Thoughts on this hind lameness

[poiuytrewq]

This is NOT my horse and I'm not riding it, I'm just really quite intrigued as to what's going on with him.

Slightly lame in front and always has been so it a very light hack. He gets a sachet of bute a day and hacks out seemingly very happily. Ears always pricked, really marches out completely off his own back.
I'd noticed a slight hind toe drag on occasion, he wears his shoes pretty dramatically!
Recently he seems to have lost a hind leg a few times. Nothing major just a weird moment, over before it started.
Today he did it several times and imo far worse than usual, he also toe dragged a lot but very severely down hill. It was pretty awful, as in if he'd been like that on the flat i think transport home would have been needed. Fine up hill.
Stifle?

 

[Hormonal Filly]

Is there supposed to be a video attached?

 

[Zoeypxo]

I imagine theres a multitude of issues and compensation going on if hes been lame infront for a long time, do they know why?
And yes was there supposed to be a video?

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

Arthritis often causes a leg to appear like it gives way.

 

[Tiddlypom]

Remember the mantra ‘lameness leads to lameness’.

As he’s been long term lame in front it could be one or several of any number of compensatory issues. Or a whole separate issue rearing its head.

Presumably the horse won’t be ridden again, or at all, until checked over by a vet?

 

[poiuytrewq]

No sorry no video.
It is like it just buckles under him but then he's absolutely fine again a second later.

 

[poiuytrewq]

I imagine theres a multitude of issues and compensation going on if hes been lame infront for a long time, do they know why?
And yes was there supposed to be a video?

As far as i know it was looked into but nothing found

Remember the mantra ‘lameness leads to lameness’.

As he’s been long term lame in front it could be one or several of any number of compensatory issues. Or a whole separate issue rearing its head.

Presumably the horse won’t be ridden again, or at all, until checked over by a vet?

No idea to be honest. I didn't ask.

 

[Tiddlypom]

As far as i know it was looked into but nothing found

No idea to be honest. I didn't ask.

You’ll have reported it back to the owners, though?

 

[poiuytrewq]

You’ll have reported it back to the owners, though?

The owner was riding it. I just happened to be riding behind at the time.

 

[Tiddlypom]

Ah, ok sorry, you did say in your OP that you weren’t riding him .

Let’s hope that the owner gets a vet in.

It doesn’t sound trivial.

 

[Zoeypxo]

Mine toe drags behind down steep hills when her hocks need topping up, mild arthritis.
Stifles present similarly. It could be either, or both.

 

[poiuytrewq]

Ah, ok sorry, you did say in your OP that you weren’t riding him .

Let’s hope that the owner gets a vet in.

It doesn’t sound trivial.

I wasn't no, but I feel like it's worrying me more than her!

 

[Zoeypxo]

I wasn't no, but I feel like it's worrying me more than her!

Does the rider not notice or just think its normal?

 

[Sprogladite01]

My gelding (the one in my avatar) did this, he had chronic bilateral PSD in his hinds which led to lameness in the front - although he presented with lameness in the back end first. That being said, he was so equally lame in the back legs that he didn't actually **look** particularly lame until he went for a workup because I thought he was off (3 different vets agreed - one told me he had an attitude problem!), but couldn't identify what was wrong. I ended up losing him about a year later after an extensive rehab journey which ultimately failed.

 

[Highmileagecob]

Any idea how old the horse is, or whether he is shod?

Apologies - read ir properly, yes he is shod.

 

[poiuytrewq]

Does the rider not notice or just think its normal

Well of course she knows he’s not 100% hence being on bute and only in light work.
This was the first time it’s been “oh shi%”
Previously he’s looked maybe like he stood on a stone or just had the odd stumble, but it was starting to be too often to be just one of those things, then this today.

 

[oldie48]

I don't think it's unusual for a bilaterally lame horse behind to show some degree of lameness in front. It's all about compensation. I'd look at hocks first.

 

[Gloi]

I'm another who would suspect arthritis in hocks or fetlocks.

 

[ycbm]

Thoughts on this hind lameness

My thoughts are that your friend is far from alone in riding an obviously lame horse and stuff like this is making me increasingly unhappy at the thought that we ride horses at all.

In retrospect, with what I know now, I've done it myself in the (not recent) past.
.

 

[santas_spotty_pony]

The owner was riding it. I just happened to be riding behind at the time.

we have one that does this - very occasionally now and if he does it’s usually downhill. His was caused by underdevelopment of the muscle around the stifle. With correct schooling and hill work it has sorted itself but it always returns if he has lots of time off and drops some muscle.

 

[LEC]

My experience would say bilaterally lame behind which would be causing the lameness in front. The diagonal hind to front limb lameness will be the bigger issue though. My starting point would be to scan the suspensorys, then to look at stifles and hocks. If it’s still showing up on bute then unlikely to be hocks. You will often find changes in that front foot though and I suspect feet will be telling a story through shape and collapsed heels.

 

[Goldenstar]

It’s probably hock arthritis that’s what normally causes that leg giving way thing but it could be lots of other things as well .

 

[poiuytrewq]

Up til now he’s always looked ok behind, I’d say weak but I guess with an already dodgy front end it can be deceiving at to what else is going on.
He has had time off over winter, it’s just since aiming back that the occasional hind stumble happened so maybe that’s part of it.

It reminded me a lot of a horse I had who one day was suddenly crippled behind trotting home. That turned out to be stifle

 

[Fransurrey]

Could be anything from the ground up. PSD, old tendon injury, hock arthritis, luxating patella...

My thoughts would be that this horse shouldn't be ridden. My mare is on bute and seems fine at the moment (she's the one who was pretty lame before Christmas), but that's because we're masking the symptoms, not curing the problem. In the case of this horse, he's clearly still lame on bute. Time to get off and either call it a day now, or give him a few weeks 'retirement' while she comes to terms with it.

 

[Highmileagecob]

What do his feet look like?

 

[Tiddlypom]

Was the front end lameness ever properly diagnosed?

As others have said, a horse that looks off in front may actually be lame behind.

 

[Love]

The cause of my gelding's front right lameness was him compensating for the mild arthritis starting in his hocks. He had also started to toe drag behind. Both cured now that his hocks have been medicated. Something similar going on in your friends horse would be up there on my list of suspicions

 

[suestowford]

There is a pony here who does this and it's down to arthritis. He has it in all four legs so it's a lottery which leg will give way. He's no longer ridden.

 

[dorsetladette]

My gelding (the one in my avatar) did this, he had chronic bilateral PSD in his hinds which led to lameness in the front - although he presented with lameness in the back end first. That being said, he was so equally lame in the back legs that he didn't actually **look** particularly lame until he went for a workup because I thought he was off (3 different vets agreed - one told me he had an attitude problem!), but couldn't identify what was wrong. I ended up losing him about a year later after an extensive rehab journey which ultimately failed.

Yep my old lad presented similarly to this. Arthritis in hocks caused weight over front end which eventually caused knee issues (I believe) medicated hocks improved slightly but still toe dragging behind. Oddly it was his knees which used to give way more than his hocks and again sometimes felt more of a trip and over before it started. He's no longer with us, which is probably a good thing and he took the decision away from us about when the 'time' was right.

 

[poiuytrewq]

Feet look ok, as above he wears shoes like you’d not believe but Is done regularly by a decent farrier
Various combos of different shoes/pads have been tried to help.
Last owners investigated front lameness, found nothing (no idea what they did) so sold on as a light hack. Then he was actually sound, about 2-3 yrs ago.
The front lameness came on after maybe a treat, very slight but noticeable in trot, I’d guess 2 maybe 3/10.
I quite agree on lameness masking lameness. I’ve. Been through all the very weird souls destroying investigations with my own.