To Stallion or not to Stallion...

[HedgePig]

Hello and thank you in advance for reading this post and to those who are willing to reply. Thanks.

A little background. I grew up riding horses, from about the age of 7 and kept at it right through uni. In fact to pay my way through university I worked on a yearling stud breaking horses in. I have never considered myself a particularly technical rider, in fact 75% of the terms I see and hear used are lost on me, but I know I have a good seat and have always loved and enjoyed horses. Over the years I have owned almost exclusively thoroughbreds, with one Hanoverian. As such I hope I don't appear to know much at all and am approaching this topic with a great deal of caution and a healthy dose of common sense. I hope.

I haven't ridden for about 20 years. Well other than the occasional holiday hack on a beach. My gf on the other hand IS a technical rider. Owns her own Spanish PRE and has had instruction every weekend in all the years I have known her. I am always genuinely impressed with her technical knowledge and her ability to get horses to do the clever stuff. I began to put feelers out about 2 months ago with a view to getting my own horse. As such I have been very, very impressed with the Baroque horses. They seem (generally) hardy and sound, they seem loyal and affectionate for the most part and they all seem to move beautifully. A game changer for me was going to a PRE specific event where I quite literally (I hate people who overuse the word literally by the way) had my mind blown. STALLIONS!?! EVERYWHERE!?! In amongst mares, geldings, lining up for awards, doing shows! Noise! Music! Lights! Drums! STALLIONS?!? All perfectly behaved! Even stalled right next to 'strange' mares and not a peep out of them?!

Remember my background. Stallions were demons. Stallions are kept behind steel bars on the other side of the farm, infrequently in pairs but never in a herd. Ever! They were breeding machines, pure spunk and testosterone, brought out by several handlers with chain leads for the singular purpose of covering a mare and then lead back into the distance. Anyone who has seen a 17hh stallion covering needs their head read if they actually thought about riding one! That was my experience. I was young, that was just how it was done at the stud. Stallions were 'wild'.

So here I am, sitting at this show, with as many as 8 or 9 of them just casually getting on with it! Was it the Spanish blood? WHAT WAS GOING ON?!? Young and old, ridden or in hand, in formation or solo they were impeccably behaved. Truly unbelievable. I was forced to evaluate my own obvious prejudices. Have I been wrong about stallions?

(This is turning into quite the story I apologise...I hope some of you are still with me)

Through my partners Spanish horse connection I made really good friends with one of the instructors, you know when you just hit it off with someone and you behave like you grew up together. Out of an obvious early need to be diplomatic I should err on the side of discretion and not provide too much detail, other than that he is a veteran rider/instructor from the Spanish School in Vienna. With international titles. We hang out often enough and enjoy a beer or 3.

Out of the blue last week, we were talking about something or another (he is trying to help me find a horse) and he described how he has been watching my gf and how she rides, how he feels he knows me well enough as an individual and personality and after some thought, he would like me to take ownership of his Lippizaner Stallion. *Thud*

Just like that.

I don't wish to speculate too wildly, but this is a horse from the Siglavy bloodline, has done several years of schooling and has been trained to perform Airs above ground. To anyone not familiar, this is a classical dressage discipline where the horse is trained to rear and jump and kick in the air. It is extraordinarily beautiful and complex.

I simply do not know what to do. I have this warped experience of stallions, embedded by years of something close to fear of them and now I have been gifted an extraordinary chance to own and ride something so exclusive I am speechless. To anyone still reading this, if you were in my position you would ABSOLUTELY be captured by the romance and thrill this opportunity represents. I would beg you to park any initial hot flush of envy you may have, if I were reading this myself I would probably quite naturally be judgemental initially. You have every right. What I am now asking for once the dust has settled is advice. Because every single one of us would take the time to do the assessment if you were given this chance.

Had I not seen the Spanish horses perform my reply would have been a reluctant but emphatic no. I must speak with my head and not my heart.
Next, this horse is WAY above my pay grade in ability. I am scared I would ruin him. The owner, however, has turned down offers over the years to buy him and is clear he believes I am right for his horse and he is currently not being used to his potential and that I will help him realise it. He believes this which compelled him to ask me.
BUT STALLIONS!?! I have outlined my fears above. I need some pragmatic, sensible advice on owning a stallion please. From livery (I don't have my own yard) to insurance to real world expectations about how he is likely to behave in a best and worst case scenario. Hacking out. Local shows. From the outside he is a well-mannered, exceedingly well trained athlete. But I am genuinely cautious.
We have seen him perform several times at shows and while its hardly conclusive he mixed well with other horses at the shows. We will be going to meet him in person this weekend.

So I would ask you. Give me as much advice as you are able. Tell me why you think I may (or may not) be an idiot for even thinking about it. As things stand right this second I have the time and the resources to see him every day and ensure he is well attended to. My friend has made a commitment to teach me all I need to know to continue his schooling, something he feels is not being done well enough at the moment. Hence the offer.

I don't need to state the obvious but these horses are 'priceless'. There is a framework agreement in place for an exchange but a quick Google of "Lippizaner for sale" and the numbers by comparison for a horse with none of the training he has had sound like monopoly numbers. He is 'around' 10 years old. So I am told all of his bad habits have come and gone.

So in closing can someone help us decide? Speaking last night my gf and I are probably about 50/50. Our main concern is that a horse of this calibre is going to be wasted on us. Thats not false modesty we just don't want to get it wrong. But, the owner wants us to have him. So we may be doing something right. I need to address my very real concerns about stallions and the serious negative stigma they have in my head. I go from feeling like a thrilled child at Christmas to sober about what the reality may mean that this really is just a dream that is not mine.

If you were me it would be criminal to not sit down and ask these questions. I hope to hear from you.
Hedge.

 

[Meowy Catkin]

I think that one of the most fundamental issues which you need to be able to answer is where will he be stabled? Do you have a livery yard near you that will livery a stallion and treat him as a horse with his welfare in mind?

If you don't have that, then there is no point in thinking about it any further.

 

[milliepops]

Was about to ask the same as faracat. I can't think of many yards round me that would accommodate a stallion. It's not impossible but many YOs either can't or won't make adjustments necessary to give them a good life.

That said a well trained stallion is just a well trained horse with nuts, as you saw with the PREs. if you keep up the correct handling then there's no reason why they can't be civilised. But I'd get use to other people expecting it to be an out of control sex-crazed animal.

 

[Orangehorse]

I know people who have bought Spanish or Portugese stallions, to become part of the UK fraternity - they have shows and competitions and clinics, so it is an active group of riders.
They both had their own land and facilities. The one I know best ended up having the horse gelded.

I don't know how the system works abroad, I think I would want to know much more about the management and lifestyle they are used to.

I know there are some very quiet and well mannered stallions around, but I think to have a stallion on a livery yard where there is a changing population of horses, could be tricky.

 

[HedgePig]

I know people who have bought Spanish or Portugese stallions, to become part of the UK fraternity - they have shows and competitions and clinics, so it is an active group of riders.
They both had their own land and facilities. The one I know best ended up having the horse gelded.

I don't know how the system works abroad, I think I would want to know much more about the management and lifestyle they are used to.

I know there are some very quiet and well mannered stallions around, but I think to have a stallion on a livery yard where there is a changing population of horses, could be tricky.

The truth is for the moment I just don't know. I am told he is stabled on a yard. By extension I just assume this will be with/around other horses but I should have more to go on by the weekend. My sense is that he is very well socialised. With the obvious caveat that he is not a normal mare or gelding so his handling is done differently. I have seen him at shows in the warm-up arena where he is in amongst maybe 30 other horses. And he hasn't flinched. Again my own insecurity (if that's the right term) is that its down to the rider who is perhaps working his bütt off to keep him under control. But then I just don't know.

 

[Asha]

I have a very simplistic view , there are too many stallions. I personally don't understand why people want the hassle unless they intend to breed from them. I appreciate that in the right hands some are very well behaved. But theyd be equally well behaved without their nuts. Id also be questioning the owners motives. He/she may well be perfectly well intentioned. But the line ' ive been offered lots of money for him , but would rather you had him doesn't work with me.

So my advice for someone on livery would be get a gelding. Or get him gelded.

 

[HedgePig]

I have a very simplistic view , there are too many stallions. I personally don't understand why people want the hassle unless they intend to breed from them. I appreciate that in the right hands some are very well behaved. But theyd be equally well behaved without their nuts. Id also be questioning the owners motives. He/she may well be perfectly well intentioned. But the line ' ive been offered lots of money for him , but would rather you had him doesn't work with me.

So my advice for someone on livery would be get a gelding. Or get him gelded.

I appreciate your response even if its notably cynical. A lot of the nuance of the circumstances is lost in translation and perhaps its down to me that you have not picked up on it. I am not naive, I have owned horses for years. I have, however, never owned a stallion. Equally in this particular setting, if my aim was simply to take him on and geld him, would be perpendicular to the spirit of this animal and his line. A quick google of the bloodline of his stallion suggests that there is a distinct absence of his offspring or siblings in the UK so again perhaps you have misunderstood.

If your advice is a stallion is an unnecessary horse in the world today, that there is a glut of original Arab line Lippizaners in England then perhaps taking him on to simply hack off his nuts would be an answer. It is, however, not a helpful answer to me but thank you all the same.

 

[tiggipop]

well my thoughts (having a stallion of my own!) if you have this opinion of stallions being demons etc how on earth are you going to manage to handle one? mine is a total poppet, but is handled confidently, correctly and consistently and he KNOWS the boundaries.. He lives just as my geldings do, but I have my own property and therefore he gets daily turnout with other horses around him and is stabled along side them.

I understand that in this country not many livery yards can/will accommodate stallions, which is fine.

 

[HedgePig]

well my thoughts (having a stallion of my own!) if you have this opinion of stallions being demons etc how on earth are you going to manage to handle one? mine is a total poppet, but is handled confidently, correctly and consistently and he KNOWS the boundaries.. He lives just as my geldings do, but I have my own property and therefore he gets daily turnout with other horses around him and is stabled along side them.

I understand that in this country not many livery yards can/will accommodate stallions, which is fine.

Hi Tiggipop and thank you for your reply.
You're absolutely right. I have it wrong. Remember I was on a stud so my interactions were with stallions with one thing in mind. It has forced me to rethink all of this and if at the end of this thread I have 75 people telling me I am a fool and 25 saying its subjective but manageable, then I will take that advice in board and probably decline. I guess I am just ignorant. Not in a dumb-down way, I just simply do not know. Its a bit like you asking me if its a good idea to buy a helicopter (my job). Me being annoyed at you for asking the question isn't helpful, I must accept you just don't know. If the answer is its not enough to just do a poll on a forum to make a decision then I will take that on board and keep asking questions.
I have sent out messages to 3-4 local liveries to see what they say about keeping a stallion. If anything nearby is unwilling to take him I am not about to sell up and buy a farm just yet. (Even if I think its a lovely idea!)

Again thank you for your reply. Hedge.

 

[Auslander]

I appreciate your response even if its notably cynical. A lot of the nuance of the circumstances is lost in translation and perhaps its down to me that you have not picked up on it. I am not naive, I have owned horses for years. I have, however, never owned a stallion. Equally in this particular setting, if my aim was simply to take him on and geld him, would be perpendicular to the spirit of this animal and his line. A quick google of the bloodline of his stallion suggests that there is a distinct absence of his offspring or siblings in the UK so again perhaps you have misunderstood.

If your advice is a stallion is an unnecessary horse in the world today, that there is a glut of original Arab line Lippizaners in England then perhaps taking him on to simply hack off his nuts would be an answer. It is, however, not a helpful answer to me but thank you all the same.

Could you clarify - you would be taking him on as a riding horse, or to breed from - or both?
I like stallions, and have spent a lot of time working with them. Trained and handled with a bit of common sense, there's no reason that they can't live pretty normal lives. It only seems to be in the UK that people lose their heads about the presence of stallions

 

[Asha]

I appreciate your response even if its notably cynical. A lot of the nuance of the circumstances is lost in translation and perhaps its down to me that you have not picked up on it. I am not naive, I have owned horses for years. I have, however, never owned a stallion. Equally in this particular setting, if my aim was simply to take him on and geld him, would be perpendicular to the spirit of this animal and his line. A quick google of the bloodline of his stallion suggests that there is a distinct absence of his offspring or siblings in the UK so again perhaps you have misunderstood.

If your advice is a stallion is an unnecessary horse in the world today, that there is a glut of original Arab line Lippizaners in England then perhaps taking him on to simply hack off his nuts would be an answer. It is, however, not a helpful answer to me but thank you all the same.

I didn't reply to be unhelpful, I was merely responding to your post. You asked for opinions. I gave you mine. Good luck with him

 

[laura_nash]

As everyone is saying your biggest problem would be other peoples attitude and finding a good livery where people aren't going to be scared of him or blame any small problem on his being entire. You might find the higher-end competition yards are more used to stallions, or a yard that specialises in spanish types. Almost certainly it will make livery further away and / or more expensive. I have known a stallion on a livery yard and he was fine, but he was owned by the YO. The other stallions I've known, who were all fine and perfectly sane, were kept at home and turned out with company (usually a gelding / geldings, but one was out with a barren mare).

 

[Floofball]

How exciting for you! I echo Faracat in that you need to know you can give him a home first and foremost. I’d be ringing round now before I went to see him at the weekend.

 

[HedgePig]

Could you clarify - you would be taking him on as a riding horse, or to breed from - or both?
I like stallions, and have spent a lot of time working with them. Trained and handled with a bit of common sense, there's no reason that they can't live pretty normal lives. It only seems to be in the UK that people lose their heads about the presence of stallions

It's only as I know nothing about using stallions for breeding that my answer must be I don't know. My thinking then would be why keep him entire. But as I have said before it just 'feels' wrong to take ownership of him only to cut of his nuts simply because he MIGHT be more of a handful than the next horse. I have owned a few TB mares who would certainly have had their nuts removed if that was an option!

Certainly he would be for riding and showing. 100%. If there is a way to include breeding in his program assuming there is a demand then I would certainly be open to it. Though I must be clear up front I know only what I have learnt out and about over the years I am not someone to be considered well informed. I would be grateful for more of your thoughts please? Hedge.

 

[HedgePig]

As everyone is saying your biggest problem would be other peoples attitude and finding a good livery where people aren't going to be scared of him or blame any small problem on his being entire. You might find the higher-end competition yards are more used to stallions, or a yard that specialises in spanish types. Almost certainly it will make livery further away and / or more expensive. I have known a stallion on a livery yard and he was fine, but he was owned by the YO. The other stallions I've known, who were all fine and perfectly sane, were kept at home and turned out with company (usually a gelding / geldings, but one was out with a barren mare).

This a surprisingly helpful answer thank you. Pragmatic. Not emotional. Anecdotal. So thank you. It seems a lot of this comes down to the practical stabling of the horse. Nobody has commented on my other fears about him being out of my weight-class in ability. I have sent out a few messages to local liveries for their position on taking on a stallion.

 

[Orangehorse]

There are plenty of stallions who both breed and compete, and live "normal" existence with turnout, thinking about dressage horses, show jumpers and some ponies.

But I wonder if these are kept at the owner's yard, where they can control who comes and goes. I know many people say that their stallions are very quiet, but these are in a stable herd, I am guessing. I have also seen young stallions that have been perfectly OK at home, taken to a show and let their hormones take over and cause mayhem, and generally these have been gelded by the time they appear in public again.

But as you say OP, in Spain and Portugal all the horses are stallions, so what do we know?

 

[HedgePig]

How exciting for you! I echo Faracat in that you need to know you can give him a home first and foremost. I’d be ringing round now before I went to see him at the weekend.

Ha yes I am actually terribly excited. But trying REALLY hard to not be lead by the excitement of it. I have sent off a few messages to local liveries to see what they say. Watch this space.

 

[HedgePig]

There are plenty of stallions who both breed and compete, and live "normal" existence with turnout, thinking about dressage horses, show jumpers and some ponies.

But I wonder if these are kept at the owner's yard, where they can control who comes and goes. I know many people say that their stallions are very quiet, but these are in a stable herd, I am guessing. I have also seen young stallions that have been perfectly OK at home, taken to a show and let their hormones take over and cause mayhem, and generally these have been gelded by the time they appear in public again.

But as you say OP, in Spain and Portugal all the horses are stallions, so what do we know?

I guess some of this will become clearer as I spend more time with him. I am clearly frustrating many reading my replies by saying 'I don't know' all the time, suggesting I am poorly equipped to make this a success. But yes, stallions everywhere. Thank you again.

 

[The Fuzzy Furry]

I prefer stallions, have my own yard and a secure paddock or 2. I used to breed, plus also produce the boys too and consider myself ok to handle and work stallions. Some I turned out with geldings, one lived the other side of a fence from an old mare of mine. A couple had to be solo distant turnout.
.
However, because I enjoy popping to RC training and events, and meeting up with friends to ride as well as the odd comp and camp, its more practical for me to not have an entire, so I have 3 ladies.

I don't know of any livery yard near me that will have a stallion on the place bar one, which is a full livery comp yard.

Edited to add, despite my lads all being good to ride and handle, I did have issues with getting yard cover and also when out and about, due to peoples 'expectations' of a stallion......
If he's not going to cover, then get him cut.

 

[laura_nash]

Nobody has commented on my other fears about him being out of my weight-class in ability.

I guess I (and possibly others) aren't really clear on your fear on this one.

Are you worried you won't be good enough to ride him, as in you will be out-horsed and will be scared or in danger riding him? If so, that is really impossible to advise on via a forum and you would need to get someone who knows your riding (possibly your gf, NOT the person selling the horse) to advise and ideally see you riding him in a variety of different situations as per any other horse purchase.

If your worried about "wasting" him because you won't be able to train him to the same level as, say, his current owner then I wouldn't consider that at all. No horse cares about that stuff provided they enjoy their life. I used to share an ex-GP dressage horse who was owned by a farmers wife and used purely for hacking and he was perfectly happy and healthy, if that's what she wanted to do with him - she paid for him so nobody else's business.

 

[MrPerkins]

Nobody has commented on my other fears about him being out of my weight-class in ability. I have sent out a few messages to local liveries for their position on taking on a stallion.

I think this is something you'll get the most useful feedback about from the current owner. He's really the only person who can answer that for you. We can only offer the two most usual responses - 1) a horse doesn't miss what it doesn't do. Not competing to the level it *could* achieve isn't going to send it into the pits of depression. They just don't care about it the way we think. And 2) It is, however, possible to overhorse yourself.

I'd have a good chat with the owner. For one, find out WHY they have made this offer. As Asha maybe alluded to, it does sound a little strange - though not impossible, I'd want to really dig deep on that one. And also some guarantee that the owner is offering to remain in place as trainer and support network for you. I would presume so (otherwise why not sell him elsewhere?), but I'd want that reassurance.

I think if you can source livery, know you have the training and support in place, and have discussed with the owner what you would both like to see happen if things don't work out - then you'll be better set to make a decision.

 

[Auslander]

It's only as I know nothing about using stallions for breeding that my answer must be I don't know. My thinking then would be why keep him entire. But as I have said before it just 'feels' wrong to take ownership of him only to cut of his nuts simply because he MIGHT be more of a handful than the next horse. I have owned a few TB mares who would certainly have had their nuts removed if that was an option!

Certainly he would be for riding and showing. 100%. If there is a way to include breeding in his program assuming there is a demand then I would certainly be open to it. Though I must be clear up front I know only what I have learnt out and about over the years I am not someone to be considered well informed. I would be grateful for more of your thoughts please? Hedge.

My query about breeding from him arose from your comments about not wanting to geld him - there seemed to be an element of romanticism about not cutting him just because of his lineage, which would be pointless if he wasn't ever to be used as a breeding stallion. Should you have him, and keep him entire because you do want to breed from him, there are ways to do it, even as a novice stallion owner. Sending him to somewhere like Twemlows where he can be dummy trained and have a good harvest of semen taken and stored would be the most sensible way to go - and you could then geld him if you find keeping an entire to be an issue, because you will have a store of semen to carry in the line. Other than TB's who have to be covered in the conventional way, most sports horse breeding these days takes place via artificial insemination. Caveat - if you geld a mature stallion, their behaviour may not change - especially stallions who have run with mares/covered

Re riding a stallion - if he's been well trained, and knows how to behave, it's no different to riding any other horse, just with a little more awareness of what's going on around you.

 

[HedgePig]

I think this is something you'll get the most useful feedback about from the current owner. He's really the only person who can answer that for you. We can only offer the two most usual responses - 1) a horse doesn't miss what it doesn't do. Not competing to the level it *could* achieve isn't going to send it into the pits of depression. They just don't care about it the way we think. And 2) It is, however, possible to overhorse yourself.

I'd have a good chat with the owner. For one, find out WHY they have made this offer. As Asha maybe alluded to, it does sound a little strange - though not impossible, I'd want to really dig deep on that one. And also some guarantee that the owner is offering to remain in place as trainer and support network for you. I would presume so (otherwise why not sell him elsewhere?), but I'd want that reassurance.

I think if you can source livery, know you have the training and support in place, and have discussed with the owner what you would both like to see happen if things don't work out - then you'll be better set to make a decision.

This is another informative reply thank you. I probably need to edit my original post to reflect something less sinister about his acquisition. I am well resourced and when I was discussing my budget with my friend the number I gave against a number he must have had in his head were not that far away. He has evidently had a think about it and through a combination of outright purchase along with a weekly program of training by him (again for a fee) the numbers aren't actually that far away from each other. To be clear it represents a rather significant 'discount' (if thats the appropriate term) but its not limited to just a purchase. There is an ongoing 'retainer' for his expertise which would make this work for both him and the horse.

Which I guess answers your 2 of 3 points. Training and support are in place. I guess I just wouldn't have the first clue about leg position to make a horse like him do 90% of the stuff he is capable of. And its important I am honest about my own ability. Hence my apprehension.

Again thank you for your reply. Hedge.

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

Personally I think first and foremost you need to decide if you can truly get over your original perspective of working stud stallions. You will always have that in the back of your mind - would it continue to trouble you through the years and thus inadvertently cause you to treat this stallion a little more harshly or with a little more caution which could rub off on him? Stallions are incredibly perspective and whilst they need good, firm handling you can't pussy foot around them or be to big and bossy. You need to find your middle, mutual ground where the is no fear - on the surface or in your subconscience that will make you treat him differently.

How long are you able to spend getting to know him and learning how to work with him before you make a decision to buy him or not?

I love stallions, I much prefer them to mares by far and away! People also readily forget that mares are entire horses too with hormones and pin all blame on stallions.

 

[Barlow]

If you can find a decent yard that will treat a stallion as a horse and not as a fire breathing lion then that will help. Also there is an additional responsibility - what happens when you fall off.
FWIW my gelding was a stallion when I bought him and the livery yard I kept him at was set up for stallions (mine was one of four at the time) but as I can’t guarantee staying at the yard and because I didn’t want to breed I had him cut as a 5yo.

 

[eggs]

Have you actually ridden this horse yet? I would start from that point as it might well be that you don't feel 'right' on him (in which case there is no point in acquiring him) but then again you might find that you just don't want to get off him. A highly schooled horse does not suit every-one as you do have to know the right 'buttons' to press.

There is definitely a stigma with stallions and livery yards in the UK so unless you can find a yard that is used to having stallions and would keep him in an acceptable way then it would be a no-no. I have a Spanish friend and her father breeds PREs (in Spain). The colts are all kept entire and are perfectly used to being around each other and mares without an issue.

Unless there is a plan to breed from this horse I am not sure that there is really any benefit in keeping him entire in England as it does greatly reduce your options of livery.

No horse wakes up in the morning thinking that their talent is being wasted!

 

[Abi90]

I used to work on a PRE stud and the stallions were incredibly well behaved and mannerly, even when covering. The mares could be worse than the stallions to be honest.

i have no issue with stallions and they shouldn’t be frightening, we have a hang up about them in the UK, they put kids on them in Europe. Where to keep him, as has been said, will be your biggest issue

 

[HedgePig]

Personally I think first and foremost you need to decide if you can truly get over your original perspective of working stud stallions. You will always have that in the back of your mind - would it continue to trouble you through the years and thus inadvertently cause you to treat this stallion a little more harshly or with a little more caution which could rub off on him? Stallions are incredibly perspective and whilst they need good, firm handling you can't pussy foot around them or be to big and bossy. You need to find your middle, mutual ground where the is no fear - on the surface or in your subconscience that will make you treat him differently.

How long are you able to spend getting to know him and learning how to work with him before you make a decision to buy him or not?

I love stallions, I much prefer them to mares by far and away! People also readily forget that mares are entire horses too with hormones and pin all blame on stallions.

Another great reply thank you.
I guess fear isn't the right word. Healthy respect is probably better. I can't emphasise enough how surprised I was to see PRE stallions all behaving like 'normal' horses. By the end of the weekend, in fact, I found myself having a little look at their undercarriage to confirm what I was actually looking at, it was that uniform. Yes, they would unsheathe often enough but that was it. Some would be a little 'shouty' when being led to the arena but no more or less than I have seen out of a TB in similar settings.
I have read in forums that 'novice' stallion owners can actually be very good for a stallion, as they tend to add an additional layer of sense in their interactions, something that is good for a stallion. While making sure the rules are followed. Its not in my nature to be cruel or rough, though I won't hesitate to administer a decent wallop to any horse who is starting to behave badly. I have had a few complete idiots in my time who all ended up better than when they started. Just not stallions. Again though I don't want to curve fit what I am reading to fit my own agenda. I am trying to approach this with no agenda and seem to be hovering around the 50% mark on it being a good idea or not. In fact I seem to be reading one reply and deciding its just not going to work only to read the next one and think its entirely doable and quite exciting.

The owner is not on a schedule to unload. My next steps would be to meet him a few times. Ride him at least as many times. If I am nipping myself and can't 'settle' then I will decline. I am not a glutton for punishment.

Thank you again for your reply. Hedge.

 

[HedgePig]

Have you actually ridden this horse yet? I would start from that point as it might well be that you don't feel 'right' on him (in which case there is no point in acquiring him) but then again you might find that you just don't want to get off him. A highly schooled horse does not suit every-one as you do have to know the right 'buttons' to press.

There is definitely a stigma with stallions and livery yards in the UK so unless you can find a yard that is used to having stallions and would keep him in an acceptable way then it would be a no-no. I have a Spanish friend and her father breeds PREs (in Spain). The colts are all kept entire and are perfectly used to being around each other and mares without an issue.

Unless there is a plan to breed from this horse I am not sure that there is really any benefit in keeping him entire in England as it does greatly reduce your options of livery.

No horse wakes up in the morning thinking that their talent is being wasted!

Ha ha I loved your last line!

I have not ridden him yet, no. Like any normal purchase I would expect to a good few times in various settings to see if we are a good fit. I didn't say before that my Hanoverian and I were NOT a good fit. This may sound counter intuitive but I didn't ever really 'like' him. Not his fault, he did everything I asked him to but he was a horse I just never felt a particular bond with. I will not be making that mistake again as I don't think it was fair on either of us. I had him for only 8 months before I sold him on and actually felt relief. Where with every other horse I owned I felt genuine remorse and sadness.

Thank you for your reply. Hedge.

 

[HedgePig]

I used to work on a PRE stud and the stallions were incredibly well behaved and mannerly, even when covering. The mares could be worse than the stallions to be honest.

i have no issue with stallions and they shouldn’t be frightening, we have a hang up about them in the UK, they put kids on them in Europe. Where to keep him, as has been said, will be your biggest issue

I wonder why our attitudes are so divergent? Health and safety gone mad?