TURNERS ABBATOIR - RED LION

CHL clearly thinks that she has had a great victory and managed to educate all of us harsh nasty horse murdering HHO people. That's how she's putting it across on her fb page anyway....:rolleyes:

Oh and CHL - people on this thread have acknowledged the NEED for horse slaughter.....but NOT ONE of us has said that we would send our own horses.
The people on this forum tend to be genuine horse lovers, who would always PTS at home (or 'murder at home' as you so nicely put it). However we recognise that not everyone has the means or inclination to do this, and here lies the need for the abattoirs; which should be humanely and fairly run.

But these ideas have been here long before you so condescendingly 'educated' us :rolleyes:

Just glad Debbie didn't turn up as she hinted she might....!
 
I agree, I too worry about charities that risk themselves getting this footage. They are super brave and committed to the welfare of animals. Why dont the authorities use this evidence to prosecute? Maybe because the fever and anger at the situation from the public dies down, maybe it costs too much money, maybe they have too many cases on their hands, etc etc.

To finnish I too am a horse lover. I too see the need for horse slaughter houses. I agree, it pees me off to say this but if I had the money I would open a super efficient well run slaughter house for horses. I would have it purposely built with correct care for the horses, I would create a totally non mechanical (as mush as one could) atmosphere. I do believe there are other abattoirs like this for cattle etc. All very calm and peaceful not like huge plants.

Thank you for your info on working in an abattoir its reassuring that it can be done correctly.

B, I fail to see how it disappoints you me looking on the internet for info, the days of me going to the library and leafing through books for reference are well gone. I prefer to use the internet.


CHL
The reason the authorities probably cannot use Hillsides footage is probably not legal to do so as it was done under trespass.

Glad you now not against the idea of abattoirs, and no I would not send my horses to an abattoir, but there is a need for it as long as we have all types of sport or leisure with horses we will have breeding and there is always going to horses/ponies not suitable for one reason or another, we cannot rescue them all.


I am glad you have realised not all abattoirs are bad and you would consider opening one yourself if you had the chance (properly regulated of course).

The reason I am disappointed that you use the internet (just a personal thought) to get all your info is because at the time you said you wanted to "educate" people of the fact, in my opinion you can only do that if you are qualified to do so, by that I mean have practical skills in the field or have studied Animal Welfare in practice, college or Uni (have qualifications on the subject) That is the only way to be taken seriously not just viewing footage on the net.

I am glad my comments have been some help.
 
FionaM12 said:
I find some of these posts confusing as people don't seem to be able to use the facility correctly. :confused:

Just click QUOTE guys! Then we can tell who said what! :D
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Sorry about that, but I not a expert on the pc lol, didn't want to quote the whole thing, could say I am bit of a old dinosaur:):)
 
Bertieb123 said:
Sorry about that, but I not a expert on the pc lol, didn't want to quote the whole thing, could say I am bit of a old dinosaur:):)
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As long as you leave the [QUOTE = etc... ] and [ /QUOTE] at the beginning and end, you can edit some of it out. Just don't accidentally delete the bracket parts. :)

I'm a dinosaur too. My daughter despairs.
 
mredd said:
i can not believe what crap i read on here ....supposed to be a world of animal lovers ? yet you watch the proof of what goes on and the fact the fsa immune the vet and meat inspectors from prosecution, yet think this place deserves to carry on regardless ?
you really think this heartless family with the worst rep deserve a second chance ? do any of you know them ?? or know of them ?
yes the footage was taken over 80 days and was 120 hrs of film.. you really think they have just the 3 mins shown on sky ? pmsl...
derick him self was hoping shut this dump and build houses but planning was refused, what would have happened to welfare then ? do you think he gave a toss about that ? or was just trying line his pockets ? you heard about the rspca complaints about his treatment of ponies bought from the sale ?
you are aware of hewitts i take it not far from the redlion who slaughter horses, read there is only 2 in this country pmsl again research you will find 6, and another due to open and be licensed in cheshire very soon .. please do not preach on here slaughter houses ran by heartless cowboys are needed as they are not.. im sure after the fsa investigation you lot will be proved very wrong, with regards to campaigning to close then to bloody right, these people are not trying to ban slaughter, but do not want to see this heartless family fail again, they should not be allowed to trade after such serious welfare breeches, and i have read that if this place did close they support new management, not them who go round stumping fags out on horses faces just for a laugh !! think all these key board warrios need get some facts straight you have enough time type ***** on here yet not enough do some simple research :mad:
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That's given me a headache.
 
By the way, does anyone sensible here know Hewitts slaughter house? It's been mentioned a few times on this thread as slaughtering 200 horses a week. Yet googling it I could only find one site which said,
Species slaughtered: from cattle (bovine), sheep (ovine), pigs (porcine), goats (caprine), poultry, farmed game, wild birds, wild lagomorphs (rabbits, hares), wild ungulates (deer)
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No mention of horses. :confused:


http://www.tracingpaper.org.uk/foodtracer/abattoirs/north-west-england/
 
mredd said:
thank god someone think's like us !!! or is it because we are local ? and we know about this family ??? and people just believe what they read :p
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Forgive me if I am wrong, but nobody has suggested Turners should be allowed to carry on, or get away without being prosecuted.

The point everyone is making is that slaughterhouses are vital for horse welfare, and they should be more closely monitored NOT closed.
 
Moomin1 said:
Forgive me if I am wrong, but nobody has suggested Turners should be allowed to carry on, or get away without being prosecuted.

The point everyone is making is that slaughterhouses are vital for horse welfare, and they should be more closely monitored NOT closed.
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A point which has been clear throughout this thread, but our new troll chooses not to read that. :rolleyes:
 
mredd said:
yes i know it !! you are right on the tracing paper site it does not state they slaughter horses, maybe never got round to changing it, they have slaughtered them for over 12 months and yes they do slaughter between 100-200 horses per week
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What about Hewitts? :confused:
 
mredd said:
yes i know it !! you are right on the tracing paper site it does not state they slaughter horses, maybe never got round to changing it, they have slaughtered them for over 12 months and yes they do slaughter between 100-200 horses per week
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Sorry, I did say anyone sensible. ;) Thanks anyway. :)
 
mredd said:
ok you google past cases like this. fact. the meat inspector and vet are present to monitor the slaughter line/process.. never in a single case have either one of these ever faced prosecution, why because the fsa state that they are not expected to watch the slaughter line 24/7.. to me this is bloody stupid what is the point of there presence then ? i would go as far to say as the whole thing is corrupt, did you know that john young (horsemeat scandal) high job in the fsa is now in fact on turners pay roll, employed just 3 weeks after the footage shown.
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So what would you like to happen?
 
mredd said:
yes i know it !! you are right on the tracing paper site it does not state they slaughter horses, maybe never got round to changing it, they have slaughtered them for over 12 months and yes they do slaughter between 100-200 horses per week
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No, I am asking what is the issue with Hewitts?

You mention them but don't say why.:confused:
 
Turners should lose their license permanently. They have had too many chances over the years and too many incidences of appalling standards to welfare. Derek Turner himself has either turned a blind eye to the standards of his slaughter men in his abbatoir or he didn't know which i really dont believe.

Neither makes him a fit manager to continue.

the Red Lion should have new management brought in, strict welfare standards of slaughter practise, monitored regularly, CCTV installed in all areas, paperwork admin tightened up on passported animals and strong penalties imposed for non compliance.
 
mredd said:
i think its time every uk slaughter house installed cctv not just the 30% that have to date, if you look online you can find many videos in the uk of vile cases like this.
i do want derick turner stopped as like i said i have known of this family for years,
he makes no point in hiding his heartless ways, stumping fags out on foals faces in public !!
i think every slaughter house needs regulating better and that the fsa need to look at there part in it all, most places have 3 fsa staff on site so surly if 1 goes on a break etc the other 2 continue to monitor the line,
more education on how you get your slaughter licence it is to easy and you can slaughter on a provisional licence,
i rant on as employing polish workers who live on site and are paid £80 a day cash in hand is asking for trouble. i would say lots needs to be addressed but rome wasn't built in a day :o
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Err. Is that not what everyone on here is saying?!!

:confused:
 
mredd said:
i mention it with response to previous posts about travelling horses miles if turners was closed
and the posts i read of just 2-3 horse slaughter houses, when there is 7.
had derick of had his way the place would have been closed 2 years ago. so i do not understand why people think welfare will be worse if this place is closed.
I hope the old goat gives up, and sells it on to people who have respect for animals not like this monster
changing the subject again did you see the animal aid footage taken at potters ?
only i would rather watch that where animals do not look distressed like they do on the redlion footage ;)
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I don't need to see it really, I have shot animals myself in two separate slaughterhouses. Not one of the animals was distress in either.
 
mredd said:
i mention it with response to previous posts about travelling horses miles if turners was closed
and the posts i read of just 2-3 horse slaughter houses, when there is 7.
had derick of had his way the place would have been closed 2 years ago. so i do not understand why people think welfare will be worse if this place is closed.
I hope the old goat gives up, and sells it on to people who have respect for animals not like this monster
changing the subject again did you see the animal aid footage taken at potters ?
only i would rather watch that where animals do not look distressed like they do on the redlion footage ;)
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mredd, people here ARE saying that Turner should lose his license. I dont think anyone here thinks any differently to you.

Im not sure what all the histrionics are about..
 
mredd said:
:p:p:p:p:p:p:p:p:p:):):):):):):):)
here here !!!!!!!!!!! it seems it us locals who have the same opinion !! knowing the vile family
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im not local mredd, but i do agree with you.

i think you'll find that a lot of people on here think the same way tho. at least, i think they do.
Turner has had too many chances now for too many years. enough is enough. Sadly we do need the red lion but it needs a complete overhaul starting from the management to the slaughter men and support staff to the office.
everything needs to be thrown out and start again to rebuild the appalling rep Turner has given the Red Lion for many years.

its sad we need horse abbatoirs at alkl in the UK but until over breeding is curbed and a world of issues are addressed, we do but that doesn't mean abbatoirs have to be places of horror.
 
mredd said:
i can not believe what crap i read on here ....supposed to be a world of animal lovers ? yet you watch the proof of what goes on and the fact the fsa immune the vet and meat inspectors from prosecution, yet think this place deserves to carry on regardless ?
you really think this heartless family with the worst rep deserve a second chance ? do any of you know them ?? or know of them ?
yes the footage was taken over 80 days and was 120 hrs of film.. you really think they have just the 3 mins shown on sky ? pmsl...
derick him self was hoping shut this dump and build houses but planning was refused, what would have happened to welfare then ? do you think he gave a toss about that ? or was just trying line his pockets ? you heard about the rspca complaints about his treatment of ponies bought from the sale ?
you are aware of hewitts i take it not far from the redlion who slaughter horses, read there is only 2 in this country pmsl again research you will find 6, and another due to open and be licensed in cheshire very soon .. please do not preach on here slaughter houses ran by heartless cowboys are needed as they are not.. im sure after the fsa investigation you lot will be proved very wrong, with regards to campaigning to close then to bloody right, these people are not trying to ban slaughter, but do not want to see this heartless family fail again, they should not be allowed to trade after such serious welfare breeches, and i have read that if this place did close they support new management, not them who go round stumping fags out on horses faces just for a laugh !! think all these key board warrios need get some facts straight you have enough time type ***** on here yet not enough do some simple research :mad:
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Rather than being offensive and offering what can only be considered as rather silly comments, why not place your thoughts in order, and list your points in a way that make sense?

You are new to the forum, apparently, and following an introductory post, advising everyone else that they are wrong, few will take either you, or your arguments seriously.

One opening point for you to consider; NO ONE on this thread has justified the treatment of those horses which were filmed during their demise. WE ALL want change, but shouting and screaming and accusing others of being "key board warrios", will achieve nothing.

Join in a debate which has a generally forward momentum.

Alec.

ps. and calm down dear. ;)
 
mredd said:
ok you google past cases like this. fact. the meat inspector and vet are present to monitor the slaughter line/process.. never in a single case have either one of these ever faced prosecution, why because the fsa state that they are not expected to watch the slaughter line 24/7.. to me this is bloody stupid what is the point of there presence then ? ........
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Now there I agree with you. See? Common ground already! ;)

Alec.
 
lula said:
i think you'll find that a lot of people on here think the same way tho. at least, i think they do.
Turner has had too many chances now for too many years. enough is enough. Sadly we do need the red lion but it needs a complete overhaul starting from the management to the slaughter men and support staff to the office.
everything needs to be thrown out and start again to rebuild the appalling rep Turner has given the Red Lion for many years.

its sad we need horse abbatoirs at alkl in the UK but until over breeding is curbed and a world of issues are addressed, we do but that doesn't mean abbatoirs have to be places of horror.
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^^^ditto this

and Mredd kick-on, its an emotive subject and i admire your passion
 
mredd said:
i think its time every uk slaughter house installed cctv not just the 30% that have to date, if you look online you can find many videos in the uk of vile cases like this.

Completely agree ALL slaughterhouses need CCTV
i do want derick turner stopped as like i said i have known of this family for years,
he makes no point in hiding his heartless ways, stumping fags out on foals faces in public !!

IF this is true then it is indeed disgusting
i think every slaughter house needs regulating better and that the fsa need to look at there part in it all, most places have 3 fsa staff on site so surly if 1 goes on a break etc the other 2 continue to monitor the line,

agreed
more education on how you get your slaughter licence it is to easy and you can slaughter on a provisional licence,

Good idea
i rant on as employing polish workers who live on site and are paid £80 a day cash in hand is asking for trouble. i would say lots needs to be addressed but rome wasn't built in a day :o
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Careful when mentioning nationalities, in this way you will avoid any accusations of racism.

Now remind me why you are castigating us?
 
mredd said:
what a rude vile person you are !!!
i suppose its the trolls like you that give this forum a bad name ???
to much time in your boring life ??
to insult people who have a view different to your's ??
well bring it on chic...you just met your match pmsl:p
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Hooray! I've finally been called a troll. :D:D

I'm a rude and vile one too it seems. Go me (as the young people say:o)!

:p:D



eta Mind you, it seems I'm also chic. That means fashionable and stylish doesn't it? Well, thanks, I've not been called that before either... :D
 
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mredd said:
i mention it with response to previous posts about travelling horses miles if turners was closed
and the posts i read of just 2-3 horse slaughter houses, when there is 7.

On the FSA site it gives only 3 slaughterhouses licensed to kill horses, Hewitts we therefore only have your word for.
had derick of had his way the place would have been closed 2 years ago. so i do not understand why people think welfare will be worse if this place is closed.

Of course people are concerned about horse welfare, hence the hue and cry
I hope the old goat gives up, and sells it on to people who have respect for animals not like this monster

I agree with you again
changing the subject again did you see the animal aid footage taken at potters ?

Yes and saw nothing that concerned me regarding welfare, and before the poor chesnut is brought into the conversation, she waited 7 minutes whilst they got the chap with the licence to arrive, she arrived out of hours, if you want to blame anyone look towards the owner, but even then you do not actually know the full story.
only i would rather watch that where animals do not look distressed like they do on the redlion footage ;)
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I agree, no one wants to see distressed animals, and one of the things that stood out glaringly in the Potters video, was how calm the animals looked and what respect the slaughtermen showed, I changed my mind completely about slaughterhouses after watching that footage.

When people come on here preaching stuff we already know (I am talking about the brainless one here not you) and then try to 'educate' us in a very condescending manner, they will get people's backs up.
 
Bertieb123 said:
.......

....... I agree, it pees me off to say this but if I had the money I would open a super efficient well run slaughter house for horses. I would have it purposely built with correct care for the horses, I would create a totally non mechanical (as mush as one could) atmosphere.

........
Click to expand...

There are plans afoot for such a facility. Whether purpose built, or a modification of an existing premises, depends upon those who would fund it, but the efforts are being made, and it will be as ethical and as humane as it is possible.

The humane, and so the correct slaughter of horses is reliant upon a series of both principles and environment. Those doing the work need to have a demonstrable work ethic, and a compassionate but practical system needs to be in place.

It CAN work, but whether the charities will get behind it and offer support, remains to be seen. The more vitriolic the campaigner, it seems, the louder their voice. Raised voices rarely work for the common good, I've found.

Anyway, we'll see what happens.

Alec.
 
Dab said:
.......

and Mredd kick-on, its an emotive subject and i admire your passion
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No one objects to passion, providing that it arrives with a balanced argument. Being offensive and making wild and unsubstantiated claims will achieve nothing but discord, and benefit no one, least of all the most outspoken.

Alec.

ps.
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Yeah, I know, that's rich, coming from me! :D a.
 
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