Ups and *downs* of dressage

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AbFab

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Pfffffffffffffft


So we went to our local dressage comp again on Saturday. I had entered the elementary thinking it was E42, but realised on Thursday it was E50. Looked at the test and fell about laughing. 10m circles in collected canter, simple changes on half 10m circles....our working canter is just about passable on a good day :D Anyway, was doing the novice too and the ele looked like a fun test, if a tad impossible for us, so went along with it. I tried it once on Friday evening and she was great, so that buoyed me quite a bit.

The grass was quite wet on Saturday but the land drains well so we were alright with me taking it steady. She warmed up nicely and we went in for the elementary (that was first, novice 2nd..hmm). She was SUCH a sweetheart. She really listened and did everything I asked. Yes there were times when she could've been more through and round, yes some of our transitions could've been clearer, but 10m circles on wet grass are a bit squeaky at the best of times! I was thrilled to bits with her as we came out :D










We then had 15mins to warm up for the novice, so I let her walk around on a loose rein for 10mins before having a quick trot and canter. We were cantering along no problem, turned slightly at the top of the warm up area and wham...back end went from under her and we both went crashing to the floor :( I leapt into the air and dived on her to check on her, shaking like a leaf (me, not her!). She was shocked, but fine. No scrapes, no sore bits, thank goodness. Not a single steward came to see if we were ok. I'm disgusted with the venue to be honest. If a horse falls, you go see if they're ok. You don't stand and stare from the other side of the field. Thankfully, Saffy and I are used to doing things by ourselves, so we were ok. I walked her around for a bit and then trotted her up. She was fine. I decided to take her in for the novice and if she felt at all hesitant or unbalanced I'd pull up.

Again, she did a lovely job. I rode very carefully, not pushing the canter on the circles etc and just generally nannying her around. I was still very pleased with her, she was so obedient and sweet.















It was a bit rainy :D

I went to see our scores and we got 57 in the elementary and 58 in the novice. To say I was gutted is an understatement. I really felt like we had both improved and done, on the whole, decent tests. They are 2 of our lowest ever marks. Was so let down. We've been working so hard and she has been doing such a good job, yet we get awful marks. It seems the better and more 'correct' she is working, the lower our marks get!!

AND!! The horse before me in the novice went wrong at least 4 times, so should've been eliminated. She didn't even finish the test. She got 56%!!! To only get 2% higher than a horse that didn't even finish the test is just insulting. And no, the moves it *did* do weren't worthy of Valegro or anything.

So I've made the decision to let dressage take a back seat for a bit. It's soul destroying continuing the way we are. I love schooling her and seeing her improve, but getting marks like that just takes all the enjoyment away. Having to hire transport too makes it a very expensive way to get upset. I'm not throwing in the towel, just taking a good break. I want to do something else with her, something where she won't be at a disadvantage because of her build etc. I'm thinking maybe TREC or some low-level endurance? I know very little about both of those things, so any advice anyone could give me on getting into either would be very much appreciated!

Haven't got much to offer, shopping is tomorrow! Have Bran Flakes though if anyone made it all the way through my rambling :)
 
Glad you and saffy are ok after the fall ad horrific that no one came to check you were both ok. Re scores am not really qualified to give much advice other than get someone to video you as sometimes as riders we don't get as full a picture of a test as those on the ground do. And run through the video with your instructor.
 
That is such a shame, and I agree very disheartening when your score is lower than expected. What were the comments that the judge made? Any particular theme throughout i.e shows tension ? You both look very smart though I love her browband :-) don't give up, one judges ok horse is another judges favourite
 
The main theme is usually that she needs to work more from behind, which I definitely acknowledge that she does need to do more consistently. Without wanting to sound like a failure, I'm just sick of trying :) She's build downhill, massive front end, huge neck, it's just a massively uphill battle. I want to have fun, which I do when schooling. I'm not sure what route we're going to take now, but I'm definitely interested in trying something new.
 
And OMG how fat is she looking now?!?! They're out in the summer fields and she's just ballooned. Wonder if I could attempt to get a muzzle on her? Hmmm...how much do I value my life?
 
I find dressage frustrating for this reason too (with a highland - he's never going to move like Valegro, but if he's correct and obedient he does actually deserve better marks than a flashy moving, but incorrect WB :rolleyes: ).

Where abouts are you in the country?
 
She's just so lovely!!! :D

We've been there, don't worry, dressage judges can be strange creatures, and there is definitely a lot of prejudice. (flashy wb types getting placed higher than others even if they did a worse test). What were the comments?
 
Don't be too disheartened. She looks lovely in the pics. This has happened to me as well, I really thought we were getting loads better but we started getting much worse marks. I too was on the verge of giving up. I even got really brave and posted a video on here. I had some really useful feedback and have been working on the suggestions very hard with my instructor. Between trying to make him more forwards AND attempt sitting trot we had lost suppleness through too much tension. Some judges also don't like certain horses so just keep trying, and try to judge against your own benchmarks for progress not just the %. Easier said than done I know from experience. My horse will always struggle because of his tongue issues but I want to move up the levels and as long as everything else is correct, I have accepted we won't go to regionals any time soon. However half pass is getting better and I had never even done it before this horse so take satisfaction in what you CAN do- and enjoy your lovely horse :-)
 
Hope you're both ok after the fall.
With regards to the dressage marks not being there, I know exactly what you mean! Been there, done that, still struggling. Stressage has also taken a back seat here but due to lameness :(

Perhaps drop yourselves down a level. Enter a prelim HC and then do a novice. Sometimes if things aren't working out, slow it all down, pull it apart and rebuild it.

Good luck :)
 
Don't get disheartened, it was just a bad day. Horrible that you slipped over, and very mean that noone came to help. But you did really well - the photos show a very sweet little horse and to get approaching 60% in an elementary in those conditions isn't at all bad. Onwards and upwards. :) x
 
Oh how irritating is that! She looks lovely in the pictures. Don't give up I went up to elementary on my little welsh section D and I had something similar. I worked so hard and after a lot of patience our marks did improve!
 
Oh, you poor thing! As I looked at the pics of you doing E50 on grass I though "Blimin' heck that's brave" must have been really slippy.

As for giving up....really dont. Really smart pony - get yourself a decent trainer and keep going. Chunks is down hill and a lump and he is doing PSG now, so if he can do it, so can you :)
 
I think that's a great score doing a difficult test, in difficult conditions on what is not (as you say) a natural dressage horse. You must be doing a lot of things right! It is disheartening when things don't go to plan but I don't think you should beat yourself up. Trying TREC would be fun though, I'm tempted to give it a go myself...
 
I agree with Ferdinase, get yourself a good instructor and crack on - you obviously have the desire and commitment to improve, and saffy is so sweet and really tries for you (love the second pic btw, she looks like she is laughing) :).
Can't believe nobody at least came to check you were ok after she fell - where were you, Bolton ? Mine crashed during to the ground during an actual test at rochdale once (party due to shocking ground but also due to the little toad taking a great leap as he wanted to buck) but at least the judge got out to check everything was ok !
 
I dont think your scores are that bad, as you say she probably isnt a natural dressage horse and at elem most horses are pretty well established in their frame, are becoming more uphill and showing bigger moves for mediums etc so i wouldnt worry about it, maybe take her down a level to get some confidence building outings?
 
She's just lovely and your position is superb :) Don't be disheartened just think 'another day another judge' - that's the problem with dressage and showing it can be too subjective and some judges are generous others not so. Annoying when you compare yourself to another and feel let down by the judge.

As for the built downhill - the thing is that the judge should judge the horse in front of them and how that horse performs for it's 'type'. Around here in Essex at local level I have found the judging to be fair (I ride a cob), just note that judge's name and avoid them would be my advice.
 
Well done! I have a thoroughbred that the judges don't like really, pretty & flashy paces! Oh she's a chestnut mare with attitude too ;). Can never win sometimes!
 
Carry on with your dressage, but do try some TREC and endurance - the best thing about Saffy's type of horse is that they are so much fun, and so versatile.
Years ago I used to help a friend with his riding school horses - all cobs,and his philosophy was that to be good school horses they needed to have fun with a more experienced rider too.
So my husband and I used to take two of the bigger cobs off on fun rides, to local shows for WH, hunter trials, local dressage and I even did a team chase on the heavyweight part ID. They adored it and so did we - I have a great pic of the two cobs tied up to the back of the trailer at a fun ride, tangled up in each others ropes, shoulder to shoulder and looking so happy!Trec was in its infancy then, but it would have been ideal for them.
One comment about dressage on grass - does she have stud holes? We also used to show the cobs a bit, especially in side saddle classes and they were so much more surefooted on grass with little studs in.
Does she have any appy papers? Even if you are not into showing as such, the BAPS/APHC shows have some fun classes, plus they have dressage and SJ at their champs show.
 
You have my sympathies. She is a lovely mare and you obviously try very hard.

I am not meaning to sound like a cowbag here I promise but personally, if I were you, I would get a decent trainer (if you haven't already) drop her back down to prelim/novice for the rest of the summer and find a venue that isn't on grass. I think she is already at an unfair disadvantage at a venue on grass (aren't they all?) A nice proper surface would probably help her and give her a bit more confidence to come up and 'through' a bit more. The fall won't have helped (appaling btw that nobody came to see if you were okay, disgusting :mad:)

I know it's all meant to be fun and there are no hard and fast rules about what people 'should' do but personally, I don't see the point in just competing at a level just for the sake of competing at it, you may as well wait until you are truly working properly for the level before stepping up to it. At Elementary (well around here anyway) a lot of the horses are beggining to get more established in their mediums, consistentcy of the outline, stronger over their backs and more through etc. I would want my horse being the same before putting them in at that level.

I really hope I don't come across as a witch :o as I think Saffy is fab and more than capable and that you do a fantastic job with her, I just think everything needs to be more fine tuned and perhaps a venue with a surface for a proper elem debut.
 
JFTD said:
I find dressage frustrating for this reason too (with a highland - he's never going to move like Valegro, but if he's correct and obedient he does actually deserve better marks than a flashy moving, but incorrect WB :rolleyes: ).

Where abouts are you in the country?
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Frustrating isn't it? I'm in Lancashire. I really struggle with transport now since I sold my lovely little box but I'm hoping that situation will improve when I move next month to a much bigger yard.

RiderLizzie said:
Perhaps drop yourselves down a level. Enter a prelim HC and then do a novice. Sometimes if things aren't working out, slow it all down, pull it apart and rebuild it.

Good luck :)
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Farma said:
I dont think your scores are that bad, as you say she probably isnt a natural dressage horse and at elem most horses are pretty well established in their frame, are becoming more uphill and showing bigger moves for mediums etc so i wouldnt worry about it, maybe take her down a level to get some confidence building outings?
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I think when we start again I'll go back to prelim and novice. Thing is, I did so many competitions last season when I had my little wagon that I was bored to tears with prelim, so moved up a level even though I know we're not really ready for elementary yet. The change in movements etc just injected a bit of variety into our schooling, although there's no reason I can't school at elementary (or something resembling it!!) and compete at prelim/novice.

Ferdinase514 said:
Oh, you poor thing! As I looked at the pics of you doing E50 on grass I though "Blimin' heck that's brave" must have been really slippy.

As for giving up....really dont. Really smart pony - get yourself a decent trainer and keep going. Chunks is down hill and a lump and he is doing PSG now, so if he can do it, so can you :)
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Looking back, it really was quite daft of them to run E50 on wet grass. I don't think it's a big mystery why there are only ever 3 people in the ele classes!! After our break (including a house and yard move!) I'm going to look into getting a new instructor. I'll be in a completely new place so will be able to start on a clean slate. If anyone knows any good instructors around Chorley (Lancs), let me know!


cobden99 said:
I agree with Ferdinase, get yourself a good instructor and crack on - you obviously have the desire and commitment to improve, and saffy is so sweet and really tries for you (love the second pic btw, she looks like she is laughing) :).
Can't believe nobody at least came to check you were ok after she fell - where were you, Bolton ?
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Yep Bolton! It used to be great, not sure what has happened but it doesn't have the same feel as before. Last time I got told off for warming up in the wrong place (everyone warms up everywhere..), being told 'you don't want to annoy the judge if she's judging your class' (obviously ridiculous to think they might just judge the movements and not let their personal opinion creep in!), then being told I had to go in 10mins before my time because the person before me hadn't shown up and they didn't want to leave the judge waiting. Don't think I'll be returning in too much of a hurry! Anyway sorry, bit of a rant there..

Yes Saffy is a sweetheart and she really does try to please bless her :) I hope to find a good instructor that we both click with once we've moved house.


ironhorse said:
Carry on with your dressage, but do try some TREC and endurance - the best thing about Saffy's type of horse is that they are so much fun, and so versatile.


One comment about dressage on grass - does she have stud holes? We also used to show the cobs a bit, especially in side saddle classes and they were so much more surefooted on grass with little studs in.


Does she have any appy papers? Even if you are not into showing as such, the BAPS/APHC shows have some fun classes, plus they have dressage and SJ at their champs show.
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I do love how versatile she is :) She might not be a world beater at anything, but we can have lots of fun at a range of things!

She doesn't have stud holes in. She's only shod in front at the moment and I've always found studs more hassle than they have been worth for what we do - although saying that I never expected her to crash to the ground! It's definitely something I'll look in to if we end up doing more dressage on grass, but I do think I need to stick to surface venues for a while now :) Preferably indoors...with a good cafe :)

She doesn't have any appy papers unfortunately. Her passport is very vague and has no breeding on there whatsoever. I've tried to contact the first registered owner multiple times but to no avail. She must have a decent amount of appy genes though - she's got the mottled skin, blue round eyes etc.

Perfect_Pirouette said:
You have my sympathies. She is a lovely mare and you obviously try very hard.

I am not meaning to sound like a cowbag here I promise but personally, if I were you, I would get a decent trainer (if you haven't already) drop her back down to prelim/novice for the rest of the summer and find a venue that isn't on grass. I think she is already at an unfair disadvantage at a venue on grass (aren't they all?) A nice proper surface would probably help her and give her a bit more confidence to come up and 'through' a bit more. The fall won't have helped (appaling btw that nobody came to see if you were okay, disgusting :mad:)

I know it's all meant to be fun and there are no hard and fast rules about what people 'should' do but personally, I don't see the point in just competing at a level just for the sake of competing at it, you may as well wait until you are truly working properly for the level before stepping up to it. At Elementary (well around here anyway) a lot of the horses are beggining to get more established in their mediums, consistentcy of the outline, stronger over their backs and more through etc. I would want my horse being the same before putting them in at that level.

I really hope I don't come across as a witch :o as I think Saffy is fab and more than capable and that you do a fantastic job with her, I just think everything needs to be more fine tuned and perhaps a venue with a surface for a proper elem debut.
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No don't worry I completely agree! :D As I've said somewhere near the top of this mammoth reply, the main reason I moved up to ele was because I was so sick of monotonous prelims! But I fully acknowledge we're not properly at an elementary level yet. I'll definitely get back down to basics once we start up again and start a fresh with prelims and perhaps the odd novice :)
 
Go do some BD competitions. You can do the prelim non qualifiers with both of you unregistered.
The judging is often squiffy in unaffiliated. My baby horse got 51% in N28 in an unaffiliated for a test that should have been low 60's. She did everything where she should have, no bloopers, just a little babyish. I've competed and trained to a high enough level to know roughly what mark to expect and judge dressage myself up to elementary level.
Took her to a BD comp this weekend and she was rather norty plus she had issues with a large boggy patch in the middle of the arena due to overwatering (tough, but she has to learn to get on with it in those circumstances.) We got through both tests after a fashion with lots of mistakes and few strops and came out with a well deserved 55% (N28) and 54% (N35) from a judge who is known to be harsh but fair. Marks ranged from 2 to 7 and comments were spot on. It does highlight the difference in judging between a trained judge and someone who is not trained. You still get some not so fab judging affiliated but as a general rule you will get a much better guide to your progress
 
We've done quite a few BD comps, all at prelim (I'm registered, she isn't) and she's done ok to qualify for the areas last season. The problem I have around here though, pretty much all the judges come from the same pool, so a lot of the unaffiliated judges are also BD judges (though not all). There are a couple that I know I will get a fair mark under, but so many that consistently award higher marks to horses that don't always deserve it. I do like to see a good range of marks used though. I hate it when something is pretty rubbish and gets a 6, then something is miles better but just gets a 7. Give me a 2 if I deserve a 2!! But then please give me an 8 if it was good :D
 
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