seperately. I am sure that overall they do a good job - but its time they made a statement on this forum about this particularly situation - if as you say, they have posted on here before?

Please Brooke, I desperately want to believe in you.
 
canteron said:
Ok, I for one need to hear from The Brooke now.

Like many others I have a standing order for their works and have raised funds seperately. I am sure that overall they do a good job - but its time they made a statement on this forum about this particularly situation - if as you say, they have posted on here before?

Please Brooke, I desperately want to believe in you.
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I can't imagine they're in any position to comment at the moment, until the email has been located and investigation carried out.
 
Just to say that I have received email from Brooke this morning to say, that they are shocked and concerned re the remarks made in this post, have contacted their offices in Luzor and investigations are being carried out. They have said they will keep me informed. If I was a technophobe I would put email on here, but I am afraid I cannot. I will of course report any other emails back.
 
Honey08 said:
I think the OP has been completely credible from start to finish! I can't believe people would doubt her. But then again, those people have probably never been to a third world country and seen suffering - it really could make you so angry that you would come on here and fire off a thread... It sticks in your mind.. If nothing else, among the accusations there were some useful suggestions on where to go next with the complaint..

OP good luck, and keep us posted.x
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Well I lived in one and have seen the work Brooke do and something in the original post did not feel right to me.
 
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