The Good, The Bad and the Ugly...Shocking Reports..please read if you can..

I would hope most people on here have already signed up to the WHW campaign. A hard hitting report in H & H would perhaps bring it to the attention of a lot more people too.
 
nativeponies said:
Indalo............i have, and still do, just this.

But, sadly for me, i have received a fair few abusive pm's on hee for doing just that.

sadly, some on here tend to forget those that have gone on to lead fabulous normal lives..

But....i have a very thick skin..;)
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huge respect for you NP. I hope to be in the position one day where I can save what I can and ensure a decent and humane end to what can not be saved.
 
Having worked for a well known animal welfare organisation(wont mention not worth it!) This kind of treatment of horses has been going on for years.
And regardless of legisation it has continued on after the initial interest from the pubic and other welfare groups.
Sadly many horses leave Ireland for belgium as they aslo import for meat etc.
I know this as a local dealer sends horses out that way on a regular basis. My yearlings mother a tb, who Id looked after for another dealer sold her to the belgium guy:mad::(
 
nativeponies said:
Rugs?

And handbags/shoes/boots/jackets etc etc

its an abomination...
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Maybe it is but IMO it is just simply an adjustment of what has gone on before.30 years ago NF foals were sold for meat in France. 95% were sold for meat. Now they are sold for their skins/meat. Meat is not so good economically so the skins are more important. Add a bit of spotty and bobs your uncle. Pretty rug and a bit of dog food.

So long term what is the answer?
Do we continue with natives or do we diversify and scrap the natives for the sake of the European warmblood pony?Should we accept these horses were good in their day but dont fulfil the needs of modern society?
 
TBH, and as blunt as this may come across, i don't care where/what these little guys end up as...

BUT..and i say this as loudly as i can...is it morally right that tiny dartmoor hill ponies/NF/welshies should be sold for 2 quid eah and shipped illegally to France, to be sold again, then shipped again to Italy to be made into a handbag?...when they could have travelled to Taunton, shot there and made into a handbag?....AHA....spot the error...not a lot of kudos in a handbag made in somerset is there?
 
nativeponies said:
TBH, and as blunt as this may come across, i don't care where/what these little guys end up as...

BUT..and i say this as loudly as i can...is it morally right that tiny dartmoor hill ponies/NF/welshies should be sold for 2 quid eah and shipped illegally to France, to be sold again, then shipped again to Italy to be made into a handbag?...when they could have travelled to Taunton, shot there and made into a handbag?....AHA....spot the error...not a lot of kudos in a handbag made in somerset is there?
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My next question was going to be... why can't they be slaughtered in the UK and the skins shipped to Italy, if that's they only bit they want?! It is absolutely horrific.

I was sobbing when I saw the photos of the foals on the floor. They are only a few days old by the looks of them and given up with life already.

Surely there must be more that can be done about this? Some sort of targeted campaign - writing to your MP for a start off.
 
chestnut cob said:
This may be a stupid question but how are other "meat" animals transported? Is it only horses transported live in this way, or do cattle, sheep and so on endure this as well?
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As far as Im aware and Im sure someone more knowledgable than me can tell you- but I see cattle and sheep been transported in better conditions.
But Im wondering if that is because although they travel to saughter they arent been shipped out of the country they were raised in? Due in part to BSE and foot and mouth.:o
 
chestnut cob said:
My next question was going to be... why can't they be slaughtered in the UK and the skins shipped to Italy, if that's they only bit they want?! It is absolutely horrific.

I was sobbing when I saw the photos of the foals on the floor. They are only a few days old by the looks of them and given up with life already.

Surely there must be more that can be done about this? Some sort of targeted campaign - writing to your MP for a start off.
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the skins cannot be shipped to Italy as because of EU regs..it would mean they werent "produced" as Italian..so lower value to the Italians
 
WoopsiiD said:
How many abattoirs are there in the UK in total?
Out of interest what would be the longest journey a meat animal could expect if bought from a sale?
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IF ...AND IT'S A MASSIVE IF....DEFRA regs were adhered to...these ponies were shipped illegally....

As are 100's every week...

IF the rules WERE adhered to, then the transporting time would be less tan 6 hours...in the UK
 
*gingerly puts hand up*

Can I ask a probably stupid and potentially offensive question? I only joined HHO this year, but have heard a lot of muted reference to 'those who must not be named'. Whenever I heard of ERF I assumed they were part of it.

Now it seems I got that wrong - ERF have a different agenda?
 
nativeponies said:
TBH, and as blunt as this may come across, i don't care where/what these little guys end up as...

BUT..and i say this as loudly as i can...is it morally right that tiny dartmoor hill ponies/NF/welshies should be sold for 2 quid eah and shipped illegally to France, to be sold again, then shipped again to Italy to be made into a handbag?...when they could have travelled to Taunton, shot there and made into a handbag?....AHA....spot the error...not a lot of kudos in a handbag made in somerset is there?
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Mr Nail, meet Mr Head.....
 
Millyard Rejects said:
As far as Im aware and Im sure someone more knowledgable than me can tell you- but I see cattle and sheep been transported in better conditions.
But Im wondering if that is because although they travel to saughter they arent been shipped out of the country they were raised in? Due in part to BSE and foot and mouth.:o
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Exporting live animals (cattle/sheep/pigs) does not make economic sense - that's why they are slaughtered in UK and exported on the hook.
Transport of livestock is much more tightly regulated, the 8 hours rule is easier to impose as the passport of the cow or a movement license for sheep/pigs actually states where it comes from...
Sheep and cattle are also easier to transport and look after in transit - generally less panicky and more sturdy than horses, they are easily travelled loose and don't need to stand up to be safe.
 
Ok i am going to make this post and no doubt be shot down what they are doing over there is sh@t but lets face it all the low grade ponies in the new forrest exmoor the dartmoor hill ponies and especially in wales where do we think they all end up.

Now if i am wrong correct me but even the op has posted several times about low grade ponies being better off sent to meat if we didnt allow commoners as they are known to allow ponies to be free grazed on common land and not properly cared for of fed in winter it would not pay to keep them therfore if they had to pay for grazing etc it would not happen that is why dartmoor hill ponies ended up there because they cost nothing to raise therefore have no value . I believe the op recently posted about sales in wales selling ponies for a guinea where do you think these ponies end up but most of all who does breeding them and the way they are raised benefit nobody we are not protecting anything by doing this just because it has always been doesnt mean it is right.

Now just to clarify i am not a fluffy bunny i have a few horses buy and sell a bit have five permanent as it happens all sales rejects i have bought from auctions etc but really think the time has come to stop the needless breeding of ponies especially not even because they are not handsome enough to show etc but because most of the wild ponies bred are not looked after properly handled or fed as needed weaned on day of sale WHAT IS THE POINT OF THIS AND WHO OR WHAT DOES IT BENEFIT ?

The sad thing is ponies who are handled a bit and are friendly if not the best looking can usually find good homes, i am probably a bit soft to some always take care of my horses even if i am selling will take them back if new owners dont get on with them etc etc
And i am sure the WHW would love to be involved in any high profile case like this it is a shame when 40 horses were dumped illegally in a field next door to me and starved all last winter they told me the horses were just resting because they had there heads on the floor although when i said i would take pictures of said horses to daily mail it was then dealt with .

Sorry for epic post as you can see been joined for a while but only post when something gets my goat and guess i you can see this has annoyed me and just again.
THE BREEDING OF NATIVE PONIES OR SMALL HAIRY THINGS THEN BECAUSE YOU ARE A COMMONER AND CAN GRAZE FOR FREE DOES NOT MEAN YOU SHOULD NOT WEAN PROPERLY FEED USE FARRIER OR HANDLE BEFORE YOU DRAG TO SALE AND SELL FOR PEANUTS AND NOT GIVE A SH@T WHEN YOUR PONIES WHO YOU ONLY BREED BECAUSE ITS A FAMILY TRADITION AND YOU LOVE THE BREED END UP AT MEAT.
Ok rant over hope op isnt pissed i discussed some of their views. This is a bit off topic as in not in France but it is the same attitude towards their meat horses there has even recently been horses raced in this country then less than a month later in the french meat markets.

I had an idea that i think is a good one if we added a 1 % to all horses ponies sold at market for any one buying low value horses it wouldnt be alot top racehorses would be more but lets face it these people could afford it this could go towards a central fund anyone who ended up with one of these horses they couldnt look after or any that were found who had fallen on hard times could receive some form of care.
If the money was invested in the long term i am sure this could work.

We need to lead by example and we have a long way to go here first.
 
martlin said:
Exporting live animals (cattle/sheep/pigs) does not make economic sense - that's why they are slaughtered in UK and exported on the hook.
Transport of livestock is much more tightly regulated, the 8 hours rule is easier to impose as the passport of the cow or a movement license for sheep/pigs actually states where it comes from...
Sheep and cattle are also easier to transport and look after in transit - generally less panicky and more sturdy than horses, they are easily travelled loose and don't need to stand up to be safe.
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I knew about the licenses for pigs etc. Just wasnt sure about the rest! :rolleyes::)
thank you!:)
 
Sorry but have to angrily post again to NP you have posted about it being morally wrong for ponies being transported abroad and shot to make handbags when they can be shot here ha bloody ha why instead of posting about horses in france cant you protest about the low grade ponies at the sales over here .

Should that not be more important now if i am wrong then correct me but is it because you make money from this trade that you have not posted to people to contact the whw about this trade that is just as despicable.
 
Getting people to stop breeding is never going to happen.
'Oh my pony is so pwitty and has a womb and Joe Bloggs says I can put his stallion on it for the price of a pint'.

Thats a loosing battle, might as well start a fight you have a chance in.
 
Trinity Fox said:
Sorry but have to angrily post again to NP you have posted about it being morally wrong for ponies being transported abroad and shot to make handbags when they can be shot here ha bloody ha why instead of posting about horses in france cant you protest about the low grade ponies at the sales over here .

Should that not be more important now if i am wrong then correct me but is it because you make money from this trade that you have not posted to people to contact the whw about this trade that is just as despicable.
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I think you got the wrong end of the stick here... those were ponies from low end sales here, that's the whole point - they get sold here for peanuts, get shipped over to France (illegally), sold at a sale there and shipped over to Italy to be made into a handbag. The fact they make a handbag is not particularly wrong as such, the fact that they have to endure several hours or even days of transport in poor conditions is.
 
Trinity Fox said:
Sorry but have to angrily post again to NP you have posted about it being morally wrong for ponies being transported abroad and shot to make handbags when they can be shot here ha bloody ha why instead of posting about horses in france cant you protest about the low grade ponies at the sales over here .

Should that not be more important now if i am wrong then correct me but is it because you make money from this trade that you have not posted to people to contact the whw about this trade that is just as despicable.
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When they are dead, they are dead. Do it here, where we can regulate it and make sure it is done as quickly and humanely as possible, or load them on a lorry, travel them across the continent, alive, for days, without having any say how they are transported, treated or dispatched, which is 'better'?
 
Trinity Fox said:
Sorry but have to angrily post again to NP you have posted about it being morally wrong for ponies being transported abroad and shot to make handbags when they can be shot here ha bloody ha why instead of posting about horses in france cant you protest about the low grade ponies at the sales over here .

Should that not be more important now if i am wrong then correct me but is it because you make money from this trade that you have not posted to people to contact the whw about this trade that is just as despicable.
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I thought this thread was about live export? :confused:
 
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