What advantage does a horse have trained by parelli regime v traditional training

AdorableAlice

AdorableAlice

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Enduring a sleepless night last night I flicked the TV on and watched 4 sessions of parelli training/demo sessions.

It was totally beyond my reasoning to understand why, let alone what, they get up to. It seems to be a cult.

I hid beneath the duvet when there were 8 horses cantering in a circle, 4 each way, bridleless, whilst the riders threw their long whips to one another. Why ? one womans horse had a bucking fit and the trainer could be heard screaming 'drop the stick'. What do the horses learn from that exercise ?

What the heck is it all about. Does a horse really need to be stood on and have a ball bounced. I am grumpy and over tired !! what do you make of the regime.
 
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Its supposed to be about building the horse and rider's confidence, desensitizing them to various objects moving around them (its not about the ball or the carrot stick :) ) and getting a calm and responsive horse that works willingly with its rider/handler. That said, many parelli-ites seem to focus heavily on the groundwork games and make the horse stale with them - so ears are pinned back, horse is doing the stuff by rote not because they enjoy it and it becomes rather close to circus tricks. I've used the techniques but only so far as I need to, once my horse knew enough for my aims then we hardly ever practice the games any more except as a change of routine. The earlier books were best as they just did the essentials without all the 'fluffy' stuff!
Traditional training, if done right, should achieve the same calm, responsive, confident, willing partner - its about how it is applied, with respect for the horse and understanding when the horse is trying for you, when to back off a bit and when not to - many riders/owners don't have that experience and don't seek help when they should hence Parelli has found a niche for those that want a prescriptive training programme they can follow themselves and they market it well. Does anybody offer the same sort of programme for more classical methods?
 
unicorndreams said:
Traditional training, if done right, should achieve the same calm, responsive, confident, willing partner - its about how it is applied, with respect for the horse and understanding when the horse is trying for you, when to back off a bit and when not to
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Agree with above
 
unicorndreams said:
Parelli has found a niche for those that want a prescriptive training programme they can follow themselves and they market it well. Does anybody offer the same sort of programme for more classical methods?
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I think there is a massive danger of someone thinking they could buy a programme and it is one size fits all. I have seen from the sidelines, a lot of babies being backed and brought on and you can't tell till you start how each horse will react or what it will throw at you. You could have the theory but if you are following a set number of steps, where do you have the experience to know how to deal with, as an e.g., a youngster who will keep turning in on you on the lunge? or a baby who is violently opposed to anything on its back? or know that this baby that is having a hissy fit is actually hurting somewhere and not simply trying it on.

the basic concept of desensitisation is a good one and most people apply it anyway. Parelli has fallen into a bad place as there are a lot of people who jumped on that bandwagon, think its the only way but then never seem to progress through the stages with it.
 
At least they TEACH people - good traditional methods are hard to get someone to teach, there are far too many people who do what they do, badly and without understanding or knowing how to do it right.

(Sorry, can't find out how to delete this for the one I wrote afterwards. Any suggestions?)
 
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"Traditional training, if done right, should achieve the same calm, responsive, confident, willing partner - its about how it is applied, with respect for the horse and understanding when the horse is trying for you, when to back off a bit and when not to - many riders/owners don't have that experience and don't seek help when they should"

Totally agree with this, but it is really difficult to find GOOD training
At least the Parelli people TEACH and don't assume handlers know it all.
 
((dons hard hat and prepares to run for the hills))

In my experience they have the advantage of an owner who will explain away every bit of bad behaviour and lack of manners with the words "I do Parelli". :)
 
Although I'm not an advocate of 'Natural' horsemanship 'techniques' at all, I think it worth noting that any training 'method' is only as good as the trainer themselves.

So, I guess you will see a lot of badly trained/schooled and downright stressed horses that have been 'trained' using a more traditional 'method' and a more happy obedient Parellie trained horse trained because the trainer themsleves is more experienced and has more natural 'feel'.

Although I advocate using equitation science in training, give me a horse that has been trained with correct 'traditional' methods from a sympathetic trainer any day. I believe that Parellie and the like, although there may be some good aspects, in my experience produces confusion and fear as their methods APPEAR to use conflicting signals.
 
Patterdale said:
Parelli has found a niche for people who daren't ride their horses and like to throw good money after bad.
And they've done mighty well out of it.....
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Worked for us :D

MalagaatJames024-1.jpg
 
But some training methods are just.....bad.

Say I made a new way of training, where you had to clunk the horse hard on the chin with the lead rope buckle to get him to do what you want, or withhold water for whole days to 'assert your authority.'
It wouldn't matter how good I was at these methods, they would still be bad and wrong.



Oh, and for those who didn't know, these are well-documented methods of 'training' used by the Gruesome Twosome.
 
well i am disappointed ladies, came back from driving lesson expecting 17 pages of arguments, carrot sticks being used to brutally beat the traditionalists and some of the older members keeping the peace...

- huffs, whilst tapping foot-
 
sally2008 said:
((dons hard hat and prepares to run for the hills))

In my experience they have the advantage of an owner who will explain away every bit of bad behaviour and lack of manners with the words "I do Parelli". :)
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That and the "you don't understand, because you don't do Parelli."

To me, it seems the most odd way to teach a horse, or a "rider" how to do anything. Got to be said though - Parelli - good businessman!
 
Interesting that those who prefer a more traditional approach (read anything but Parelli ;-) ) are quite prepared to don the hard hats.........The two P's (pratts, parelli, call them what you will haha) wouldnt agree with the need to use one ;-)
 
RunToEarth said:
That and the "you don't understand, because you don't do Parelli."
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LOL! Yup, I've had that one too. I once watched a Parelli devotee having chunks repeatedly taken of her arm whilst waiting her turn for the farrier (and I'm talking full on bites here not nips or plucks at clothing). "Ooooh look, he's playing with me!" she said and quoted the above at me when I told her she must be kidding. You are quite right, I don't understand ;)
 
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What i have always been curious about is if a youngster is brought up with Parelli methods, if then foreced to be sold does what will it do to that horse going to a home that perhaps doesn't do parelli methods ? :)
* Not after an argument simply curious*
 
A lady up my yard does parelli.....well she picks out the bits she agrees with and leaves the bits she doesn't.....her horse is a youngster with a cheeky personality that is very well behaved for people that don't do parelli as well. Like she said she doesn't want him to just learn one way as everyone rides and handles differently so he can be handled by everyone.


I think like anything you should take what suits you and your horse and leave the rest.
 
JillA said:
At least they TEACH people - good traditional methods are hard to get someone to teach, there are far too many people who do what they do, badly and without understanding or knowing how to do it right.

(Sorry, can't find out how to delete this for the one I wrote afterwards. Any suggestions?)
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Like.There may be poor NH?Parelli stuff done sometimes but there is alot of total (and at times very violent) stuff done under the TRADITIONAL umberella as well.
 
Patterdale said:
But some training methods are just.....bad.

Say I made a new way of training, where you had to clunk the horse hard on the chin with the lead rope buckle to get him to do what you want, or withhold water for whole days to 'assert your authority.'
It wouldn't matter how good I was at these methods, they would still be bad and wrong.



Oh, and for those who didn't know, these are well-documented methods of 'training' used by the Gruesome Twosome.
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This thing about with holding water? Is it just myth or is there some actual proof?
 
slightlyconfused said:
A lady up my yard does parelli.....well she picks out the bits she agrees with and leaves the bits she doesn't.....her horse is a youngster with a cheeky personality that is very well behaved for people that don't do parelli as well. Like she said she doesn't want him to just learn one way as everyone rides and handles differently so he can be handled by everyone.


I think like anything you should take what suits you and your horse and leave the rest.
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Sounds great, I agree with her ideology, although i do not practice this myself i think in any form of training you encounter the good and the bad.
 
eahotson said:
Like.There may be poor NH?Parelli stuff done sometimes but there is alot of total (and at times very violent) stuff done under the TRADITIONAL umberella as well.
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TBH, if a youngster is brought up correctly from the first then hardly any actual 'breaking in' of any kind will need to be done as the horse will be so used to you doing different things that it just takes anything new in its stride with the view that 'mum is doing something else now'.

There is never an excuse for brutish behaviour from anyone towards a horse at any time.

The only other thing I will say is the Parrellied horses I've known have all been thugs with no manners whatsoever because they've been allowed to 'express themselves' which are other words for being allowed to walk all over anyone.
 
I did Parelli years ago before it became really comercialised. I found it really useful for myself and spooky horse and we got to level 3 groundwork and level 2 ridden. It changed him from a dangerous monster to an excellent horse that I could ride bridleless.

Years later it is completely different now and I wouldnt touch it with a barge pole. I have my own way now using traditional, natural and common sense and my pony is excellent.

A friend who I did Parelli with all those years ago bought a 2 year old. She has used Parelli up to the point she is at now (horse is 5) and has never sat on it yet. Apparently it keeps telling her its not ready yet. It is a Sec D, Looks very ready to me to be she assures me she wont go near it with a saddle until the horse tells her she can. I think she may be waiting a while...
 
When I bought my horse a few years it was dead trendy. Most of the liveries on the yard I was on used to go out one by one and chase their horses around the arena, playing the 7 Games. I was intrigued so got a fellow livery/parelli devotee to show me what it was all about. My very self confident cob took one look and walked away with an expression I now know after 8 years of ownership to be contempt. Couldnt get him to play at all.

My view is that all it is is good old fashioned horsemanship flowered up by silly games and whip whop sticks, all done to make sure that Pat and Linda Parelli benefit financially. I know a few people who swear by it and have seen a few demonstrations of 'natural' horsemanship at country shows as well. It leaves me cold. You cant deny the marketing and business talents of Messrs Parelli though.
 
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