evsj
Well-Known Member
Just had a thought. If we attached the same social stigma to those who watch gratuitous real (as in not action films)violence to animals and people on youtube as we do to paedophiles, maybe we wouldn't have this problem?
Vile people part II *disturbing*
- Thread starter Sooty
- Start date
mollymurphy
Well-Known Member
That's just sick! I really just cannot fathom these religions. I don't want to discriminate in ANY way, but they just seem so backward when it comes to stuff like this. I mean, in this country, people cheat on partners all the time, and date people of different races / religions. Can you imagine us holding public stoning sessions for people who cheat or date someone different to ourselves?! I try so hard to understand where they are coming from, but i just can't.
They're sick in the head.
airedale
Well-Known Member
totally agree - but they hold human life cheap if you consider the bombings in iraq and the civilian death toll
Weezy
Well-Known Member
Going against the grain I totally applaude CNN for screening the footage - we hear about these things and they go to the back of our minds - I just watched the CNN news footage and have now seen, first hand, how things these things happen and the absolute truth in them - sometimes you have to see these things with your own eyes to make them real? With footage such as this being screened on the media, maybe JUST maybe, more people will sit up and pay attention and something more can be done to help poor girls like this
Gingerbird
Well-Known Member
I just dont know what to say..................disgusting
mollymurphy
Well-Known Member
Oh i completely agree with you weezy - too many people like to live in a bubble and pretend these things dont go on. It's just sick that it happened in the first place!
Sooty
Well-Known Member
Well thank God nobody filmed the Holocaust on a mobile and decided it was entertaintment to be shown on YouTube. Most people are intelligent enough to be able to put the story together from the photographs that were published; showing the footage removes the last of that poor girl's dignity IMHO. Oh, and unlike any clip showing sex, I didn't have to sign in to YouTube to see it, so anyone of any age can access that footage.
suesmith
Active Member
I have seen part of this footage ~ and it sickened me to the core...
HOWEVER... everyone is basically saying that youtube and the like shouldn't show these sort of films, as it could seriously affect people.
GOOD.
If it wasn't for mobile phone technology (as in the swan attack) and for youtube broadcasting ~ how many of us would honestly be sitting in our "middle england" homes, completely unaware that atrocities go on.
The holocaust WAS filmed, and its through this footage that lessons were learnt ~ would you REALLY have been so outraged at that if someone just described it.
We live in a visual world now. We should embrace this technology, and use it to the good. If you are so offended by the horrific murder of this young defenceless girl by her own family, then write to the government, to amnesty, to whoever to urge them to investigate and to make changes, and protect the probably hundreds of girls that are in danger of the same fate.
HOWEVER... everyone is basically saying that youtube and the like shouldn't show these sort of films, as it could seriously affect people.
GOOD.
If it wasn't for mobile phone technology (as in the swan attack) and for youtube broadcasting ~ how many of us would honestly be sitting in our "middle england" homes, completely unaware that atrocities go on.
The holocaust WAS filmed, and its through this footage that lessons were learnt ~ would you REALLY have been so outraged at that if someone just described it.
We live in a visual world now. We should embrace this technology, and use it to the good. If you are so offended by the horrific murder of this young defenceless girl by her own family, then write to the government, to amnesty, to whoever to urge them to investigate and to make changes, and protect the probably hundreds of girls that are in danger of the same fate.
X
xspiralx
Guest
I totally agree with both you and Weezy. I watched the CNN report on Youtube, and I've watched a good deal of footage from the Holocaust in my history lessons.
Not for entertainment purposes, I felt sickened to the core, but personally I believe awareness is very important, and sites like Youtube allow people to actually see what happens in the world, and not be sheltered thinking everything is hunky dory. If somebody doesn't want to watch, they don't have to search for it or they can turn off the tv when the graphic warning comes on, but I think its a good thing for people to be able to see these things and come face to face with the nastiness of it.
Not for entertainment purposes, I felt sickened to the core, but personally I believe awareness is very important, and sites like Youtube allow people to actually see what happens in the world, and not be sheltered thinking everything is hunky dory. If somebody doesn't want to watch, they don't have to search for it or they can turn off the tv when the graphic warning comes on, but I think its a good thing for people to be able to see these things and come face to face with the nastiness of it.
glencoe
Well-Known Member
I have read about this in the paper (Guardian) and that was enough. I don't see why anyone has to see it for themselves for it to be true (and a faked video is not an impossibility) although I understand why people do not trust the press. Hopefully most people will not be viewing it as entertainment but in real life as it is now, it probably is.
YorksG
Over the hill and far awa
Would you need to see footage of children being abused to be aware of it happening? I am sure there are other ways of bringing this to attention rather than showing the footage.
X
xspiralx
Guest
Personally I think the visual gives a stronger impact - you hear of tragedies everyday, for me personally very few of them really sink in. If you physically see that atrocity, I think the impact is far far greater.
Sooty
Well-Known Member
I think the only people who would want to see this video, or footage of Saddam being hanged, are sick people who would seek it out for entertainment. There is nothing to be learned from watching that can't be gleaned from reading an account, with photos. Nobody is allowed to die with dignity any more. I mean - YouTube! Not exactly a seat of learning or source of advice, is it?
Weezy
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Well thank God nobody filmed the Holocaust on a mobile and decided it was entertaintment to be shown on YouTube. Most people are intelligent enough to be able to put the story together from the photographs that were published; showing the footage removes the last of that poor girl's dignity IMHO. Oh, and unlike any clip showing sex, I didn't have to sign in to YouTube to see it, so anyone of any age can access that footage.
[/ QUOTE ]
I did have to sign in and *state* that I was over 18 years old, and I thought that was a good thing - didn't realise there were other showings of the clip that DIDN'T have that = bad.
Still cannot help but think seeing things visually hits us harder. I have read about stonings before, and whilst I didn't just shrug I did just turn the page. After seeing the CNN footage of what happened to this girl I spent a good while yesterday researching organisations and information into why and how these things are permitted to happen, so, for me at least, it DID do good.
Well thank God nobody filmed the Holocaust on a mobile and decided it was entertaintment to be shown on YouTube. Most people are intelligent enough to be able to put the story together from the photographs that were published; showing the footage removes the last of that poor girl's dignity IMHO. Oh, and unlike any clip showing sex, I didn't have to sign in to YouTube to see it, so anyone of any age can access that footage.
[/ QUOTE ]
I did have to sign in and *state* that I was over 18 years old, and I thought that was a good thing - didn't realise there were other showings of the clip that DIDN'T have that = bad.
Still cannot help but think seeing things visually hits us harder. I have read about stonings before, and whilst I didn't just shrug I did just turn the page. After seeing the CNN footage of what happened to this girl I spent a good while yesterday researching organisations and information into why and how these things are permitted to happen, so, for me at least, it DID do good.
MagicMelon
Well-Known Member
Any kid can still watch the video even with the sign in and verification bit, they just need to pretend they're over 18 - what kid wouldn't?!
I must admit I have now seen the actual (totally uncut) footage, not just the shortened bit they showed on CNN and You Tube. Its terrible. Absolutely sickened me to the core watching it. It was weird though, whilst attacking this girl - the men also made a point of pulling her skirt to cover her back up again as if to maintain her dignity. I just thought this was so odd considering what they were doing to her.
I have heard there are much worse "honour killings" roaming about on the internet but I certainly wont be watching them. It's the fact that so many men where recording it on their mobile phones which gave me chills. What a thing to record. I would love nothing more than for every single on of those men present to be killed in an even more horrific way, exactly what they deserve.
Religeon has ruined the world! Sorry, but it has.
I must admit I have now seen the actual (totally uncut) footage, not just the shortened bit they showed on CNN and You Tube. Its terrible. Absolutely sickened me to the core watching it. It was weird though, whilst attacking this girl - the men also made a point of pulling her skirt to cover her back up again as if to maintain her dignity. I just thought this was so odd considering what they were doing to her.
I have heard there are much worse "honour killings" roaming about on the internet but I certainly wont be watching them. It's the fact that so many men where recording it on their mobile phones which gave me chills. What a thing to record. I would love nothing more than for every single on of those men present to be killed in an even more horrific way, exactly what they deserve.
Religeon has ruined the world! Sorry, but it has.
The Virgin Dubble
Well-Known Member
Ditto here too.
I believe that seeing film of atrocities like this, the holocaust, 9/11, etc, bring the horror home to us far more effectively than photo's or stills.
My father collected a huge amount of WWII data, and I remember vividly, watching a video he had, of the liberation of Auschwitz concentration camp. Although I had read and studied endless books about it at school for O level, it was only after watching that footage that I had any real concept of the atrocities comitted against the Jews.
I had no concept of what stoning was truly like, until I saw CNN's footage.
Yes, putting the stoning video on Youtube seems rather voyeuristic, but in an ideal world, it should never have happened at all.
Maybe, just maybe, the public outrage this has caused, might mean there is a small glimmer of hope for all those oppressed women who live in fear of this happening to them.
I believe that seeing film of atrocities like this, the holocaust, 9/11, etc, bring the horror home to us far more effectively than photo's or stills.
My father collected a huge amount of WWII data, and I remember vividly, watching a video he had, of the liberation of Auschwitz concentration camp. Although I had read and studied endless books about it at school for O level, it was only after watching that footage that I had any real concept of the atrocities comitted against the Jews.
I had no concept of what stoning was truly like, until I saw CNN's footage.
Yes, putting the stoning video on Youtube seems rather voyeuristic, but in an ideal world, it should never have happened at all.
Maybe, just maybe, the public outrage this has caused, might mean there is a small glimmer of hope for all those oppressed women who live in fear of this happening to them.
MagicMelon
Well-Known Member
Wouldn't it be nice to bring those women to this country where it is so much more civilised. I bet they cant imagine a place where they cant live in permanent fear of being stoned to death. We're rather lucky Id say!
The Virgin Dubble
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Wouldn't it be nice to bring those women to this country where it is so much more civilised. I bet they cant imagine a place where they cant live in permanent fear of being stoned to death. We're rather lucky Id say!
[/ QUOTE ]
It shouldn't have to come to that though should it?
They should be able to live in their own country, amongst their own people, alongside family and friends, without fear.
I agree with your earlier comment about religion. I wonder what the total count would add up to, of the people who have been murdered in the name of one religion or another.
It certainly has a lot to answer for.
Wouldn't it be nice to bring those women to this country where it is so much more civilised. I bet they cant imagine a place where they cant live in permanent fear of being stoned to death. We're rather lucky Id say!
[/ QUOTE ]
It shouldn't have to come to that though should it?
They should be able to live in their own country, amongst their own people, alongside family and friends, without fear.
I agree with your earlier comment about religion. I wonder what the total count would add up to, of the people who have been murdered in the name of one religion or another.
It certainly has a lot to answer for.
Sooty
Well-Known Member
Religion is a convenient hook to hang fanaticism on. Most religions are a set of guidelines; it is the extreme interpretation that causes the problems. Like Ireland - two different branches of Christianity. Now Iraq - different factions of Islam. It just seems to be endless...
The Virgin Dubble
Well-Known Member
Yes I agree.
Acts of terrorism and barbarity, carried out in the name of God, Allah, etc etc etc (*fill in as applicable*) gives the perpetrators their own ultimate moral high ground...
Acts of terrorism and barbarity, carried out in the name of God, Allah, etc etc etc (*fill in as applicable*) gives the perpetrators their own ultimate moral high ground...
Pidge
Well-Known Member
only read the first bit and its made me feel sick, totally an utterly barbaric
Bex7
Well-Known Member
More civilised?
I am not sure I woul be able to call it that with a straight face. The stoning of this girl is not a daily occurrence and I am sincerely not trying to justify it but our way of doing things isn't without it's own barbaric issues.
Wife Beating
Rape including old age pensioners
Mutilation and torture - including children
Child Abuse
Murder
Drug problems
The list goes on......
I do think that allowing it on you tube is appalling but I am not sure that as a society we are in a position to be in uproar about the barbaric and outdated relgious view of others. When horrific thing are taking place in our own society with no reason behind it at all.
I am not sure I woul be able to call it that with a straight face. The stoning of this girl is not a daily occurrence and I am sincerely not trying to justify it but our way of doing things isn't without it's own barbaric issues.
Wife Beating
Rape including old age pensioners
Mutilation and torture - including children
Child Abuse
Murder
Drug problems
The list goes on......
I do think that allowing it on you tube is appalling but I am not sure that as a society we are in a position to be in uproar about the barbaric and outdated relgious view of others. When horrific thing are taking place in our own society with no reason behind it at all.
MagicMelon
Well-Known Member
Of course we are more civilised. Mainly because we don't "accept" the terrible things that do occassionally happen here. Over there, if you see how many men there were standing by watching (hundreds) and the frequency of how often their "honour killings" happen then it is widely accepted there as if it is ok. Police were standing about doing nothing...... that certainly wouldn't happen here!
Apparently "honour killings" are a regular occurance in those types of countries. So yes, they almost ARE a daily occurance (especially since the majority of them Im sure would go unreported).
Of course those things you mention like rape, child abuse etc. are absolutely awful but they are not a normal occurance in the UK. I mean, how often are there murders here? Not that often and when there are, Ive never heard of any involving being stoned to death by members of their own family.
I dont think drug problems are barbaric? In what way? If people choose to take drugs, its entirely their own problem and basically they deserve what they get IMO.
What horrific things are happening in our own society? I cant think of any?! I am not a christian (I dont believe in any religeon) but as far as I understand it there aren't any extreme views of it in the UK?
Apparently "honour killings" are a regular occurance in those types of countries. So yes, they almost ARE a daily occurance (especially since the majority of them Im sure would go unreported).
Of course those things you mention like rape, child abuse etc. are absolutely awful but they are not a normal occurance in the UK. I mean, how often are there murders here? Not that often and when there are, Ive never heard of any involving being stoned to death by members of their own family.
I dont think drug problems are barbaric? In what way? If people choose to take drugs, its entirely their own problem and basically they deserve what they get IMO.
What horrific things are happening in our own society? I cant think of any?! I am not a christian (I dont believe in any religeon) but as far as I understand it there aren't any extreme views of it in the UK?
CazB
Active Member
we had some stuff come from the NSPCC a few days ago about 100 children a year die at the hands of their parents every year in this country
Bex7
Well-Known Member
Apparently "honour killings" are a regular occurance in those types of countries. So yes, they almost ARE a daily occurrence (especially since the majority of them Im sure would go unreported). - They are not a daily occurrence any more than murder, rape etc is a daily occurrence in this country.
Of course those things you mention like rape, child abuse etc. are absolutely awful but they are not a normal occurrence in the UK. I mean, how often are there murders here? Not that often and when there are, Ive never heard of any involving being stoned to death by members of their own family.
Of course there are murders here, they happen all the time and Are a regular occurrence. People may not be stoned to death but cases such as the James Bulger case etc do happen and are no less horrific.
I dont think drug problems are barbaric? In what way? If people choose to take drugs, its entirely their own problem and basically they deserve what they get IMO. Drug issues are not limited to those using it it has knock on effects and is responsible for many other crimes including prostitution, murder, violence and theft
What horrific things are happening in our own society? I cant think of any?! I am not a christian (I dont believe in any religeon) but as far as I understand it there aren't any extreme views of it in the UK? I am glad that you cannot think of anything horrific in our society and I am also not religious I do however feel that child abuse, rape etc are horrific and as such they would be the things I am reffering to.
Sooty
Well-Known Member
Do you think these are exclusive to the UK? In many Muslim countries women are not even allowed to show their faces; do you think beating them would count as a crime as it does here? They have no rights at all, not one.
MagicMelon
Well-Known Member
That's what I mean. Im saying that yes, bad things happen here but at least here we are against it, help is available for people who are beaten by their husbands etc. and if reported then they will be dealt with in the courts.
However, in other countries such as Iraq - there is no help available and most crimes seem to go unpunished. And they accept it far more over there, I mean 2000 men turned out to watch that 17yo be stoned to death. That just wouldn't happen here.
However, in other countries such as Iraq - there is no help available and most crimes seem to go unpunished. And they accept it far more over there, I mean 2000 men turned out to watch that 17yo be stoned to death. That just wouldn't happen here.
Sooty
Well-Known Member
Good point - and hasn't 'bringing democracy to Iraq' made a huge difference...
Bex7
Well-Known Member
Of course I do not think they are exclusive to this country, the point I was making is that these things happen all over the world regardless of how barbaric we may think a religion is.
Sooty
Well-Known Member
See my post above - it is not religion that is barbaric, it is the interpretation of it by fanatics.