Vets letter to RCVS

[Irish-Only]

Doing the rounds on fb. Makes me sad as this IS what vets used to be. Apologies to the independent vets who are lovely and look after their clients and patients.

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David Thomson MRCVS

 

[Needtoretire]

Times have changed and not for the better. Very hard to read the letter written by Mr Thomson MRCVS. My vets are still independent, but for how much longer I wonder.

 

[setterlover]

How sad what a good man.very hard to read.
Our vets has been taken over and is no longer independent the prices inevitably have increased and we are pressured to have unnecessary things done.
I took my young puppy in to be weighed so I could buy wormers they weighed him and checked him over and mentioned he had a loose tooth ( a baby tooth not an adult tooth) which I knew about.
They suggested that I should bring him in and have him sedated to remove it
I said surely it will fall out! Oh it would be safer to remove it.I declined saying I would bring him back if there was a problem and guess what it fell out a couple of dates later and has been replaced by an adult tooth no problem.

 

[Backtoblack]

Last year when my dogs vaccine booster was due I took him to vets he got his booster and vet then said he could do with a tooth scale and they'd take out any loose teeth. I've never been back, he's not had his booster this year and unless there's a problem he won't be going to the vets. He's eating ok.My friend took her dog in for a checkup and they removed four of his teeth she was unaware of any problems. These are independent vets. I think it's all about making money.

 

[MiJodsR2BlinkinTite]

We are with an independent equine practice, but how much longer they will remain "independent" is anyone's guess. Previously we were with a lovely practice and our vet was also "the cow vet" - but there was no-one who I'd have trusted more with our horses, not ever. When he retired a few years ago it truly was an end of an era.

 

[SEL]

My cat was prescribed thyronorm in Feb. It was £140 just for the drug on the bill and I've since spotted I can get it for under £50!!

 

[gunnergundog]

Restores your faith in the profession knowing that there is still the odd one about who puts the animal's welfare first. Unfortunately, they are a dying breed.

 

[scruffyponies]

I have a lovely independent equine vet. He understands that some of us are pragmatic, old fashioned and prepared to use time and rest rather than all available tests and treatments with doubtful or inconclusive outcomes. The animals get the treatment they need, and he is open and honest about cost, risk and prognosis.
He supplies homeopathic rubbish to those customers who want it. As he put it 'they'll buy it anyway, and if it's from me the pony will get the medicine it needs too'.

The small animal vets are avoided unless it's something we can't deal with, then they have to be told from the get-go that we aren't just going to pay for whatever they think they can get away with... for example if I have to bring in all 5 dogs to satisfy their requirement to issue a prescription for one of them, I am NOT going to pay 5 consultation fees. Astonishing that you have to agree this beforehand just to get your dog seen.

 

[dougpeg]

I had a similar situation to the one described with my dog. Cut paw which wasn't healing with bandages. Vet wanted to staple under full anaesthetic. I said no that and that I'd hold her still. 2 staples to her paw and job done. Literally took about 30 seconds. Dog didn't even finch.

 

[Alibear]

I use an independent vet practice, but they are rightly popular and the good vets seem to move on so fast that I struggle to get reliable treatment. The newer ones seem to just order endless expensive diagnostic tests rather than looking at the animal and trying to diagnose it.

I'm ashamed to admit I got a bit snitty with one poor nurse who had to tell me that the vet I'd specifically booked and taken my horse in to see was then not available on the day, and we'd be seeing a completely new one. Thankfully the new one was actually a very experienced vet from Newmarket, but within 6 months she was no longer available either.

 

[Fluffypiglet]

We moved vet practice for the cat from one in our own village to one 6 plus miles away. Our cat has thyroid issues and every time we spoke with our village practice they were pushing us to have surgery. Every time. We had discussed it and decided it wasn’t the right thing to do given his age etc but they still kept on about it. The new practice have treated him with medication and he’s still very well (for an older cat). They understand that quality of life is preferred to quantity of life. Unfortunately our vet has left, possibly because there are some ‘management changes’. We are hopeful that we won’t see the standard of care deteriorate.

 

[dorsetladette]

I'm registered with two practices now. One still has the zone visits so the boys have there routine stuff done with them. The other is an independent practice (I think) and emergency things and things I need a pragmatic approach to are all done by them.

 

[Landcruiser]

Doing the rounds on fb. Makes me sad as this IS what vets used to be. Apologies to the independent vets who are lovely and look after their clients and patients.

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David Thomson MRCVS

Who is he? He says he's head of a vet practice in Stoke. Which one? He says he makes a profit on £15 consult charges. Show me the website, so I can check out his story. He says he's dictating and apologises for spelling and grammar mistakes - of which there are many. Including Metacam, one of the most commonly used NSAIDs on the market. He sounds incredibly unprofessional, and the letter is disjointed and full of accusations and statements which are not backed up by evidence.

I declare an interest - I'm a receptionist at a corporate practice, and have seen many changes over the last decade. BUT. I don't believe this letter is a genuine letter from a vet. I've tried to Google him. The RCVS lists a vet called David Thomson graduating in 76, but then the trail gets cold. Anyone can claim to be anyone. I think this person is someone who is or has been in the business, but I don't think he's a practicing vet - happy to be proved wrong.

 

[Rowreach]

Who is he? He says he's head of a vet practice in Stoke. Which one? He says he makes a profit on £15 consult charges. Show me the website, so I can check out his story. He says he's dictating and apologises for spelling and grammar mistakes - of which there are many. Including Metacam, one of the most commonly used NSAIDs on the market. He sounds incredibly unprofessional, and the letter is disjointed and full of accusations and statements which are not backed up by evidence.

I declare an interest - I'm a receptionist at a corporate practice, and have seen many changes over the last decade. BUT. I don't believe this letter is a genuine letter from a vet. I've tried to Google him. The RCVS lists a vet called David Thomson graduating in 76, but then the trail gets cold. Anyone can claim to be anyone. I think this person is someone who is or has been in the business, but I don't think he's a practicing vet - happy to be proved wrong.

His Facebook page is very open if you really want to check him out.

 

[sollimum]

Who is he? He says he's head of a vet practice in Stoke. Which one? He says he makes a profit on £15 consult charges. Show me the website, so I can check out his story. He says he's dictating and apologises for spelling and grammar mistakes - of which there are many. Including Metacam, one of the most commonly used NSAIDs on the market. He sounds incredibly unprofessional, and the letter is disjointed and full of accusations and statements which are not backed up by evidence.

I declare an interest - I'm a receptionist at a corporate practice, and have seen many changes over the last decade. BUT. I don't believe this letter is a genuine letter from a vet. I've tried to Google him. The RCVS lists a vet called David Thomson graduating in 76, but then the trail gets cold. Anyone can claim to be anyone. I think this person is someone who is or has been in the business, but I don't think he's a practicing vet - happy to be proved wrong.

Looking at the comments he certainly has had many happy clients over the years as a vet - not sure if he is still working though.

 

[gunnergundog]

I think this person is someone who is or has been in the business, but I don't think he's a practicing vet - happy to be proved wrong.

 

[Tarragon]

I think he did say that he was in his 70's!
So quite likely not currently practicing.

 

[honetpot]

I think some of the extra tests are because vets, and even doctors are discouraged to use their clinical judgement, because they may get sued. An elderly cat I had PTS, the vet wanted to take blood 'just to be sure', the cat was a the end of its life, the blood test cost £256, the cat had end stage leukemia, so of course it was PTS.
The last time I had a long coverstaion with a vet, the dog had a chest tumour, I said who are trying reassure because its not me, the older vets have are much more confident usually of their own diagnostic skills.

 

[Polos Mum]

Around here it's effectively surge pricing - whatever they think someone will pay. Not what it costs plus a margin.

A neighbour recently had to have an emergency out of hours call out (to her horse yard) for the pet sheep. Same vet as usually sees the horses at the same location.
The call out fee was 1/3 of the horse call out fee - the reason "Farmers won't pay horse call out fees so the charging structure for livestock is different"

Same vet, same location but if the animal in the box is a different species it's x3 the price. Infuriating.

I had a horse need a lameness work up last year. They wanted me to sign a consent form for them to spend up to £2k if they felt the need. I said absolutely no way. I made them change it to £600 and then to call me if they felt more was needed and we would discuss specifics once they had maxed out the £600.
I've been a client for 10 years, never paid a bill late or queried it - but I was made to feel like a bank robber for refusing to give them a blank cheque. I had to pay the £600 in advance before they would even let the horse into the yard. I've never been made to feel more horrible by anyone than the receptionist and practice manager who got involved .

Eventually the actual vet took a totally different approach to the work up and it was all sorted for £800.

 

[Alibear]

Sounds familiar Polos Mum , I had to pay £600 upfront when my older horse hurt his eye last year as they hadn't seen him for a few years. Ignoring the £20,000 I'd spent with them on him before retirement and what I spent with them on my other horses in the meantime.

I have changed to a new vet for at least 5 years but kept my old retired guy with them as they had his records. I should have moved him across.

 

[Tarragon]

I find that horse vet costs are cheaper than the local small animal vet costs. The total cost to have a vet come to where I keep the ponies for annual boosters and dental, including sedation, was almost the same as us taking two cats to a local vet for roughly the same treatment. I use an equine vet, and the cats just use the local vet.

 

[Kaylum]

Charities yet again having to pick up the costs they can't afford. We are doing our best to raise money to help animals. 50 on the waiting list at the moment.

 

[Jambarissa]

Historically I've always preferred companies who aren't independent; vets, garages, dentists etc. Logically someone who is salaried rather than paid by the job or taking a cut from profit has no real incentive to invent extra work.

This used to work but I think now everything is a huge cartel where they've cornered the market and can set any price they wish. Very happy to have them reviewed.

 

[LEC]

So many variables:
Medicine costs money, good wages cost money, diagnostic equipment costs money, staffing cover costs money.

Natalie McGoldricks costs as a one person non clinic based 1st opinion vet will be very low. She covers all emergency’s herself and so can pay herself whatever wage she wants. Anything that needs extensive diagnostics gets referred to a clinic.

Compare that to an organisation like B&W which has support staff, multiple site clinics, diagnostic machines, emergency cover, leave etc to pay for of staffing, multiple cars, IT kit etc etc.

 

[Polos Mum]

Logically someone who is salaried rather than paid by the job or taking a cut from profit has no real incentive to invent extra work.

Sadly the vets are bonused on meeting sales targets (or penalised when they don't meet sales targets) - so not as simple as being salaried.

 

[ester]

Last year when my dogs vaccine booster was due I took him to vets he got his booster and vet then said he could do with a tooth scale and they'd take out any loose teeth. I've never been back, he's not had his booster this year and unless there's a problem he won't be going to the vets. He's eating ok.My friend took her dog in for a checkup and they removed four of his teeth she was unaware of any problems. These are independent vets. I think it's all about making money.

Tooth stuff in small animals always seems to be come up as ‘vets just trying to get more £ and it’s fine as it’s eating’
Whereas we generally try to be proactive with our own/equine teeth and tooth issues can really hurt.

 

[ROMANY 1959]

I am so relieved, that my vet is “Old school” and has younger just qualified vets in the practice. Consults only £30 and I can get repeat scripts and only take dog in to be checked twice a year. He is a very respected farm vet in my area, the practice does all my horses.

 

[TheMule]

It's like most things where you generalise. There's good and bad in both systems.
My OH works for a practice owned by big corp, but please dont think that means that the vets care any less, and he is certainly not briefed to try to up spending!
He goes to work everyday (and night, often all night) to do the best job he can for the horses he treats. Sometimes the 'best' thing is gold standard and costs more than the 'ok' thing which may ultimately have the same outcome, but he knows that the 'best' thing would increase that chance.
He doesn’t get a bonus…. The company he works for are operating at a loss and how much longer we can expect to have 24/7 countrywide cover at home for equine emergencies remains to be seen. I can see a time where it is entirely probable that you will only be able to access emergency care if you take the horse to the clinic (as in large parts of the US). Providing 24/7 cover is incredibly costly- it's not just about paying your vets, it's about paying the people who handle the phone calls/ logistics, keeping large, expensive cars on the road, keeping the car stocked up with all kinds of drugs for all kinds of situations, often meaning large quantities of stock go out of date and have to be thrown away. And then all of the equipment needs to be maintained, you have to chase up bad payers and frequently have to write off debts. You have to deal with rude clients and poorly behaved/ managed horses which put you at risk of injury. Vets have one of the highest suicide rates of any profession, and vets are leaving the industry at a rapid rate because they don’t get paid a fair living wage compared to the hours they put in and what they could earn with their valuable science degree in other fields.

Please support and celebrate your vets, no matter who they work for. They aren’t out to make money off you, they're just trying their best for your animals.

 

[EventingMum]

I shared this this morning. I am very grateful to be registered by a small, family run, independent vets, a father and two daughters, for my small animals and had my horses with the university run equine practice. The senior equine vet told me the reason they were cheaper than others was because they weren't profit driven like other practices, he said the university preferred them not to make huge losses but didn't puut them under pressure to achieve profit either - I count myself very lucky!

Depression and suicide are well documented in the veterinary profession and I'm sure corporate pressure to return large profits is just contributing to this.

 

[scruffyponies]

I find that horse vet costs are cheaper than the local small animal vet costs. The total cost to have a vet come to where I keep the ponies for annual boosters and dental, including sedation, was almost the same as us taking two cats to a local vet for roughly the same treatment. I use an equine vet, and the cats just use the local vet.

Same here. Equine vet call out is less than the small animal consult fee. Total madness, especially since one of my ponies routinely tries to kill him.
He should get danger money!