nicol1
Active Member
did prove jugdes wrong when they gave him 3rd last yr about him back this yr and they gave him a 1st.I also seen the sheet from the foal in question so now it wasnt whot i thought i saw i did see!!!.xxxx
Was any1 else upset with comments made at the furtity
- Thread starter nicol1
- Start date
arwenplusone
Well-Known Member
Nothing to add that others haven;t already said but personally I can see EXACTLY why the BEF don't want these things discussed on forums.
I am a 'one man band' breeder, not a big stud and whilst I understand that my horses may not be world beaters I am prepared to put them through a grading to learn about their good and bad points.
I myself sat through the day at Myerscough as think it is a great opportunity to train my eye in conformation. On the whole I think the evaluators comments were fair. Indeed I saw one horse that looked lame/poor to me and whilst this was noted, there were also plenty of positives mentioned about the horse - so it was done very well.
However, If I had not been and I had just read this discussion I would be very much put off going. It's a shame as I think the futurity is a wonderful opportunity for breeders, large and small
I am a 'one man band' breeder, not a big stud and whilst I understand that my horses may not be world beaters I am prepared to put them through a grading to learn about their good and bad points.
I myself sat through the day at Myerscough as think it is a great opportunity to train my eye in conformation. On the whole I think the evaluators comments were fair. Indeed I saw one horse that looked lame/poor to me and whilst this was noted, there were also plenty of positives mentioned about the horse - so it was done very well.
However, If I had not been and I had just read this discussion I would be very much put off going. It's a shame as I think the futurity is a wonderful opportunity for breeders, large and small
magic104
Well-Known Member
did prove jugdes wrong when they gave him 3rd last yr about him back this yr and they gave him a 1st
Well then you should be pleased & shows how much they can change in a year. You are intitled to your opinion of course you are, as is everyone who expresses their opinions after watching grading etc.
I do apologise for sounding rude, but I found it hard to follow some of your posts. Is it possible you could do a spell/grammer check before posting?
Well then you should be pleased & shows how much they can change in a year. You are intitled to your opinion of course you are, as is everyone who expresses their opinions after watching grading etc.
I do apologise for sounding rude, but I found it hard to follow some of your posts. Is it possible you could do a spell/grammer check before posting?
Partoow
Well-Known Member
lucey12 you may well have seen the sheet of the foal and you may well have had your opinion but you were not party to the discussion with the owner of the foal or why the panel decided to go against the harsh vet mark. You actually are exactly what i worry about a case of a little information being a dangerous thing. especially as you continue to go on about it.
I will not discuss the particulars as this is not the place. It has been talked about and to people that will make a difference.
At the end of the year the BEF team will discuss any problem areas in an open, informed and constructive way.
If you feel this scheme has so little value then i suggest you go elsewhere to show your foal in future as you obviously know better than the BEF and the team who work hard and are trying to improve the lot for british breeding.
I will not discuss the particulars as this is not the place. It has been talked about and to people that will make a difference.
At the end of the year the BEF team will discuss any problem areas in an open, informed and constructive way.
If you feel this scheme has so little value then i suggest you go elsewhere to show your foal in future as you obviously know better than the BEF and the team who work hard and are trying to improve the lot for british breeding.
Cullohill
Well-Known Member
Glad you've said that! i haven't been to any dyas to watch yet and taking our homebred 3 yr old to Arena UK (hope you mange to go with all your goings worng!) never bred before and never will again, we think Fin is amazing and love him to bits but at end of day we are taking him to be evaluated and prepared to here experienced peoples opinion on him be it good or bad.
Zebedee
Well-Known Member
QR.
I've just read a PM from Lucey. She is quite upset & feels that a few of you have misunderstood the situation. She also realises that her written grammar & spelling may makes it harder for people, but from what she tells me she does the best she can with them.
She has asked me to post the following on her behalf to try & clear up some misconceptions that have arisen.
With regard to the scores that she witnessed where one foal was penalised for a conformational fault & one with the same fault & a worse vets score wasn't, both animals belong to friends of hers. She has seen both score sheets, & was present when both owners queried with Jan on the day why the one with the same fault & the worse vet score (on both) got a 1st & the one with the better vets score a 3rd, so it is not gossip or rumour. It is first hand information.
Lucey is an experienced breeder, & is well aware that horses change tremendously between foal & full grown. However she is personally now unsure of the merits of a system where a horse can go from 1st to 3d then back again, as things like 'being croup high' (mentioned in a previous post) are a part of the natural growth pattern of a young horse & they should not therefore be penalised if that's the stage of growth they have reached.
These were the kind of things she wanted to discuss on here, but became very frustrated both with the assumptions that were made about her, as well as not being able to express herself in the way she wanted to.
Her post was not made in sour grapes in any form. Her own foal did exceptionally well, but I have promised not reveal anything more, as she is naturally very concerned that she remains anonymous.
I will add on my own behalf that I think it's a shame that someone who wanted only a debate has been made to feel this way, & I still think that people should be free to discuss whatever aspects of any event they wish - from both positive & negative points of view.
I've just read a PM from Lucey. She is quite upset & feels that a few of you have misunderstood the situation. She also realises that her written grammar & spelling may makes it harder for people, but from what she tells me she does the best she can with them.
She has asked me to post the following on her behalf to try & clear up some misconceptions that have arisen.
With regard to the scores that she witnessed where one foal was penalised for a conformational fault & one with the same fault & a worse vets score wasn't, both animals belong to friends of hers. She has seen both score sheets, & was present when both owners queried with Jan on the day why the one with the same fault & the worse vet score (on both) got a 1st & the one with the better vets score a 3rd, so it is not gossip or rumour. It is first hand information.
Lucey is an experienced breeder, & is well aware that horses change tremendously between foal & full grown. However she is personally now unsure of the merits of a system where a horse can go from 1st to 3d then back again, as things like 'being croup high' (mentioned in a previous post) are a part of the natural growth pattern of a young horse & they should not therefore be penalised if that's the stage of growth they have reached.
These were the kind of things she wanted to discuss on here, but became very frustrated both with the assumptions that were made about her, as well as not being able to express herself in the way she wanted to.
Her post was not made in sour grapes in any form. Her own foal did exceptionally well, but I have promised not reveal anything more, as she is naturally very concerned that she remains anonymous.
I will add on my own behalf that I think it's a shame that someone who wanted only a debate has been made to feel this way, & I still think that people should be free to discuss whatever aspects of any event they wish - from both positive & negative points of view.
nicol1
Active Member
sorry to say i didnt take my foal i took my two year old that done very well!!!!
Zebedee
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
sorry to say i didnt take my foal i took my two year old that done very well!!!!
[/ QUOTE ]
Oops sorry Lucey -I thought you meant you took a foal.
sorry to say i didnt take my foal i took my two year old that done very well!!!!
[/ QUOTE ]
Oops sorry Lucey -I thought you meant you took a foal.
nicol1
Active Member
Thank you zebedee for all your help and your kindnest,you have put it in a nut shell.sorry to all those who took whot i said wrong.frightened to say anymore or put anymore posts on .xxxx
pinktiger
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
QR.
I've just read a PM from Lucey. She is quite upset & feels that a few of you have misunderstood the situation. She also realises that her written grammar & spelling may makes it harder for people, but from what she tells me she does the best she can with them.
clear up some misconceptions that have arisen.
These were the kind of things she wanted to discuss on here, but became very frustrated both with the assumptions that were made about her, as well as not being able to express herself in the way she wanted to.
Her post was not made in sour grapes in any form. Her own foal did exceptionally well, but I have promised not reveal anything more, as she is naturally very concerned that she remains anonymous.
I will add on my own behalf that I think it's a shame that someone who wanted only a debate has been made to feel this way, & I still think that people should be free to discuss whatever aspects of any event they wish - from both positive & negative points of view.
[/ QUOTE ]
i totally agree with this post, what a shame someone, new who came to express dissatifaction was made to feel this way, a real shame, and to say that they couldnt understand what she had written and so therefore took it as agressive is just down right nasty!!! please Luce keep using the forum you will get support on here and will learn those to avoid!!!
QR.
I've just read a PM from Lucey. She is quite upset & feels that a few of you have misunderstood the situation. She also realises that her written grammar & spelling may makes it harder for people, but from what she tells me she does the best she can with them.
clear up some misconceptions that have arisen.
These were the kind of things she wanted to discuss on here, but became very frustrated both with the assumptions that were made about her, as well as not being able to express herself in the way she wanted to.
Her post was not made in sour grapes in any form. Her own foal did exceptionally well, but I have promised not reveal anything more, as she is naturally very concerned that she remains anonymous.
I will add on my own behalf that I think it's a shame that someone who wanted only a debate has been made to feel this way, & I still think that people should be free to discuss whatever aspects of any event they wish - from both positive & negative points of view.
[/ QUOTE ]
i totally agree with this post, what a shame someone, new who came to express dissatifaction was made to feel this way, a real shame, and to say that they couldnt understand what she had written and so therefore took it as agressive is just down right nasty!!! please Luce keep using the forum you will get support on here and will learn those to avoid!!!
StaceyTanglewood
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
If people want to moan then fine
[/ QUOTE ]
No one is moaning as far as I can see - the OP asked a perfectly reasonable question. It would appear that she's not totally alone in her views.
[ QUOTE ]
i think the BEF have done a great job -
[/ QUOTE ]
I don't think anyone has said that they aren't. It is a relatively new concept & there are still aspects that need improving upon.
[ QUOTE ]
if we get more posts like this then they will think twice about doing the evaluations which i think is sad as its a great thing to go out and do !!
[/ QUOTE ]
HHO is a great place, but I think you over estimate its influence in this case.
[ QUOTE ]
you are also making people that havent been think that maybe they dont want to go next year - thats not fair !!
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm sure people will make up their own minds one way or the other. Whats wrong with them seeing both sides the coin?
[ QUOTE ]
so no sorry i wont apologise !!
[/ QUOTE ]
That really says so much more about you than the OP.
My involvement in this thread has mainly been in defence of a new poster who you immediately denounced as a troublemaker because she voiced her (quite legitmate as it turns out) unease about some of the evaluations that she was present at.
Ciss has been kind enough to (again) answer the queries in some detail.
I am however am STILL waiting for you to answer my original question as to why you feel only positive feedback re the BEF evealuations shoud be posted?
[/ QUOTE ]
you obviously havent read all my posts then !!!
and you definately havent read the first post ??? if you had then you will see how when i read it i actually found it quite offensive and unfair
starting to think you have something personal against this - please feel free to PM me if you do??
[ QUOTE ]
If people want to moan then fine
[/ QUOTE ]
No one is moaning as far as I can see - the OP asked a perfectly reasonable question. It would appear that she's not totally alone in her views.
[ QUOTE ]
i think the BEF have done a great job -
[/ QUOTE ]
I don't think anyone has said that they aren't. It is a relatively new concept & there are still aspects that need improving upon.
[ QUOTE ]
if we get more posts like this then they will think twice about doing the evaluations which i think is sad as its a great thing to go out and do !!
[/ QUOTE ]
HHO is a great place, but I think you over estimate its influence in this case.
[ QUOTE ]
you are also making people that havent been think that maybe they dont want to go next year - thats not fair !!
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm sure people will make up their own minds one way or the other. Whats wrong with them seeing both sides the coin?
[ QUOTE ]
so no sorry i wont apologise !!
[/ QUOTE ]
That really says so much more about you than the OP.
My involvement in this thread has mainly been in defence of a new poster who you immediately denounced as a troublemaker because she voiced her (quite legitmate as it turns out) unease about some of the evaluations that she was present at.
Ciss has been kind enough to (again) answer the queries in some detail.
I am however am STILL waiting for you to answer my original question as to why you feel only positive feedback re the BEF evealuations shoud be posted?
[/ QUOTE ]
you obviously havent read all my posts then !!!
and you definately havent read the first post ??? if you had then you will see how when i read it i actually found it quite offensive and unfair
starting to think you have something personal against this - please feel free to PM me if you do??
StaceyTanglewood
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
I was astaunded at the apparent inconistensces,what 1 was penalised for was ignored in others.Some of the score sheets i saw the comments made did not tally up with the remarks.The poor vet did his bit but on occassion was ignored by the evaluators!!I also feel they should not know the breeding of these horses.I am totally deflated by the whole thing.Good luck to any1 attending that doesnt have what they call excellant and well know breeding!!!
[/ QUOTE ]
here it is again for anyone that has forgotten !"!
I was astaunded at the apparent inconistensces,what 1 was penalised for was ignored in others.Some of the score sheets i saw the comments made did not tally up with the remarks.The poor vet did his bit but on occassion was ignored by the evaluators!!I also feel they should not know the breeding of these horses.I am totally deflated by the whole thing.Good luck to any1 attending that doesnt have what they call excellant and well know breeding!!!
[/ QUOTE ]
here it is again for anyone that has forgotten !"!
Zebedee
Well-Known Member
Good lord no..........nothing personal against you at all........I still do not see anything offensive in the OP., & if you read her post above she's now at the stage where she doesn't want to post anymore, so I guess the objective from your point of view has been achieved.
I haven't PM'd you because I don't have anything to say to you that can't be said on open.
I apologise if I've missed the answer to my question in all these posts. I'm going out now to feed horses. I'll have another read through when I get in.
I haven't PM'd you because I don't have anything to say to you that can't be said on open.
I apologise if I've missed the answer to my question in all these posts. I'm going out now to feed horses. I'll have another read through when I get in.
Zebedee
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I was astaunded at the apparent inconistensces,what 1 was penalised for was ignored in others.Some of the score sheets i saw the comments made did not tally up with the remarks.The poor vet did his bit but on occassion was ignored by the evaluators!!I also feel they should not know the breeding of these horses.I am totally deflated by the whole thing.Good luck to any1 attending that doesnt have what they call excellant and well know breeding!!!
[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
here it is again for anyone that has forgotten !"!
[/ QUOTE ]
When you have finished on your defensive mission of self justification could you please explain what exactly you find offensive. The OP isn't alone in her suggestion that perhaps the evaluators shouldn't know the breeding - one very good post on another thread talked about evaluating genotype against phenotype. She had first hand knowledge of what she felt were in her opinion (which she is fully entitled to) inconsistencies. All she wanted was to hear what other people thought & enjoy a friendly exchange of views. Her own youngster did exceptionally well, & she has supported the futurity since it's inception.
[ QUOTE ]
I was astaunded at the apparent inconistensces,what 1 was penalised for was ignored in others.Some of the score sheets i saw the comments made did not tally up with the remarks.The poor vet did his bit but on occassion was ignored by the evaluators!!I also feel they should not know the breeding of these horses.I am totally deflated by the whole thing.Good luck to any1 attending that doesnt have what they call excellant and well know breeding!!!
[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
here it is again for anyone that has forgotten !"!
[/ QUOTE ]
When you have finished on your defensive mission of self justification could you please explain what exactly you find offensive. The OP isn't alone in her suggestion that perhaps the evaluators shouldn't know the breeding - one very good post on another thread talked about evaluating genotype against phenotype. She had first hand knowledge of what she felt were in her opinion (which she is fully entitled to) inconsistencies. All she wanted was to hear what other people thought & enjoy a friendly exchange of views. Her own youngster did exceptionally well, & she has supported the futurity since it's inception.
magic104
Well-Known Member
Zebedee, I am sorry but this line "I am totally deflated by the whole thing.Good luck to any1 attending that doesnt have what they call excellant and well know breeding!!!
This clearly insinuates that if your exhibit does not have knowN breeding then it is doomed to fail. How else would Lucy like us to read it??? How about IMO I feel that if the animal is of unknown breeding it may not score as well. Sorry to nit pick, but as there seems to be a fair bit of that occuring on this post, then lets nit pick away.
This clearly insinuates that if your exhibit does not have knowN breeding then it is doomed to fail. How else would Lucy like us to read it??? How about IMO I feel that if the animal is of unknown breeding it may not score as well. Sorry to nit pick, but as there seems to be a fair bit of that occuring on this post, then lets nit pick away.
StaceyTanglewood
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Zebedee, I am sorry but this line "I am totally deflated by the whole thing.Good luck to any1 attending that doesnt have what they call excellant and well know breeding!!!
This clearly insinuates that if your exhibit does not have knowN breeding then it is doomed to fail. How else would Lucy like us to read it??? How about IMO I feel that if the animal is of unknown breeding it may not score as well. Sorry to nit pick, but as there seems to be a fair bit of that occuring on this post, then lets nit pick away.
[/ QUOTE ]
just got in from finishing my horses and tucking them into bed and it seems that Magic104 has answered the question for me thanks xxxx
Zebedee, I am sorry but this line "I am totally deflated by the whole thing.Good luck to any1 attending that doesnt have what they call excellant and well know breeding!!!
This clearly insinuates that if your exhibit does not have knowN breeding then it is doomed to fail. How else would Lucy like us to read it??? How about IMO I feel that if the animal is of unknown breeding it may not score as well. Sorry to nit pick, but as there seems to be a fair bit of that occuring on this post, then lets nit pick away.
[/ QUOTE ]
just got in from finishing my horses and tucking them into bed and it seems that Magic104 has answered the question for me thanks xxxx
magic104
Well-Known Member
ST did not mean to butt in, but this is how I have read Lucy's statement. It is very difficult to interpret the written word at times, which is why most people will put IMO. I am not ganging up on this poster, by any means, but they have stated something which gives a poor impression on how this is judged. As an owner of a colt ex of an un reg mare, something like that comment could be very off putting indeed.
Zebedee
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Zebedee, I am sorry but this line "I am totally deflated by the whole thing.Good luck to any1 attending that doesnt have what they call excellant and well know breeding!!!
This clearly insinuates that if your exhibit does not have knowN breeding then it is doomed to fail. How else would Lucy like us to read it??? How about IMO I feel that if the animal is of unknown breeding it may not score as well. Sorry to nit pick, but as there seems to be a fair bit of that occuring on this post, then lets nit pick away.
[/ QUOTE ]
Well at least you saved Stacey the bother of answering her own question!!
To be honest given Luceys self confessed problems with written expression I would have thought it was obvious that she meant no offence, especially in the light of her subsequent posts. The first two respondents to her posts questioned her motives for posting. Lucey tried again to convey what she meant. One poster apologised for the misunderstanding immediately. The other didn't, & also at one point accused me of being nasty !!
Lucey now says she's withdrawing from the forum. Whilst I'm sure there are some who will breathe a sigh of relief I think it's a poor reflection when a new user ends up frightened to post & has to resort to asking someone who has at least been polite to them to post on their behalf.
My involvement in this thread has mainly been in defense of a new user, & I have had very little to do with the futurity discussion itself.
Zebedee, I am sorry but this line "I am totally deflated by the whole thing.Good luck to any1 attending that doesnt have what they call excellant and well know breeding!!!
This clearly insinuates that if your exhibit does not have knowN breeding then it is doomed to fail. How else would Lucy like us to read it??? How about IMO I feel that if the animal is of unknown breeding it may not score as well. Sorry to nit pick, but as there seems to be a fair bit of that occuring on this post, then lets nit pick away.
[/ QUOTE ]
Well at least you saved Stacey the bother of answering her own question!!
To be honest given Luceys self confessed problems with written expression I would have thought it was obvious that she meant no offence, especially in the light of her subsequent posts. The first two respondents to her posts questioned her motives for posting. Lucey tried again to convey what she meant. One poster apologised for the misunderstanding immediately. The other didn't, & also at one point accused me of being nasty !!
Lucey now says she's withdrawing from the forum. Whilst I'm sure there are some who will breathe a sigh of relief I think it's a poor reflection when a new user ends up frightened to post & has to resort to asking someone who has at least been polite to them to post on their behalf.
My involvement in this thread has mainly been in defense of a new user, & I have had very little to do with the futurity discussion itself.
magic104
Well-Known Member
Lucey now says she's withdrawing from the forum. Whilst I'm sure there are some who will breathe a sigh of relief I think it's a poor reflection when a new user ends up frightened to post & has to resort to asking someone who has at least been polite to them to post on their behalf.
First of all I am sorry if she feels this way, she is not the first & most certainly wont be the last. I find this odd as at the end of the day, does it really matter on a forum? Most people on here dont know ea other, & are unlikely to ever meet up. So what if they dont agree with you, or take what you have said as incorrect. I remember when my daughter at 14 was accused of being a liar by someone one here. As I said to her you know the truth & the people who matter know the truth, so take it with a pinch of salt.
Secondly because of that I wonder how anyone can be frightened to carry on posting? By the sounds of things you have an issue with one other poster, again so what. They are just as intitled to defend what they think is right as Lucy is to make her comments, which I have to say did not come across as well meaning. You have explained on her behalf, & I would think that is fine. It seems to me that there is now an issue between you, Lucy & ST as to who is being nasty, who is mis-understanding who, & it is all unnecessary.
If I have offended Lucy then I am sorry, but we all make the odd typing error, & if my spelling/grammer was that poor then I would double check it. I have a habit of shortening words (my days of sending telexes). Now it is all text speach which does not always flow in a way that makes for easy reading. If Lucy stops posting then that is her choice, IMO though it should not be blamed on bullying as I do not think that is the case at all. I have read her other posts & I can find no evidence of bullying on any of those either. Again this is virtual stuff, it really is nonsence to be upset over what a couple of people have typed. My god 1/2 the people would have left & there would be no forum if we all felt that way. Dont get me wrong I have felt upset in the past with stupid comments, & I saw red when I saw what had been sent to my daughter, but we get over it & move on. Dont we?
First of all I am sorry if she feels this way, she is not the first & most certainly wont be the last. I find this odd as at the end of the day, does it really matter on a forum? Most people on here dont know ea other, & are unlikely to ever meet up. So what if they dont agree with you, or take what you have said as incorrect. I remember when my daughter at 14 was accused of being a liar by someone one here. As I said to her you know the truth & the people who matter know the truth, so take it with a pinch of salt.
Secondly because of that I wonder how anyone can be frightened to carry on posting? By the sounds of things you have an issue with one other poster, again so what. They are just as intitled to defend what they think is right as Lucy is to make her comments, which I have to say did not come across as well meaning. You have explained on her behalf, & I would think that is fine. It seems to me that there is now an issue between you, Lucy & ST as to who is being nasty, who is mis-understanding who, & it is all unnecessary.
If I have offended Lucy then I am sorry, but we all make the odd typing error, & if my spelling/grammer was that poor then I would double check it. I have a habit of shortening words (my days of sending telexes). Now it is all text speach which does not always flow in a way that makes for easy reading. If Lucy stops posting then that is her choice, IMO though it should not be blamed on bullying as I do not think that is the case at all. I have read her other posts & I can find no evidence of bullying on any of those either. Again this is virtual stuff, it really is nonsence to be upset over what a couple of people have typed. My god 1/2 the people would have left & there would be no forum if we all felt that way. Dont get me wrong I have felt upset in the past with stupid comments, & I saw red when I saw what had been sent to my daughter, but we get over it & move on. Dont we?
Zebedee
Well-Known Member
You didn't offend her!! From what she said to me via PM she knows she doesn't always express herself very well via the written word. She doesn't mind people asking her what she means or anything like that. From the PMs she sent me I've got the impression of someone who has a deep understanding of breeding & a real love of horses.
She wanted a debate & an exchange of views. The first reply to her post basically said 'We've been asked not to complain on the forums'. The next couple if posts accused her of being a troublemaker who had only come on here to stir.
I think it's very easy for people who can express themselves well via the written word to forget how intimidating this medium can be for those who can't. Lucey told me she'd been trying to pluck up the courage to post for some while. Reading between the lines I think she now feels that of people are going to misconstrue her posts in such an unpleasent manner thats there's little point in her continuing to try & be part of the forum.
I'm a little confused re your comment about someone having an 'issue' with another poster? Does the 'you' refer to myself or Lucey? If it refers to me I can only assume that you think I may have an issue with StaceyT? I can assure you that before all this I'd never even noticed her as a user - I'm sure she hadn't noticed me either. I think the way she behaved to a new user was appalling though.
Anyway Lucey seems to have gone & I'm getting a little tired of the self righteousness that has permeated some aspects of this thread throughout (not your posts by the way). I will repeat once more though for the record that I believe in free speech, & I see no reason why people who perhaps are disatisfied with an aspect of ANY event shouldn't have as much right to post as those who aren't.
She wanted a debate & an exchange of views. The first reply to her post basically said 'We've been asked not to complain on the forums'. The next couple if posts accused her of being a troublemaker who had only come on here to stir.
I think it's very easy for people who can express themselves well via the written word to forget how intimidating this medium can be for those who can't. Lucey told me she'd been trying to pluck up the courage to post for some while. Reading between the lines I think she now feels that of people are going to misconstrue her posts in such an unpleasent manner thats there's little point in her continuing to try & be part of the forum.
I'm a little confused re your comment about someone having an 'issue' with another poster? Does the 'you' refer to myself or Lucey? If it refers to me I can only assume that you think I may have an issue with StaceyT? I can assure you that before all this I'd never even noticed her as a user - I'm sure she hadn't noticed me either. I think the way she behaved to a new user was appalling though.
Anyway Lucey seems to have gone & I'm getting a little tired of the self righteousness that has permeated some aspects of this thread throughout (not your posts by the way). I will repeat once more though for the record that I believe in free speech, & I see no reason why people who perhaps are disatisfied with an aspect of ANY event shouldn't have as much right to post as those who aren't.
maggiehorse
Well-Known Member
well said zeberdee , although i have only ever had frendly replies to my posts , i do wonder whether to post at times as i,m afraid i may be misconstrued and slated , lucey as far as i can see just wanted to ask a question about the gradings she witnessed and should have got a mature and informed reply , not bitchy bitchy , its a shame at times that certain members feel the need to jump down a persons throat for voicing genuine concerns or for having less than perfect grammer
magic104
Well-Known Member
I will repeat once more though for the record that I believe in free speech, & I see no reason why people who perhaps are disatisfied with an aspect of ANY event shouldn't have as much right to post as those who aren't.
You are 100% correct, & I have already answered how I felt it came across. I honestly think this is just a big misunderstanding. Z you have been on here long enough to know that there are people who come on & stir up things. I think that is how ST saw it. TBH no one really knows what is behind some peoples comments, when they are directed in this way. I just think it is a shame, that this part of the forum has on the whole been free of all this sillyness, & now people are stating they are not sure they want to carry on using the forum. Honestly I think once Lucy has slept on it, she will see that it really does not matter, it is a misunderstaning in cyber space, not real life.
You are 100% correct, & I have already answered how I felt it came across. I honestly think this is just a big misunderstanding. Z you have been on here long enough to know that there are people who come on & stir up things. I think that is how ST saw it. TBH no one really knows what is behind some peoples comments, when they are directed in this way. I just think it is a shame, that this part of the forum has on the whole been free of all this sillyness, & now people are stating they are not sure they want to carry on using the forum. Honestly I think once Lucy has slept on it, she will see that it really does not matter, it is a misunderstaning in cyber space, not real life.
magic104
Well-Known Member
I have explained the reason for that as well, & apologised for it. What would you like me to do? Do penance in church later today perhaps? I am sure the priest will be quiet amused by it all!!
Tia
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
I will repeat once more though for the record that I believe in free speech, & I see no reason why people who perhaps are disatisfied with an aspect of ANY event shouldn't have as much right to post as those who aren't.
[/ QUOTE ]
Hear! Hear! Zebedee. Totally agree with pretty much everything you have said in this post and in your previous ones on this thread.
Censorship is really not something to be coveted in my opinion and I'm quite surprised that some on here feel it should be.
I will repeat once more though for the record that I believe in free speech, & I see no reason why people who perhaps are disatisfied with an aspect of ANY event shouldn't have as much right to post as those who aren't.
[/ QUOTE ]
Hear! Hear! Zebedee. Totally agree with pretty much everything you have said in this post and in your previous ones on this thread.
Censorship is really not something to be coveted in my opinion and I'm quite surprised that some on here feel it should be.
AndyPandy
Well-Known Member
Just saw these guidelines on another site and thought I'd post them here... just food for thought
Be civil.
No personal attacks. Do not feel compelled to defend your honor in public.
Be kind to newcomers.
Newcomers may be annoying. They ask the wrong questions, including ones that seem obvious (or whose answers seem easy to find). But lots of valued contributors started out this way, and treating newcomers kindly makes them more likely to turn into the valuable community members we all know and love (and cut some slack when they mess up).
So while you don't have to humor them or suffer them gladly, and it's fine to point out when they make mistakes, point newcomers in the right direction in addition to turning them away from the wrong ones, and be kind to them in the process of correcting their transgressions.
Let sleeping dogs lie.
It's tempting to revisit controversial decisions you disagree with, but it's rarely productive to do so, since it almost always results in the same heated, lengthy, and time/energy draining discussions leading to the same conclusion that was reached in the last round.
Therefore, for issues already raised, discussed, and decided upon, reopen the discussion only if you have significant new information that would reasonably prompt reconsideration of the original decision.
Be civil.
No personal attacks. Do not feel compelled to defend your honor in public.
Be kind to newcomers.
Newcomers may be annoying. They ask the wrong questions, including ones that seem obvious (or whose answers seem easy to find). But lots of valued contributors started out this way, and treating newcomers kindly makes them more likely to turn into the valuable community members we all know and love (and cut some slack when they mess up).
So while you don't have to humor them or suffer them gladly, and it's fine to point out when they make mistakes, point newcomers in the right direction in addition to turning them away from the wrong ones, and be kind to them in the process of correcting their transgressions.
Let sleeping dogs lie.
It's tempting to revisit controversial decisions you disagree with, but it's rarely productive to do so, since it almost always results in the same heated, lengthy, and time/energy draining discussions leading to the same conclusion that was reached in the last round.
Therefore, for issues already raised, discussed, and decided upon, reopen the discussion only if you have significant new information that would reasonably prompt reconsideration of the original decision.
StaceyTanglewood
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
You didn't offend her!! From what she said to me via PM she knows she doesn't always express herself very well via the written word. She doesn't mind people asking her what she means or anything like that. From the PMs she sent me I've got the impression of someone who has a deep understanding of breeding & a real love of horses.
She wanted a debate & an exchange of views. The first reply to her post basically said 'We've been asked not to complain on the forums'. The next couple if posts accused her of being a troublemaker who had only come on here to stir.
I think it's very easy for people who can express themselves well via the written word to forget how intimidating this medium can be for those who can't. Lucey told me she'd been trying to pluck up the courage to post for some while. Reading between the lines I think she now feels that of people are going to misconstrue her posts in such an unpleasent manner thats there's little point in her continuing to try & be part of the forum.
I'm a little confused re your comment about someone having an 'issue' with another poster? Does the 'you' refer to myself or Lucey? If it refers to me I can only assume that you think I may have an issue with StaceyT? I can assure you that before all this I'd never even noticed her as a user - I'm sure she hadn't noticed me either. I think the way she behaved to a new user was appalling though.
Anyway Lucey seems to have gone & I'm getting a little tired of the self righteousness that has permeated some aspects of this thread throughout (not your posts by the way). I will repeat once more though for the record that I believe in free speech, & I see no reason why people who perhaps are disatisfied with an aspect of ANY event shouldn't have as much right to post as those who aren't.
[/ QUOTE ]
oh my god this is stupid - i think the post that was first put up was out of order ok thats it at no time afterwards have i really spoken to the new user or tried to get her not to post - and it is actually yourself that has carried on this arguement !!
Sorry that you are unhappy that i found the first post un-necessary but i did and felt that something needed to be said - now stop carrying on like its a big deal if Lucey doesnt want to post anymore then thats down to her but if she does then great !!
You didn't offend her!! From what she said to me via PM she knows she doesn't always express herself very well via the written word. She doesn't mind people asking her what she means or anything like that. From the PMs she sent me I've got the impression of someone who has a deep understanding of breeding & a real love of horses.
She wanted a debate & an exchange of views. The first reply to her post basically said 'We've been asked not to complain on the forums'. The next couple if posts accused her of being a troublemaker who had only come on here to stir.
I think it's very easy for people who can express themselves well via the written word to forget how intimidating this medium can be for those who can't. Lucey told me she'd been trying to pluck up the courage to post for some while. Reading between the lines I think she now feels that of people are going to misconstrue her posts in such an unpleasent manner thats there's little point in her continuing to try & be part of the forum.
I'm a little confused re your comment about someone having an 'issue' with another poster? Does the 'you' refer to myself or Lucey? If it refers to me I can only assume that you think I may have an issue with StaceyT? I can assure you that before all this I'd never even noticed her as a user - I'm sure she hadn't noticed me either. I think the way she behaved to a new user was appalling though.
Anyway Lucey seems to have gone & I'm getting a little tired of the self righteousness that has permeated some aspects of this thread throughout (not your posts by the way). I will repeat once more though for the record that I believe in free speech, & I see no reason why people who perhaps are disatisfied with an aspect of ANY event shouldn't have as much right to post as those who aren't.
[/ QUOTE ]
oh my god this is stupid - i think the post that was first put up was out of order ok thats it at no time afterwards have i really spoken to the new user or tried to get her not to post - and it is actually yourself that has carried on this arguement !!
Sorry that you are unhappy that i found the first post un-necessary but i did and felt that something needed to be said - now stop carrying on like its a big deal if Lucey doesnt want to post anymore then thats down to her but if she does then great !!
birchave0
Well-Known Member
in response to the original question, yes I was. I am not about to spout off on the airwaves, but yes, I was upset. It was comments, remarks and attitude of the vet, not the panel who were great and very helpful.
While I understand the BEF do not want any bad publicity nothing in life every goes smoothly so I do believe people should be aloud to voice an opinion, remember we do not live in 1930s Germany.....
As for how this this thread is yet another example of how things get out of hand, I will say no more apart from it happens too often.
People who post usually have a geniune question, they expect some helpful feedback not an attack..
Be happy people, life is just too short.......
While I understand the BEF do not want any bad publicity nothing in life every goes smoothly so I do believe people should be aloud to voice an opinion, remember we do not live in 1930s Germany.....
As for how this this thread is yet another example of how things get out of hand, I will say no more apart from it happens too often.
People who post usually have a geniune question, they expect some helpful feedback not an attack..
Be happy people, life is just too short.......
KenRehill
Well-Known Member
remember we do not live in 1930s Germany..... In fact, the levels of political correctness now being experienced in the UK are notably similar to those seen in Germany in the 1930's, which were the precursor to the rise of Hitler. But that's not very horsey.
birchave0
Well-Known Member
another good reason to express yourself and say want you have to say
But please, no nastiness.....
But please, no nastiness.....
SirenaXVI
Well-Known Member
Well said Z, have read the whole post and have also agreed with you throughout