WARNING DISTRESSING VIDEO: Mare kills stallion

[Caol Ila]

I guess we choose their mates, whereas in the wild, they would have a choice. I read an account by a guy called Robert Vavra, a horse photographer who has spent a lot of time in Spain at big PRE studs. At some studs -- at least back in the 80s -- they would turn the stallion and mare loose together and let them get on with it. He writes that they put a stallion, we'll call him Mr. Macho, out with the mare, and he was flexing his muscles and trying to get on the mare without any foreplay, and the mare kicked out whenever he got too close. The handlers were sure she was in the right place in her cycle. They took that stallion away and brought out a different one, a horse known for being suave and charming -- we'll call him Mr. Mensch -- and that stallion took his time to nuzzle the mare, graze with the mare, lots of horsey foreplay, and the mare was very happy to let him do the deed.

He then writes about another mare, an old broodmare, who preferred Mr. Macho's quick-and-dirty approach because she just wanted to get on with it, and got annoyed, impatient, and unreceptive when Mr. Mensch faffed around too much.

For most breeders, that sort of horsey Tinder approach isn't realistic. So we just have to live with the cognitive dissonance.

 

[MissTyc]

I guess we choose their mates, whereas in the wild, they would have a choice. I read an account by a guy called Robert Vavra, a horse photographer who has spent a lot of time in Spain at big PRE studs. At some studs -- at least back in the 80s -- they would turn the stallion and mare loose together and let them get on with it. He writes that they put a stallion, we'll call him Mr. Macho, out with the mare, and he was flexing his muscles and trying to get on the mare without any foreplay, and the mare kicked out whenever he got too close. The handlers were sure she was in the right place in her cycle. They took that stallion away and brought out a different one, a horse known for being suave and charming -- we'll call him Mr. Mensch -- and that stallion took his time to nuzzle the mare, graze with the mare, lots of horsey foreplay, and the mare was very happy to let him do the deed.

He then writes about another mare, an old broodmare, who preferred Mr. Macho's quick-and-dirty approach because she just wanted to get on with it, and got annoyed, impatient, and unreceptive when Mr. Mensch faffed around too much.

For most breeders, that sort of horsey Tinder approach isn't realistic. So we just have to live with the cognitive dissonance.

Even with the geldings in the herd we see these different approached. Some become study and aggressive, herding mares, biting. And some of the mares want to be in that "cool gang" and seem to be constantly in season and standing to be mounted and watching the studly boys prance about and argue with each other. Another groups of geldings seems like total softies: lots of courtship, sharing mares, licking, nuzzling, gentle mounting, watching each other without any fomo. The two groups rarely interact at this time of year when everyone is in season. I should also add we also have gelding who realise they are geldings and couldn't care less. But out of 15 geldings, a good 8-9 will be busy mounting or courting mares. As for the mares, they almost ALL get involved with one of the two groups. And some of the mares mount each other too.

 

[Shilasdair]

And that, dear readers, is why you don't let men have a little macho party complete with beer and music, while you forcibly cover mares.

I don't think there was a single mistake that they didn't make...

 

[Birker2020]

I am intrigued about the foal that someone earlier mentioned has been hurt too. What had it got wrapped around its leg that dragged after it around 1.40 on the video?? Very disturbing video which leaves more questions than answers.

 

[Tarragon]

It is so sad to see such vitality end just like that. At least it was a quick end.

 

[Wishfilly]

I can understand that. Its like breeding dogs in some circumstances too. I get things need to be done in a safe way particularly with horses but if the mare says no that should be it. Forced breedings are rape and what does that make the people that do it?

Apart from people who turn loose to cover, which pretty much only happens with natives and sometimes cobs, the mare really doesn't get to say no.

No-one is going to risk a multi-million pound TB stallion by allowing the mare to "say no". And Weatherbys insist all foals are the result of live cover, so there's not even the option to AI.

 

[Alwaysmoretoknow]

For me the most distressing part of the video was the poor little foal who fell over and then seemed to get up very lame.
But what a bunch of macho arseholes with no clue, experience or even the vaguest thought for what could possibly go wrong. I'm sure the beer helped - not.
I wonder what their macho culture made of this?

 

[Palindrome]

Apart from people who turn loose to cover, which pretty much only happens with natives and sometimes cobs, the mare really doesn't get to say no.

No-one is going to risk a multi-million pound TB stallion by allowing the mare to "say no". And Weatherbys insist all foals are the result of live cover, so there's not even the option to AI.

Not thoroughbred but when I helped out for breeding in hand, the stallion was put near the mare and if she kicked out/ didn't seem to accept the breeding they would each be put back in their stables and it would be tried again the next day. If the mare doesn't accept the stallion it's usually that she is not in the right part of her breeding cycle so there is no point trying to breed.

 

[Errin Paddywack]

It was pretty obvious that the mare was not ready to accept the stallion, should never have been taken in with him.

 

[ElectricChampagne]

Apparently according to the comments under the video the men said in Spanish that the stallions head was caved in afterwards.

The mare swung her back end past the stallion twice before landing the kick, it does look like she was giving a warning she was going to kick. The stallion's handler actually pulled his head I to the kick too.

Was she shod? The stallion looked to be barefoot. The mare literally kicked the cr*p out of that poor stallion.

Disgraceful handling all round by a bunch of men trying to be macho.

 

[Rokele55]

I didn't watch the video. I've seen enough horses die in weird and unimaginable ways. From the comments it sounds like a bunch of prats were (not) in charge However, I have seen many coverings of horses, dogs, sheep, cows etc.. None were what you would call pleasant, my ultra receptive and willing bitch cried like baby. However, I don't think you can apply the anthropomorphic term rape. In the wild a mare is receptive in foaling heat which is how mature intends, in order to foal at the optimum time of the year. Incidentally, seeing an in hand covering with a suffolk punch stallion in my teens nearly left me celibate for life...

 

[Birker2020]

Yes but what happened to the poor foal? Had it gone through something? It was dragging something behind its foot around 1m 43s in the film. It looked like it fell down a hole. Open up the video on your screen by maximising it and you can see it clearer.

 

[MiJodsR2BlinkinTite]

For me the most distressing part of the video was the poor little foal who fell over and then seemed to get up very lame.
But what a bunch of macho arseholes with no clue, experience or even the vaguest thought for what could possibly go wrong. I'm sure the beer helped - not.
I wonder what their macho culture made of this?

Yep I wonder what happened when the vid ended; and the realisation that the stallion was actually DEAD had gotten into their thick troglodite skulls; and at some point the "Oh sh!t" moment would surely kick in where they got to realise that they just might have to compensate the owner of that lovely stallion and explain what had happened..........

 

[Laurac13]

Absolutely heartbreaking ? idiot macho guys without a clue, waste of a beautiful stallion, poor injured foal and it wasn’t the mares fault at all they put her in that awful situation. But how the hell has the you tube video got 9.6k likes and no dislikes what is wrong with people ?

 

[Shilasdair]

Not thoroughbred but when I helped out for breeding in hand, the stallion was put near the mare and if she kicked out/ didn't seem to accept the breeding they would each be put back in their stables and it would be tried again the next day. If the mare doesn't accept the stallion it's usually that she is not in the right part of her breeding cycle so there is no point trying to breed.

I agree.
Professional studs don't cover mares that aren't ready, for a couple of reasons. Firstly, it's less likely to be successful, and secondly, it's a danger to the stallion and the mare.
The studs I know in the UK generally use a teaser or tease with the stallion, in a covering yard with a non-slip surface, and often a teaser board (like a solid fence) in the middle.

 

[ElectricChampagne]

Absolutely heartbreaking ? idiot macho guys without a clue, waste of a beautiful stallion, poor injured foal and it wasn’t the mares fault at all they put her in that awful situation. But how the hell has the you tube video got 9.6k likes and no dislikes what is wrong with people ?

didn't YouTube remove the dislike button recently?

 

[Nasicus]

didn't YouTube remove the dislike button recently?

Kind of, I think the uploader can still see the dislikes, and the button is still there, but users can no longer see the number of dislikes nor the like to dislike ratio on a video.

 

[marmalade76]

i wonder about that too. My homebred was conceived via natural cover but tbh i am not sure Salty had much of an inkling what was going on, she was scanned to confirm timings but still wasn't massively keen on the whole process, tho it was handled well by the stud and the stallion was nice to her I felt hugely guilty watching her actually give birth, it was textbook but all the same

I went AI for Kira because i didn't think she'd be up for the invasion of her personal space one bit. I wonder whether they have any idea what's going on as the foetus grows and starts wriggling about or whether its all just instinct taking over when the time comes for foaling. I suspect the latter?

There was me thinking my horse had a really unusual name yet here's another one!

Poor Salty has a very lumpy and deformed face from a kick sustained in the field last year (before I bought him), after seeing this, I suppose he's lucky to be alive. He's no innocent, though, he kicked a companion a couple of months ago catching him on the inside of the hind leg, nicked an artery and cost me £300 ?

 

[Goldenstar]

That’s awful, a full on car crash of stupidity.

 

[Birker2020]

Absolutely heartbreaking ? idiot macho guys without a clue, waste of a beautiful stallion, poor injured foal and it wasn’t the mares fault at all they put her in that awful situation. But how the hell has the you tube video got 9.6k likes and no dislikes what is wrong with people ?

Some of the comments on the video explain why it has so many likes, stupid, stupid replies from stupid stupid people

Like the "mare literally kicked the sh*t out of the stallion" or "that smile.... that damned smile".
He said “Dim those lights baby” and she said “Lights out boo” , "Damn! That was some Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon action right there!", "guess he died hard" - Bruce Willis

Just ignorant people thinking its funny. Very strange.

 

[Orangehorse]

I know of a stallion that was the dopiest, most placid, quiet horse to ride and handle possible. He was bought by a man who had some experience of breeding and had saved a previous badly handled stallion from being from PTS to become a very good all round horse.

So the man and his experienced groom had this stallion in hand and a mare in season and had no qualms about his covering, they had done it many times before with the other stallion. But instead, the stallion savaged the mare, absolutely attacked her, much to everyone's horror. I think they tried once more, but the same thing happened and they never tried it again with a mare (might have gone for AI possibly).

After some looking into the background, and gossip! It seemed that as a young colt this stallion had been turned out with a bunch of mares. He had tried to cover one mare, but he was severely attacked by this mare's sister or dam. Obviously this experience put him off for life and made any mare in season a very dangerous, to him, animal.