Tried a new horse and he threw me off...Am I mad going back for more?

[crabbymare]

This could be seen from 2 angles 1) as everyone else has said and the horse is a rearer so walk away or 2) while not being a total novice you are more used to older more settled horses and that putting you on a young orse that had not been ridden for a month was taking you outside your experience so far. when the horse got to the field where it was probably anticipating what a previous rider had done and going through the gate and having a good canter or gallop so had started to get excited which is why the walk got quicker approaching the field and although you were doing what you had learned and looking sor a relaxed walk its possible that at that point the horse would have been better with a strong trot in a circle to give it somewhere to go instead of being held back to a walk. A lot of horses will doo a small rear and spin round in the start box at cross country and that could be the sort of thing this horse did which took you by suprise hence the unsheduled dismount and when you are on a strange horse a small feet hardly off the floor rear can feel VERY different. I am not saying you are a bad rider but just trying to show another side to what happened and why.

 

[pip6]

By saying there may be something about you that sets the horse off isn't a crtique of your riding. I'm just putting the other perspective that if I owned a horse who didn't rear, & a new rider got on & he did I would not be so desperate to get them on again that I'd pay for them to have a lesson the following week (possibly she knows he wont do it in the school). I'd ask to see the owner ride him in the field if I wanted to find out if it was a genuine first time. If a long line of excuses are rolled out, it would say it all. Some people have the experience to cope with this. If you do, fair play & have fun. If you havn't & just want to give it a go then I'd wait until you've got your own horse. To 'try it out' so to speak on another persons horse where they will be left with a problem horse if you don't succeed, is this fair to the owner? Would it not be better asking for her to get him schooled out tha habit at livery by an experienced rider who will give the horse the best chance to sort its head out, then go back & share? There will still be a lot of educating left to do to satisfy your itch to bring on an inexperienced horse.

There are seveal serious shortcomings in this situation, it reads to me as though you are trying to justify to yourself taking this horse on. If he was right you wouldn't need to ask the question if you are mad or not. He reared, you fell off. Are you more likely to stay on second time? Will you get hurt second time (a good friend had her pelvis broken in 6 places by a rearer who went over on her)? Would a major injury stop your riding career? Do you have the experience necessary to do the horse justice? Wouldn't you be better looking for something you can compete. just because a horse isn't in his first flush doesn't mean he is an easy ride with nothing to teach you, don't discount older competition horses.

 

[ISHmad]

Your neck, your choice. Would I go back, no I wouldn't. Rearing is a real no no for me out of all the vices.

 

[Tinsel Town]

As my mum always says, if in doubt walk away

 

[PandorasJar]

Tbh I would not want to share this horse with you if I were the owner, you are putting too many conditions on (including sending away for expensive training)I do not think you, this horse and this owner are the right combination.

+1

The rear alone wouldn't bother me. However the whole post sounds like it isn't even close to what you are after. It sounds like you or the horse would end up being hurt.

Pan

 

[Passtheshampoo]

I'd walk away and carry on your search. It's that time of year when many owners think about darker nights, stable chores and how they'll cope. It won't be long before something comes up. Perhaps whilst you are waiting have some lessons so you are still riding. Have you tried advertisiing for a share or are you responding to ads?

 

[Littlelegs]

For me, he doesn't sound like there's anything dangerous or difficult about him. Asking a green 6yr old who's not in regular work to remain in walk when excited on an open field is asking for trouble. Much better to give them something useful to do with their energy, than try to just hold it in & let them suddenly explode. Lack of facilities wouldn't bother me either. But thats me, from what you say he doesn't sound right for you.

 

[kc100]

Crabbymare - I thought it might be that, so I asked the owner and she normally just walks him around the field so I dont think it was being held back that did it. I wasnt even having to hold him back really, he wasnt being particularly strong at the time it was just a little half halt to keep him in check. I was thinking about having a little trot at that point to let him burn off some energy but it was a very uneven muddy field, and we were going downhill at that point so I was going to wait until the bottom of the hill for the trot so I wasnt putting him in any danger of trotting too fast downhill on a dodgy surface! Perhaps he sensed we were going to trot soon and that was what did it.

Pip6 - the owner has said she will have a ride on Saturday as well (we are going to share the lesson half an hour each) so I think this will be a perfect chance to see how he is with her on board. She cant hide under any excuses if he acts up with her riding him!

I think she already has a problem horse at the moment and she knows it, and I know from my work with my current share horse (he is 13 but has had many years of being a happy hacker so has developed all sorts of problems in the school) that I can improve a horse and I am good at it - my current share horse is like a new horse on a good day and even his owner has commented (perhaps why she is selling him now - all my hard work going to someone else!).

I would love to ask her about sending him away for schooling livery, her husband did mention they have been thinking about it so perhaps it wouldnt be such a big ask for her. I think Scotty would benefit massively from an experienced rider working with him solidly for a few weeks/months to get him back on track - I know I wouldnt be able to achieve the same results as sending him away on schooling livery! I think if he went away for a while he could get the basics sorted and stop any silly habits he might have, and then that would be a good place for me to start the share after that. I'm just not sure if she would agree to this though and as you said before, I dont want to be forcing conditions on her, that's not fair to the owner.

 

[paddi22]

Be wary about the woman promising you the sun moon and earth as well. Of course she will be all enthusiastic about the theory of getting him schooled, bringing you to shows etc. She mightn't be as enthusiastic when she considers the cost, petrol, time etc.

This woman has had the horse a long time. If she had really wanted him going, she would have sorted it out months ago. If she gets a sharer she won't have the motivation to resolve it permanently. she will probably be happy to be getting a bit of cash and for the horse to be used. Why would she pay livery fees when she knows you will probably accept the status quo of riding him around the field.

As for bringing him to shows, he's not a high end competition horse. The novelty of bringing a green horse round local shows might wear off quickly. As for sending him to a pro, thats fine, but unless you are shown through lessons how the pro rides him then it's not much use. Plus with no school a lot of the finesse will be lost.

Plus is he doesn't move yards (and she hasn't) then how will you even get to show level. The ground will get muddy in wonter and you have no jumps, can't set up a course or grids to practise.

I know you like this horse, but you acknowledge yourself that you have a weakness for getting attached to them and that's what's happening here. You are selling yourself short, when you have no need to.

There are plenty of challenging horses, (with normal owners to own from!), in good yards with proper schools and cross country jumps, people to get advice from, and good facilities.

This woman sounds like an unfocussed, undecided rider who got in over her head and is now trying to offload a green horse on someone for a bit of cash, so she feels better about it being used, and hopes it might be rideable for her some day.

As for the rearing, if you are not used to riding rearers then i'd avoid completely. If rearing is it's thing it will default to it at any time. I have one myself and it's hard going. It's not something you can fix on most, they will always do it. I wouldn't fancy riding by myself in bad facilities on a green rearer. Imagine that every time you ride, it will be like it was the first time you did. Because realistically that's probably what it will be like on such a green horse. That doesn't sound like a challenge, it sounds dangerous and foolhardy. My rearer is a challenge all the time, and it does wear you out. I have another horse though who is a much of a project but much safer, and he is a pleasure to train and work on.

Please don't rush into it! Wait and get the perfect sharer that ticks all the boxes for you.

 

[9tails]

I'd say you would be overhorsed with this one. Obviously I wasn't there, but for a first ride on a new horse you should be on high alert and it'd be nigh on impossible for a "normal" neddy to ditch you. If it did manage it you should say no and walk away, you're unlikely to be able to manage it and teach it well when the ***** hits the fan.

Once your guard is down, for instance having ridden a horse for a few months and you're slopping along on a long rein, it's perfectly possible to topple off and no biggie. I've done that plenty of times.

 

[indie999]

Yeah, right.

Walk away.

I agree walk away, I had the usual doesnt buck or rear as I go for a second viewing and thank goodness it chucked me off big style.What a saving my 1000s+ I was ready to hand it over too.."its never done that before" Well I didnt get on but the owner did and it kangarooooood about 100 metres buckaroooo.

So no no no. Wonder why she has had so much surgery on her knees. I wouldnt touch a rearer either major vice. No way. Plenty of other youngsters out there.

Good luck.

 

[Nightmare before Christmas]

Sorry I wasnt very clear - I am looking for a share horse where I ride 3-4 times a week (maybe more if the owner needed), however with this particular horse because he is so green and I'm not sure about him yet, I thought it might be a good idea to offer to ride him for the owner once a week (she is desperate for someone to ride him while she is not fully fit), see how I get on with the horse before I commit to the share (where I would have him 3-4 days per week). I dont want to commit to a horse like this when he might be beyond my abilities (hence why I need to ride him more to find out!).

As for the facilites - I totally agree, and that is putting me off massively. Hence why I think she probably needs to move him to a different yard if she wants him to be the horse she wants. She wants him to be competing! He cant reach his full potential where he currently is, and she isnt happy either with the facilities or the other woman she shares the field with, so perhaps she would consider moving him? She is only asking for £60 pcm which is nothing, I'd happily pay double if he moved to a different yard with the facilities he needs. But again that would all depend on how me and him get on, and whether the riding element improves.

Where exactly are you based in the west mids?

 

[Kokopelli]

I think you're being very silly. Rearing is unacceptable, also if you want to bring a youngster on why would you send him off for schooling?

Also from someone who shared a horse out I wouldn't like all those conditions. It's my horse I can decide what I want to do with him. You don't need facilities to compete, I know someone who competes at 1* with no facilities.

 

[mandwhy]

Please take my advice having been in almost exactly this situation, tread carefully and do not allow yourself to be sucked into committing to a horse that isn't right for you from someone you feel kind of sorry for - more importantly don't PAY to get thrown off someone else's problem!

Yes you could go back and try again, it could have been an off day but it only takes one fall to be badly injured (your body and your confidence).

Being 2 months into recovery with about a month left was it worth it for me? Not really! Do I feel the same never-ending 'nothing shakes me' confidence that made me do it in the first place? About 70%!

 

[kc100]

Where exactly are you based in the west mids?

I'm in Solihull but looking for a share around the South Birmingham/North Warwickshire/Solihull/Coventry area.

 

[kc100]

I think you're being very silly. Rearing is unacceptable, also if you want to bring a youngster on why would you send him off for schooling?

Also from someone who shared a horse out I wouldn't like all those conditions. It's my horse I can decide what I want to do with him. You don't need facilities to compete, I know someone who competes at 1* with no facilities.

I think he would benefit from intensive training from someone very experienced with youngsters - he pretty much needs to start all over again as he's never had any proper schooling from the sounds of things. He cant even go round on the right rein (refuses and will only go on the left) - I think having someone school him daily until he get the basics sorted would be the best thing for him. While I would happily have him 3-4 days per week, I still dont think that would be enough. So yes I do want to bring on a youngster, but I think he needs a bit of help first before anyone else touches him just to get the basics right and to nip any bad habits in the bud.

As for the 'conditions' - as I've said before these were never conditions I've outlined to the owner, these were just my ideas that I came up with based on what his owner said to me and what I saw. By no means would I ever dictate to the horses owner what she should be doing, it is her horse and her decisions. I only thought about these things because she mentioned how she wasnt happy with her current yard situation, she mentioned sending him away for schooling livery and she talked in depth about how much she would like to see him compete.

This yard really doesnt have ANY facilities - it is a patch of land between the M6 and M42, very boggy and muddy without even a field to try and school in. The hacking is along VERY busy roads with the motorways on each side with traffic roaring past (kudos to him he didnt bat an eyelid at the traffic). Your friend must be very talented to compete without any facilities, I simply cant see how you could manage it without even a field to ride in!

 

[Nightmare before Christmas]

I'm in Solihull but looking for a share around the South Birmingham/North Warwickshire/Solihull/Coventry area.

Damn if I was still at uni you could have come and ridden my mare! She could do with someone to enjoy her before I try and put her in foal again!

 

[LollyDolly]

To be honest it sounds to me that OP has already made her mind up.

Would I touch this horse? No.

Also I want to echo what other posters have said, firstly as the owner I would be terribly offended if a loaner came to me and said "I'll take your horse, but first I'd rather you move to a better yard with more facilities, oh and would you mind sending the horse away on schooling livery? I know that it's £800 a month, but that'd be great."
At this rate the woman is making a loss with you loaning her horse!

Furthermore, if you want experience in bringing on a youngster then you bring it on, sending it away for a few months and then merrily playing ponies doesn't count.

It seems like you want the 'experience' of bringing on a youngster, but without actually doing it yourself.

Trust me when I say that youngsters are hard work, and I certainly wouldn't be paying to bring on someone else's youngster! It's bad enough bringing on my own baby, without actually paying someone else for the privilege!

 

[Copperpot]

Tbh I wouldn't buy a rearer but the horse I bought last week bucked me off when I tried him still loved him thou.

 

[Kokopelli]

I think he would benefit from intensive training from someone very experienced with youngsters - he pretty much needs to start all over again as he's never had any proper schooling from the sounds of things. He cant even go round on the right rein (refuses and will only go on the left) - I think having someone school him daily until he get the basics sorted would be the best thing for him. While I would happily have him 3-4 days per week, I still dont think that would be enough. So yes I do want to bring on a youngster, but I think he needs a bit of help first before anyone else touches him just to get the basics right and to nip any bad habits in the bud.

As for the 'conditions' - as I've said before these were never conditions I've outlined to the owner, these were just my ideas that I came up with based on what his owner said to me and what I saw. By no means would I ever dictate to the horses owner what she should be doing, it is her horse and her decisions. I only thought about these things because she mentioned how she wasnt happy with her current yard situation, she mentioned sending him away for schooling livery and she talked in depth about how much she would like to see him compete.

This yard really doesnt have ANY facilities - it is a patch of land between the M6 and M42, very boggy and muddy without even a field to try and school in. The hacking is along VERY busy roads with the motorways on each side with traffic roaring past (kudos to him he didnt bat an eyelid at the traffic). Your friend must be very talented to compete without any facilities, I simply cant see how you could manage it without even a field to ride in!

The doesn't go on right rein combined with rearing screams pain to me, does he have even muscle tone?

Facility wise what about the field you tried him in?

 

[Annagain]

I'm going to go against the grain here. I agree that rearing is unacceptable, however it is possible for a horse to rear once and not be a serial rearer. In 7 1/2 years, my horse has done exactly that - reared once about 4 years ago. He was napping - which he can do a bit at events and up he went. I'm not a horse beater, but he had such a thrashing from me (well, it felt like it in the heat of the moment but it was probably a few swift swipes until he came down and went forward, over in a few seconds) that he's never done it since. He still has the odd nap but just plants or whips round to try go back to his friends, which is swiftly dealt with with continuing the turn until we've gone 360, a growl and a pony club kick, it's never gone further and I'm confident that it won't.

I don't for one second think Happy Hoof is the culprit, but maybe if it is his first time out in a month and maybe if the other rider has been letting him canter in that spot it was a question of his excitement getting the better of him. It doesn't justify it, but it might explain it and it doesn't mean it's definitely going to happen again.

The difference is, with mine, it was 3 1/2 years into be owning my horse so I knew it wasn't a regular thing, it wasn't enough to get me off - and certainly nowhere near enough for him to go over backwards. But if (and it's a big if) you feel you can deal with it, you might end up with a nice horse out of it. If you want to go down that road you really need another chat with the owner and ask her to be totally honest about whether it was a one off - or maybe the other rider if you can get access to her?

This is of course without the other issues of facilities etc and there probably are easier options out there.

Good luck whatever you decide.

 

[kc100]

The doesn't go on right rein combined with rearing screams pain to me, does he have even muscle tone?

Facility wise what about the field you tried him in?

I noticed he has very little muscle tone whatsoever, despite being fairly slim and not at all overweight he was pretty soft and flabby with very little muscle. Compared to my current share horse they felt worlds apart, a clear sign of the lack of work! I agree it could be pain, I think the owner definitely needs to get that looked at. She claimed it was down to her doing 'everything from the left' i.e. tacking up on the left etc but that sounds like nonsense to me, no horse can only go on one rein just because he is tacked up on the left!

The field he lives in has his stable in it, and also a shetland pony (owned by Scotty's owner) and then a little pony owned by the other woman that shares the field, so that is not suitable for riding in as the other horses would be in the way! So we rode out down the roads by the fields, then into this other field at the bottom of the lane (where I then fell off!). That was a very muddy field that had just been cleared by the farmer who owns it, and it looked like it had crops in their previously so I imagine when the farmer decides to use the field again it wont be available for the horses to use. I dont think that field was suitable for schooling either, it was very uneven with lots of slopes and a loose surface so going at much more than a walk could have caused the horse to lose his footing and slip.

 

[paddi22]

the more you describe it the worse it sounds!

Owner sounds like a fruitcake with wacky theories, she could be difficult (she already has issues with woman sharing field). Facilities sound dreadful. It could be an absolutely miserable experience for you.

I'd be wary about getting involved too much with the owners as it will be easier for her to sway you with promises. Just picture it in the depths of winter when all you have to ride in is mud, and its gets dark so early.

 

[horsemad67]

The fact that the horse has been on happy hoof is nothing to do with behaviour it wouldn,t make a horse fizzy. why would you want the horse to be sent away for schooling?

 

[TheShark]

Sounds like an accident waiting to happen - even to a person of my inexperience

Just read your comments back to yourself...

 

[TheShark]

Sorry, phone. I hope you find a good horse that meets your needs soon but really would walk away from this one.

Good luck.

 

[Hobbitpony]

To be honest it sounds to me that OP has already made her mind up.

Would I touch this horse? No.

Also I want to echo what other posters have said, firstly as the owner I would be terribly offended if a loaner came to me and said "I'll take your horse, but first I'd rather you move to a better yard with more facilities, oh and would you mind sending the horse away on schooling livery? I know that it's £800 a month, but that'd be great."
At this rate the woman is making a loss with you loaning her horse!

Furthermore, if you want experience in bringing on a youngster then you bring it on, sending it away for a few months and then merrily playing ponies doesn't count.

It seems like you want the 'experience' of bringing on a youngster, but without actually doing it yourself.

Trust me when I say that youngsters are hard work, and I certainly wouldn't be paying to bring on someone else's youngster! It's bad enough bringing on my own baby, without actually paying someone else for the privilege!

I think this situation is slightly different. The owner has a youngster which she doesn't have the skills/ability to bring on herself. She is looking for a sharer to do it for her for free whilst collecting £60 towards the bills. Now either the owner will find someone fully capable of doing it single handed and anyone that is that good/experienced would be likely to charge for their services (otherwise they are a complete mug) or she (as is most likely the case) will find someone of middle ground like the OP who could maybe take it on with some professional help for the 'fun' of it. But should the sharer shoulder that cost when the long term benefit of any improvement and value of the horse is reaped by the owner?? I doubt the OP would suggest moving the horse or schooling livery if the horse didnt come with obvious issues or was just intended for happy hacking. I actually think the OP's suggestions to the owner are a fairly sensible, the horse wont progress being ridden around a muddy field once a week will it. Whether the owner chooses to take the OPs opinion on board is entirely up to her but I do feel some owners have unrealistic expectations of what sharing actually entails and see it as a cheap alternative when actually a professional is required.

 

[mandwhy]

I think this situation is slightly different. The owner has a youngster which she doesn't have the skills/ability to bring on herself. She is looking for a sharer to do it for her for free whilst collecting £60 towards the bills..................

I do feel some owners have unrealistic expectations of what sharing actually entails and see it as a cheap alternative when actually a professional is required.

I agree with this wholeheartedly!!

For what it's worth OP I understand your thoughts of having the horse sent away to a professional for schooling instead of risking doing it yourself, as you admit to not having the experience, but for you to gain from it you could either go along to the yard where this is being done to learn from what they are doing (if the yard is happy with that obviously) or get an instructor/trainer to come to you and show you how. I kind of doubt the owner is going to do that though as they probably want someone to school the horse for free and pay towards its keep as above!

I have a rented field and school in one end, it's only one up from what you have but makes all the difference! Posh facilities aren't everything and cost too much in my opinion, although lights would be nice

 

[D66]

I think this situation is slightly different. The owner has a youngster which she doesn't have the skills/ability to bring on herself. She is looking for a sharer to do it for her for free whilst collecting £60 towards the bills. Now either the owner will find someone fully capable of doing it single handed and anyone that is that good/experienced would be likely to charge for their services (otherwise they are a complete mug) or she (as is most likely the case) will find someone of middle ground like the OP who could maybe take it on with some professional help for the 'fun' of it. But should the sharer shoulder that cost when the long term benefit of any improvement and value of the horse is reaped by the owner?? I doubt the OP would suggest moving the horse or schooling livery if the horse didnt come with obvious issues or was just intended for happy hacking. I actually think the OP's suggestions to the owner are a fairly sensible, the horse wont progress being ridden around a muddy field once a week will it. Whether the owner chooses to take the OPs opinion on board is entirely up to her but I do feel some owners have unrealistic expectations of what sharing actually entails and see it as a cheap alternative when actually a professional is required.

my thoughts entirely.^^^^

It sounds to me like the owner has overhorsed herself and doesn't want to spend the money to reschool, she hasn't even put the horse on a yard where he could be retrained. She is looking for someone to do the work for her on the cheap, do some competitions and then she will sell. My bet is that she would help out with transport to competitions, but won't move to a better yard unless your sharing contributions cover the cost.

The horse MAY be fine with regular work and consistent discipline, if I was in your shoes I'd like to see that improvement before agreeing to take him on. ie IF she moves to a good yard and IF his behaviour improves after 2/3 weeks professional schooling it MIGHT be worth the effort.

Good luck.

 

[indie999]

I have got a bit lost on this post but there are so many adverts in for sale then it turns out to be a share to be "kept on current yard". slightly green with help to bring on ie they dont know what they are doing and want someone else to do what is potentially risky but are quite happy for someone else to get hurt(and that is going to save them lots of money too).

Sounds like the owner needs to go for re-schooling. So many ruined horses. Shame. Walk before you get hurt yourself. You either sort it out yourself with help or send it to somewhere good who will happily do it for you at a price(& why not thats fine too).

Good luck walk fast.