Vets have me at my wits end..

ElectricChampagne

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So I have always been feeding my now 9 yr old pom Markus muhle and he's done well on it. It is chicken based. Last November he started having bad diarrhea and vomiting. I also noticed he was getting itchy and his skin was dry. Went off his food and had a massively noisy tummy. Would keep me awake at night.
Vet trip and he was wormed, put on steroids and antibiotics, seemed to clear his issues. Guardia was blamed.
Advised to feed home cooked chicken and rice. Which I duly did.

Three more bouts and same outcome, but he'd always improve on ste steroids.

One evening about a month ago he had explosive diarrhea with a considerable amount of blood in it. Refused his grub but was happy and playing away with his little puppy brother.

Original vet was quite dismissive on the phone (different practice though) so as it was an emergency we tried another nearby practice.

Got him in, got bloods done tested for parvo which was thankfully negative and he has protein losing enteropathy. Very low blood protein, and calcium readings. Told he was a high seizure risk due to low calcium.

Sent home with high dose wormer, antibiotics and steroids, to come back a day later for more tests, an ultrasound and to be put on a drip.

Weekend of worry and running between home and vets.

Thankfully he improved on fluids, and his ultrasound didn't show up lymphangiectasia which was assumed the cause.

He refused the Markus muhle when home so put him on Caesar lamb, just to get him to eat. It's all I could get short notice . He went bonkers for it. As he was eating it and turning his nose up at others I kept him on it.

Anyway he improved and finished his wormers and antibiotics, but stayed on steroids. Back in for an ultrasound about a week later. Couldn't find his spleen!

But no lymphangiectasia seen this time either and bloods had improved, not quite normal levels but massively up since the original test.

In the meantime kept him eating the lamb Caesar and he was happy, bright and playful.

Accidentally gave him a chicken version and back to diarrhea and itchy.

So he is allergic to chicken!!
Said this to the vet as we had another blood test the next evening.
Knew bloods wouldn't be great as his tummy was sore from the chicken.
So bloods came back slightly increased in protein compared to last and not back to normal yet.

Vet said she needs to consult the practice and figure out what medicine he needs to go on.

Rang twice days later, keep him on steroids (I had asked about reducing this as he's now hyper and got the jitters) and to put him on something that's for humans to help blood platelets.
Immediately he was to be changed to royal canin hypoallergenic. It's high protein, low fat apparently. But no chicken in it and no ingredients on the tin. Whatever. None

Oh my word we were back to explosion diarrhea within one meal. Refusing to eat.

Googled the ingredients and eventually found them, 6.4% protein from poultry sources, 22% fat (low how is that low) and 1.2% fibre.
Back on Caesar lamb and he's back eating and got solid poos again. It's not the best food but he eats it with no reaction until I can find an alternative.
I should have protested because I knew the RC is pure ditch water but I didn't. Annoyed at myself.

Anyway... I believe he's got ibd from chicken allergies
Vets want to keep doing more and more and more tests, which are very expensive. Feel like they think I'm the sort that will do anything and am ABIT if a cash cow.
Anyone any experience of protein losing enteropathy in dogs? Any suggestions on how to manage my next vet appointment next week. I know his bloods will be bad.

Feel like I'm losing him and don't have much time left and I'm so worried because he's the best dog I could wish for...

Sorry for the length of this post!
 
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Auslander

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Nothing like as serious as your guy, but my puppy cannot tolerate chicken at all. Vets were a bit dismissive about "food allergies" but I ignored them, went with my gut, and switched him to lamb based kibble. He's absolutely fine on it, so I will happily ignore anyone who tries to make me change his diet
 

ElectricChampagne

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Nothing like as serious as your guy, but my puppy cannot tolerate chicken at all. Vets were a bit dismissive about "food allergies" but I ignored them, went with my gut, and switched him to lamb based kibble. He's absolutely fine on it, so I will happily ignore anyone who tries to make me change his diet
I believe this is the crux of it, he's got a chicken allergy and is fine off it! On vets advice I was unknowingly making him worse by feed it to him.
 

Clodagh

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Very good advice meleeka. Thank you. I feel a bit better now as my gut is telling me they just want to keep testing testing testing and I believe he needs time to heal. My gut tells me he's fine off chicken and needs a break from constant stressful vet visits
If he’s bright eyed and bushy tailed I’d assume he’s ok.
 

Cinnamontoast

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I know I used to be a terror for denigrating supermarket kibble or food advocated by vets (I still am) but I can’t stop wondering why vets, who mostly see dogs/cats in small practices, don’t get a ton more training on nutrition in vet school. Obviously they do further study but to advocate RC containing chicken when the dog reacts so poorly to it is just madness.

I’m another who would say keep him on whatever is going down well not causing issues and stay away from the vets!
 

ElectricChampagne

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I know I used to be a terror for denigrating supermarket kibble or food advocated by vets (I still am) but I can’t stop wondering why vets, who mostly see dogs/cats in small practices, don’t get a ton more training on nutrition in vet school. Obviously they do further study but to advocate RC containing chicken when the dog reacts so poorly to it is just madness.

I’m another who would say keep him on whatever is going down well not causing issues and stay away from the vets!
I am not a fan of the supermarket stuff either. I detest the vet advised crap too.

To say I'm livid over the prescription diet is an understatement. I don't understand this need to peddle crap food.

I always followed all about dog food (his tik toks are good!) and tried my best for the dogs.

It's a bloomin minefield.
 

Cinnamontoast

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I am not a fan of the supermarket stuff either. I detest the vet advised crap too.

To say I'm livid over the prescription diet is an understatement. I don't understand this need to peddle crap food.

I always followed all about dog food (his tik toks are good!) and tried my best for the dogs.

It's a bloomin minefield.
I’ve never understood why vets peddle such crap food, but I was told they aren’t sponsored, but then why peddle it? And why are there so many branded items at every vets-measures, cups, everything seems to be from RC or Hills!
 

Pearlsasinger

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Just feed according to the dog in front of you. If he does well on the Cesar, feed him that. Vets can only advise according to their experience. If you keep going back telling them the dog is ill, they will want to test. If you know what is making him ill and how to make him feel better, trust your own judgement.
 

ElectricChampagne

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I’ve never understood why vets peddle such crap food, but I was told they aren’t sponsored, but then why peddle it? And why are there so many branded items at every vets-measures, cups, everything seems to be from RC or Hills!
Exactly, but I suppose the markup on it must be huge so it spins a profit..

Do they not see it makes pets worse in some occasions?
 

ElectricChampagne

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Just feed according to the dog in front of you. If he does well on the Cesar, feed him that. Vets can only advise according to their experience. If you keep going back telling them the dog is ill, they will want to test. If you know what is making him ill and how to make him feel better, trust your own judgement.
So I'm telling them he's doing well, I told them the chicken makes him worse, but they are pushing the tests and bloods etc.

They want to do a bladder scrape next. I said no. They tested his urine and no protein in it so I don't see why they need to go that route. They're pushing for more tests and I keep saying no..

Just feel scammed and they think I'm a cash cow.
 

Spanny

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One of ours doesn't tolerate chicken. He gets the classic itchy/inflammed feet and ears. Apparently it's very common for dogs to react to chicken, which was something I learned only as we were going through identifying and resolving his issue. (Also, how many foods are labelled as 'hypoallergenic' and then contain chicken or poultry somewhere in the ingredients - grrr.)

I'm another who would trust your gut. Keep him on the lamb and if he seems well on that, give his body a chance to heal. You could get bloods run again in a few months to see if the low protein issue has resolved for peace of mind?
 

Clodagh

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So I'm telling them he's doing well, I told them the chicken makes him worse, but they are pushing the tests and bloods etc.

They want to do a bladder scrape next. I said no. They tested his urine and no protein in it so I don't see why they need to go that route. They're pushing for more tests and I keep saying no..

Just feel scammed and they think I'm a cash cow.
Im not taking Scout back for a follow up on his raised kidney levels. He’s had all the extra tests which were fine, the markers were marginal and he looks great. He had a course of abs for a skin issue and is now fat and gleaming.
 

tda

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Just feed according to the dog in front of you. If he does well on the Cesar, feed him that. Vets can only advise according to their experience. If you keep going back telling them the dog is ill, they will want to test. If you know what is making him ill and how to make him feel better, trust your own judgement.
Agree
 

SAujla

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Looks like you are doing really well and vets are getting in the way. When my dog was young I switched her to a chicken kibble as I thought it was better for her and immediately she had diarrhoea problems. I've since ruled out beef, lamb and doggy peanut butter for the same reasons. Stick to what works and it'll settle his stomach. His bloods could be skewed by all that's been going on for him recently
 

Cinnamontoast

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You know what? I’m thinking itchy feet? What are we feeding Goose? Raw chicken, green tripe and the beef mix I got the manufacturers to make. I’m going to take him off the chicken after today, given he had diarrhoea in the woods just now. I’ve a horrible feeling it’s more likely the big treats the OH bought them, but worth experimenting. He had constant diarrhoea as a pup, I think it was the kibble, god knows why I ever decided to put them on that!
 

BallyRoanBaubles

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Agree with the others feed the dog in front of you, my dog isn’t on a ‘good’ kibble but it works for him so he’s staying on it unless he doesn’t do well on it. It’s hard to go against vets advice/wants in regards to tests as you obviously want the best for your dog, I sometimes feel I’m a bad owner if I don’t do as the vets say but you know your dog best. Hope he’s back to normal soon x
 

MissTyc

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I have one who can't have any chicken and another who gets really bad acid reflux from any fatty meats. Vets were honestly useless with both of them, just as they were useless with my previous dog and her chronic pancreatitis.

I now raw feed + a handful of "venison and trout" freeze dried kibblethings in every meal. No idea why it works but both dogs have been perfect for years now. Normal kibble sets off the reflux one, as does raw pork, duck, lamb. Any poultry sets off the other one, but now we have found balance. I don't even tell the vet at this point.
 

CanteringCarrot

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I'll echo feeding the dog what works.

Mine are both on Lamb based diets, but do seem to tolerate chicken when they get some as a treat. If they didn't tolerate something, I wouldn't feed it to them. Simple.

The cat on the other hand...he was eating a combo of really good quality dry and wet foods with ingredients he's always had (certain fish and meats) but was vomiting quite a bit and losing weight. Tests weren't showing anything and the vet always pushes Royal Canin and/or Hills. I did switch him to the Hills just so I could satisfy them, even though I felt like the ingredients were a bit crap, and he's thriving. So f*ck knows! He doesn't vomit anymore and I've had to decrease his food since he was getting fat.

So if it works for the animal, just go with it, I guess is what I'm trying to say. So if it's the Cesar, then stick with that for now. Or find a better quality food without chicken.
 
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Andie02

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Introducing bone broth would probably help a lot and also a good probiotic and Turkey tail mushrooms. I changed our dog's probiotic to Adored Beast Healthy Gut 3 months ago and with the bone broth and Four Leaf Rover Turkey tail mushrooms have seen a big difference (we had the dreaded itchy thing with our dog). Boil & Broth bone broth is convenient to use, there is a choice of flavours, and there are offers available occasionally on their website. Avoiding carbs and sugars is a must with the itchy thing.
Healthful Pets stock the Adored Beast and Four Leaf Rover products and are very helpful should you need advice.


 
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