Two reins on a dutch gag/bubble bit

One rein or two?

  • Total voters
    0
Tazhazzareindeer said:
yes someone gave me this piccie which was helpful, it gives me the impression that if you rotate your thumbs towards your stomach you bring the curb into action? i am sure i'll get the hang!
doublerein.jpg

ah right, boss told me opposite but that is probably because her tb is strong (i should know the bugger took off with me round and round the school!) :p:p
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This website explains the whys and hows really well:)
http://www.sustainabledressage.net/tack/bridle.php#kandar
Just scroll down to the Double Bridle section.


Tazhazzareindeer said:
i didn't think that at all! :p
so sorry for being dumb here but what is the purpose of the back strap? i can't find a picture...:confused:
:)
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It's a curb strap, same as on a pelham or a weymouth, and it stops the bit from rotating too far, pulling the cheekpieces forward and the mouthpiece up against the back teeth.:)
 
faerie666 said:
This website explains the whys and hows really well:)
http://www.sustainabledressage.net/tack/bridle.php#kandar
Just scroll down to the Double Bridle section.



It's a curb strap, same as on a pelham or a weymouth, and it stops the bit from rotating too far, pulling the cheekpieces forward and the mouthpiece up against the back teeth.:)
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that baffled me! :o

however i was interested to read about the bit i use and purpose of curb strap. if i can find one that will attach onto my gag i think i will use one.
 
ditto the old flash strap! I would put it from the little ring that the cheeckpieces attach to :)

Just stops the shack rotating too far, usual fitting would be so it stops at 45 degrees, same with a curb chain :)
 
no you can still use the drop, the back strap will probably fit better with a drop as it can end up sitting the same sort of height as a cavasson :)

I usually say 2 fingers flat against the jaw, so one fingers width loose in effect, but you can sort of see its right, in that if you pull the bit back to 45 degrees to the mouth, the back strap should then be putting pressure on the underside of the jaw/stopping the bit rotating :)

http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?q=ba...tart=0&ndsp=26&ved=1t:429,r:0,s:0&tx=87&ty=61

this kind of shows how they sit :)
 
Cheiro1 said:
no you can still use the drop, the back strap will probably fit better with a drop as it can end up sitting the same sort of height as a cavasson :)

I usually say 2 fingers flat against the jaw, so one fingers width loose in effect, but you can sort of see its right, in that if you pull the bit back to 45 degrees to the mouth, the back strap should then be putting pressure on the underside of the jaw/stopping the bit rotating :)

http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?q=ba...tart=0&ndsp=26&ved=1t:429,r:0,s:0&tx=87&ty=61

this kind of shows how they sit :)
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okay, thankyou :)
and i take it this is much kinder to horse!
 
I used to ride and compete my old showjumper in double reins and a curb, when i got him he was on one rein on the lowest ring and stupidly strong and difficult - double reins an actual sweetie and soft as putty!
 
Tazhazzareindeer said:
not as harsh as some, but that is just my opinion. :)
i would rather have her in that and half halt to slow and have control jumping than have to use my hands strongly with a snaffle bit in her mouth.

.
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Oh I see..... So it's like having handlebar brakes...

So, tell me what is wrong with your legs?
 
Two always. My old TB is in one, and has been since we managed to change him out of the long american gag that he came with (along with drop nose band, caveson and standing martingale......)

Its not great though I have to say, and the bottom rein is in case of emergency.
 
Brandy said:
Two always. My old TB is in one, and has been since we managed to change him out of the long american gag that he came with (along with drop nose band, caveson and standing martingale......)

Its not great though I have to say, and the bottom rein is in case of emergency.
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ETA - he is an ex polo pony if that makes a difference!
 
Absolutely two reins - always. The whole point of them is that they are used like a double bridle. It frightens me to death to see horses being dragged about round jumping courses with a single rein on the bottom ring. I once, as an experiment, dropped the rein to the top ring and just used the bottom ring and my poor horse reacted like she had been stung. Head up in the air and it was obvious it really hurt.
 
fornema said:
Would always ride double on a gag but hate the bit personally and hate riding in them i ride in a pelham with 2 reins, although saying that the fact that so many have ticked 2 is laughable as how often have you seen ANYONE riding double in a gag at a show? Definitly not over 50% ride double in a gag i think i may have seen one this year during the show season :O
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Wrong. I did workers and showjumping in double reins. The reason you see so many with a single rein is because so few people know how to use the bit correctly, and then their buddies all copy them the same as fashions for gadgets come and go.
 
I think the reason that you rarely see people riding in a dutch gag with two reins and a curb strap is that often when people understand the bit well enough to know why you need to do this they also understand that this bit is not a great solution and they use something else. A cheltenham or a pelham perhaps depending upon what they are trying to acheive.

Personally I'm not a fan of the bit, but if I was going to use one i'd use two reins and a back strap. But it would be low on my list of bits to try. I can't think of a single horse I've ridden that has gone better in a dutch gag than something else.... and certainly adding a second rein gets better results than riding off one rein as the horse is less inclined to fight against it or tuck in behind the contact.
 
Really I'm just pleased that my horse went really well with the double reins on and i'm also going to put a curb strap on.

she has a snaffle bridle also, but i use the gag for jumping or fast work as she really respects it.
 
I voted 'other' as I avoid using them. I don't like the action of the bit and it wouldn't suit my horses anyway. One is ridden bitless and the other is in a baucher frenchlink or a cambridge mouth pelham with two reins and a lip strap. If I did use one it would probably be a last resort but would always use two reins. I did know they were supposed to be used with two reins but I didn't know about the 'curb' strap. Makes sense when you think about it :rolleyes:
 
saffytessa said:
I voted 'other' as I avoid using them. I don't like the action of the bit and it wouldn't suit my horses anyway. One is ridden bitless and the other is in a baucher frenchlink or a cambridge mouth pelham with two reins and a lip strap. If I did use one it would probably be a last resort but would always use two reins. I did know they were supposed to be used with two reins but I didn't know about the 'curb' strap. Makes sense when you think about it :rolleyes:
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i wish they would use a curb on the cob at college, he is ridden with one rein on the bottom ring and by novices. always throwing his head in the air and shaking it or tucking nose right into his chest.
 
None of my horses are ridden in them as I generally am not a fan of the bit itself. I would never, ever, use it with one rein on the bottom ring yet I would be inclined to use it on the second ring with one rein if needs be. Generally however I would use two reins if I used the bit on one of my horses, the choice of which rein you use I think is really beneficial, rather than just yanking at the mouth constantly on the bottom ring.

The dutch gag is a lot harsher than I think most people realise!
 
Interesting thread this as I have just bought a horse who has come with this type of bit. It had the one rein fitted one the lowest hole. The horse is said to be fiesty and strong. Just ridden him for the first time and he is indeed very shap, but the bit seemed far to severe for him so I added a rein to the top and he was happier - still quick though. I think as he's so sharp people have tried to slow him down with a harsh bit, that or it's simply been fitted because a lot of show jumpers seem to like them (he came from a competion yard)
Anyway now I have to try and find something more suitable for him, I'm thinking of trying a simple snaffle just to see what he does in it. I'll have to make sure my seat belt is on!
 
Tazhazzareindeer said:
yep. nothing that can be done though unfortunately.
it's because he's a small strong and whizzy chap
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Rubbish. With how I imagine he is being treated...

I bet he's a small, scared and nervous chap!!!!

ANY horse can be made to respond in a plain snaffle if schooled well enough. I myself had a "strong" horse who so say could ONLY go in a PELHAM.

From advice on here, I reschooled MYSELF aswell as the HORSE and do you know what? He now does a xc round in a simple snaffle.
 
tallyhohoho said:
Rubbish. With how I imagine he is being treated...

I bet he's a small, scared and nervous chap!!!!

ANY horse can be made to respond in a plain snaffle if schooled well enough. I myself had a "strong" horse who so say could ONLY go in a PELHAM.

From advice on here, I reschooled MYSELF aswell as the HORSE and do you know what? He now does a xc round in a simple snaffle.
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the horses at college are well treated...he isn't scared or nervous :confused:
that's nice for your horse, but not every horse on planet earth can go in a snaffle. and as the bit keeps my horse sensible jumping i'll continue to use it for that purpose.
the rest of her work is done in a plain french link snaffle as she has two bridles normally.

and when i said nothing that can be done, i meant the college aren't allowed to change the horse's tack...
 
Tazhazzareindeer said:
the horses at college are well treated...he isn't scared or nervous :confused:
that's nice for your horse, but not every horse on planet earth can go in a snaffle. and as the bit keeps my horse sensible jumping i'll continue to use it for that purpose.
the rest of her work is done in a plain french link snaffle as she has two bridles normally.

and when i said nothing that can be done, i meant the college aren't allowed to change the horse's tack...
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I disagree tazz.

I think all horses can go well in just a snaffle. most of the hunt horses go in a snaffle.

I guess it's up to the rider to teach it how. Before the one I spoke about, every horse I had went in a mild bit or no bit.

This is the only one I had an issue with. If you read my a year ago I would be on your side of the argument on bits for control. I guess I was converted.

I'm not trying to convert you but just trying to say there are more reasons for a horse to be "strong" than just his 'personality'.
 
tallyhohoho said:
I'm not trying to convert you but just trying to say there are more reasons for a horse to be "strong" than just his 'personality'.
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I agree with that ^^^

But I'm not "bits are for control" :confused:
If a horse can go in a snaffle, I have it in a snaffle. My mare's usual bridle is a snaffle bridle. But for faster work outside of the school/jumping she has the gag, and respects it and I don't have heavy or hard hands so she respects it and likes it.

Each to their own.
 
I have found with some horses that get whizzy they are more controllable in a snaffle than the dutch gag as you have something in your hand and they accept the contact rather than evading it all together. They may still be fast or strong but you have something to work with.

Often the speed control needs to come from your seat, legs and shoulders rather than your hands. I used to ride a cob that went in a dutch gag, with the gag in he would often tuck behind the contact and evade it. To jump in a snaffle he would be fast and strong but this could be dealt with by riding him up into the contact and slowing him with your body, keeping your leg on and your shoulders back. He was best in a simple french link snaffle but he was in a riding school and too many people felt they didn't have brakes in a snaffle so he went in the gag, the reason they couldn't slow him down was because their riding wasn't at a level where they understood or had the control to do so properly.

I'm not saying that is always the case, I have ridden horses that need a stronger bit for some activities, but I would rather use a kimblewick or wilkie/universal if I need extra brakes with just one rein. If I was planning to ride with a dutch gag I would use two reins. It isn't that difficult to learn and gives you the ability to use the gag action when you need it.
 
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