Turning out a clipped horse with no rug to lose weight ?

not fully clipped no, I would perhaps be under rugging a bit like goldenstar said but not fully clipped and naked and out.
 
No way.

Think about it this way, how would you feel if you were taken from your lovely snuggly coat and left outside all night?

Pretty rotten I should think.

Really surprised at a vet saying such a thing, it's crossing over into a welfare issue to try and freeze weight off.
 
I have my highland blanket clipped with head and legs left on, he is still out 24/7 with a rain sheet on overnight. He is plenty warm enough so far.
 
I would do a high blanket clip and put out naked on dry days, I would not turn out a horse naked if it did not have its natural coat over its back and loins.

OP if the horse has lost weight over the summer then the owner has been doing something right-if the horse is not touching hay when it comes in it is because it has a full belly and therefore is getting too much grass, I would increase exercise, feed soaked hay and restrict grazing
 
I am sure I have read about WHW using this method to get weight off very over weight horses......... I will probably be shot down in flames but I can see this working on a horse/pony that has specific issue and therefore can't be exercised. If muzzling does not work where do you go from there? I would rather the horse loose the weight through cold than lack of fibre.
 
Hetsmum said:
I am sure I have read about WHW using this method to get weight off very over weight horses......... I will probably be shot down in flames but I can see this working on a horse/pony that has specific issue and therefore can't be exercised. If muzzling does not work where do you go from there? I would rather the horse loose the weight through cold than lack of fibre.
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This is basically what I do with my mare when I need to but she has a rain sheet on. Her body always feels warm when I lay my hands on her.
 
I'm surprised that so many people aren't aware that this is pretty standard veterinary advice. With common sense, it shouldn't mean weight drops too rapidly, if it does than obviously the horse needs more fibre, shelter or a light rug.
 
Surely everything we do with horses (and in life!) is on balance of risk. Clearly in this case the vet decided the risks of turning out clipped without a rug were outweighed by the risk of leaving the horse to continue through winter obese.

It's not something I'd do - I would stop feeding hay and only feed barley straw for a start. I would muzzle when out too, or restrict (but its too wet here to do that).

If I had tried all of the above, and exercised as much as possible. Then I would consider turning out naked with a trace clip. Although as the horse is already fully clipped, i'd then just turn out in a no fill to keep the rain off.
 
Wagtail said:
IMO it would be cruel. Would a person walk around half naked 24/7 in this weather to lose weight? Do doctors recommend people do this? No they don't, because it would be unbearable.
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Sorry Wagtail, but there is now some medical guidance that it's a great way to lose weight. Apparently, not only does it use calories but it changes fat into healthier brown fat to be cold. I recently saw advice to remove stubborn fat patches by putting ice packs on them. My brother has routinely used winter outdoor swimming as a weight control device, and if I'm a bit porky I will deliberately under dress for a football match.
 
As others have said, I would under rug and possibly (if the sun is out like it has been here today) let them go without a rug and fully clipped in the day but not out at night.

I am guilty of doing this kind of thing with my own, portly horse (who is the fittest fat horse I've ever met) but only in the sense he has a low trace and is out in a LW. I can't really restrict his grazing due to ulcers.
But then I'm the only person on my yard that is turning out in a no fill. Other liveries have cried at it being below 5 degrees and have stuck porky natives out in full neck HW's....so I'm probably going to hell already anyways.
 
cptrayes said:
Sorry Wagtail, but there is now some medical guidance that it's a great way to lose weight. Apparently, not only does it use calories but it changes fat into healthier brown fat to be cold. I recently saw advice to remove stubborn fat patches by putting ice packs on them. My brother has routinely used winter outdoor swimming as a weight control device, and if I'm a bit porky I will deliberately under dress for a football match.
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But we are only getting cold for an hour or two. This horse is out 24/7. I really wouldn't object to putting a horse out without a rug clipped if it was only for a couple of hours, but not all night long. It's going to be miserable.
 
I would under rug a fully clipped horse but would not turn one out overnight naked, if you clip you rug the hair does also give protection from rain and the elements, taking it all away and not replacing that protection is just not fair.
 
Bav said:
As others have said, I would under rug and possibly (if the sun is out like it has been here today) let them go without a rug and fully clipped in the day but not out at night.

I am guilty of doing this kind of thing with my own, portly horse (who is the fittest fat horse I've ever met) but only in the sense he has a low trace and is out in a LW. I can't really restrict his grazing due to ulcers.
But then I'm the only person on my yard that is turning out in a no fill. Other liveries have cried at it being below 5 degrees and have stuck porky natives out in full neck HW's....so I'm probably going to hell already anyways.
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Lol I will join you down in hell then :)
The fully clipped elegant is only in a 100g fill rug, he is a little over weight but he is slowly slimming down.
 
Using energy to keep warm is a good way for humans and horses to burn calories. Horses are very efficient at regulating body temperature, so as long as it isn't left wet and shivering, it's fine.
 
cptrayes said:
Sorry Wagtail, but there is now some medical guidance that it's a great way to lose weight. Apparently, not only does it use calories but it changes fat into healthier brown fat to be cold. I recently saw advice to remove stubborn fat patches by putting ice packs on them. My brother has routinely used winter outdoor swimming as a weight control device, and if I'm a bit porky I will deliberately under dress for a football match.
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Does getting a cold shower also help speed up your metabolism too or is that a load of tosh?
 
Wagtail said:
But we are only getting cold for an hour or two. This horse is out 24/7. I really wouldn't object to putting a horse out without a rug clipped if it was only for a couple of hours, but not all night long. It's going to be miserable.
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What is the difference between being cold due to insufficient food wearing a rug, and cold due to insufficient food not wearing a rug?


A bellyful of food.

Besides which, horses are great self regulators of heat and it will be mobilising fat to keep warm, it will not necessarily be cold (though I would check at midnight and early morning).

Do horses grow winter coats just to keep warm? No, they grow winter coats because there is not enough food around in the winter to keep warm. If they have enough fat use up, there is no reason why they should be unacceptably cold.
 
WelshD said:
I'm over 20 stone. I hope to goodness my doctor doesn't read this!!
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Well ... now you know what to do WelshD ... strip down to your scanties and go and stand in a field til Christmas!! You'll be in a size 8 in no time!!!!

.... but seriously ... this is a just ridiculous IMO. To the person who said they go cold water swimming or "under dress" for outdoor sports, well good for you. You can make your own decisions and subject yourself to uncomfortable levels of chill factor for short periods if you choose. But to deliberately allow your horse to get cold just to shift a bit of weight .... beggars belief to me.

ETA ... just because a horse isn't actually shivering, does not mean it's not uncomfortably chilled.
 
Greylegs said:
Well ... now you know what to do WelshD ... strip down to your scanties and go and stand in a field til Christmas!! You'll be in a size 8 in no time!!!!

.... but seriously ... this is a just ridiculous IMO. To the person who said they go cold water swimming or "under dress" for outdoor sports, well good for you. You can make your own decisions and subject yourself to uncomfortable levels of chill factor for short periods if you choose. But to deliberately allow your horse to get cold just to shift a bit of weight .... beggars belief to me.

ETA ... just because a horse isn't actually shivering, does not mean it's not uncomfortably chilled.
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I don't believe that the horse will be cold. I believe that it will be doing what it is well adapted to doing, using up fat to keep warm.

I would check it to make sure, but honestly guys, if you think it's that much of a problem how come any of you clip your horses bellies and leave them uncovered?
 
cptrayes said:
What is the difference between being cold due to insufficient food wearing a rug, and cold due to insufficient food not wearing a rug?


A bellyful of food.

Besides which, horses are great self regulators of heat and it will be mobilising fat to keep warm, it will not necessarily be cold (though I would check at midnight and early morning).

Do horses grow winter coats just to keep warm? No, they grow winter coats because there is not enough food around in the winter to keep warm. If they have enough fat use up, there is no reason why they should be unacceptably cold.
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I personally would rather diet to lose weight than be cold. I just do not agree with clipping all the coat off horses and then putting them out in this weather naked or with a no fill rug on. If the OP was feeding enough to make up for the amount of shivering the horse would do then it would cancel out the weight loss in any case. It is perfectly possible to provide a horse with constant trickle fed forage whilst it is losing weight and still keeping warm. My own mare was never without feed of some kind (soaked hay in trickle nets or soaked chopped straw) and she lost 130 kg over the space of 9 months. She was always warm and a good doer. She was actually too thin by the end, poor thing, and I would never have shaved that much weight off a non laminitis prone horse, but I am just saying that a horse can still lose weight even when they are never stood without forage. In the wild in winter they are designed to live on very slim pickings. Slim but a constant trickle. It is what nature intended. Nature didn't intend them to have their coats shaved off and to stand around shivering.
 
My cob only had a 100g rug on all last winter with a full clip. This was not for weight loss. Anything thicker and she is too hot. I rug according to the weather and the horses needs, I would not like the thought of them being cold.
 
Wagtail said:
I personally would rather diet to lose weight than be cold. I just do not agree with clipping all the coat off horses and then putting them out in this weather naked or with a no fill rug on. If the OP was feeding enough to make up for the amount of shivering the horse would do then it would cancel out the weight loss in any case. It is perfectly possible to provide a horse with constant trickle fed forage whilst it is losing weight and still keeping warm. My own mare was never without feed of some kind (soaked hay in trickle nets or soaked chopped straw) and she lost 130 kg over the space of 9 months. She was always warm and a good doer. She was actually too thin by the end, poor thing, and I would never have shaved that much weight off a non laminitis prone horse, but I am just saying that a horse can still lose weight even when they are never stood without forage. In the wild in winter they are designed to live on very slim pickings. Slim but a constant trickle. It is what nature intended. Nature didn't intend them to have their coats shaved off and to stand around shivering.
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Wagtail I don't know about you but when I diet I get cold.

No, nature did not intend them to have their coats shaved off and stand around in the cold. Nature intended them to starve all winter, lose a substantial amount of weight, and the weaker/thinner ones to die.
 
Each horse is different. We have a TB here that is the neshest horse I have ever come across. I found him shivering one evening in the summer when it had been raining, but it was 18 degrees! He was therefore wearing a medium light rug most nights and some days all through summer. All the others would have had heat stroke! My old mare was a very hot horse and so only had a heavyweight on if she was fully clipped and out in minus 5 or below. A medium no neck rug was sufficient the rest of the winter.
 
I know someone who tried this with a New Forest pony. Said pony only had a trace clip, but she spent all day, every day, standing at the very back of the field away from the herd looking totally miserable. After a few weeks the owner decided to rug her again and she was back to her happy self.

Under-rugging sounds like the best idea. If we decide to remove their coat, their protection from the cold, then we should at least give something back.
 
cptrayes said:
Wagtail I don't know about you but when I diet I get cold.

No, nature did not intend them to have their coats shaved off and stand around in the cold. Nature intended them to starve all winter, lose a substantial amount of weight, and the weaker/thinner ones to die.
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I feel the cold very easily, lol. I only need to slim during the summer though because my work load is far less. I only have to look at a chip and I balloon :D. But in winter I can eat normally as I work it all off. But I always wrap up really warm.
 
I don't think you can directly compare humans and horses, they have evolved completely differently. And even a fully clipped horse still has a layer of hair that regrows reasonably quickly.

No I wouldn't personally turn a fully clipped horse out overnight naked. But I would definitely steer towards significant under rugging than starvation. In reality I think there is a balance between the 2 to be had
 
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