Who went to Hartpury?

Yes, LPG is the new rider of Garuda K. There was some discussion back in the summer about whether she would be able to maintain her impartiality as a Futurity evaluator and whether she ought to continue at all...
 
Well said Monkers, tempting though it must be as an evaluator they must be seen to be totally impartial and frankly learn to keep their opinions except on the evaluating day to themselves .
Their opinion didn't put me off, in fact I was curious what they meant, if a stallion who appears to be breathing fire when ridden is their idea of what is required in breeding good competition horses then I do wonder despite their credentials if they are the right person for the task.
The number of people (usually professional riders) who can ride that type of animal (I read the lady even likes "hot" horses herself) must be in the top 10% of riders in the UK. What about the other 90% who want a beautiful, sound and attractive and above all trainable horse ?
It's been said so many times, yes, we need amazing horses for the top level of competition, but we also need decent ones for the middle, and hopefully the standard will rise to drag the lowest levels up as a result.
I feel so sorry for stallion owners when they get this sort of negativity said, but take the view that the proof is in the pudding, getting their offspring out there and competing will soon stop unjustifed comments, let's see in 8 years time how the picture's changed, I'd like to bet the results will speak for themselves....
 
Echo this. I have lost track of the times I have said that it is no use us breeding horses with impeccable bloodlines, amazing trots, but ones that the 'average' rider (and I was no better than 'average' when I rode) can't handle.

Many riders work full time, have families etc and perhaps no arena to use daily even given that they have the time. The horses get ridden at weekends, one that needs serious work daily isn't the answer, no matter how good they think they are.
 
seabsicuit2 said:
Any thoughts on take it 2 the limit and Ramiro B?
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Quick reply about Ramiro B, as I thought the reply you got was a little negative!! He is a legend of a stallion and his wealth of progeny are testament to the fact that he is producing the goods! He has around 40 Grade A Showjumping horses competing worldwide, plus numerous event horses including very consistent 4 star performer Ballynoe Castle RM!! He is now 19 years old and still exceptionally fertile.
 
Having seen Franklyn Sugar twice in the flesh & up close, the comments are rubbish. And if he lacks masculinity god knows what she thought of a least another there who I had the same thoughts about. We all see things differently I suppose, & you do wonder at some of they hype, "The Emperor's New Clothes" comes to mind. What can't be forgotten though is the mare. I also feel that judges & evaluators need to be careful about voicing their opinions on public forums. People need to have confidence in the system & I think it about time that these horses are judged without their breeding been known. What relevance is that to the judges anyway? If they are judging the animal in front of them, then the parentage is irrelavant, surely? Once they have given their marks then give them the information, but not before. If someone can explain why the parentage is needed that would be very helpful.
 
Having seen Franklyn Sugar twice in the flesh & up close, the comments are rubbish. And if he lacks masculinity god knows what she thought of a least another there who I had the same thoughts about. We all see things differently I suppose, & you do wonder at some of they hype, "The Emperor's New Clothes" comes to mind. What can't be forgotten though is the mare. I also feel that judges & evaluators need to be careful about voicing their opinions on public forums. People need to have confidence in the system & I think it about time that these horses are judged without their breeding been known. What relevance is that to the judges anyway? If they are judging the animal in front of them, then the parentage is irrelavant, surely? Once they have given their marks then give them the information, but not before. If someone can explain why the parentage is needed that would be very helpful.
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We need a 'like' button on this forum :D
 
magic104 said:
....... People need to have confidence in the system & I think it about time that these horses are judged without their breeding been known. What relevance is that to the judges anyway? If they are judging the animal in front of them, then the parentage is irrelavant, surely? Once they have given their marks then give them the information, but not before. If someone can explain why the parentage is needed that would be very helpful.
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If you remember rightly we've been saying this ever since the Futurity started and have been told that it's necessary for them to know so they can compare with other stock of similar breeding and know how a stallion stamps his stock or words to that effect; I'm sure you'd find them on here if you searched, there were long replies from Ciss amongst others why it was necessary for them to know. I have a far more cynical idea why they need it myself which I'm sure you can well imagine but at the end of the day, if they are ignoring some vet reports (as already reported several times) and doing it on breeding alone then it is just a showing class judged on preferences of breeding which is totally wrong.
It would be very interesting to see if results differed from not knowing the breeding beforehand.
 
Yes we do. As an (ex) In Hand Hunter exhibitor, it was a big nono, and against the rules, to ask the breeding of any horse you judged before the Championship.

Of course those on the circuit all knew each others horses breeding inside out. So when an unknown such as me was well placed or won then you knew that you'd been judged on the horses merits, certainly not the breeding - or the handler.
 
Couldn't agree more Chrissie, that's how I used to feel (other than with the horses) when our Border Terriers won their classes in front of the usual 'culprits'; they had done it on their own merits which is so much more satisfying.
 
Maesfen said:
If you remember rightly we've been saying this ever since the Futurity started and have been told that it's necessary for them to know so they can compare with other stock of similar breeding and know how a stallion stamps his stock or words to that effect; I'm sure you'd find them on here if you searched, there were long replies from Ciss amongst others why it was necessary for them to know. I have a far more cynical idea why they need it myself which I'm sure you can well imagine but at the end of the day, if they are ignoring some vet reports (as already reported several times) and doing it on breeding alone then it is just a showing class judged on preferences of breeding which is totally wrong.
It would be very interesting to see if results differed from not knowing the breeding beforehand.
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Sorry Maesfen but they dont answer the question because nothing explains why the judges cant know after they have judged. Any comparisons can still take place afterwards.
 
You and I and many others know that Magic and I think a lot of people would prefer it if breeding wasn't known until after marks are given. It always makes me think that the evaluators actually need to know for a bit of guidance as to whether they should approve of it or not silly as that might sound but it's how it appears; makes them seem not so independent as they would like us to think.
 
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