Think I may have taken on too much too soon

[9tails]

Hi,

I have no other yard so to speak to go to, I work full time and don't have time to travel far everyday plus I do like the yard I'm at I just need more help. When he turns his bum on me it's when he has a rug on in a morning and I grab the front and pull him round, it's when I'm changing his rug to put him out that the nibbling starts and ears back, the other owners down the yard are never down there that early but I have to be to go to work in time so he does have to be put out on his own for sometime till the other people turn there horses out. He wasn't getting daily ridden at the old yard but with me he has turn out during the day and has plenty of space, he doesn't seem to energised as when I put him in the field he doesn't run or prance off he's quite relaxed but he just seems to want to walk on me he respects my space and doesn't turn his bum towards me when I get him out the yard only when he's in the stable and the nibbling is always on a morning. I'm getting so fed up I thought owning a horse would be enjoyment and riding but it's so much hard work and early mornings and for what a horse that try's it on all the time

Elbows. Use your elbow to keep him out of your space if he comes into it. In the chest, on the shoulder.

Mine nibbles, she nibbles every morning and I've embraced it as part of her character. She doesn't hurt though as she's learnt that if she catches me I make loads of noise and it frightens her. She's a fidget for rugs but we work around it, I stand still and she walks about, the rug gets thrown on and as she's walking around I straighten it on the moving target.

 

[blackbeauty86]

Elbows. Use your elbow to keep him out of your space if he comes into it. In the chest, on the shoulder.

Mine nibbles, she nibbles every morning and I've embraced it as part of her character. She doesn't hurt though as she's learnt that if she catches me I make loads of noise and it frightens her. She's a fidget for rugs but we work around it, I stand still and she walks about, the rug gets thrown on and as she's walking around I straighten it on the moving target.

Reminds me of my boy.....doing circles whilst trying to straighten the rug! The things we love them for!

 

[Dexter]

Whereabouts in North Yorkshire? If I'm close enough I'm more than happy to come and give you some pointers

 

[9tails]

I am such an animal lover and love all animals but can't stand animals that think there better than there owner

PS Don't get a cat!

 

[Jesstickle]

Bless you. It does sound like you just need a helping hand. It must be really hard being totally on your own so early on to the horse game! They can be little monkeys when it comes to testing you out. Why not try and get some help on the ground, either from an instructor or from one of the people who have offered on here (I have come to learn over my time here that if someone on the forum offers help they usually mean it so don't feel bad taking them up on it!) for a little while and reassess how you feel in a few weeks. If you still want to sell then it is entirely up to you. I only suggest you try and work out what he's up to first incase it is an easy fix so that you don't end up regretting selling him

Good luck whatever you do. It'll work out in the end

 

[Spotsrock]

nipping when you do his rugs = doing them wrong. either they may not fit or you are tugging forward which hurts as his fur gets all pulled wrong. Get some help please, you sound inexperienced and your horse is trying to talk to you. You need an interpreter.

 

[blackbeauty86]

nipping when you do his rugs = doing them wrong. either they may not fit or you are tugging forward which hurts as his fur gets all pulled wrong. Get some help please, you sound inexperienced and your horse is trying to talk to you. You need an interpreter.

It doesn't necessarily mean she's doing them wrong "/ I had a mare that hated her rugs being done and looked like she would take your face off, but I wasn't doing them wrong.

Some horses are extra sensitive, and some don't like being fussed over. I think she's having a hard enough time as it is without being told she's doing his rugs wrong. I agree she needs help but give her a chance.

 

[*hic*]

Digger66, don't worry, I wouldn't be offended nor would she. Although she has come through PC up to getting her B test and has obviously learnt the PC way of doing things she has enough experience with our own difficult and / or quirky horses to know that there's more than one way to get the result you need but that calm and effective is always required.

Carolina - as jesstickle said, people offering help are in nearly all cases making a genuine offer so do feel free to take them up on their offers.

btw, even if you decide to sell you may need someone to help you handle the horse unless you are prepared to put him on selling livery somewhere.

Best of luck though, whatever you decide.

 

[NeverSayNever]

nipping when you do his rugs = doing them wrong. either they may not fit or you are tugging forward which hurts as his fur gets all pulled wrong. Get some help please, you sound inexperienced and your horse is trying to talk to you. You need an interpreter.

or it could be plain and simple like many other horses, he is associating his rugs going on with being turned out and nibbles/nudges with anticipation. Rude yes, but not necessarily something the OP is doing wring.

 

[9tails]

nipping when you do his rugs = doing them wrong. either they may not fit or you are tugging forward which hurts as his fur gets all pulled wrong. Get some help please, you sound inexperienced and your horse is trying to talk to you. You need an interpreter.

Ooh, come and show me how to do mine! As blackbeauty86 says, some horses really don't like their well fitting rugs and would prefer to believe that they're hairy natives even if they're fully clipped wimpy warmbloods.

 

[Queenbee]

Elbows. Use your elbow to keep him out of your space if he comes into it. In the chest, on the shoulder.

Mine nibbles, she nibbles every morning and I've embraced it as part of her character. She doesn't hurt though as she's learnt that if she catches me I make loads of noise and it frightens her. She's a fidget for rugs but we work around it, I stand still and she walks about, the rug gets thrown on and as she's walking around I straighten it on the moving target.

And do you know the absolutely bizzare, stir crazy, nutty thing about owning horses? Its that I just read this post and it was so bloody familiar it was like I had written it, and instead of the frustration all I could feel was adoration for my mare who if a total fidget over rugs and my gelding who loves to nibble, in the end OP you really do end up loving that part of them, because it makes them who they are

I also bet, that if you scratched his bum cheeks, just where the tail meets them alongside the dock his ears wouldn't stay pinned back for long, it would be like 7th heaven for him

 

[*hic*]

I also bet, that if you scratched his bum cheeks, just where the tail meets them alongside the dock his ears wouldn't stay pinned back for long, it would be like 7th heaven for him

Up until the time I got my new boy I'd have agreed with you on that. Now I would never advise anyone to try it out without caution. The poor lad was absolutely horrified.

 

[Emilieu]

I'm beginning to resent him and feel like I've taken on too much, no one down my livery yard is ever around to ask questions or help and I just feel so in-experienced it's really getting me down.

Does anyone else feel like this or had this? ?

Carolina I am quite a new horse owner too and have definately felt what you are feeling. One night i just couldn't stop crying because i thought i was going to ruin him if i kept him :'( its awful and i really feel for you. Luckily there are lots of helpful people at my yard who gave me tips and pointers and it has really really helped my confidence. I would accept the kind help being offered on here before making any final decisions - or even in the meantime as it will help him to go to a good home if you do decide to sell. I would also really recommend the Kelly Marks book 'Perfect Partners' which helped me a great deal. Hope things improve for you x

 

[Ladylina83]

Some really good advice and I will echo the tie up when rugging remark as my horse likes to do the rounds of her stable when I tack up and nips my bum when I do her girth, always has done - she's just being a grump there is nothing wrong with her.

I'm not sure that selling him is the best idea as I think you can learn lots from these challenges - believe me we ALL have days when we want to give up.

I have 2 suggestions

1. go on a BHS owners course - you will learn a lot about the every day stuff and can ask questions as you go and be dealing with lots of different horses which will build your confidence no end.

2. If you are dead set on selling put him on sales livery - do not try and sell him yourself as you won't get your money back bing scared, slightly novice and desperate does not a good presentation make. Plus this time of year is shocking for sales.

I found this place (1st one that came up on Google) but this is what you should be looking for http://www.farmviewhalllivery.co.uk/Livery.htm I have had my mare for YEARS but recently bringing her back into work I felt I needed a little bit of help, it isn't a bad thing. it just might be slightly more than you are paying now but the prices are on the nose for what I would pay to give you a guide. If they are on livery you won't need to go twice a day - or even every day in some cases and it would offer you the support you need in these early days. Plus you would have indoor and outdoor facilities to enable you to work together

The other bonus is no mucking out lol not that everything is included in these prices too

 

[BillyBob-Sleigh]

I also bet, that if you scratched his bum cheeks, just where the tail meets them alongside the dock his ears wouldn't stay pinned back for long, it would be like 7th heaven for him

Haha my boy did this in the stable the first couple of days I had him - everytime I went in his stable I was presented with his bum which was a bit disconcerting with a new horse, but he was asking for his bum to be scratched! He gets so into the "zone" when his bum is scratched that he nearly falls over

 

[eatmoremincepies]

Please please contact Sarah Dent at Gallabar Farm near Boroughbridge - she will show you how to have your horse behave well (and safely) without scaring him or making him head shy. She can teach you how to understand the "questions" he is asking you (that's what the nibbling and turning his quarters on you is about) and show you how to answer his questions in a way that makes sense to him, improves his happiness and behaviour, and makes you feel like you understand and love horses again.

Honestly, just give her a call for advice and perhaps she can come and see you for a lesson. It's not expensive and will make all the difference. She's lovely and a great laugh, and super-experienced in getting horses and owners on the same page.

http://www.gallabarfarm.co.uk/aboutus.htm
(most of the website is about starting horses but she does lots of situations like yours too.) Good luck.

 

[Carolina24]

It doesn't necessarily mean she's doing them wrong "/ I had a mare that hated her rugs being done and looked like she would take your face off, but I wasn't doing them wrong.

Some horses are extra sensitive, and some don't like being fussed over. I think she's having a hard enough time as it is without being told she's doing his rugs wrong. I agree she needs help but give her a chance.

thanks for the back up here - I aren't doing his rugs wrong I have been shown how to put a rug on and have the right size rugs for him, I quite agree extra criticism isn't going to help here just make me feel more of a failure than I feel already

 

[maree t]

Sorry to hear that you arent enjoying having a horse. I think the most important thing you have to decide is wether you want to go to the effort of trying to work it out or not. Horses are damn hard work especially at this time of year.
If your heart isnt in it then moving him on would be best for him in the long run. I dont hear anything from you that cant be worked through but you have to want to do it. Is there a local riding club near you that you could join?
Please dont think that your horse doesnt like you he is trying you out to see where he can get and then feeling like he has got to be the herd leader. Try reading some richard maxwell or kelly marks for some ideas.
Good luck

 

[Ellies_mum2]

My youngster does this Loves her bum being scratched Although the first time she did it I thought she was going to kick so put my hand out to push her away and she froze and moved slightly so my hand was in the right position for scratching. Its now a part of our routine I scratch her bum and she gives me very gentle kisses



Having horses is a learning curve, a flipping steep one at times but the rewards are fab as is the feeling of achievement when you have worked through a problem and got it right. Hang in there and take up any offers of help you have and you will enjoy your horse again


Good luck

 

[blackbeauty86]

thanks for the back up here - I aren't doing his rugs wrong I have been shown how to put a rug on and have the right size rugs for him, I quite agree extra criticism isn't going to help here just make me feel more of a failure than I feel already

You're very welcome, I don't agree when people throw blame around when they don't know you! You aren't a failure at all, you're just going through a tough time and its nice to see you've turned to look for help, its the first step!

I would snap up all the offers as you have nothing to loose. Everything is worth a try when you feel rock bottom.

Good luck! I hope it all works out!

 

[Naryafluffy]

Do you tie your horse up when you change his rug? If not tie a small loop of baler twine to the tie ring and then tie the head collar rope to that. This will stop him being able to turn round and nibble you. If he tries, growl at him in a cross voice.
Then find some one local to help you - to teach you how to control him and to understand when he's frightened, or in pain, or bullying you. Ask the yard owner or a local saddler or farrier for a recommended contact. My preference is to pay a professional for help - having had similar problems in the past IMO it is usually worth the expense.
It will be worth doing this even if you decide to sell because you'll get a better price/easier sale if you can show you can handle him.

cross posted with Jemima_too
Saying I prefer to get a pro I didn't mean J's daughter help should be turned down! Just don't let one of the other liveries bully your horse for a while and leave you with more problems.

thanks for the back up here - I aren't doing his rugs wrong I have been shown how to put a rug on and have the right size rugs for him, I quite agree extra criticism isn't going to help here just make me feel more of a failure than I feel already

As other people have said, tie him up for his rugs, we've got a few that get tied up for different reasons, one's very grumpy and would take a chunk, the others are too impatient to get out and fidget constantly meaning you take twice as long to put the things on, so it's easier just to clip them up.
Please don't give up and let the people on here that have offered to come and visit help, you'll find once you've found the buttons to press you'll have an even better relationship with the horse because of what you've over come, my first pony I got when I was a teenager was a little toad to be ridden and very stubborn, but after we had worked through this (tytpical highland pony, sharp smack and few sharper words that I probably shouldn't have known at that age and he backed down) he was a brilliant pony.
My current mare is brilliant on the ground now and the kids can handle her no problem, but when I first got her she would try it on with everyone just to see what she could get away with, as someone else has said elbows are your friend and if I slapped her it was always on the neck/shoulder never the face.
Think about them like children (without the smacking!!!) they will take the proverbial mile if allowed, you've kind of got to demand respect (especially from the more native types).
What about at weekends is there anyone on the yard that you could speak to, or speak to the YO see if she can recommend anyone to give you a steer on things, you'll probably find that the YO wouldn't mind helping, it's not like your asking for an hour every night, just 5min here and there, maybe her being there whilst you're rugging up would just give you a confidence boost that you need.
From your original post he doesn't sound particulary nasty, maybe just a bit pushy and knows that he can push you (they are very good at training us even when we are not quite as good at training them).
Good Luck, keep us updated.

 

[Bertolie]

Carolina, please dont feel that you shouldn't be owning a horse because of the problems you are encountering. I have been a horse owner now for 4 years and was a complete novice when I first bough my cob. Even now, every time I go into his paddock he will have his ears pinned back - I just laugh at my grumpy boy, give him a scratch and ignore the ears! He will nibble at me in the mornings but I take that as his way of 'loving' me and think its really sweet! His manners can still leave a lot to be desired on occasions (something that I am still working on!) but he does try to take the pee with me (because he knows I am a softie!) and thinks he can get away with things with me that he couldn't do with others - he's a pussycat with my daughter!

Accept the help that people are offering you. Spend time on the ground bonding with your boy and read, read, read! I even did a home learning course on basic stable management because I didn't think I knew enough. It gave me the confidence to do the everyday things with my lad, but I am always asking advice from other people and accepting their help.

Dont write off horse ownership just yet - yes there are times when it can be hard, but the rewards far outweigh the bad times.

 

[tess1]

well I thought if a horse was already schooled and ridden before I bought it that I would be able to get on and ride it, I didn't realise it would spook at nothing all the time and that my only support at the yard would leave and then I'd be left to my own devices. I thought the horse would like me and realise I'm looking after it and will love it and spend time with it. I didn't think it would challenge eveyr action I make, pin its ears back and hate me, the girl I get to ride for me sometimes is a great rider and she has no problems with me so I think he actually doesn't like me, I am such an animal lover and love all animals but can't stand animals that think there better than there owner I would never mis-treat an animal or give up on it but I'm scared of it starting to get worse and before I know it I'll get kicked or dumped or something, why do you people do this for a hobbie when they give nothing back! sorry I know your not digging at me but seriously as a novice I never realised how much forgiveness is needed

If this is how you feel then I think it would be better for the horse if you sold him. He is an animal, and he is acting like one. Your main problem is that you have taken all his behaviour 'personally' - he is simply responding to your behaviour. You need to get control of your emotions, and respond to your horse calmly, and with some empathy for him - you can be sure that he is not doing all of this just to 'take the pee' - there are always reasons why horses respond the way they do - as the brains in the parternship it is up to the human to figure out what is going wrong, and how best to address the issues - he can't change if you don't.

His behaviour is not serious, but you sound genuinely afraid of him, so I would agree with the title, I think you have taken on too much. If you cannot find another yard and/or find a good instructor and/or get some help with ground work and handling then it is better to admit that and sell the current horse. Then, if you are still interested in horses, go and learn about them, about their behaviour and how to handle them. Or go and ride occasionally at a riding centre where the horse is given to you tacked up and someone else does all the hard work, if you do not feel that you are cut out for horse ownership - there is no shame in admitting that it is not for you. If you are in this state now, you will never survive a winter of mud, rain, snow, ice and freezing temperatures - and your horse will suffer having to endure your negative emotions. Capable of the complex human emotions you have ascribed to him, he may not be, but by god he will be picking up on how you feel about him and it will be making him even more stressed and anxious. My sympathies lie with the horse - you can change the situation, he can't.

 

[Booboos]

You have taken on an animal whose species you know very little about. What he is doing would hardly be worth mentioning as a problem, but his behaviour is overwhelming you because you are completely at a loss as to how to handle him. You have two choices:
1. Learn. Get an instructor to give you handling lessons, go on a BHS course, find a sharer or friend to help you out.
2. Sell the horse. To even manage this you will need to pay for sales livery, but ask around for recommendations before you part with any money.

Sorry if this sounds harsh but you are looking after a living animal and if you are frustrated with him, imagine how frustrated he is with you!

 

[Suzie86]

A few things to bear in mind

Having a horse at this time of year can be crappy. I also work full time so I get up at 6am to go and turn out and muck out before a good hours commute to be in work for 9, then finish at 5.30 and get to the yard to bring in and ride, then put to bed around 6.30. We have a school so I can ride/lunge through the week in the winter - does your yard not have a school? Even if it doesn't spend the weekday evenings doing groundwork and loads of grooming to bond with your horse, then do your riding at the weekends. You have all summer to have lovely evening hacks but this time of year can be hard!!

Some horses can just be a bit grumpy about certain things in the stable. Yours sounds like he just has the normal type of little quirks that all horses have! Make sure you tie him up when you change rugs etc so he can't turn around or nip you.

Maybe horse ownership isn't something you can commit to yet - perhaps if you do sell him it would be good to find a nice share horse that you could ride a couple of times a week without the pressure of ownership?

Good luck, I hope you get something sorted

 

[Queenbee]

Up until the time I got my new boy I'd have agreed with you on that. Now I would never advise anyone to try it out without caution. The poor lad was absolutely horrified.

Sorry but I absolutely peed myself reading that, I can just imagine the shock horror on your lads face

Ben and Ebony love it though, and OP most horse do, Jemima too's is just strange

 

[Bigginge]

Ok, I'm going to be completely honest and say yes I think you have taken on too much too soon and if you're not prepared to change your situation then you should sell him.

That was the short answer, the long answer, if you can be bothered to read it is....Horses are complex creatures, behaviourally and physically, they have strong instincts but they are also the most fascinating animals, which is why we love them and can spend hours talking and reading about them and justify spending so much money on them. Building a relationship with your horse takes a minimum of 6 months and IMO isn't really cemented for at least a year, and even then it continually develops and needs work. They are hard work, they are frustrating at times, they are not machines, they will react to you and to things around them. The reward for all that is this big strong instinctive animal working with you, carrying you, whinnying to you in the morning (ok I know he just wants his breakfast ) I can't even put into words how amazing I think they are and that's why we do it.

After 20 odd years with them I am still learning, I still have lessons and I still ask for advice.

To be blunt, you are very inexperienced with horses, it's like learning the alphabet and then trying to read war and peace, I'm not having a go but it is no wonder you can't appreciate it.

It does not mean that with experience you couldn't be a great horsewoman and feel the love we all do for this ridiculous hobby! Anyone on here or another internet forum could give you a hundred reasons for why your horse might be acting the way he is, the difference between a scared, aggressive, confused, mildly mischievous or just normal horse aren't that huge. We all base our perceptions on our experiences and you will have limited knowledge of what is 'normal' and what isn't, before we even get onto the ways in which your horse may or may not need to be handled, which again needs experience (and the confidence that comes with it) to implement, it is far from just being about "showing them who is boss".

You sound like a caring owner who wants to get things right and believe it or not I have been in a simiilar position. You have two options, either get some help, by either moving to a new yard where you can be on part livery or have sympathetic support or have someone come out to you. You don't just have to have lessons in riding there are plenty of instructors (or try googling Kelly Marks RA) who will help you with handling and can offer you advise on feeding, worming and everything else that comes under stable management and read as much as you possibly can. The 2nd option is to sell your horse, go and have some more lessons over the winter at a good riding school, see if they'll let you hang around (H&S permitting) observe how the horses behave and are handled, make some friends and see if they will start to let you help out a bit.

I wish you the best of luck with whatever you decide and hope that you find some way to keep these beautiful animals in your life so you can really appreciate how amazing they are.

 

[Queenbee]

thanks for the back up here - I aren't doing his rugs wrong I have been shown how to put a rug on and have the right size rugs for him, I quite agree extra criticism isn't going to help here just make me feel more of a failure than I feel already

Carolina,

You will find that there are a lot of very experienced people on here who at one time or another have had their self confidence knocked by a new horse, you are not alone in this, I honestly could not recount to you the sheer amount of times I suffered heartbreak, tears, self doubt and falls with ebony, I really did not think that I was going to be able to be the best for her and would have sold her had it not been for my fear that she could have ended up in the wrong hands and a worse mindset, for that I would have rathered keep her in a field for life. I am so very very glad that I stuck with her through thick and thin, I now have every thing I ever dreamed of in her and absolute faith and confidence in her, do I completely trust her... no, I would never completely trust a horse, they can hurt you without malice, the day you give complete trust is the day things go wrong. But it is worth it and I am sure that with a bit of external hands on support you will begin to enjoy your horse and cherish him, your bond will grow and the irritations will be what you could never see yourself living without

 

[caroline23]

i haven't had time to read through all of post so sorry if this has already been suggested, but could you maybe get an RA out? from intelligent horsemanship? they will be able to teach you how to handle him with confidence and any issues you have with him on the ground?

 

[Suechoccy]

Carolina, I feel for you. We've all been there with our first horses, when the honeymoon period's over, and we're on our own, and winter/dark days arrive, and we get those horrible OMG negative he's-too-good-for-me, I-will-ruin-him, I-will-get-injured feelings.

And winter esp run-up through Nov-Dec is always a bad time for anyone looking after horses - it's dark, cold, mud, ice, frost, hay and mucking out, you go to bed dreaming of poopickers and wheelbarrows and wondering what happened to those lovely carefree days where you just turn up, tack up and ride in the sunshine!

Accept it's natural to have a phase of eeebeejeebees and then work on ways to move forward so you can cope with these feelings and "put the monkey back in the cage" as the British Cycling team coaches say to the Olympic cyclists whenever they have selfdoubts.

A few practical things:

1. When you arrive at yard, give him a haynet and tie him up. This will both absorb him and keep his mouth away from you. If you prefer too, and if it's not pelting rain, do both these things outside the stable so that you have more working room around him. Then change his rugs, pick his feet, whatever.

2. Ears back mean many things - means "I'm hungry" "why are you late" "why are you tense?" "why are you nervous" "I'm going to ignore you" "don't touch me" but never necessarily "I hate you, I'm gonna kill you." Ears back is part of his expression range. Grin and laugh and say "awww, put them up!" whenever he does it, and that will relax you and you being relaxed will make him relaxed.

3. Dress for success. Always. Esp on your own. Stout boots or shoes. Hat. Warm and waterproof clothes if weather's crap. Gloves if leading him anywhere. Keep gloves in your pocket so they're handy.

4. Winter's a crappy time for riding. Many of us only ride at weekends in winter, maybe one midweek lunge or school session, often not. You've not had him long. Treat your winter evenings as Special Time with him to get to know each other. So after the chores, spend half-hour just brushing him, chatting to him, plait his mane and tail and then unplait them, give him a good scratch along his neck or bum and find his tiggly bits and laugh when he pulls faces and then backs his arse towards you in a friendly way for a bigger, better scratch.

5. Read some books on horse behaviour. There's lots out there. Richard Maxwell, Mark Rashid, etc. Understand that your horse does not think like a human and so you shouldnt judge him by human standards.

6. Spend time just being with your horse, watch hhim, draw him, photo him, get to know him.

Then when spring comes, you and he will have a lovely relationship and be ready to ride and do whatever you've planned to do with him.

ENJOY him!!