nicol1
Active Member
Whot diffence does it make if this was my first posting.U shouldnt judge people when u dont know them thats most unfair.Please can we stop the nastys its not nice!!! xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Was any1 else upset with comments made at the furtity
- Thread starter nicol1
- Start date
Zebedee
Well-Known Member
Don't let it worry you Lucey - I don't !!!!
On the whole you are right. Nearly everyone on here is friendly & helpful & has a shared love of horses.
This room in particular is full of the most wonderful people who are prepared to share their wealth of knowledge & experience with anyone who asks for help.
Some people occassionally get a little overly defensive & this maybe affects their judgement in what they post. The typed word is very easily misunderstood as well, as we lose the other sensory imput from tone, eye contact, & body language that we have in a verbal / face to face exchange!!
On the whole you are right. Nearly everyone on here is friendly & helpful & has a shared love of horses.
This room in particular is full of the most wonderful people who are prepared to share their wealth of knowledge & experience with anyone who asks for help.
Some people occassionally get a little overly defensive & this maybe affects their judgement in what they post. The typed word is very easily misunderstood as well, as we lose the other sensory imput from tone, eye contact, & body language that we have in a verbal / face to face exchange!!
StaceyTanglewood
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
PMSL at being called tetchy !!!!
I think you're a bit too sensitive to be honest!! Thats both myself & the OP who you have deemed to be nasty & / or agressive!!
How on earth can you say the above is written in a nasty tone? Any more than the OPs was really? Its a balanced assessment of previous comment coupled with a question.
If you post you must expect replies, & on an open forum not everyones going to agree with you I'm afraid, & some may even have the gall to question your posts & opinions. People who do so are not necesarily being nasty or agressive, merely seeking an exchange of views to better understand the subject. Replies that seem overly defensive on any subject are alway going to elicite reponses that ask for further justification - for instance you still haven't answered the basic question asked - Why do you deem it ok to praise but not criticise ?
(Insert lots of nice huggy smiley smilies here to defuse any further accusations of 'nastiness'!!!)
[/ QUOTE ]
As we have stated this is an open forum and that is my opinion of the post - I think everyone has worked really hard at the futurity i went to but took the first post as rather negative !! yes my foal did do well but i cant really think of anyone that was upset with their marks or totally disagreed !!
and anyone that did should of spoken to the judges/vet on the day to iron out any problems or thoughts they may have had !!
Im not saying people shouldnt have conversations like this but the post should of been worded slightly better - and would of got a better debate if it had??
PMSL at being called tetchy !!!!
I think you're a bit too sensitive to be honest!! Thats both myself & the OP who you have deemed to be nasty & / or agressive!!
How on earth can you say the above is written in a nasty tone? Any more than the OPs was really? Its a balanced assessment of previous comment coupled with a question.
If you post you must expect replies, & on an open forum not everyones going to agree with you I'm afraid, & some may even have the gall to question your posts & opinions. People who do so are not necesarily being nasty or agressive, merely seeking an exchange of views to better understand the subject. Replies that seem overly defensive on any subject are alway going to elicite reponses that ask for further justification - for instance you still haven't answered the basic question asked - Why do you deem it ok to praise but not criticise ?
(Insert lots of nice huggy smiley smilies here to defuse any further accusations of 'nastiness'!!!)
[/ QUOTE ]
As we have stated this is an open forum and that is my opinion of the post - I think everyone has worked really hard at the futurity i went to but took the first post as rather negative !! yes my foal did do well but i cant really think of anyone that was upset with their marks or totally disagreed !!
and anyone that did should of spoken to the judges/vet on the day to iron out any problems or thoughts they may have had !!
Im not saying people shouldnt have conversations like this but the post should of been worded slightly better - and would of got a better debate if it had??
StaceyTanglewood
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Whot diffence does it make if this was my first posting.U shouldnt judge people when u dont know them thats most unfair.Please can we stop the nastys its not nice!!! xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[/ QUOTE ]
Im sorry when have i been nasty ???
you just seemed to come on here and want to start a debate about people that didnt agree with the judges ?? all im saying is maybe it could of been worded slightly different
Whot diffence does it make if this was my first posting.U shouldnt judge people when u dont know them thats most unfair.Please can we stop the nastys its not nice!!! xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[/ QUOTE ]
Im sorry when have i been nasty ???
you just seemed to come on here and want to start a debate about people that didnt agree with the judges ?? all im saying is maybe it could of been worded slightly different
Zebedee
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
yes an sure it also got 7 for second vet mark.
[/ QUOTE ]
Does seem a little strange then to be honest....did you ask about it on the day as Ciss has suggested anyone who is confused with any aspect ought to? It's often hard after the event to remember things with total clarity - esp if the day has been a long one. I often get people coming up to me a week after I've judged them & saying ' Oh you must remember my horse - it was the bay one........' or similar & I'll have no idea - unless of course it bucked them off or something!!
yes an sure it also got 7 for second vet mark.
[/ QUOTE ]
Does seem a little strange then to be honest....did you ask about it on the day as Ciss has suggested anyone who is confused with any aspect ought to? It's often hard after the event to remember things with total clarity - esp if the day has been a long one. I often get people coming up to me a week after I've judged them & saying ' Oh you must remember my horse - it was the bay one........' or similar & I'll have no idea - unless of course it bucked them off or something!!
nicol1
Active Member
OH dear am afraid to talk just incase people get mad!!! But i did hear a gentleman ask jan and she did look shocked and said she couldnt conment.Also speaking with others today some were told their horses were not moving of the ground when one of these is a county winner for the last couple of yrs.Please before others get high rate none of this is done to be nasty.x
nicol1
Active Member
so basically we all half to be like u.we are all different.i think this getting out of hand...not going to be bullied cause i spoke up and some of u didnt like whot i said now u know how those people felt when they were told their pride and joy wasnt very good.xxx
Zebedee
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Whot diffence does it make if this was my first posting.U shouldnt judge people when u dont know them thats most unfair.Please can we stop the nastys its not nice!!! xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Im sorry when have i been nasty ???
[/ QUOTE ]
<font color="blue">Here perhaps? </font>
[ QUOTE ]
Also seeing as Lucy12 is on here as a stranger makes me think they have only come on here to cause trouble !! x
[/ QUOTE ]
<font color="blue"> Possibly jumped to an incorrect conclusion alittle hastily then? </font>
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Im not saying people shouldnt have conversations like this but the post should of been worded slightly better - and would of got a better debate if it had??
[/ QUOTE ]
<font color="blue">Err think you did............ </font>
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can i just say on the BEF website it does ask for people not to moan etc on the forums and to direct all complaints directly to them !!!
[/ QUOTE ]
<font color="blue">Lucey would be far more justified in claiming nastiness than you to be honest, but as she seems to want to put your misunderstanding of her firmly in the past where it belongs perhaps you could apologise for your error as eventer 123 was quick to do earlier & let bygones be bygones? </font>
[ QUOTE ]
Whot diffence does it make if this was my first posting.U shouldnt judge people when u dont know them thats most unfair.Please can we stop the nastys its not nice!!! xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Im sorry when have i been nasty ???
[/ QUOTE ]
<font color="blue">Here perhaps? </font>
[ QUOTE ]
Also seeing as Lucy12 is on here as a stranger makes me think they have only come on here to cause trouble !! x
[/ QUOTE ]
<font color="blue"> Possibly jumped to an incorrect conclusion alittle hastily then? </font>
[ QUOTE ]
Im not saying people shouldnt have conversations like this but the post should of been worded slightly better - and would of got a better debate if it had??
[/ QUOTE ]
<font color="blue">Err think you did............ </font>
[ QUOTE ]
can i just say on the BEF website it does ask for people not to moan etc on the forums and to direct all complaints directly to them !!!
[/ QUOTE ]
<font color="blue">Lucey would be far more justified in claiming nastiness than you to be honest, but as she seems to want to put your misunderstanding of her firmly in the past where it belongs perhaps you could apologise for your error as eventer 123 was quick to do earlier & let bygones be bygones? </font>
nicol1
Active Member
Thanks zebedee i really didnt mean any harm but their were people who wasnt happy on the day.I know i dont always word things rite thats just my level of education.so theirs nice people on here thanks u guys .xxxx
koeffee
Well-Known Member
friend has been to preston today, from what she saw judging is not very fare, seems to be who you know not what the horse is? as some one said what failed on one was past on another, puts me off doing it next year.
nicol1
Active Member
This is whot i mean am glad some one else can see whot i mean.thank you for that.xxxxx
joeathh
Well-Known Member
Hi I have been at Preston most of the day 10am till 3pm and watched the main arena not the vet etc. I thought the comments and marks were pretty spot on (can't comment on vet marks because not close enough to the horses to see). Really interesting day and I could see exactly what the judges were looking for. After a few, myself and OH were near enough right with each average mark and not just the premium. Gives us the confidence we are looking at and for the right things. It was an excellent and educational day and I'll do my best to go and watch Heart of England now too!
StaceyTanglewood
Well-Known Member
Oh right now im being nasty ??? really makes me laugh !!
If people want to moan then fine but this sort of post gets out of hand and i think the BEF have done a great job - if we get more posts like this then they will think twice about doing the evaluations which i think is sad as its a great thing to go out and do !!
you are also making people that havent been think that maybe they dont want to go next year - thats not fair !!
so no sorry i wont apologise !!
If people want to moan then fine but this sort of post gets out of hand and i think the BEF have done a great job - if we get more posts like this then they will think twice about doing the evaluations which i think is sad as its a great thing to go out and do !!
you are also making people that havent been think that maybe they dont want to go next year - thats not fair !!
so no sorry i wont apologise !!
almorton
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- 2 March 2008
- Messages
- 1,071
- Location
- GreyGates Sport Horses Lancashire
Having had my horse assessed today,i would like to comment on the evaluations. I came home fairly upset, BUT having mainly good marks, and also having taken my concerns to the judges. We had good marks bar one (not the vet!) which dropped us from the 1st premium we wanted. As such, i feel able to comment having already voiced my opinions at the futurity.
I think what people need to realise is:
1. futurity is a fairly new concept - if you have any problems, let people know! they are open to suggestions for improvement
2. You can learn from good AND bad experiences.
3. Sometimes horses just dont perform. Face it, they are not machines! my lad cantered appallingly today. Not him at all! But hey, these things happen.
I WILL take my concerns further, i am still not happy but appreciate the organisers dont want people slating things on here. a lot of effort was put into the event which was evident.
so could we put forward ways to improve the event? i feel this would benefit everyone!
i have the following suggestions to make:
1. could we have a re-evaluation where our concerns can be voiced with the horse in front of us? perhaps just 2 minutes at the end of the day. the people with valid concerns will stay. i would have.
2. more detail on the evaluation sheet would be appreciated. mine was fairly brief, though still very useful.
3. how about video evidence of the event? i would have loved to run through it and also i couldnt hear all the comments as another judge was speaking to me! some of us might even buy the footage as a momento!
4. i feel that vetinary diagnosis of certain (medical!) conditions should NOT happen by the evaluators, if they werent mentioned by the vet! who by the way was exceptionally patient and excellent with plenty of time for both you and the horse.
5. how about a 'group' presentation after every agegroup, to show consistency ie. these 2 horses move exactly like we are looking for. these 2 horses have exceptionally good conformation. im sure people would oblige!
so yes, some of us were upset. i personally came away thinking - well, im just not going to bother again. but i feel that the futurity need supporting (and us showjumpers were very few on the ground - where was everybody???! perhaps having a SJ judge would help BEF?)
BUT - many thanks to the organisers and i hope you value constructive opinions and suggestions. i will in all probability represent next year. and i hope to come away smiling this time!
I think what people need to realise is:
1. futurity is a fairly new concept - if you have any problems, let people know! they are open to suggestions for improvement
2. You can learn from good AND bad experiences.
3. Sometimes horses just dont perform. Face it, they are not machines! my lad cantered appallingly today. Not him at all! But hey, these things happen.
I WILL take my concerns further, i am still not happy but appreciate the organisers dont want people slating things on here. a lot of effort was put into the event which was evident.
so could we put forward ways to improve the event? i feel this would benefit everyone!
i have the following suggestions to make:
1. could we have a re-evaluation where our concerns can be voiced with the horse in front of us? perhaps just 2 minutes at the end of the day. the people with valid concerns will stay. i would have.
2. more detail on the evaluation sheet would be appreciated. mine was fairly brief, though still very useful.
3. how about video evidence of the event? i would have loved to run through it and also i couldnt hear all the comments as another judge was speaking to me! some of us might even buy the footage as a momento!
4. i feel that vetinary diagnosis of certain (medical!) conditions should NOT happen by the evaluators, if they werent mentioned by the vet! who by the way was exceptionally patient and excellent with plenty of time for both you and the horse.
5. how about a 'group' presentation after every agegroup, to show consistency ie. these 2 horses move exactly like we are looking for. these 2 horses have exceptionally good conformation. im sure people would oblige!
so yes, some of us were upset. i personally came away thinking - well, im just not going to bother again. but i feel that the futurity need supporting (and us showjumpers were very few on the ground - where was everybody???! perhaps having a SJ judge would help BEF?)
BUT - many thanks to the organisers and i hope you value constructive opinions and suggestions. i will in all probability represent next year. and i hope to come away smiling this time!
nicol1
Active Member
Well their are people were i live that couldnt get into the grange one worried about going up country because whot they saw.am sure from afew comments they wouldnt pull it.thats scare mongering.xx
nicol1
Active Member
greygates i 100 per cent agree with u.xxx
no_no_nanette
Well-Known Member
My only (and first) experience of the Futurity has been at Plumpton this year, but on that basis, I'd like to comment on some of the points that have been made :
*"Seems to be who you know ..." we and the other first timers at Plumpton didn't know ANYONE and still felt that the judging was very fair, very transparent, and in spite of being complete unknowns a number of our youngsters got first premiums! And some of the bigger studs represented didn't get high marks for their youngsters .... Having accompanied a friend who is deeply into showing on several occasions, the Futurity could not have been more of a positive contrast!
*Suggestion that unless your horse is of "excellent and well-known breeding" its not worth going .... well, the reality is that if your youngster is by a successful and proven sire in a particular discipline out of a quality broodmare - the likelihood is that the offspring will also be quality. <u>Likelihood</u> but not <u>certainty</u> - there were highly marked foals at Plumpton who were the first products of young and relatively unknown stallions.
*Evaluators saying that a horse who had been a county winner was "not moving off the ground". We don't know which discipline this particular horse was being evaluated for, but I know that if I took my eventing yearling who got a first premium in the Futurity into an in-hand showing class locally he would almost certainly be placed way below the "working hunter" types .... So success in one arena doesn't guarantee high marks in another, and showing judges and Futurity evaluators are not necessarily looking for exactly the same thing.
*"Told that their pride and joy is not very good" - at no point did we see or hear ANYONE being told that their youngster "was no good". They were just getting feedback against clear criteria - if that meant that your horse, (and of course they are our pride and joy), didn't get high marks against those criteria, it doesn't mean that they are "no good". Just that on the day they were judged to have some shortcomings - very often these can be worked on and corrected.
I think that this last point is a really key one - and Anastasia has already made the point ... if we submit our horse for evaluation we HAVE to be mature enough to take constructive as well as positive feedback. After all, the Futurity is all about educating those of us who are newcomers to breeding, and improving the quality of British breeding so that we can compete on an equal footing with our continental colleagues. We have some way to go, and things are not going to advance if we object every time we get feedback on the "products" of our breeding.
Sorry that this is so long, but I'm concerned that people may be put off/get the wrong impression, as its so easy to be influenced by negative comments and not hear the positive, so I'm really keen to redress the balance! I hope that if some people who took part didn't feel that it was a good experience for whatever reason, they do take the trouble to talk to Jan or Ciss about it, with hard evidence of what went wrong.
*"Seems to be who you know ..." we and the other first timers at Plumpton didn't know ANYONE and still felt that the judging was very fair, very transparent, and in spite of being complete unknowns a number of our youngsters got first premiums! And some of the bigger studs represented didn't get high marks for their youngsters .... Having accompanied a friend who is deeply into showing on several occasions, the Futurity could not have been more of a positive contrast!
*Suggestion that unless your horse is of "excellent and well-known breeding" its not worth going .... well, the reality is that if your youngster is by a successful and proven sire in a particular discipline out of a quality broodmare - the likelihood is that the offspring will also be quality. <u>Likelihood</u> but not <u>certainty</u> - there were highly marked foals at Plumpton who were the first products of young and relatively unknown stallions.
*Evaluators saying that a horse who had been a county winner was "not moving off the ground". We don't know which discipline this particular horse was being evaluated for, but I know that if I took my eventing yearling who got a first premium in the Futurity into an in-hand showing class locally he would almost certainly be placed way below the "working hunter" types .... So success in one arena doesn't guarantee high marks in another, and showing judges and Futurity evaluators are not necessarily looking for exactly the same thing.
*"Told that their pride and joy is not very good" - at no point did we see or hear ANYONE being told that their youngster "was no good". They were just getting feedback against clear criteria - if that meant that your horse, (and of course they are our pride and joy), didn't get high marks against those criteria, it doesn't mean that they are "no good". Just that on the day they were judged to have some shortcomings - very often these can be worked on and corrected.
I think that this last point is a really key one - and Anastasia has already made the point ... if we submit our horse for evaluation we HAVE to be mature enough to take constructive as well as positive feedback. After all, the Futurity is all about educating those of us who are newcomers to breeding, and improving the quality of British breeding so that we can compete on an equal footing with our continental colleagues. We have some way to go, and things are not going to advance if we object every time we get feedback on the "products" of our breeding.
Sorry that this is so long, but I'm concerned that people may be put off/get the wrong impression, as its so easy to be influenced by negative comments and not hear the positive, so I'm really keen to redress the balance! I hope that if some people who took part didn't feel that it was a good experience for whatever reason, they do take the trouble to talk to Jan or Ciss about it, with hard evidence of what went wrong.
nicol1
Active Member
well explain please as i seem to be dum,how 1 horse got first as a foal ,3rd as yearling and 1st as 2yr old.then another top marks foal and yearling and 2nd as 2yr old.to go from 1 one yr to 3rd another then back to 1st doesnt make sense.xxx
CrazyMare
Well-Known Member
It does make sense that they can go up and down - horses aren't machines, they grow, mature and change. One year they may not be showing their true potential as they have grown and gone croup high, or being putting energy into growing, may have just been cut - the possibilities are endless.
nicol1
Active Member
no one is still a colt the other i dont think he had just been cut.its all very strange but am over the moon with mine.hes still top for hes age.xxx
no_no_nanette
Well-Known Member
"It does make sense that they can go up and down - horses aren't machines, they grow, mature and change. One year they may not be showing their true potential as they have grown and gone croup high, or being putting energy into growing, may have just been cut - the possibilities are endless"
Exactly!
Exactly!
Anastasia
Well-Known Member
Crazymare that is just what I was going to say.
I have seen foals judged by the KWPN receive a 1st premium and come back as a 3 year old mare to receive a 2nd Premium, and vice versa.
One of our friends got a 2nd Premium with her yearling filly by the KWPN one year and was told to bring her back as a 3 year old because of her lack of development. When she was presented as a 3 year old she was awarded "Ster".
Horses can develop differently and depending on how they are allowed to mature will make a great difference in their potential.....the nature versus nurture comes into play.
As I said in my earlier post, there are many people who do not like being told if their horses have negative points (I know, as have seen it at many gradings). But these types of events will dissect your horse to find both the positive and negatives, and as someone else pointed out some faults will come good with time, others may not. And lets admit it......there is not one fault free horse going about..
Its a shame when people come away with negative feelings from these events, but you will never be able to please everyone.
I have seen foals judged by the KWPN receive a 1st premium and come back as a 3 year old mare to receive a 2nd Premium, and vice versa.
One of our friends got a 2nd Premium with her yearling filly by the KWPN one year and was told to bring her back as a 3 year old because of her lack of development. When she was presented as a 3 year old she was awarded "Ster".
Horses can develop differently and depending on how they are allowed to mature will make a great difference in their potential.....the nature versus nurture comes into play.
As I said in my earlier post, there are many people who do not like being told if their horses have negative points (I know, as have seen it at many gradings). But these types of events will dissect your horse to find both the positive and negatives, and as someone else pointed out some faults will come good with time, others may not. And lets admit it......there is not one fault free horse going about..
Its a shame when people come away with negative feelings from these events, but you will never be able to please everyone.
CrazyMare
Well-Known Member
Phew - I'm not talking rubbish!! I'm a great believer in letting horses be horses and letting youngsters grow up.
henryhorn
Well-Known Member
I watched foals at The Grange and although I didn't necessarily agree with the evaluators every time I think they did their utmost to be fair, kind and constructive.
I wish some of the language had been less flowery, and that they had made use of microphones, one lady actually asked if we could hear and we all shouted no, but she carried on anyway!
It did help you understand what they were looking for because after a few I started looking for faults and finding them, though I was never sure when I really thought something was super as a spectator they would agree with me. Most times the ones I thought "Wow" got 1st premiums.
I wish in a way they would keep the actual marks private for the owners because with the best will in the world, horsey people always compare their position in the results.
I think you need a tough skin if you go because everyone always thinks their animals is fine, so if you are sensitive, don't go!
Or ask your equine vet for an unbiased opinion first.
I also agree breeding should be kept off the forms, that way the judges really would have to be judging on nothing else.
I don't think there is any favouritism at all, and feel sorry for the evaluators, all of whom I'm sure are only doing their best on the day.
It's not my thing but for anyone wanting confirmation they have super stock then it's a good way to prove it.
I wish some of the language had been less flowery, and that they had made use of microphones, one lady actually asked if we could hear and we all shouted no, but she carried on anyway!
It did help you understand what they were looking for because after a few I started looking for faults and finding them, though I was never sure when I really thought something was super as a spectator they would agree with me. Most times the ones I thought "Wow" got 1st premiums.
I wish in a way they would keep the actual marks private for the owners because with the best will in the world, horsey people always compare their position in the results.
I think you need a tough skin if you go because everyone always thinks their animals is fine, so if you are sensitive, don't go!
Or ask your equine vet for an unbiased opinion first.
I also agree breeding should be kept off the forms, that way the judges really would have to be judging on nothing else.
I don't think there is any favouritism at all, and feel sorry for the evaluators, all of whom I'm sure are only doing their best on the day.
It's not my thing but for anyone wanting confirmation they have super stock then it's a good way to prove it.
nicol1
Active Member
they didnt use the speakers as they said it was to loud and were worried about upsetting some of the horses.xx
TEDDY102
Active Member
i thought the comments were constructive and usually supported with positive feedback
Zebedee
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
If people want to moan then fine
[/ QUOTE ]
No one is moaning as far as I can see - the OP asked a perfectly reasonable question. It would appear that she's not totally alone in her views.
[ QUOTE ]
i think the BEF have done a great job -
[/ QUOTE ]
I don't think anyone has said that they aren't. It is a relatively new concept & there are still aspects that need improving upon.
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if we get more posts like this then they will think twice about doing the evaluations which i think is sad as its a great thing to go out and do !!
[/ QUOTE ]
HHO is a great place, but I think you over estimate its influence in this case.
[ QUOTE ]
you are also making people that havent been think that maybe they dont want to go next year - thats not fair !!
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm sure people will make up their own minds one way or the other. Whats wrong with them seeing both sides the coin?
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so no sorry i wont apologise !!
[/ QUOTE ]
That really says so much more about you than the OP.
My involvement in this thread has mainly been in defence of a new poster who you immediately denounced as a troublemaker because she voiced her (quite legitmate as it turns out) unease about some of the evaluations that she was present at.
Ciss has been kind enough to (again) answer the queries in some detail.
I am however am STILL waiting for you to answer my original question as to why you feel only positive feedback re the BEF evealuations shoud be posted?
If people want to moan then fine
[/ QUOTE ]
No one is moaning as far as I can see - the OP asked a perfectly reasonable question. It would appear that she's not totally alone in her views.
[ QUOTE ]
i think the BEF have done a great job -
[/ QUOTE ]
I don't think anyone has said that they aren't. It is a relatively new concept & there are still aspects that need improving upon.
[ QUOTE ]
if we get more posts like this then they will think twice about doing the evaluations which i think is sad as its a great thing to go out and do !!
[/ QUOTE ]
HHO is a great place, but I think you over estimate its influence in this case.
[ QUOTE ]
you are also making people that havent been think that maybe they dont want to go next year - thats not fair !!
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm sure people will make up their own minds one way or the other. Whats wrong with them seeing both sides the coin?
[ QUOTE ]
so no sorry i wont apologise !!
[/ QUOTE ]
That really says so much more about you than the OP.
My involvement in this thread has mainly been in defence of a new poster who you immediately denounced as a troublemaker because she voiced her (quite legitmate as it turns out) unease about some of the evaluations that she was present at.
Ciss has been kind enough to (again) answer the queries in some detail.
I am however am STILL waiting for you to answer my original question as to why you feel only positive feedback re the BEF evealuations shoud be posted?
Zebedee
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
I watched foals at The Grange and although I didn't necessarily agree with the evaluators every time I think they did their utmost to be fair, kind and constructive.
I wish some of the language had been less flowery, and that they had made use of microphones, one lady actually asked if we could hear and we all shouted no, but she carried on anyway!
It did help you understand what they were looking for because after a few I started looking for faults and finding them, though I was never sure when I really thought something was super as a spectator they would agree with me. Most times the ones I thought "Wow" got 1st premiums.
I wish in a way they would keep the actual marks private for the owners because with the best will in the world, horsey people always compare their position in the results.
I think you need a tough skin if you go because everyone always thinks their animals is fine, so if you are sensitive, don't go!
Or ask your equine vet for an unbiased opinion first.
I also agree breeding should be kept off the forms, that way the judges really would have to be judging on nothing else.
I don't think there is any favouritism at all, and feel sorry for the evaluators, all of whom I'm sure are only doing their best on the day.
It's not my thing but for anyone wanting confirmation they have super stock then it's a good way to prove it.
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As always some very good points well made.
I watched foals at The Grange and although I didn't necessarily agree with the evaluators every time I think they did their utmost to be fair, kind and constructive.
I wish some of the language had been less flowery, and that they had made use of microphones, one lady actually asked if we could hear and we all shouted no, but she carried on anyway!
It did help you understand what they were looking for because after a few I started looking for faults and finding them, though I was never sure when I really thought something was super as a spectator they would agree with me. Most times the ones I thought "Wow" got 1st premiums.
I wish in a way they would keep the actual marks private for the owners because with the best will in the world, horsey people always compare their position in the results.
I think you need a tough skin if you go because everyone always thinks their animals is fine, so if you are sensitive, don't go!
Or ask your equine vet for an unbiased opinion first.
I also agree breeding should be kept off the forms, that way the judges really would have to be judging on nothing else.
I don't think there is any favouritism at all, and feel sorry for the evaluators, all of whom I'm sure are only doing their best on the day.
It's not my thing but for anyone wanting confirmation they have super stock then it's a good way to prove it.
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As always some very good points well made.
Partoow
Well-Known Member
As in the evaluations animated discussion is constructive if we use it to move on and develope.
As for what Lucey12 thought she saw , well it was not the full story especialy with that foal in question. i think comments on others horses when you have not been party to the conversation and discussion is not wise and does not have a constructive outcome.As CISS says it leads to rumour and whispering.
Breeding information is available in the catalogues and also on the net. The class that the horse is entered and has been evaluated in is also clear and mensioned in the summary given by the judges.
as assesors their job is to identify the potential they see on the day and they make that clear ,especially with those who did not show so well. they always try and find both positive and negative comment s where necessary so to provide as clear dirrection as possible.
the presentation of the stock is also vital and what is looked for has little to do with the county show ring that is quite different.
It is not a beauty contest but an assesment of a set of princples that will hopefully guide the breeders into producing young athletes for a purpose, not all have to be the next olympic hopefull, good solid national competition horses are also worth their weight in gold and will have untold value for those that produce and ride them.
As for what Lucey12 thought she saw , well it was not the full story especialy with that foal in question. i think comments on others horses when you have not been party to the conversation and discussion is not wise and does not have a constructive outcome.As CISS says it leads to rumour and whispering.
Breeding information is available in the catalogues and also on the net. The class that the horse is entered and has been evaluated in is also clear and mensioned in the summary given by the judges.
as assesors their job is to identify the potential they see on the day and they make that clear ,especially with those who did not show so well. they always try and find both positive and negative comment s where necessary so to provide as clear dirrection as possible.
the presentation of the stock is also vital and what is looked for has little to do with the county show ring that is quite different.
It is not a beauty contest but an assesment of a set of princples that will hopefully guide the breeders into producing young athletes for a purpose, not all have to be the next olympic hopefull, good solid national competition horses are also worth their weight in gold and will have untold value for those that produce and ride them.
magic104
Well-Known Member
There is a tendency with humans to exaggerate, so one person becomes 10. Perhaps it makes the person feel more comfortable to feel like they have the back up of others. The only reason I did not go this year is because of my 2yo's hock. I will though take him & the yearling next year. This is because with the loose jumping it may show that the hock is not going to be a problem to him in the future. These things do not bother me anyway, because no one can pull my horses apart better then I can!
In the past we had the Masterlock series & it was a real shame that it finished, but I think this concept is even better because it includes foals, yearlings etc.
Thanks partoow because I think you summed it up (along with some others) very well. Sorry to those that did not like the comments, but when your horses have proved the judges wrong perhaps you can come back & let us know.
In the past we had the Masterlock series & it was a real shame that it finished, but I think this concept is even better because it includes foals, yearlings etc.
Thanks partoow because I think you summed it up (along with some others) very well. Sorry to those that did not like the comments, but when your horses have proved the judges wrong perhaps you can come back & let us know.