AmyMay
Situation normal
And I have to agree with this 100%.
why do people feel the need to prolong a suffering horses life???
- Thread starter miss_wilson
- Start date
And I have to agree with this 100%.
FionaM12
Well-Known Member
I did this once with my old dog Brian. I would take him to the vet ready to say goodbye and the vet would say no, he's fine with some treatment. Lots of presciptions later I realised I was dragging the poor lad's life on beyond the point when he had any quality of life.
He was so drugged up he was in a constant daze. I insisted the vet pts, and resolved not to trust a vet's advice in future.
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stencilface
High upon a hillside
Apologies, I can't stop myself - being eaten is still a way of dying of natural causes
I don't think its unrealistic to expect a horse to go through an element of suffering some people do every day, but it depends on the length/severity of it I think. Our old one 2 years ago had huge abscesses in both front feet, and was not a happy horse, but a week later (and 2 years later with not an abscess since) he was back to being a happy, albeit old PITA horse!
Patterdale
Well-Known Member
Pearlisasinger - not sure how the logical follow on is to PTS BEFORE suffering??
Not sure u understood me...
Not sure u understood me...
Moomin1
Well-Known Member
I did this once with my old dog Brian. I would take him to the vet ready to say goodbye and the vet would say no, he's fine with some treatment. Lots of presciptions later I realised I was dragging the poor lad's life on beyond the point when he had any quality of life.
That's very different to not taking your animal to a vet at all. If you aren't happy with one vet's advice you can always seek another opinion. At least then the animal has been given pain relief/meds in the meantime, and you are acting within the law.
To not take an ill animal to the vets and try to make the judgement on suffering yourself is not only morally wrong but against the law if the animal suffers unnecessarily too.
I come across so many people who believe they are better qualified to tell whether their animal is in a suffering state or not - including people who actually argue their emaciated, collapsed animal is not suffering because it still wags it's tail and tries to eat. There has to be a limit somewhere and those instances craw me to high hell.
Wagtail
Horse servant
I did this once with my old dog Brian. I would take him to the vet ready to say goodbye and the vet would say no, he's fine with some treatment. Lots of presciptions later I realised I was dragging the poor lad's life on beyond the point when he had any quality of life.
My dog that suffered greatly was called Brian too. He had a brain tumor but the vets said all his crying was a bad shoulder. He got worse and worse, lost half his body weight and finally got diagnosed with lymphoma. Vets persuaded us to try chemotherapy, saying that it would give him another 8 - 10 months of quality life (he was only 3). When we said that this did not seem long, they said that it was for a dog and so we went ahead with it. What we didn't realise was that the lymphoma was secondary to a brain tumor and so the chemo helped but was not the right kind. In the end he could not lower his head to drink because of the pain (but we didn't know that was why!). The vet hospital was 2 hours away and they wanted him taking down for more tests. They found the brain tumor but insisted it was secondary to the lymphoma. I think otherwise as looking back all his howling was pain from the pressure in his head. If I had know this from the start I would have had him put down then and there. It hurts so much to think about how he suffered. Even at the end the vets wanted to do more tests and more treatment. We had to insist he was PTS! Of course, they got a lot of money out of us too, around £8k.
Goldenstar
Well-Known Member
Well that's your desision I too have an old cat who is failing now I took the desision some time ago no trips to vet no forcing pills and potion down her when it's time I will ring the tell her to come to the house and PTS it's never the vet desision it's mine.
Moomin1
Well-Known Member
There is a line to be drawn when an old animal is suffering a slow death - yes it is nice for them to be pts at home I have no issues with that, and no issues with an owner making an informed and reasonable decision as to when their pet is pts. But some people take it to the extreme and leave them in shocking states of suffering, all in the belief that they are being kinder for letting them live their days out without intervention.
I remember a 20 year old cat being found collapsed in the middle of a street on a bank holiday - it was nearly 30 degrees and the cat had kidney failure and was so dehydrated it's skin was stood up on touch. It had been laying there for hours and when the owners were confronted they merely said that was how nature intended and refused to have it pts. The cat was in a terrible suffering way and IMO their attitude stunk.
mollymum
Well-Known Member
I agree entirely with stencilface. Perhaps you could perseude her to turn the horse out during the day, with pain relief and shelter and see how it goes for a bit? As you probably know, being stabled permanently does them no good physically or mentally. Otherwise, it's just going to have to be everyone trying to convince her to act in the horses best interest. What about the yard owner? He/she does have a responsibility towards the animals welfare too.
AshTay
Well-Known Member
It's one thing saying you'll "do the right thing when the time comes" but it's quite another to know when the time has actually come and to be able to do it knowing it is absolutely the right thing to do.
In many cases, it's clear when it's time to say goodbye and the "better a month too soon than a day too late" is all very noble but in many cases people don't know when the "month too soon" is and are terrified that they'll make the decision many months, or even years, too soon instead of a month too soon. Life is precious to every living creature.
This is where I am now. Long story short - older pony injured tendon in 2009. After 18 months of boxrest and individual confined grazing he came sound. Came off the drugs. Was leading a life of leisurely retirement in the fields which his chums. But now he's lame again - vet says he's either reinjured it, it's adhesions in the old injury or arthritis. Either way, he's lame and gets worse if kept in for any length of time so he's out.
Letting him go is the kindest thing to do now as he's probably just going to get worse. But at the same time, it's knowing WHEN (tomorrow, end of the month, end of the summer?). He's still merry enough in himself, isn't stood around looking glum, ears pricked and excited to come in for his feed and ears pricked and eager to get back out again to his grass.
Some cases are clear cut and in the case of the OP I agree with others who have said that maybe the lady in question needs a sympathetic ear and lots of support. But it's so easy to say "I would PTS" when you've never been in that position yourself and it's not always black and white as to what the right thing to do is.
In many cases, it's clear when it's time to say goodbye and the "better a month too soon than a day too late" is all very noble but in many cases people don't know when the "month too soon" is and are terrified that they'll make the decision many months, or even years, too soon instead of a month too soon. Life is precious to every living creature.
This is where I am now. Long story short - older pony injured tendon in 2009. After 18 months of boxrest and individual confined grazing he came sound. Came off the drugs. Was leading a life of leisurely retirement in the fields which his chums. But now he's lame again - vet says he's either reinjured it, it's adhesions in the old injury or arthritis. Either way, he's lame and gets worse if kept in for any length of time so he's out.
Letting him go is the kindest thing to do now as he's probably just going to get worse. But at the same time, it's knowing WHEN (tomorrow, end of the month, end of the summer?). He's still merry enough in himself, isn't stood around looking glum, ears pricked and excited to come in for his feed and ears pricked and eager to get back out again to his grass.
Some cases are clear cut and in the case of the OP I agree with others who have said that maybe the lady in question needs a sympathetic ear and lots of support. But it's so easy to say "I would PTS" when you've never been in that position yourself and it's not always black and white as to what the right thing to do is.
Goldenstar
Well-Known Member
And I would agree with you it will be the other way round with us the vet will be wanting to inflict this that and the other on a sixteen yo cat and will be going no its time. I know it's coming she ageing fast now but eating and affectionate .
Goldenstar
Well-Known Member
I have been in the position many many times if it's your animal you know them best it not always black and white but a horse unable to rise without assistance unless it having an acute episode that will respond to treatment is in my opinion black and white.
OP does not say ( she probally does not know ) but if the horse is arthritic it should be on daily perscribed pain relief it's not then the owner is in my view negligent those blaming the YO 'Er should think what can she do if the owner won't listen serve notice so the poor old thing is moved away from all it knows it's appallingly difficult for YO in these circumstances , it's horrible but every time the horse is helped up it prolongs it's life if it was left nature would take its course there is no right way for those around a horse and owner like this and it's probally why the other liverys refuse to be involved now.
I really feel for OP and the livery owner.
mulledwhine
Well-Known Member
Just to clarify, my vet wanted to put my cat alseep 12 years ago, I asked if I could giver her a chance, the next day he was ringing me to pick her up as she was going stir crazy!!! That was 15 years ago!!!
I would never ever cause suffering to an animal, but if you care to read the end of my post then, today you would have read that she is eating drinking and wrapping herself round our legs.
Yes I think the end is very close, but while she is gaining pleasure, and my vet admits he is not god, and cannot read a chystel ball, then I will continue to say as he does' I know my pet better then he' and he knows how well they are looked after, so make apologies for makings judgement based on knowing her/him.
And believe me I have had to make many a difficult dessision, on the spur of the moment
I would never ever cause suffering to an animal, but if you care to read the end of my post then, today you would have read that she is eating drinking and wrapping herself round our legs.
Yes I think the end is very close, but while she is gaining pleasure, and my vet admits he is not god, and cannot read a chystel ball, then I will continue to say as he does' I know my pet better then he' and he knows how well they are looked after, so make apologies for makings judgement based on knowing her/him.
And believe me I have had to make many a difficult dessision, on the spur of the moment
Orangehorse
Well-Known Member
Regarding the OP - we have friends who are really old fasioned dealers and farmers and kept their old favourites for years. One pony was still going at 45.
However, they always said that once a horse can't get up and down easily it is time to say goodbye, as it is very stressful for a horse as they are a prey species so they will feel very vunerable if they can't move around easily.
However, they always said that once a horse can't get up and down easily it is time to say goodbye, as it is very stressful for a horse as they are a prey species so they will feel very vunerable if they can't move around easily.
ew1801
Well-Known Member
I was in this situation last year. I lost both my oldies within 2 months of each other and it is so hard to make the decision. My first one I had pts I had to make the decision pretty quick. One day she was fine, the next a bit under the weather an the next she couldn't breath as she had a serious infection that her old body could not fight. The second was worse. I had owned her for 11 years an she was diagnosed with cushings. It was controlled with mess an she lived normally for two years after been diagnosed. Then she came down with lami. I tried everything possible to make her sound an 2000++ on bets bills which was majority pain relief. I tried for 8 months but for every week she was good she had 3 bad ones. It got to the point I couldn't bear seeing her like that any more. I had the vet come out in the morning an make her pain free so she could have a few hours out in the field with her friends an she was then pts. I was heartbroken but it was a relief when she had gone. I no in my heart I tried for her an she died a happy lady
AshTay
Well-Known Member
So sorry for you - must have been devastating to lose two so close together.