Walking with dog treats - what are your views?

[MotherOfChickens]

I look at many obese dogs in parks etc all have in common vets and owners and other walkers that do treats all the time, these dogs suffer as do their joints in later life, if a dogs base nature is appealed to that dog cannot be blamed for behaving like a scavenger, a dog should learn to do things as part of a team, I personally do not treat my dog with food outside the home nor do I permit vets or any other person to feed him snacks treats etc, my dog has continual positive reinforcement with praise. I have terrier which has a nature to probe and scavenge, pension due to high prey drive and survival if holed up for length of time. And in a personal note, I see my dog as a partner in our team, it feels patronising controlling him with food, I like him to be on board so it's a big no for me outside the home..

people who let their dogs get overweight, will let them get overweight regardless of whether they use treats in training or not I'd imagine.

 

[Dopeydapple]

I've posted before about the extremely reactive collie I walk, his owners took him to a trainer many years ago who tried to use food as a distraction / reward, this didn't work and the trainer had no other ideas so the owners gave up on training him. Whilst I'm not adverse to using food in training it can't be the only tool in your kit bag as it clearly won't work with every dog. I do tend to carry treats when walking clients dogs as I often won't know these dogs so well so a bit of bribery is fine with me. When I first walked the collie he wouldn't even take a treat on a walk when there were no other distractions let alone other dogs, by working on him having more space from dogs and staying calm he is now much more relaxed and will take treats off me on a walk so he now gets these when we are at the limit of his comfort zone with a passing dog, today instead of lunging etc at a dog he only growled at him, we moved a tiny bit further away and then he sat happily to have a treat while the dog walked past 😊

 

[ester]

surely if people are using treats as part of the dogs daily ration as they should it's not going to affect weight?

 

[Fools Motto]

I started this thread, and sadly the old Whippet X is no longer with us. She is still much missed, and always will be. I never did take treats with me, and still to this date don't with the spaniel. I managed the old girls treat obsession by constantly looking around me, (like some sort of OCD!). I kept her close enough to pop her on a lead if I thought it needed it. Just basically had to have my wits about me, which made 'going for a walk' more of a job than a joy, but needs must.
The spaniels treat is the tennis ball. She is good that she only likes to have hers, and won't go after anyone else's. I haven't yet had any issues with her needing it to train, it's just a game which she loves.

Re Overweight MOC, I guess it depends on how much you treat 'a dog' in order for it to do what is asked of it, added on to it's usual feed! My inexperienced OH (when I first met him), fed his dog a whole bourbon biscuit when it sat, lay and rolled over! When I asked why such a big treat, it didn't even occur to him that said treat could be given in much smaller amounts..!

 

[PucciNPoni]

using treats and reducing food is just common sense. Course I say that and don't necessarily follow that routine for my own diet :/

 

[Fools Motto]

using treats and reducing food is just common sense. Course I say that and don't necessarily follow that routine for my own diet :/

Arhh, Common Sense. One assumes it's 'common', but alas... I fear not in many!

 

[ProSocDec]

Makes sense

 

[ProSocDec]

Great Post

 

[ProSocDec]

Am in agreement with this post due to the principle

 

[ProSocDec]

Great response

 

[oldie48]

Sorry to hear of your whippet cross. I always have treats in my pocket. Stan is not food orientated but I've found some soft small treats that he likes and he gets a tiny bit when he comes back to me from an exciting encounter and if he walks nicely to heel off the lead. I don't feel I'm bribing him, it's just a reward for doing something well when tbh he'd probably rather do something else (he is a terrier). I don't give treats to other dogs unless I have the owners permission and I don't allow Stan to have them from other people unless he does something eg sits nicely and waits. His food allowance for the day takes into account what treats/extras he might have in the day and he's weighed regularly. I do what works for my dog and its up to other owners to keep their dogs in order. The only problem I've found is that all my coat pockets have treats in them and I have discovered that my horse definitely doesn't like them. AND yes I use treats when I turn horses out, when theyturn to face the gate, stand nicely, have their head collars off and wait, they get a treat. When I'm out of the way, they can explode!

 

[conniegirl]

We always carry treats, we have a beagle, he recalls beautifully if you have a treat.
If you recall him and dont give him a treat then you can garentee he isnt coming back next time!
He doesnt have a weight issue at all, the small amount he gets is hardly going to put any weight on him.

 

[CorvusCorax]

Top dog and handler teams in many disciplines use food and toys as rewards. In fact dogs with strong food and ball drive are sought out in many sports. It's how a lot of exercises are shaped.
There are breeds and types of dogs bred for generations to work remotely from humans, and a pat on the head and being told he's a good boy won't cut it.

My dog is seven, no joint issues judging by how he can still haul me up mountains and he could probably do with a few pounds on. Obese dogs get fed crap and don't get exercised, they're not getting rewarded by their owners with their normal food.
I wouldn't consider it very 'teamy' to reward my own dog's output with a scratch on the ear.

 

[oldie48]

Top dog and handler teams in many disciplines use food and toys as rewards. In fact dogs with strong food and ball drive are sought out in many sports. It's how a lot of exercises are shaped.
There are breeds and types of dogs bred for generations to work remotely from humans, and a pat on the head and being told he's a good boy won't cut it.

My dog is seven, no joint issues judging by how he can still haul me up mountains and he could probably do with a few pounds on. Obese dogs get fed crap and don't get exercised, they're not getting rewarded by their owners with their normal food.
I wouldn't consider it very 'teamy' to reward my own dog's output with a scratch on the ear.

A neighour has taken on a young rescue lab who was rather neglected by his previous owners in that they shut him away and ignored him. He's therefore very needy and attention driven ie he is constantly wanting attention usually by doing "naughty" things. He also had zero recall so can't be walked off the lead. They worked for many months with a guy who apparently trained police dogs, he wouldn't allow the use of food and it was all about them using quite forceful control (this is how they described it to me) They made very little progress. They changed trainers to one who uses food and he is making huge progress. He never gets his food in a bowl now, it is scattered around so he has to find it. They use regular fun training sessions, which he loves and she is using a long line now and his recall is starting to develop. He does the right thing and he gets a treat, when he does something they don't want he gets ignored or distracted by something else which is better. He is so much happier and so are they. Speaks volumes IMHO!

 

[CorvusCorax]

Police trainers don't use food that much (can you imagine what a distraction it would be for a dog on a search lol) but they do use toys/balls as motivators.

If I had a quid for every 'ex police dog trainer/I worked with police/this is an ex police dog' I've met, I could probably buy you a round or two in the pub

 

[oldie48]

Police trainers don't use food that much (can you imagine what a distraction it would be for a dog on a search lol) but they do use toys/balls as motivators.

If I had a quid for every 'ex police dog trainer/I worked with police/this is an ex police dog' I've met, I could probably buy you a round or two in the pub

Mine's a large glass of Merlot, please! My daughter's Viz isn't motivated by food at all but is by a ball. I took Stan to a beginner agility class recently and it was far too busy. If a dog was hesitant it got "helped" rather too forcibly for my liking. Stan was reluctant to jump over painted poles but tackled an A frame and bridge very happily. He got "helped" by the trainer the first time and the second time he just sat down and shook with his tail between his legs. We won't go there again, he just needed time to find his confidence, yanking him over wasn't the way to do it.

 

[Clodagh]

Mine's a large glass of Merlot, please! My daughter's Viz isn't motivated by food at all but is by a ball. I took Stan to a beginner agility class recently and it was far too busy. If a dog was hesitant it got "helped" rather too forcibly for my liking. Stan was reluctant to jump over painted poles but tackled an A frame and bridge very happily. He got "helped" by the trainer the first time and the second time he just sat down and shook with his tail between his legs. We won't go there again, he just needed time to find his confidence, yanking him over wasn't the way to do it.

There are some very odd 'professionals' out there, aren't there? How is force meant to help?

 

[MotherOfChickens]

There are some very odd 'professionals' out there, aren't there? How is force meant to help?

I had an awful experience with a trainer who trained GSDs for protection work (he certainly had the dogs and the set up for it) etc with my old collie-basically every time the dog ran to the end of his lead, the trainer jerked him several feet clear off the ground. he then wanted to repeat it with a prong collar! I left sharpish-with that dog we just trained him to heel off lead really well, we never did get him to walk on lead brilliantly but that was the least of his problems. tbh he wasn't the only trainer that thought beating the crap out of that dog was the way to go.

I also had a poor experience with an agility trainer years later with the setter-she claimed it wasn't really important that he hadn't enjoyed it because as a setter, he'd never be any good at it anyway. Put me off agility for about a decade.

 

[Sarah_K]

<Snip> I left sharpish-with that dog we just trained him to heel off lead really well, we never did get him to walk on lead brilliantly but that was the least of his problems. tbh he wasn't the only trainer that thought beating the crap out of that dog was the way to go. </Snip>

My dog sounds very similar. Loose lead walking is near none existent (unless I've got a bit of hotdog under his nose). Off lead though it's almost perfect no treat required. It's the same if we're at training or out and about. Sometimes wonder if it's about confidence- on lead he's relying on me to direct, offlead he thinks he has to stay close to follow directions. He is an odd little dog tho.

 

[ProSocDec]

I think dogs and bears have their dangerous parts because if they see the children with a ball or someone across the road with a ball it might prove really spontaneous to go for it

 

[Cahill]

beginners agility should maybe just some wings,no poles or other obstacles at all.

 

[CorvusCorax]

A lot of dogs can't deal with leash pressure. If they feel tension they try and evade/escape the restraint and don't realise its them doing it to themselves, essentially. Why a lot of dogs go better offlead.

 

[Moobli]

I use food rewards when training new pups or new exercises with an older dog. I do sometimes take rewards on walks - mainly when exercising a young dog to reward recall and the older ones get a reward for recalling on those occasions too, but on an average walk with my 7 year old GSD then I don't need to take rewards. He is well trained anyway and is ball obsessed so any play/training/reward for him involves playing/tugging with his ball.

Use what works and what is required to have a well behaved dog when out. Surely that much is just common sense.